TSIF!
What if Tim Lincecum doesn't immediately win the Cy Young and Rookie of the Year awards? What then? WHAT HAPPENS THEN?
And I never understood the whole "breathing into a paper bag"-thing. Doesn't work for me.
So there's a little hiccup in Lincecum's path to greatness. He doesn't have impeccable control, his pitch counts can run up quickly, and his fastball can be hit if the hitter is waiting for it. We've been through this before. Matt Cain ran into a wall last season, and he was skipped over in the rotation. There was a sound argument for sending him down and a sound argument for letting him take his lumps in the bigs. It wasn't an issue after the skipped start, though. Cain was one of the better pitchers in the league after he returned to the rotation.
Cain's struggles were worse than what Lincecum is going through right now. Cain was being slapped around the park. Lincecum is mixing in a bunch of bleeders, passed balls, and stolen bases aided by Lincecum's own brain lock. That's not to say there aren't problems; there are. Leadoff walks are just killing him, and if he isn't getting the curve over consistently, a hitter can sit on the fastball. It doesn't help that he's hanging a good portion of the curveballs that are catching the plate.
Lincecum is a young pitcher with imperfect control. So it goes. But there's no reason to panic and send him down. He's in a stretch where everything he does wrong is killing him. Stay the course. We're still about two more awful starts before it even becomes a real question.
I'd love to see more of the changeup, though....
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62 comments
Comments
Re: TSIF!
by lyricalkiller on Jun 14, 2007 2:10 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by hairball on Jun 14, 2007 2:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
But Tim has been throwing fewer than half his change up for strikes recently. I would think the low, outside change to lefthanded hitters would be a hard take. But batters have seemed to be able to do so.
The good news is that he has fairly consistently been missing low and outside, indicating a slight adjustment could turn those into perfect pitches knee high on the outside.
I would like to see the Giants catchers call for that pitch more often when Tim has the batter at 0-2 or 1-2. In Tim's first start at Fresno this year, he struck out two with the fastball, three with the curve and also three with the change. As I recall, in that game he actually threw the change more times (15) than the curve (13).
by sharksrog on Jun 15, 2007 4:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
- What's "TSIF"?
- Anyone heard anything regarding Klesko's injury yesterday. I've just been reading he pulled up running the bases, but haven't some anything more. (He hasn't returned my calls, either.)
by Goofus on Jun 14, 2007 2:25 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
Tiny Supper in Fremont?
Telephoto Sin Including (tim) Flannery?
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 14, 2007 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
Tim Seen in Fresno.
by sfgfan on Jun 14, 2007 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 14, 2007 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
Obviously commentary on our new backup catcher.
or
The Sky Is Falling
by Natto on Jun 14, 2007 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
(Not to be confused with the filmgoer's squeal: "Fanning is the shit")
by hairball on Jun 14, 2007 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by paboperfecto on Jun 14, 2007 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by howtheyscored on Jun 14, 2007 6:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
Which, it isn't, but would be the proper overexaggerated response to thinking The Enchanter is in trouble yet.
by DiegoGiant on Jun 14, 2007 3:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by Mordy From Monsey on Jun 14, 2007 2:26 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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by Mordy From Monsey on Jun 14, 2007 2:28 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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by Kitspool on Jun 14, 2007 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by hf79 on Jun 14, 2007 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
Perhaps it was on purpose. Maybe Rodriguez caught Timmy in Fresno and they worked well together. Bochy and Rags might have figured Rodriguez would catch something that Bengie hadn't.
by Goofus on Jun 14, 2007 5:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 14, 2007 10:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
In the last game, he got a nice grounder when he needed a double play, but the ball wasn't hit hard enough. I don't think even the Wizard of Vizquel could have turned it, though.
by sharksrog on Jun 15, 2007 4:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No pressure
(I've told enough people to calm the F down about Timmy, so I get to make a sky-is-falling comment. So nyah)
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 14, 2007 2:39 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Play the kids - These kids can play
by CEO of the William VanLandingham FanClub on Jun 14, 2007 2:43 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: Play the kids - These kids can play
by hairball on Jun 14, 2007 2:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Play the kids - These kids can play
by rxmeister on Jun 15, 2007 5:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Play the kids - These kids can play
Lewis might not be the next Carl Crawford, but if he is a average major leauge OF he is far more valuable to us than say a Winn / Roberts because he is super cheap and we can control him for years. Cheap serviesable guys enable us to spend big on prized free agents (as we can't develop a star bat).
Team salaries:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/teams/salaries?team=sfo
Roberts 5 mill
Morris 10 mill
Durham 7 mill
Feliz 5 mill
Bonds 15.5 mill
Aurillia 3.5
For that money, I say trade Morris and make a run at Teixera / Dunn assuming we sign them to an extension as part of the deal. If they want 15+ a year each, that is Bonds / Morris and Roberts money right there should you play Lewis in CF.
Or you can jettison Feliz and his 5 mill and play Aurila at 3rd so you could make a run at A-rod instead of say Dunn.
The long winded point...play the young guys if they are even close to producing like these old vets. They cost WAY less, they have a chance to outperform, and even if they aren't quite as good or consistent, they enable you to get major thump in free agency.
by CEO of the William VanLandingham FanClub on Jun 15, 2007 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Play the kids - These kids can play
So, how do we know that Freddie Lewis is capable or not? Let us count the ways:
. Center field bat, but had to be moved out of center field last season due to his poor angles on fly balls.
. Fantastic speed, but poor instincts.
. Not much power, but strikes out a lot, putting a cap on his batting average at around .250 against major league pitching.
. Freddie is already 26, rather old for a prospect to make the major leagues and then become a starting player.
So can Freddie BECOME a productive major league player? Yes, he can -- but he has much work to do. When I saw Freddie at Fresno for the first time this year, I figured he was probably still a couple of years away -- if he ever made it as a quality starting outfielder at all.
Freddie needs to work on his outfielding so that he can return to center field instead of being a mediocre-at-best corner outfielder. He has the speed and even the average but accurate arm to do so.
Freddie does have two things going for him as a hitter, both of which he needs to be able to exploit more.
First, unlike most Giants players not named Bonds, he knows how to take a walk. Freddie is far from a contact hitter, which puts him deeper in counts. If he can lay off bad pitches, that gives him a chance to draw a lot of walks. And he's better than average at doing so.
Second, more than half the outs Freddie has made on balls in play have come on ground balls. With just a little adjustment perhaps Freddie can hit his ground balls in a way in which he can beat more of them out with his great speed.
Freddie also needs to harness that great speed with better base running judgement in order to capitalize on it on the base paths.
Oh, and his speed could be an asset in the field (as he showed with his great diving catch in left center a week or two ago)if only he can learn to judge the ball better off the bat. He should be working with Willie Mays and taking 100 fly balls a day before games.
So, yeah, Freddie COULD become a good ballplayer. He has some tools (including developing power, although not a lot of it), but right now he is far more athlete than ballplayer.
Freddie's ceiling isn't exceptionally high, but it could be of starting caliber. But he has miles and miles to go before his improvement an sleep. And at 26, not a lot of time to make the improvement.
Freddie does have ONE thing going for him though. The Giants don't have many OTHER young outfielders. Nate Schierholtz is the only one who ranks ahead of him now.
by sharksrog on Jun 15, 2007 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by Chulk on Jun 14, 2007 2:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
If Matty Fastball can do it, I don't see why The Enchanter can't.
by Punch Rockgroin on Jun 14, 2007 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by paboperfecto on Jun 14, 2007 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by Punch Rockgroin on Jun 14, 2007 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 14, 2007 3:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
Oh, wait. I forgot that's a bad thing.
by Punch Rockgroin on Jun 14, 2007 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by PacBellBoozer on Jun 14, 2007 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by Punch Rockgroin on Jun 14, 2007 5:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!

by PacBellBoozer on Jun 14, 2007 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
That said, Tim's power curve is one heck of a pitch unless he hangs it. I believe five of his six strikeouts -- and definitely at least four -- came on the curve in his last outing.
by sharksrog on Jun 15, 2007 4:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by BondOrBust on Jun 14, 2007 3:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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by Goofus on Jun 14, 2007 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by hairball on Jun 14, 2007 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by sharksrog on Jun 15, 2007 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
Young stud pitchers often rely on their "stuff" way more often than they should to the exclusion of location, pitch selection and backing off speeds, slowing the game down with runners on, etc - the more mental side of pitching. Cain went thru the exact same thing that Tim is going thru and now he is immensely improved.
Also consider that Tim has never been rocked at any level (consistently) and has to get used to that. He's now facing major leaguers. They all can hit a fastball. He needs to just pitch a little smarter.
Recall the game in NY. Tim couldn't do jack with the curve, but Molina told Tim to ease up on the curve and almost instantly he got it working well. Linc is good. He will be fine.
by nostocksjustbonds on Jun 14, 2007 3:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 14, 2007 4:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
I grew up wrestling...like what you see in the Olympics, not that WWF shit. We didn't have Little League, no Pop Warner football, but as a 2nd grader, I started wrestling and kept it up all the way through high school. Entering my freshman year in HS I thought I was the shit, until I got my head beat in by the 2nd best heavyweight in the state in our first practice. I wasn't a HUGE kid, and could have easily dodged the guy by wrestling in the lower weight class, but my coach wouldn't allow it. To this day I'm glad that he didn't, because those two years of getting my ass kicked on a daily basis in practice did me alot of good.
Once the big guy left, I WAS the shit...If I do say so myself...and I don't doubt for a second that I wouldn't of been nearly that good if I wasn't tossed around like a little toy doll.
The moral of the story, is that it's good to get your teeth kicked in. Dealing with diversity is the only way to strengthen the skills. In Going down to Fresno Timmy will just toy with the hitters he faces. He could lose every game for the rest of the year for all I care (double backflip super anti-hex dodging jinx), because knowing that he's taken his lumps this year will make him one crazy motivated guy at the start of next year.
by PacBellBoozer on Jun 14, 2007 5:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by Kid Fresh on Jun 14, 2007 6:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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by PacBellBoozer on Jun 14, 2007 6:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by rxmeister on Jun 15, 2007 5:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
BB
by BlackDougal on Jun 15, 2007 6:19 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by NearestNorwich on Jun 14, 2007 7:19 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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by reeky on Jun 14, 2007 7:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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by PacBellBoozer on Jun 14, 2007 7:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by rxmeister on Jun 15, 2007 5:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by jponry on Jun 14, 2007 11:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by hairball on Jun 14, 2007 11:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
I disagree, with the sentiment that those two starts against the Astros were entirely a product of the poor hitters he was facing - his command was much better those starts, he wasn't just getting away with hangers.
by JakeS on Jun 14, 2007 11:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
by rxmeister on Jun 15, 2007 7:19 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: TSIF!
Tim: "So, Matt, like, what do you do when you know, you're throwing 98 mph and snapping off unhittable curveballs you know, but like, you have trouble locating them you know?"
Morris: * strangles Lincecum *
by JakeS on Jun 15, 2007 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

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