Navigation: Jump to content areas:

Network Bar & Login
Section Navigation
Main Blog Content
Secondary Sidebar: Links to Recent Stories, FanPosts and FanShots
Masthead

Around SBN: Dog Football! Which Breeds Are Best Suited For The Gridiron?

Some interesting defensive data...

by jponry on Oct 3, 2007 10:47 AM PDT

MGL has posted the top three and bottom three at each position in terms of UZR... a few Giants showed up on both lists.

http://www.insidethebook.com/ee/index.php/site/article/best_and_worst_of_2007_uzr/

The Good:

Vizquel - +16 (3rd best shortstop)
Feliz - +28 (best third baseman)
Winn - +7 (third best NL RF)

The Bad:

Bonds - -23 (3rd worst NL LF)
Roberts - -26 (worst CF in the majors!)

http://jinaz-reds.blogspot.com/2007/10/2007-fielding-data.html
A dude named JinAZ has also posted some defensive ratings, based on THT's RZR. Notable Giants numbers:

Klesko - -4
Ortmeier - +5.1
Durham - -12.1 (owch)
Frandsen - -0.1 (as a 2b)
Feliz - +28.6 (damn, he's good)
Vizquel - +12.9
Bonds - -2.3 (not so bad here)
Roberts - -5.2 (as a CF)
Davis - -1.9 (as a CF)
Winn - +7.0 (as a RF)
Schierholtz - +4.5

Any thoughts? It looks pretty clear that Dave Roberts needs to not start in CF next year... (with his offense... that signing's looking pretty bad to me right now.)

This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.

Tweet Comment 23 comments | 0 recs |

Do you like this story?

Comments

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

Dave Roberts needs to be a pinch runner exclusively next year. An very expenive pinch runner. It won the Red Sox a WS.

Can't w8 for '08!

by southcitysteve on Oct 3, 2007 10:40 AM PDT reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

Thanks for the link jponry.

I didn't think Roberts would be that bad in CF, yikes. In 2006 he played mostly LF for the Padres and had a very nice rating, definitely way into the positive side of things, but its unfortunate to have to play him there because his bat is so weak for a LF.

by xanthan on Oct 3, 2007 10:44 AM PDT reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

Ichiro -14?

wow.

Brian Anderson: converting saves and dominating as best he can.

by JT Jordan on Oct 3, 2007 10:45 AM PDT reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

And Jeter at -27.9 . . .he's still going to get the Gold Glove. Ugh.

Brian Anderson: converting saves and dominating as best he can.

by JT Jordan on Oct 3, 2007 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

That sounds about right. I live in new york and watch a ton of yankee games...yankee fans will never admit that A-rod is a better shortstop than Jeter. All those highlight reel plays he makes are making them forget about all the errors he makes.

by sup3rk1ng on Oct 3, 2007 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

And the lack of ground he covers.

by KCE on Oct 3, 2007 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

Ah, but you gotta love those pirouettes!

***

Succumb to the Enchanted t-shirt! Adopted dad of Minor Izzy

by hairball on Oct 3, 2007 12:21 PM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

Pastadiving

Billy Hayes: Nine more big-league plate appearances than you.

by delorean on Oct 3, 2007 4:27 PM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

But the intangibles!! There are so many!!

Nattowear | comics | Durham? I hardly know 'im!

by Natto on Oct 3, 2007 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

Interestingly, the JinAZ data is completely opposite on Ichiro... so who knows.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on Oct 3, 2007 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions

The THT RZR data which is

what JinAZ's numbers are based on, has Ichiro! making a very large number of out of zone plays, #1 in MLB among CFs in fact. It has him fairly mediocre at plays in zone. The large number of out of zone plays push Ichiro! to the top.

by rfloh on Oct 3, 2007 1:52 PM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

-1.9 from Davis? And +4.5 from Schierholtz?

Really?

Steve Kline: Pretty okay, but only on a whole season basis and not based on what he's doing now.

by groug on Oct 3, 2007 11:06 AM PDT reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

That seems like a sample size anomaly.

by KCE on Oct 3, 2007 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

those two are obviously pretty small sample sizes, so the data would be more likely to be on the wonky side.

I just included them to be complete.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on Oct 3, 2007 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

Oh, I'm not debating that it's a small sample size, but Davis looked really good out in center and Schierholtz looked pretty average in right.

Oh well.

Steve Kline: Pretty okay, but only on a whole season basis and not based on what he's doing now.

by groug on Oct 3, 2007 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

This is totally anecdotal, but Giants announcers several times this year have described Raj Davis as initially misreading a fly ball but catching up to it thanks to his speed. So it's possible a ratings system would sniff out his defensive lapses.

Jesse Foppert: Welcome home, my son. And meet your adopted brother, Kelvin Pichardo. He's from the Dominican Republic.

by leftymalo on Oct 3, 2007 11:41 AM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

As long as Roberts only plays LF, we'll have an awfully good defensive outfield next year. Unless Winn and schierholtz surprise, they won't supply much power, but they'll get to a lot of balls.

If they could move Roberts, I'd like these lineups:

Vs. LHP:
Winn - LF
Davis - CF
Schierholtz - RF

Vs. RHP
Lewis - LF
Winn - CF
Schierholtz - RF

World Series prediction: Cleveland over Chicago in six games. (I guess I'm still Klesko's adoptive pop; they gypsies weren't interested.)

by Goofus on Oct 3, 2007 11:40 AM PDT reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

With Winn in the lineup, Goofus, the Giants will once again be stuck with a couple of center field bats. But if the Giants are stuck with Randy again, your ideas seem sound.

I'm hoping Freddie can play well enough defensively in center to play there though. Randy is really a left fielder. He plays the corners better than center, and his arm is far less exposed in left than right.

I could see Dan Ortmeier platooning with Nate in right. Dan hit righties better than lefties with the Giants this year, but over his minor league career I believe he hit lefties better.

If the Giants could somehow get a REAL bat in left field, I could be reasonably satisfied with platoons of Davis and Lewis in center and Schierholtz and Ortmeier in right. That would presumedly mean that the Giants had traded Dave Roberts and Winn. Randy has probably grown into his salary and if his limited no-trade could be worked around, might bring a bit in return. Dave hasn't yet grown into his salary and likely would need the Giants to pick some of it up in order to be dealt.

Regarding Ortmeier, the Giants appeared to be grooming him for first base. But I doubt he'll hit well enough to be an everyday corner outfielder, let alone an everyday first baseman.

by sharksrog on Oct 9, 2007 12:15 AM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

I am a fan of defensive metrics, but it bugs the crap out of me when they differ so much (Bonds, Roberts)

by zenbitz on Oct 3, 2007 12:30 PM PDT reply actions

The metrics use different sources

for their raw data.

UZR uses data from Stats Inc.

THT's RZR and Dewan's +/- use data from BIS.

by rfloh on Oct 3, 2007 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

I would like to see Chris Dial's work as well. It shouldn't be too long, I hope.

by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Oct 4, 2007 11:23 AM PDT reply actions

Re: Some interesting defensive data...

He usually seems to come out with it around the time the Gold Gloves are announced.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on Oct 4, 2007 11:50 AM PDT up reply actions

I believe Dial uses ZR data from

STATS. So his numbers are likely to be more similar to MGL's UZR, as opposed to RZR and Dewan's +/-.

by rfloh on Oct 4, 2007 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions

Comments For This Post Are Closed

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Sp-giants21_ph_t_0501991449_part6_small

The McCovey Chronicles Fantasy League, For Money.

by GiantPain 3 days ago

37 comments | 3 recs

Calvin_and_hobbes_small

2012 Adoption Draft: Who's In?

by free f.p. #14 4 days ago

311 comments | 6 recs

Calvin_and_hobbes_small

2012 Adoption Draft: Rules Discussion

by free f.p. #14 7 days ago

148 comments | 4 recs

Honus_wagner4_small

Hector & Gregor's Excellent Adventure (In the VWL)

by Fla-Giant 7 days ago

30 comments | 3 recs

Calvin_and_hobbes_small

Community Prospect List: The Results

by free f.p. #14 13 days ago

72 comments | 20 recs

Recent FanPosts

2012 MLB Draft Snapshot – College Left Handed Pitchers

by shankbone 1 day ago

18 comments

Cormac McCarthy novel The Road

by foothillsfan 3 days ago

13 comments

2012 MLB Draft Snapshot – HS Left handed pitchers

by shankbone 3 days ago

16 comments | 1 recs

Angel Villalona reported to have a work visa

by Gianni 5 days ago

5 comments

2012 MLB Draft Snapshot – The Catchers

by shankbone 5 days ago

25 comments

Hidey-fern_small

Hiking on the 18th?

by Merope 6 days ago

4 comments | 1 recs

2012 MLB Draft Snapshot - The Shortstops

by shankbone 7 days ago

18 comments | 1 recs

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

Recent Posts

Copyright © 2012 Vox Media, Inc. All rights reserved.

Newsletter Signup About Us Frequently Asked Questions Terms of Use Privacy Policy Guiding Principles Advertise With Us Contact Us

Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.

OpenCalais - Powered by Thomson Reuters • Odds Shark