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Giants reportedly after Torii

Scroll down a bit through the Vikings-talk to see this semi-official rumour (which I hope is not true):

http://www.twincities.com/ci_7142263?source=most_viewed&nclick_check=1

This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.

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Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Say it ain't so, Sabes...say it ain't so.

by biff pocoroba on Oct 11, 2007 11:34 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Wouldn't it just figure that the one FA that we are all most unanimously against is the one Sabean wants most...
SJ Giants, 2007 Cal League champs! Couldn't have done it without the All-Father.

by EliminateMe on Oct 11, 2007 11:40 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
That's the Sabean I know and hate.
It's all my fault really.  Thanksgiving 1996 I sent him an email Begging him not to get JT Snow...

Really, that's the truth.  I am sure circumstantial evidence of this exists in the usenet archives...

by zenbitz on Oct 11, 2007 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Early Days of the Internet
Perhaps Sabean never got your message.

In those days, email was in its experimental stage, and was delivered by frisky poodles wearing knapsacks.

by Moggeee on Oct 11, 2007 7:27 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
well the only remedy to that is that we all now should be unanimously against getting johann santana, a-rod, and albert pujols
Free Justin Knoedler! (not by trading him to another team though)

by llamalimbo1 on Oct 11, 2007 6:01 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
<img src="http://www.darth_vader_no.gif">
Dave Righetti: You don't know him. / Read My Blog, Because I Write It

by howtheyscored on Oct 11, 2007 11:41 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Is this what you're looking for?
SJ Giants, 2007 Cal League champs! Couldn't have done it without the All-Father.

by EliminateMe on Oct 11, 2007 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The image isn't working for me...
Lance Niekro AAA Watch: 108 AB .287/.352/.463 6 2B 2 3B 3 HR 11 BB -- 0.2 IP 27.00 ERA 3 H 0 BB 0 K (through 8/19)

by WalrusMan on Oct 11, 2007 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

This Just In.....
Ben Copeland, because face it, Who was left to adopt ?

by nvsfg on Oct 11, 2007 12:28 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: This Just In.....
This one wins.
Not boring: Emmanuel Burriss: Not fascist: SF Dugout. Not boring nor fascist: CLE winning the World Series.

by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Oct 11, 2007 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: This Just In.....
Thank You Baron(ess). Just a Q&D for something different.
Ben Copeland, because face it, Who was left to adopt ?

by nvsfg on Oct 11, 2007 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

or this?
2002? I'm over it. But I'll never be over Rich Aurilia.

by wjackalope on Oct 11, 2007 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
The blurb says the Giants are "expected" to pursue Hunter, but who exactly is expecting this and why?  I know there are going to be plenty of Hunter rumors, as the world thinks the Giants would like to replace Bonds' bat (or just increase production in general) somehow/someway.  I just don't see this as a "rumor", as it sounds a lot more like speculation.

by sfgfan on Oct 11, 2007 11:45 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Yup- I know what you're saying. It leaves a lot of questions unanswered. Speculation for sure. But I do take a little more notice when a legit newspaper prints it. Besides, what are rumours if they aren't speculative?

by BigO on Oct 11, 2007 11:51 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
It says "expected."  Nothing to see here, move along folks.
"They can trade me," Bonds said. "I don't think they will, though. It's not like I want to be traded, man. I'm a Giant. I'm stuck here till the end."!

by GameSix on Oct 11, 2007 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
But isn't it obvious to even the dumbest beat reporter that the Giants don't need a center fielder? I don't think they'd be "expecting" it if they weren't getting signals of some sort from the Giants' front office.

by Evan on Oct 11, 2007 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
What do you want it to say? Definite interest? Short of Sabean coming out on record saying that he is dead set on signing Hunter - something he would never do even if were true - this is the sort of "evidence" that is grist for the mill...

by BigO on Oct 11, 2007 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
It's not that it just says "expected."  It doesn't explain why it's "expected."  Is it expected because a "source" tipped them off?  Or is it "expected" because they think the Giants want to fill Bonds' void?  Thats why I call it speculation, rather than a rumor.

To me, a rumor is when someone cites a source (anything) named or unnamed.  It has to originate from somewhere.  A rumor isn't when a news writer says, "I think this team needs an outfielder, that make Torii a possibility."

by sfgfan on Oct 11, 2007 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If this was coming from
Rosenthal, it would have more credibility, since he appears to be the guy that all the FOs like to leak to.

by rfloh on Oct 11, 2007 2:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't confuse quanity for quality
SF outfield is a weak link that I can see GM Sabean looking to upgrade. THunter, AJones, ARowand will most likely receive inquiry from the Giants this winter.

by wilriv21 on Oct 11, 2007 1:05 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
Every part of our offense is a weak link.  We don't have strong links. Why go after outfielders?
Steve Kline: How okay is he, really? I would say he is pretty okay.

by groug on Oct 11, 2007 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
Because there is some talent available in FA market. The other holes can either be filled with trades, players within organization, signings or re-signings.

by wilriv21 on Oct 11, 2007 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
I could be wrong on this, but...

Giants Outfield talent > Giants infield talent.

FA outfield talent > FA infield talent.

Double fudge brownies...  Angela...

In the end, something's gotta give.  Because that's one helluva lot of holes to fill.  Personally speaking, I'd prefer they look for a left side of the infield, and trot out a younger outfield.  But honestly, I don't know where I'd even begin, let alone end!  I'm just curious as hell to see what happens next.  I just don't want to go into next season as angry about the offense as I was at the start of 07.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on Oct 11, 2007 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
Yes, Sabean has plenty of work to do this winter. Should be very interesting. Left side of infield does need to be address. Vizquel and Feliz should be Plan B while Sabean attempts to upgrade. Should Sabean inquire into Hank Blalock? Could SF/FL work a deal for Cabrera? Could Teahen be a Giant? Should Sabean deal for LaRoche? Will Betemit be the answer? Does Jack Wilson become the Giants SS in 2008? How about Juan Uribe? Does Sabean deal for Michael Young or pick Eckstein off FA market? Stay tuned.

by wilriv21 on Oct 11, 2007 4:21 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
LaRoche=Yes

I have always been a closet Blalock fan, but the guy did have a rib removed from his body this season. He would cost about the same as "Abe" Feliz, and he's light on defensive skill. He hit well in 2007 until the injury. Matter of fact he hit career bests in OBP/SLG/OPS at .293/.358/.543/.901, his career numbers are less impressive, .273/.337/.462/.799, but still better than Feliz (except HR's).

No to fat guys from Florida that eat their annual contract dollars in calories each day.

I have always liked Betemit. Cheap, decent fielder, light bat but good OBP/SLG/OPS.

Young=Hell Yes, but is that even possible ? What's the trade ?

Ben Copeland, because face it, Who was left to adopt ?

by nvsfg on Oct 11, 2007 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
The other day I had a daydream : Zito for Betemit, straight up, full salary obligations.

Yanks get 200 IP of league average pitching for the upcoming years.  Giants get a starting 3B, and freed from $100m of obligation.  Betemit gets a starting job.  Zito gets 20 wins a year for pitching kinda crappy.

Everyone happy, right?

by SnowLeopard on Oct 11, 2007 10:40 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
I had a real dream before the 2006 season that the Giants traded Steve Finley and a minor leaguer for Brette Tomko.

At the time I thought it was a nightmare. After living through Finley I can see that it just would have been trading crap for poop, with a Sabean insurance minor leaguer to seal the sanitary baggie. When I woke up, I actually believed that it had happened, and it took me a while to realize it was a dream.

Dave Righetti: You don't know him. / Read My Blog, Because I Write It

by howtheyscored on Oct 11, 2007 10:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
I had a dream that I was waiting in line for a book signing. It was pretty lame.
Nattowear | comics | Durham? I hardly know 'im!

by Natto on Oct 11, 2007 10:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
I had a dream.  It was a "naughty" one.  I didn't want it to end.  
Screw the Giants, but not Omar. I'm getting drunk and watching some footy.

by PacBellBoozer on Oct 11, 2007 11:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
Blalock= do not want.

Home career:

.303/.372/.525, 1 HR/20 AB

Away career:

.243/.301/.398, 1 HR/32 AB

Arlington helps.

Brian Anderson: I can has spot in Fresno 'pen?

by Anticon23 on Oct 12, 2007 8:13 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
That's like a total of 50 ABs. The difference in his away stats between .243 and .303 is slightly less than two hits.

I'm not saying you don't know what you're talking about when it comes to Blalock at large (I have no opinion on the guy at all), but this is very poor evidence to support that.

At least in this case, I'm pretty sure I'm not confusing quantity with quality.

Dave Righetti: You don't know him. / Read My Blog, Because I Write It

by howtheyscored on Oct 12, 2007 8:24 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
Howie...that's one HR per 20 AB, not 20 AB total. Obviously Blalock has a lot more than 20 home AB. The numbers above are based on 1391 home ABs and 1393 away...

Now, if we want to talk small sample size, his .349 OPS in 11 ABs at AT&T is definitely too small a sample to be evidence of anything. But it doesn't help his case any.

SJ Giants, 2007 Cal League champs! Couldn't have done it without the All-Father.

by EliminateMe on Oct 12, 2007 9:46 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
Oh! That was completely my mistake. I knew something about that small number sounded wrong, but the way these guys change levels all the time I had no idea his service at a specific park and just jumped the gun. Like I said, I don't know a lot about Blalock to begin with

Sorry for the confusion. And thanks for straightening that out.

Dave Righetti: You don't know him. / Read My Blog, Because I Write It

by howtheyscored on Oct 12, 2007 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
Did anyone notice how good Blalock was after coming back from his injury? .313/.405/.656.

It's not much more than a hunch, but I think that after years of squandering his talent he may finally be getting back on track. If Texas is still willing to trade him cheaply, which I doubt, I'd take him on.

by Evan on Oct 12, 2007 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Don't confuse quanity for quality
Okay, now we are talking small sample size - 64 ABs in September. Frandsen went .370/.427/.479 over the same period. I wouldn't bet on him to sustain those numbers, either.
SJ Giants, 2007 Cal League champs! Couldn't have done it without the All-Father.

by EliminateMe on Oct 12, 2007 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cartman sums up my sentiments nicely at 00:41
Bochy: grounded until he stops hitting and running with slow runners and crappy hitters

by Stuttering John Tamargo on Oct 11, 2007 1:37 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
The Giants don't need any more outfielders, unless they can somehow get Carl Crawford in a trade.  Assuming they don't get someone like that, their real offensive focus should be on the corner infielder positions.  Only two desirable names come to mind who MIGHT be expendable by their current organizations for the right price: Miguel Cabrera and Garret Atkins.  There aren't any available, good First Basemen out there unfortunately.  The other thing to note for the road back to success is that the current bullpen is terrible.

by sfshortstop on Oct 11, 2007 1:40 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
If Sabean's phone has been been a-ring-ring-ringin' with offers for Winn and Roberts, I'd be down with a Hunter signing at the right price.  Otherwise, I'm thinking it'd be a bad bad thing.

by Goofus on Oct 11, 2007 1:49 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Even if the phone has been ringing, it's going to drive me nuts if we go after Hunter instead of Andruw Jones.

by Evan on Oct 11, 2007 2:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
If the price is right, would prefer Andruw over Torii.

by wilriv21 on Oct 11, 2007 2:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Same here, but I don't want either of them.
Nattowear | comics | Durham? I hardly know 'im!

by Natto on Oct 11, 2007 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

AJones is shiny shiny
He would look good in 2008 and in 2012. Got to at least give it a shot.

by wilriv21 on Oct 11, 2007 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: AJones is shiny shiny
If we sign Andruw, I'll be thinking, "This probably isn't going to work out, but I'm kind of excited anyway." If we sign Torii, it's just business as usual.

by Evan on Oct 11, 2007 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: AJones is shiny shiny
Ugh, I don't want to see him in SF in 2012.
Nattowear | comics | Durham? I hardly know 'im!

by Natto on Oct 11, 2007 2:54 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: AJones is shiny shiny
Unless he's on another team.
Nattowear | comics | Durham? I hardly know 'im!

by Natto on Oct 11, 2007 2:54 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
The Giants must have a dream of playing three center field bats in their outfield.  Apparently playing two last season wasn't enough.

by sharksrog on Oct 12, 2007 8:15 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Pass.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on Oct 11, 2007 3:15 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Sheesh, this many posts and no one's made a joke about Tori Spelling, Tori Amos, or anything like that?

by Skaldheim on Oct 11, 2007 3:56 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
We left them for you, man. Go for it.
SJ Giants, 2007 Cal League champs! Couldn't have done it without the All-Father.

by EliminateMe on Oct 11, 2007 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
2 years ago, i woulda said yes

now...if sabean wastes a ton of caishe on him, im going to be ill

by bacci40 on Oct 11, 2007 3:57 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Maybe Sabes is gonna one of my patented video game maneuvers and sign Hunter, then trade him for a first round pick.  Sabes is crafty like that.

by ololo3 on Oct 11, 2007 4:06 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
I don't see what's wrong with Torii.  Unlike Andruw he actually plays good defense and doesn't hit 250 every year.  Even in ATT I think he could hit 25 homers because he hits it so hard, rarely are one of his homers a high pop up that makes it out in the dome.  Plus, in day games, he would completely rake with the wind going out, that's when his oppo hits will go over the wall instead of off it.

by Azmanz on Oct 11, 2007 4:51 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
The problem here is that this isn't a footrace between Andruw and Torii to make it to the Giants. Torii is not made desirable by Andruw Jones being a bad choice. Both guys are undesirable.

Furthermore, between the two Jones would be the clear winner anyway. BA is not the end all consideration going around here. Jones is two years younger, OBPs twenty points higher for his career, and sluggs the hell out of Hunter in an average year. Both are righties, so their power would take the same minor hit at AT&T. Both are multiple Gold Glovers on defense, for whatever little that is worth.

Hunter has a bit of an injury history that may or may not worry somebody, and Jones has a bit of a fat-jury history that may or may not worry somebody.

So of the two, Andruw makes a very good case for being the superior choice. Like I said, though, it's not a matter of "either/or" here. Not pursuing Torii doesn't mean we will be pursuing Andruw, and the other way around.

Now, this is not to say that signing one of the two is necessarily a bad idea. And it all comes down to your opinion on two things: 1) whether or not the Giants can compete within 3 years, and 2)the value of playing the kids (quotes optional) that we have.

If you believe the Giants can be competitive within three years, then one of these two guys could easily be an asset on that competitive team. If you don't believe they can be, then it's not worth it because in three years Hunter will likely be well into his decline, and Jones is already showing signs that he might be in danger of an early decline period (which would put him declining around 32 or 33... in about three years). In those decline phases, these guys will not have much value on the post-three year competitive Giants team.

If you believe that there is value in playing our prospects (ditto quotes), then signing either of these guys would be a liability, especially if neither Winn nor Roberts is movable during the offseason, for the obvious reasons.

Personally, I believe that - while maybe unlikely - the Giants can be competetive within three years. I also believe that there is value in evaluating each of these players we have on the periphery. Schierholtz needs to get every chance he can, I love everything about Fred Lewis even if I completely understand his significant limitations. I'm not particularly high on Ortmeier, though if he's getting his shot at first that's no harm no foul. And I think it's important to see which Rajai is the real Rajai - the high OBP leadoff hitter with speed, or the jumpy, no plan at the plate AAAA guy we saw when he was in his rough patches. The first Rajai could be an important part of a good NL team for 5-7 or so years. The other Rajai is the guy who couldn't crack a Pirates lineup, and we obviously don't want that.

I also believe that if only one or none of these guys demonstrates value over the course of 2008, then there will be FA talent over the 2008 and 2009 offseasons that will make us not care about either Jones or Hunter. So I think we can actually have the best of both worlds. Not everybody thinks that, and I can see an honest argument for signing one of the two guys.

I just wouldn't do it.

Dave Righetti: You don't know him. / Read My Blog, Because I Write It

by howtheyscored on Oct 11, 2007 6:06 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Oh yeah... I'd like to claim my $10,000 McCovey Bucks in cash. Incentives are awesome!
Dave Righetti: You don't know him. / Read My Blog, Because I Write It

by howtheyscored on Oct 11, 2007 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
I think you've earned it, but personally I'd deduct 1000 McCovey Bucks for "fat-jury history."

by Evan on Oct 11, 2007 7:21 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
After that post, I'd say Howie earned the $10K, and I kind of like the "fat-jury" comment :-)
Ben Copeland, because face it, Who was left to adopt ?

by nvsfg on Oct 11, 2007 8:09 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Mistake.
The rally pumpkin guy, round and full of seeds; unlike the Giants.

by jtoj on Oct 11, 2007 5:06 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Ewwwwwwwwwwwww

So overrated

Frandsen for 3B (til July 08)

by NeifiChicken on Oct 11, 2007 5:25 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Of course, the Giants are trying to sign him
He's a big name aging free agent who will demand a lot more money and more years that a smart club would sign him for. PLUS, he plays a non-need position for the Giants.

Why wouldn't the Giants go after him?

Bonds stands alone.

by nostocksjustbonds on Oct 11, 2007 5:36 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
I believe the Giants have no interest in Torii Hunter whatsoever. This is just idle speculation on the part of a writer who doesn't know what he's talking about. I would believe it if a Giant beat writer mentioned it, but considering the tampering rules, why would someone in the Giants' organization tell some Minnesota guy that they're interested in Torii Hunter?? This guy is just guessing as to who would be interested.
Joe Simpson:"I was told by a player that the hardest throwers he saw all year were Ubaldo Jimenez and RANDY MESSENGER"

by rxmeister on Oct 11, 2007 6:38 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Bah, not worth wetting your pants over it.  

I've seen a number of columnists speculate on Torii coming here, this guy is probably just regurgitating what he read in other places.

"I'm a Giant now... I like watching the ball get up there" - Wendell Fairley "I'm really proud to be on this team." - Nate Schierholtz

by obsessivegiantscompulsive on Oct 12, 2007 12:06 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Why does ANYONE worry about rumors?  Most rumors don't come true, and many things that happen were never rumored to begin with.

A rumor that the Giants will sign Torii Hunter?  No problem.  The fact that the Giants re-signed Brian Sabean -- well, that couldn't REALLY have happened, could it?  Must have been merely a rumor.  :)

Thank goodness we didn't get TOO excited by the rumors that Brian would be gone.  If we had, there could have been a rash of suicides back in July.

by sharksrog on Oct 12, 2007 8:19 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
a little part of me commits suicide every time i consider the giants these days.
"Bri-an Sab-e-an, I hope you're satisfied with what you've done..."

by The Gene Hackman on Oct 12, 2007 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Giants reportedly after Torii
Good point.  With Sabean holding everything close to the vest, his moves are usually a surprise, not something that's rumored beforehand.

by Goofus on Oct 12, 2007 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

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