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The 'Pen

Okay, we all know the Giants bullpen has stunk it up pretty good this year, but there do seem to be some bright spots on the horizon. And I think there are a few key moves which could really improve them as a group. Here's a quick rundown of my thoughts on the subject:

MUNTER

THE CASE: First, why is he still on the team? I've heard and read about the team considering sending him down, yet here he still is, walking guys with regularity and giving up hit after hit. I think today's debacle was the last straw, but that's also what I thought after his debacle against the Dodgers. It was then that all the Munter down/Wilson up rumors started, but when Wilson was healthy he was optioned to Fresno, and only came up after Worrell was DL'd. Seemingly, all it took to regain Felipe's confidence was one meaningless DP grounder in a blowout in Houston. The worst part is Felipe's insistance on using him in key spots like today.

THE VERDICT: I think he is the key. The bullpen cannot seriously improve until he is removed from the equation. Send him down. Today.

ACCARDO

THE CASE: I've made my bromantic feelings about Accardo quite clear. Despite his poor performance yesterday, he's got the nastiest stuff on the team. Here's a quote from Alou in Draper's notes column from today:

"He's got a Mariano Rivera-esque cutter that I think he could use in certain situations [as a closer]," Alou said of Accardo. "I think he's going to be a good closer some day."

This makes me think two things:

  1. I thought that was a slider. And because of the similarity in grips, isn't it a stretch to call it a cutter when it breaks a foot down and a foot to the left? I guess it's no more of a stretch than calling it a 92 mph slider.
  2. The last time Felipe said a young Giants reliever who I loved was a future closer, Sabean traded him for a certain turkey-necked catcher whose name I will not mention. So, should I stop loving him now just to avoid the heartbreak?
THE VERDICT: He needs to pitch more often in high-leverage situations, like today in the spot Munter was used for instance.

WILSON

THE CASE: He also appears to have closer stuff, and better command then Accardo (small sample size, small sample size, small sample size). Plus, he just looks kind of intimidating.

THE VERDICT: Like Accardo, I'd like to see him used more in high pressure spots.

CORREIA

THE CASE: Although his velocity seems to have dropped a little since he first made his debut, he has been effective since the middle of spring training, no matter what the role or amount of rest, and his K rate is among the best on the team.

THE VERDICT: Like Wilson and Accardo, he needs to be playing a larger role.

BENITEZ

THE CASE: Can I just skip this one? Okay, his velocity seems to be returning, his command and off-speed pitches do not.

THE VERDICT: I'd like to see him marginalized until he looks better. Of course, I'd also like a pony for Christmas, but I don't think I'm getting that either.

WORRELL

THE CASE: He looked so good early, and so bad lately. His stuff is not good, so it's going to be all about his command, which just hasn't been there. I'd feel a whole lot better if everybody wasn't saying this injury of his didn't affect his pitching.

THE VERDICT: Give him the benefit of the doubt and let him try and work out his problems on the mound. But have Accardo, Wilson or Correia warming just in case.

KLINE

THE CASE: Never liked him, never will.

THE VERDICT: A necessary evil. The team needs a lefty, and like Worrell and Benitez, his contract will keep him on the mound more frequently than his performances probably would.

HENNESSEY

THE CASE: Pitched very well out of the rotation if you look at his primary numbers, very poorly if you look at most of his peripherals. Not accustomed to pitching in relief.

THE VERDICT: Felipe stated publicly yesterday that the team is carrying one more pitcher than they need. Why? When Worrell rejoins the team, send him down to Fresno to start every 5th day.

So I would have a six man bullpen featuring the following (in order of how much I swear when they're in the game):

Accardo
Wilson
Correia
Worrell
Kline
Benitez

Please chip in your two cents, and comment with your own ideal bullpens if they differ from mine.

This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.

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Ideal bullpen
First I would like to rescind a prior trade for a catcher to remain nameless.  My bullpen looks like this:

Nathan
Liriano
Accardo
Wilson
Kline
Correia

Unless we can make some ridiculous ficticious moves I am in agreement with most of your thoughts on the 'pen.  I would list Kline slihgtly lower on the obsenity list.  I can see Correia carving out a nice niche in the land of setup men.  I think he is better suited for that role that the rotation.  Hennessey is most useful to the team as a stop-gap guy in the rotation.  If he ends up as a regular due to injuries or ineffectiveness that is okay as long as he is not the long-term solution.

"San Diego, which of course in German means a whale's vagina" - Ron Burgundy

by W8ingForATitle on May 24, 2006 5:02 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: Ideal bullpen
When I saw that bullpen I creamed my shorts a little. And now I'm doing what I always do post-coitus -- weeping softly into my pillow.
"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f***ing amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on May 24, 2006 5:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Ideal bullpen
I thought you were going to say you reach for your wallet.
This post brought to you by Chico's Bail Bonds.

by Goofus on May 24, 2006 7:03 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Ideal bullpen
If I was projecting, I would have said "Apologize profusely for the poor performance."
This post brought to you by Chico's Bail Bonds.

by Goofus on May 25, 2006 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Ideal bullpen
Coincidentally, that's the same post-coital ritual followed by members of the Giants bullpen.
"Look at that: I didn't even know I had a dime in the shoe." - F.Alou

by EliminateMe on May 25, 2006 5:06 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
I think you nailed it. Munter has to go (and probably will soon). I don't see much upside there... should another spot on the 40-man become necessary down the road, it wouldn't upset me if Munter was DFA'd.

I'd like to see more of Wilson and more consistency from Correia before I get too excited about either of them, but I am optimistic.

I'd also like to think that Felipe is serious about using an 11-man staff. If not, I'd rather have Taschner, Sanchez, Hines, Miller, or even Tejera in the back of the pen than Hennessey.

"Robb Nen is going to get you" - Benito Santiago to Chipper Jones, 10/7/02

by Pants Man on May 24, 2006 5:06 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
Great post, Josh.

This might sound insane, but if everyone thinks Accardo's going to make a great closer someday, why not test that hypothesis sooner rather than later? Like, for instance, this weekend. If he only gets up in the bullpen and then comes into pitch for clearly defined save situations it'll probably prevent incidents like last night, when he was ineffective after having warmed up numerous times in the past few days without ever being used.

As for the rest, use 'em however you want, just make sure Brian Wilson's part of the mix so those of us on the blog can strip-mine the Beach Boys song titles for puns.

by Kitspool on May 24, 2006 5:11 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
I agree. Felipe actually tested that hypothesis very early, using Accardo in a save situation last year during his second big-league appearance. Accardo blew the save in the ninth and the game in the Brower-aided tenth and the Tyler Walker era was born. Accardo hasn't seen a save situation since... I hope that changes soon.

And believe it or not... I'd like to see Benitez pitch more often. The sporadic work of a closer (three appearances between April 29th and May 20th) helps explain why his arm strength is improving but his command isn't.

I know none of us expect to see Benitez pitch like he did in 2004, but there are some interesting splits from that season in terms of days of rest between outings.

0 DR: 19.1 IP, 0.47 ERA, 0.83 WHIP
1 DR: 20.2, 0.00, 0.48
2 DR: 11.1, 0.79, 0.62
3-5 DR: 16.2, 4.02, 1.14

Let's trot that fat boy out there 3-4 times a week regardless of the score and see if he can't gain some command.

"Robb Nen is going to get you" - Benito Santiago to Chipper Jones, 10/7/02

by Pants Man on May 24, 2006 5:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
Interesting.  As much as I dislike seeing him out there, I would have to concur.  Plus, anything at all that reduces the risk of walking in a run I'm a fan of.

by amoose on May 25, 2006 2:10 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
Accardo
Correia
Sanchez
Taschner
Valdez
Wilson

This is the bullpen I would like to see, if we were the Royals or Marlins.  Obvioulsy we can't just say sayonara to Worrell, Kline, and Benitez, but I think this would be a fun albeit scary bullpen to watch.

Depending on where the Giants decide to go next year, Bonds yes or Bonds no, this may be the bullpen of the future.

by bigfly71 on May 24, 2006 5:24 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
I should have said assuming Schmidt and Wright stay, otherwise Sanchez will most likely end up in the rotation.

by bigfly71 on May 24, 2006 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
Hard to imagine Schmidt is going to test the market after his comments this offseason that the Giants picking up his $10mil option was "a mixed blessing." Don't need a weatherman...

by Roger on May 25, 2006 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
As dominant as Sanchez has been in Double-A ball, why haven't the Giants moved him up to Fresno? It seems like he would benefit most from being in Triple-A right now.

by oelayat on May 24, 2006 5:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
Munter is already gone, no word on who is coming up.  Accardo has pitched the ninth inning on a few ocassions recently.  Each time, as I recall, he easily got the first two hitters out, then wnet to hell.  He needs to have a one inning assignment, either the 7th or 8th to learn and acclimate.  Then in a year or two, especially if he develops another pitch, he will be ready to step in as closer.  He is only 24 - too soon to rush him into the closer's role.  I agree with Pants Man:  Let Benitez pitch over an extended period of time, then see how he is doing.

by allfrank on May 24, 2006 5:50 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
You're right about Accardo's problems getting the 27th out. Along with his command, that's his last hurdle, and until he gets past those, I agree -- his ceiling is as a 8th inning guy. With Worrell and Benitez around, he's probably an 7th inng guy for now.

I disagree that he needs a new pitch, however. He's got three (fastball, cutter/slider, and split), all of which are working for him as strikeout pitches.

"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f***ing amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on May 24, 2006 9:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

*UPDATE
Munter has already been sent down. Within an hour of my original post. Do you see the power which I wield? Are you not intimidated? Now, I must attempt a "heat check" to see how much influence I really have:

Sabean, I command you to immediately DFA Vizcaino, retire Will Clark's number, drop the price of beer to 5 cents, and make Tomko's wife my sex slave. Obey me! Obey me!

"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f***ing amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on May 24, 2006 6:14 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Compromise?
How about I drop the price of beer BY five cents, retire Vizcaino's number, and make Will Clark your sex slave?

Oh, and if it makes you feel any better, Tomko's wife is banging J.D. Drew.

Meaningless games since 1997: -8

by Brian Sabean on May 24, 2006 6:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Compromise?
And Derek Lowe is banging Tomko?

by tk on May 24, 2006 7:08 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sex Slaves can wait if beer is cheap
One heat check at a time, Josh. Stick with 5 cent beer.

And REALLY concentrate.

by Moggeee on May 25, 2006 12:59 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Compromise?
makes ME feel better...
"Baseball is life, the rest is just details."

by nick on May 25, 2006 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
Great analysis Josh! I will only add that had the MCCCW (McCovey Chronicles Conventional Wisdom)been running the Giants, we woulda had 1 world series title in the bank plus a NLDS win and probably a pennant in 2003 if not a return trip to the WS. And playoff spots both in 04 and 05.  Thats what Magowan paid for.

Unfortunately none of us are trust-fund baby boomers  like Magowan, so he gets to do what he wants. Which is to listen only to people who tell him what he wants to hear.

he blames tomko and i blame magowan, alou, morris, benitez, and a player to be named sooner rather than later.

by E Ticket on May 24, 2006 7:37 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

So my bullpen....
CL: Benitez
SU: Kline (by default)
SU: Accardo/Worrell
MR: Wilson
MR: Taschner/Tejera
MR: Acccardo/Worrell
MU: Correia

MU=Mop Up

I don't really see the point in having an 11-man pitching staff.  Alou has a history of abusing the bullpen (leading the league in appearances for 2 straight years I beleive) and also he's having a hard enough time finding playing time for one of our bench players.  Who are we going to call up too?  Linden is probably going to come up for Ortmeier Friday, but after that we've either got Ishikawa, or Sanchez/Schierholtz who have no experience at all.

Jason Ellison's numbers through 45 team games: 37 G 1 GS 19 AB

by WalrusMan on May 24, 2006 9:56 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
And in all fairness to Benitez, he's given up only 1 run this season and hasn't blown a single save.  But yes he does look ugly.  

I wonder if Giants fans will be satisfied with a closer until we have another one as good as Rob Nen.  That's a pretty tough yard stick to measure up to.  

by orangeandblackattack on May 24, 2006 11:28 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Mando
Actually, he has blown two saves -- one in Colorado, one the other day in Oakland -- he just managed to do it without allowing any earned runs.
"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f***ing amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on May 25, 2006 1:15 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Mando
Never mind.  Then F*&^ Benitez.  

by orangeandblackattack on May 25, 2006 7:17 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Mando
He's leading the league in VWPA*

"Vultured Wins Per Appearance"

by zenbitz on May 25, 2006 9:33 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

By any measure, Nen the standard
A Nen Yardstick vs. a Benitez Ugly Stick.

by Moggeee on May 25, 2006 1:04 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Re: By any measure, Nen the standard
Probably an unrealistic yardstick.  I think we'd have been happy with the Armando of 2004.
This post brought to you by Chico's Bail Bonds.

by Goofus on May 25, 2006 7:24 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Brian was Beguiled
THAT Armando (2004) was better than Nen.

And let's refrain from saying he was pitching in low stress games, under the radar. He was closing for the Defending World Series Champs.

by Moggeee on May 25, 2006 11:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Re: The 'Pen
THE 'PEN.

Am I the only one who thought this diary was about a new Wes Craven movie?  

by zenbitz on May 25, 2006 9:35 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

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