Cole Hamels and Matt Cain, All-Stars younger 30 with strong postseason pedigrees, are unsigned past this season. Either would make more sense for the Yankees, in the long term, than Wilson or the other top starters on this winter’s market.
5 months ago
Grant Brisbee
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your not alone, but...
i think Cain would look better in a Red sox uni. Lincecum is more of a pinstripe kind of guy…and I cant wait until Bumgarner heads to Philly…if only we had some sort of way to make sure they wouldnt leave via free agency..maybe we could figure out a way to make their orignial contracts last longer…what would something like that be called? oh well no big deal who needs pitching. i cant wait until Macier Izturis is a free agent and we can get that big bopper we always wanted.
Ride the tiger...You can see his stripes but you know he's clean.
by James Westfall on Jan 5, 2012 7:53 PM PST up reply actions
I would say the opposite. Maybe that’s the Pedro talking.
2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller
by Johnny Disaster on Jan 5, 2012 9:54 PM PST up reply actions
Why not... both?
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
by GiantPain on Jan 4, 2012 8:17 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
I might actually murder someone if both of those guys end up in pinstripes.
2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller
by Johnny Disaster on Jan 4, 2012 8:22 AM PST up reply actions
’The Janks payroll numbers are just absurd. $80M tied up in 4 players next year and “That leaves a lot of room for marquee talent, …”
Yes…as opposed to $31MM tied up in 2 players, one of whom will be fighting for the 5th starter spot and one of whom is no longer on the roster. And that leaves room for an Eli Whiteside minor league contract.
Boo
by LosGigantesTodoElTiempo on Jan 4, 2012 9:50 AM PST up reply actions
Eli got a major league contract.
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 10:06 AM PST up reply actions
I thought it was a split contract 150K minor/ 600K major depending on spring training. I could be wrong, but that was the initial reports.
LOL Spring Training.
I know it’s one of Grant’s standby bits, but nothing like 40 AB’s against questionable competition in meaningless games to base your decisions on.
GIANTS BASEBALL: HOPE LIKE HELL!
Didn't he have a couple hundred at bats of abomination last season?
GIANTS BASEBALL: HOPE LIKE HELL!
rec'd
Don't think he can cut it in the bigs? Brock Bond will be the bigger man and walk walk walk away.
Well, what do you expect
The Yankees didn’t really pursue anyone this off season so the writers had to start writing about who they can get next season.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 8:19 AM PST reply actions
I really think the Yankees are hosed for a couple of years.
Famous last words, but they have $125 million or something committed to six players in 2013, as well as $28 million in options for Cano and Granderson. They’re almost guaranteed to go over the luxury tax, which means that they’ll have to pay $30 million per year for a $20 million per year contract to Cain.
But, yeah, they’re the Yankees and they probably don’t care.
by Grant Brisbee on Jan 4, 2012 8:50 AM PST up reply actions
That's old Steinbrenner era talk
new Steinbrenner cares about a budget.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Thought experiment
If A-Rod was a free agent this offseason, what would he have gotten?
3/45 maybe? That’d probably be the high end.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
similar to Beltran I’d imagine. Maybe a little more? 3/45 might be right.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 11:08 AM PST up reply actions
Another thought experiment: how much would the Yankees have to pick up to make him tradeable to, say, the Giants?
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
To the Giants, probably all of it
To a rational team with some money, probably all of it but 40ish million.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
The top 50 gifs article is amazing
http://www.sbnation.com/2012/1/4/2681567/the-greatest-animated-sports-gifs-of-2011
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
by GiantPain on Jan 4, 2012 8:23 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
I like to think it's just the one.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
The beauty of this is that it is looped so well
It appears to happen multiple times.
GIANTS BASEBALL: HOPE LIKE HELL!
hint: it loops when the catcher teleports from squatting to kneeling
2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller
by Johnny Disaster on Jan 4, 2012 8:41 AM PST up reply actions
Sounds hawt.
Proud parent of SD-born Shane Loux.
If Cain is with us, who can be against us? - atxgiantsfan
NO EACHING ALLOWED!!
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 8:59 AM PST up reply actions
/eaches Lars
2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller
by Johnny Disaster on Jan 4, 2012 8:59 AM PST up reply actions
Aldon Smith is # 47
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 8:48 AM PST up reply actions
I think we identified Howie's mystery player
who moves around in the box before the pitch (no. 29)
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Thanks for the link
There went 30 minutes of my day. Some of those were unreal.
I am going to have nightmares on number 6.
Blerg
Holy shit
The “Booger Disposal Protocol” is maybe the funniest thing I’ve ever read. I’m literally crying. Tim Rattay’s dishwasher? WTF?
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
by kdl on Jan 4, 2012 9:21 AM PST up reply actions
Join Bois is hilarious.
Proud parent of SD-born Shane Loux.
If Cain is with us, who can be against us? - atxgiantsfan
Uh Jon Bois.
Proud parent of SD-born Shane Loux.
If Cain is with us, who can be against us? - atxgiantsfan
He really is. (Also, I didn’t even notice the misspelling.)
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
by kdl on Jan 4, 2012 9:24 AM PST up reply actions
Better than the overlord we have currently.
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
No argument here.
But he’s not a Giants fan, so suck it up.
by Grant Brisbee on Jan 4, 2012 10:04 AM PST up reply actions
So bad I can taste it
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
Balk Rules. #18
BALK RULES! IMPORTANT!
1. You can’t just be up there and just doin’ a balk like that.
1a. A balk is when you
1b. Okay well listen. A balk is when you balk the
1c. Let me start over
1c-a. The pitcher is not allowed to do a motion to the, uh, batter, that prohibits the batter from doing, you know, just trying to hit the ball. You can’t do that.
1c-b. Once the pitcher is in the stretch, he can’t be over here and say to the runner, like, “I’m gonna get ya! I’m gonna tag you out! You better watch your butt!” and then just be like he didn’t even do that.
1c-b(1). Like, if you’re about to pitch and then don’t pitch, you have to still pitch. You cannot not pitch. Does that make any sense?
1c-b(2). You gotta be, throwing motion of the ball, and then, until you just throw it.
1c-b(2)-a. Okay, well, you can have the ball up here, like this, but then there’s the balk you gotta think about.
1c-b(2)-b. Fairuza Balk hasn’t been in any movies in forever. I hope she wasn’t typecast as that racist lady in American History X.
1c-b(2)-b(i). Oh wait, she was in The Waterboy too! That would be even worse.
1c-b(2)-b(ii). “get in mah bellah” — Adam Water, “The Waterboy.” Haha, classic…
1c-b(3). Okay seriously though. A balk is when the pitcher makes a movement that, as determined by, when you do a move involving the baseball and field of
2. Do not do a balk please.
Ignoring Tim Mccarver since 2002.
SL
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
by kdl on Jan 4, 2012 9:59 AM PST up reply actions
At that moment, Novak wishes he didn’t have to wear white pants on TV.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 10:03 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah
That entire list kills.
I have Croix de Candlesticks older than you.
Golden Gate Beer Bars | Tweetybox
by troymccluresf on Jan 4, 2012 10:02 AM PST up reply actions
Holy shit
There are a lot of good ones in there that I never saw. Thanks for the link!
by fishmicmuffin on Jan 4, 2012 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
I love love love that article. Makes me literally cry every year.
Carter Jurica!
"Has anyone really been for even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?"
by GrahamCrakalaka on Jan 4, 2012 11:47 AM PST up reply actions
I like Cano, but..
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
why not?
/curious
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 9:14 AM PST up reply actions
Because
Matt Cain
Proud parent of SD-born Shane Loux.
If Cain is with us, who can be against us? - atxgiantsfan
Thank you for providing the correct answer jhiat
I would prefer that Matt Cain remain a Giant.
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
Cano can hit, of that there is no question..
but I prefer a little defense along with my hits.
Bottom 9 defensive 2B for 2011
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
yeah
If Cano was available for Cain I’d take it in a heartbeat if it seemed like Cain wouldn’t be re-signed.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 9:33 AM PST up reply actions
If Cano was available for Cain I’d take it in a heartbeat if it seemed like Cain wouldn’t be re-signed.
This is the key. If you have to, why not. Cano might end up being as expensive as Matt Cain in the long run however.
Robinson Cano 2b
4 years/$30M (2008-11), plus 2012-13 club options
■4 years/$30M (2008-11), plus 2012-13 club options
■signed extension with NY Yankees 2/08 (avoided arbitration, $4.55M-$3.2M)
■08:$3M, 09:$6M, 10:$9M, 11:$10M, 12:$14M club option ($2M buyout), 13:$15M club option ($2M buyout)
■NY Yankees exercised $14M club option for 2012 10/29/11
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
I only want to keep Cain if we get a hitter like Cano.
I only want a hitter like Cano if we can keep Cain.
I guess you could say it’s a matter of finding a way to make our Cain-yes into a Ca-no.
/shoots self
Better to be a Giants fan than an Athletic supporter!
/ golf clap
A slightly humorous , but valid point.
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
On a more serious reiteration,
I’m worried that the only thing worse than continuing to have astounding pitching with lousy offense losing games 2-1 will be having amazing hitting losing to mediocre pitching 14-12.
Over the past two and a half weeks, I’ve been re-watching my 2010 World Series DVD set, the World Series Blu Ray, and the Franchise DVDs. I already professed as much before watching, but Cain absolutely MUST stay, and seeing Andres again made me very sad.
Better to be a Giants fan than an Athletic supporter!
What about this guy?
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
My favorite Cain stat is totally SSS!
Post season
ER: 0
GIANTS BASEBALL: HOPE LIKE HELL!
by Cody_ransom on Jan 4, 2012 8:35 AM PST reply actions 2 recs
Cain would be a mistake in Yankee Stadium
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 8:36 AM PST reply actions
At least they won't want Lincecum
The Yankees prefer pitchers with bones in their arm.
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 8:38 AM PST reply actions
U R A BAD FAN!!!!1
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
/Giants encourage Nationals to forward Mark DeRosa on to NYY, citing all-bone, no-tendon wrist
Better to be a Giants fan than an Athletic supporter!
Insert my oft-repeated Brian Sabean on Matt Cain rant here.
Sabes needs to sign Cain before spring training starts, or trade him this offseason. He’s not going to get a huge haul for Cain if he trades him after the season starts (due to the changed FA comp rules in the new CBA) and if Sabes lets him walk in FA next offseason he runs the risk of only getting a 1-S round and a late 2nd round pick as compensation. When you look at the haul that Matt Latos, Ubaldo Jimenez and Gio Gonzalez have brought for their old teams in the past 6 months, it’s not hard to imagine what a package that Cain would bring back if he were made available to all comers.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
I wish I thought the Sabean regime knew how to trade for prospects.
by wcw on Jan 4, 2012 8:45 AM PST up reply actions
Well, you can think it even if it’s not true. Doublethink!
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
Doesn’t have to be all minor league prospects. I think Sabes will want to bring back mainly guys that are major league-ready due to the current makeup of the team and not wanting to poison the Timmy extension talks by signalling that they were going into a rebuilding mode.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
Brian Sabean is kind of like me playing Civ. There are some things I’m really good at, some things I’m really bad at, and some of each that I just love to do regardless of how good I am at them. I’m a whiz at building a culturally rich nation, for instance, and I dig expansion during the early stages of the game. This is my pitching development. I also love waging war, but I have no plan, patience, or strategy. I spend hundreds of years trying to take over one city because I never give myself the numbers I need or bother to wear down their defenses. Meanwhile, my undefended cities get rampaged for their sweet, sweet culture. This is my trading.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 9:07 AM PST up reply actions
capults are cool
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
/golf clap
2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller
by Johnny Disaster on Jan 4, 2012 10:56 AM PST up reply actions
I’m too shortsighted, though. If I have the choice between building a catapult and a strong melee or horseback unit, I don’t see the point in the catapult at that very second. And then I always forget to use them first when I do have them. It’s like Knight, Knight, Knight, Longbowman, Knight, Longbowman, Reduce Defenses, aw damn it….
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 9:23 AM PST up reply actions
You can also take over city
by surrounding it and destroying all the fields.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
No. I’mma try and kill dudes.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 9:28 AM PST up reply actions
That. Is why you fail.
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
Droppin' Jedi knowledge on y'all.
Proud parent of SD-born Shane Loux.
If Cain is with us, who can be against us? - atxgiantsfan
Yep.
I’ve got the highly advanced Portuguese armies rampaging around for a conquest victory, and I’m only now realizing that I could’ve ended the game centuries earlier by going for domination instead. Why is it so hard to kill dudes when it’s so fun?
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 9:35 AM PST up reply actions
We can hope
The Matt Williams deal is eerily similat to the Cain situation right now, and Sabes easily won that trade.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
My worry is that Sabes has gotten too lazy and won’t put in the long hours of negotiations and wheeling and dealing needed to maximize the haul for Cain if Sabes realizes that Cain won’t re-sign with the Giants. Patience will be required to allow the frenzy for Cain from competing teams to reach a crescendo, but I’m not sure that Sabes has the patience anymore. His MO in the past several years appears to be to make a decision on startegy and then go out and get the best deal that they can over a 2 to 7 day period. This pertains to trades and FA signings.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
The isolation doesn’t worry me as much as the impatience. I believe that Bobby Evans keeps in touch with the other teams and has a fairly good relationship with most of their GMs.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
Sometimes you wage war against the Dutch.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 9:20 AM PST up reply actions
Yes!
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 9:29 AM PST up reply actions
Matt Williams wasn’t in a walk year. He was in the middle of a long term contract that had, I think 2 years left on it with an option (it began before the 1994 season), which was the same as the contract control situation of Kent (albeit at a lower salary). Kent had an option for the 1999 season that was almost certain to vest, and early in the 1998 season the Giants negotiated a contract extension with him.
It’s also worth noting that in the immediate term, Cleveland didn’t do badly in that deal. They didn’t necessarily win, but in the ’97 season (which ended with them coming within a pitch of a World Series championship) they got a 4.3 fWAR season out of Williams, while the Giants got a collective 6.6 fWAR from the 4 players they received, 4.4 coming from Kent and 2.4 coming from Vizcaino (who would have been the backup SS behind Omar Vizquel in Cleveland). Plugging Williams in at 3B also allowed them to shore up their defense by moving Thome to 1B, whereas the Thome at 3B, Kent at 2B infield was pretty clanktastic.
What really blindsided the Indians was Williams whole divorce meltdown which caused him to demand a trade to Arizona with the threat of retirement.
On the whole, over the remaining three years of both their contracts (‘97-99), Williams was worth 11.3 WAR for $20mil, while Kent was worth 12.8 WAR for $12 mil. However, I still maintain that Sabes won that trade more or less by accident — it certainly wasn’t his intention to move a fading superstar for a rising superstar; he was trying to exchange a single great player for a group of solid players, which is very clearly a philosophy of team building that he has always believed in (as Hank Schulman blogged just the other day).
Thome played 3rd?
I can’t even remember that…must have been an abomination.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 9:49 AM PST up reply actions
But is that luck?
The idea is to “diversify” your talent. As you stated, Williams had an unexpected meltdown but it is really no different than him being injured or just becoming old.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Baseball teams are not stock portfolios. You can only have 25 active players.
by wcw on Jan 4, 2012 9:53 AM PST up reply actions
I would say that most people
own less than 25 stocks.
Also, it remains the same concept. Owning a bunch of penny stocks and Google or own a bunch of blue chips.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Own Google.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 10:12 AM PST up reply actions
Wow!
You own a google stocks!
Lunch on howie, for like, ever.
Though it is clearly well-informed, we find his argument unconvincing; however, the possibility that we are too stupid to comprehend it deserves serious consideration. Germane Literature: The Cutting Edge 13:2, 4/2006
POKEMON
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 10:25 AM PST up reply actions
Well, to clarify, I think there’s luck involved in all good trades and good personnel moves of any kind. Luck to avoid injury, or bad luck to fall victim to it are obvious but there’s all kinds of things you can’t necessarily predict.
My point isn’t the Sabean was lucky, my point is that the intent of the deal and the success of the deal were somewhat disjointed. Everyone knows the infamous Vlad quote, but the justification for the Williams trade (the forgotten rest of the quote after “I’m not an idiot”) was nearly identical.
One can theorize that had Sabes or somebody looked back at the Williams/Kent deal and thought "you know, that turned out completely different from what I thought. Most of those “solid” guys turned out to be pretty crappy, or not as good as what I already had (ie Vizcaino viz Aurilia), but getting that one great player really made us better!" they might have then adjusted their team building philosophy in later years and realized that signing Vlad or whatever was better than putting together a whole mess of mediocrity.
But they didn’t and they still haven’t. Here’s how Schulman put the issue the other day:
It is a fair question that speaks to a disconnect between the faithful’s expectations and the team’s philosophy, so soon after a World Series championship and a year of 81 sellouts at AT&T Park.
This is not new. It actually began 15 years ago when Brian Sabean, just named GM, traded one of the game’s best hitters (Matt Williams) to Cleveland essentially for three players: second baseman Jeff Kent, shortstop Jose Vizacaino and pitcher Julian Tavarez, who actually was the key to the deal. I’m bringing up ancient history because it is very relevant this morning in illustrating Sabean’s team-building philosophy.
Sabean always has believed that it makes little sense to have one or two big players if the supporting cast is weak. He would rather own a room full of toys than one Xbox 360. He was ripped for that philosophy in 1996, ripped for it again after the 2003 season when he didn’t make a move for Vlad Guerrero and is being ripped for it today. But he is not budging.
Critics argue that had the Giants had taken the $5 million they gave Jeremy Affeldt, the $6 million or so they will have to spend on Melky Cabrera and found another million in the sofa cushions, they could have had Beltran back. In other words, it’s better to have a sure thing like Beltran in the middle of the lineup and fill other holes with replacement-value players.
The Giants counterargue that they secured two important pieces for the price of one, that Cabrera is younger than Beltran and a better fielder now, and that Affeldt fills a big need in the middle of a bullpen that they refuse to weaken.
There’s the disconnect in a nutshell.
Slightly disagree about the outcome but
I have argued the exact same thing. You can have Vlad and 8 league minimum players or the 9 players Sabean signed.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Yes
but no 3rd starter, no 1B, no bullpen, no bench and a backup C as your starter.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Which to some degree has to be the fault of the GM for not being able to create a farm system that developed talent during those years.
Yes
but we’re talking about that year and the choice that had to be made at that time.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
A choice that Sabean himself has said was a mistake.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 10:33 AM PST up reply actions
Probably true
but that’s hindsight and the justification is not unsound.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Yes, he made the best of a bad situation of his own creation. I guess we can pat him on the back for that. And then use that accolade to prop him up and defend him no matter what.
Not what I said
I am not defending his failure to have a good farm system. I am just saying that people mock him for that quote as a representation of his utter lack of understanding.
That’s just not true.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Here's the single season stats
Values:
Guerrero $11 mil, 6.3 fWAR
Crowd of 9 $13.3 mil 16.8 fWAR
As follows:
Brower $0.625MM 1.0 WAR
Eyre $1.025MM -0.1 WAR
Herges $1.0MM 0.0 WAR
Tomko $1.5MM 2.7 WAR
Hermanson $0.8MM 1.9 WAR
Pierzynski $3.5MM 1.3 WAR
Feliz $0.85MM 2.0 WAR
Snow $1.5MM 4.0 WAR
Hammonds $1.0MM 0.3 WAR
Mohr $0.325 1.7 WAR
Tucker $1.5MM 1.5 WAR
And a few contextual bits:
Neifi Perez was in the 2nd year of a guaranteed contract. He made $2.75MM in 2004 and gave the Giants 0.4 fWAR before they traded him.
Edgardo Alfonzo made $6.5MM and provided 1.9 fWAR.
Joe Nathan made $0.4MM for 3.1 fWAR in ’04.
System players available: Noah Lowry, Kevin Correia, Brad Hennessey, David Aardsma, Yorvit Torrealba, Jason Ellison, Jason Ellison, Cody Ransom, Todd Linden.
Jason Ellison wasn’t really much of an option, but Jason Ellison might have been nice.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 11:14 AM PST up reply actions
Vlad, Tucker, AJ, frickin’ Neifi,
There are 3 huge failures wrapped up in there – no big bat in Vlad, a trade that backfired horribly and the punt the draft pick nonsense.
And Alfonso to boot. No physical and all.
On the other hand, the Snow contract was one of the freakishly great one year contracts we’ve ever given out.
and Mohr
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Really I don’t even know why Mohr was on the list in Sabean’s quote. He was pretty close to a major league minimum guy, and didn’t really have much experience. Was Sabes seriously suggesting they’d have to go with a 23 man roster if they signed Guerrero?
No
I just think he was listing name at that point but Mohr had played a couple years in the majors.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Snow’s 1997 stats are pretty dope.
281/387/898 with 28 dongs and 104 ribeyes.
nostocksjustbonds sponsors BR’s 97 giants page for shooter. Alright mate!
Thanks
I do sponsor it for now, but the price got jacked up this year, so I have to let it expire (no job anymore) in a few days. I’ll go back to a $5 page, which is in my budget, just b/c the site is awesome.
"There was no torture in the end. Only rapture." - Mike Krukow
Flags Fly Forever
"Orlando before Zod" doesn't have the same nice ring to it.
by nostocksjustbonds on Jan 4, 2012 12:22 PM PST up reply actions
collective 6.6 fWAR from the 4 players they received, 4.4 coming from Kent
And the difference between that 4.4 WAR he got that year and the 1.9 he had the year before was almost entirely due to defense. And even if you think a single year of defense means something, there is certainly no reliable way to predict a drastic swing in defense from year to year.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 9:54 AM PST up reply actions
Well, to be honest Kent and Williams were pretty comparable offensive players that year. Kent had a 105 wRC+ and Williams 102.
Also
Kent played 2B while Williams played 3B.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Which Civ are we talking. I liked the first three a lot, but found 4 to be too fast-paced with the advancements. Never played 5.
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
The one I have here is IV with the Warlords expansion, so that’s my point of reference.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 9:41 AM PST up reply actions
My favorite is still the first one
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
You've got to get Beyond The Sword.
It’s really cool.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 9:47 AM PST up reply actions
CiV is awesome.
Hexes are better than squares for games like these. Also, the limitation to one unit per tile makes warfare really interesting.
Massive memory hog, though.
My macbook is only a couple years old, and it threatened to burst into flames if I put Civ V on it.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 9:49 AM PST up reply actions
Of COURSE Sabes knows how to trade for prospects..!
Find somebody nobody wants anymore for very good reasons, and give that team your best prospects! If the trade happens to be a good one, be sure not to re-sign the gritty vet in the offseason. Totally worth it. Dismiss naysayers as impossible-to-please malcontents, repeat.
Better to be a Giants fan than an Athletic supporter!
All signs indicate that Cain will be signed by end of ST
they did the extension in March right?
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Uh
The obvious answer is the Yankees.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
If the Yanks are interested then you know that Boston would jump in. Not to mention Texas, Miami, KC and the Angels. I think Cain would create a feeding frenzy around the league.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
Yerp
Montero + Banuelous or Betances would be sweet.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
Are either of Banuelos and Betances actually any good?
I’ve always assumed they’re overrated because they’re Yankees prospects and we’ve all heard of them.
Cash rules everything around me
C.R.E.A.M.
Get the money
Dollar dollar bill y'all
Nope, they’re actually pretty good.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
Okay, that changes things a bit
Still, I know the general rule about young pitchers breaking your heart.
Though I can see the impending magic with our pitching coaches working with already decent talent.
Yes
In Keith Law’s top 50 prospects (all of baseball), Banuelos was 18 and Betances was 34. They’re both legit.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
So you’d trade Belt or Posey?
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 8:54 AM PST up reply actions
For a good enough package, absolutely. Likelihood is that neither fetches such a package, though.
by wcw on Jan 4, 2012 8:54 AM PST up reply actions
I wouldn’t trade either of them now because I think their value will be considerably higher in a year. Posey is obviously recovering from an injury and Belt has yet to break out in the majors.
I encourage you to check out Fish Stripes, Catch-28 and my twitter.
I'd rather send him home to Texas...
For Profar, Martin Perez and, perhaps, Ronald Guzman.
by BestHyperboleEver on Jan 4, 2012 11:15 AM PST up reply actions
Can Guzman can be traded until July 2nd? I’m not sure if IFAs are treated the same as Rule 4 draftees. Either way, there’s no way the Rangers let Guzman go in a package like that.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
Yeah, likely not. The idea was just to see if you could get them to throw in an extra very low level, high ceiling guy to sweeten the pot.
by BestHyperboleEver on Jan 4, 2012 11:21 AM PST up reply actions
Maybe they see it as the best way to add an Ace.
They seem to have a lot of #3 pitchers in their system.
Perhaps you could get Myers, Montgomery and even Colon as a bonus.
by BestHyperboleEver on Jan 4, 2012 11:18 AM PST up reply actions
They’re building for the future. Why would they sacrifice talent inventory for a one year rental who surely would not stay?
LOL A's trading for Matt Holliday.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 11:33 AM PST up reply actions
Because they already have league minimum/early arbitration guys with at least above average potential at:
C: Perez
1B: Hosmer/Butler
2B: Giavotella
SS: Escobar
3B: Moustakas
RF: Starling/Myers
CF: Cain
LF: Gordon
SP: Duffy, Hochevar, Montgomery, Mendoza
RP: Soria, Crow, Hererra, Odorizzo.
Why wouldn’t you trade some of that excess depth for an Ace when that’s the one thing you don’t have on your MLB team or in your system?
by BestHyperboleEver on Jan 4, 2012 11:37 AM PST up reply actions
Because he’s going to be long gone by the time you’re ready to compete and he costs you more players who might be part of that competitive team. If they see him as a piece that could be part of their next competitive team it would make a lot more sense to try to sign him off the FA market next winter.
Which prospects?
Where does the future DH Montero fit in for us?
Look, I’m not going to pretend to be as knowledgeable on this sort of thing as many of you, but when I see Matt Cain, I see basically the single most consistent producer on this team since Barry. There are few commodities that are as proven as Matt Cain, so to take a gamble (and admittedly Montero will hit well and play poorly whatever position he ends up blocking someone else in) seems like an unnecessary risk.
I have loved me some Matt Cain since he was just lines in minor-league box scores, but I’d trade him for a young Barry Bonds.
by wcw on Jan 4, 2012 8:54 AM PST up reply actions
If we knew he was going to be Barry Bonds.
I know hitters are easier to project, but is there anyone out there like that at all? Harper? Trout?
The young Barry Bonds was quite obviously one of the best prospects in the game as he came up.
by wcw on Jan 4, 2012 8:57 AM PST up reply actions
And the Giants could have had him.
Cash rules everything around me
C.R.E.A.M.
Get the money
Dollar dollar bill y'all
Good God, imagine 89?
Would’ve gone a whole lot differently.
Well, except you know, my whole hometown’s downtown being decimated.
They drafted him!
2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller
by Johnny Disaster on Jan 4, 2012 8:58 AM PST up reply actions
I certainly wasn't disagreeing with that
But is there anyone that isn’t Bryce Harper that projects even remotely like young Barry did?
From what I can tell the Royals kids will be good, but not THAT good.
Well this is a silly question
Is there any player right now who projects to be one of the five best players who ever played baseball?
Well, uh, no.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
he was saying, projects like BB projected, not turned out
He projected to be a perennial all-star. I think Harper does, too.
by wcw on Jan 4, 2012 9:06 AM PST up reply actions
More than likely. Plus, a lot more exciting to watch.
by wcw on Jan 4, 2012 9:08 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah, sorry, I was phrasing that poorly.
I’ve heard Mike Trout does as well, but neither of those guys will be sent out, so if the main thing we’re seeking is offense and organizational pitching depth, I could see how the Yankees could be a fit, but there needs to be a bat in there that works, unless we intend to flip Belt or Posey too.
This conversation makes me sad. Very sad.
Oh, yeah, fair enough
I’d say probably Trout n’ Harper, yeah.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
BB
The only player I ever saw that when he batted, the entire stadium of 43k would stop, sit and watch. You could hear a pin drop (and 1000 flashes) in his at bats when he was going for a milestone.
He was awesome.
Blerg
Skinny Barry was awesome, too. Eminently hateable as an opponent.
by wcw on Jan 4, 2012 9:11 AM PST up reply actions
He was also a tremendous douchebag that tried to charge me $50 for an autograph as a kid
That said, he will always be one of the best to have ever played the game, controversy or no.
Betances, Banuelos, Mason Williams
Yankees have lots of good prospects.
Cain’s pretty good. But he’s not that good.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
Montero can play 1B and move Belt to LF. That being said, I think that the package that KC or Texas could put together would likely be superior to what the Yankees could give us.
Texas: Jurickson Profar and Nelson Cruz (or Martin Perez and Cody Buckel)
KC: Alex Gordon, Jake Odorizzi (or Mike Montgomery) and Wil Myers
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
2012 prediction:
Alex Gordon crashes back to earth. His peripherals last year were troubling.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 9:44 AM PST up reply actions
Well, if the Giants don’t sign him to an extension before the season starts, they certainly won’t trade him. His trade value is too high.
If they don’t sign him to an extension before the season starts then it’s 99.9999% sure that 2012 is his last season as a Giant. If he wants to stay SF we’ll know within the next 6 weeks. His trade value declines markedly after the season starts, because he’ll be a FA at the end of the season and any team that trades for him will not receive any comp picks when he walks away as a FA.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
Two things:
1. Sabean doesn’t trade players when their value is as high as Cain’s.
2. The Giants’ entire off-season “plan” was based on the idea that they’d have Lincecum and Cain as their anchors or gold standard, so, even if they can’t come to an agreement before the season, they will hold on to Cain and let him walk (gaining those limited draft picks, I suppose) at season’s end. Their 2012 depends on him.
Two words: Matt Williams
1. Sabean doesn’t trade players when their value is as high as Cain’s
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
I'm getting old.
Proud parent of SD-born Shane Loux.
If Cain is with us, who can be against us? - atxgiantsfan
Me too
Looking at that trade, I hardly remember seasons that long ago, Matt played about 170 games in previous 2 years. Granted, at about a 6 WAR per year clip.
Blerg
On top of that...
It is completely normal for an incoming GM to trade either a fan favorite or someone else strongly associated with the organization because the GM is new and it’s not one of “his guys.” The Giants were a shambles and he had to get it going very quickly. A decade and a half later, every player in the organization is “his guy” and so his view of each of them will be different than some Matt Williams he’s heard about but didn’t draft or track, etc. This is a completely human, normal situation. The Matt Williams trade is a completely different animal.
I’ll say again. I don’t see the comparison between Cain and Williams Williams was NOT entering a walk year. Nor was his value as high as Cains. He was coming off two straight injury plagued years in which he’d managed to play only 180 games combined. His 2.6 fWAR in ‘96 was the worst he’d ever had in a full season. I’d say Williams was being traded at his lowest value, not at his highest.
Sabes? Trade low?
Noooooooooo.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 9:58 AM PST up reply actions
I disagree with your value statement on Williams. Williams was widely seen across the league as a huge prize back after the end of the 1996 season despite the nagging injuries. None of his injuries were seen as career-limiting.
That being said, I think the 2 situaions are clearly similar enough that your value point is mute. Also, the vast majority of teams that will be willing to trade for Cain this offseason will be assuming that they can sign him to an extension before he becomes a FA (in fact they’ll likely base their offer on coming to some verbal agreement on a extension framework with his agent) so they’ll assume Cain will be on their team for at least 4 years.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
1. Sabean doesn’t trade players when their value is as high as Cain’s.
I can’t think of a player before Cain that the org brought up with his value. Seriously. Besides top 10 payrolls should be holding their home growns anyways.
Blerg
As for your 2nd point, I agree that you’re prediction is most likely true. But, I don’t think that it’s smart for Sabes to take that path. First off, it will set a very bad precedent for the Timmy negotiations next offseason. Secondly, it likely dooms the Giants to mediocre teams in the 2014 and 2015 seasons.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
Trust the management. They know what they’re doing. They also know a lot more than we do. And they won a World Series.
No, the players won the WS. And you can’t claim that Sabes & Co. knew that Cody Ross would be the 4th or 5th most important player in that WS run. They didn’t really want him and only put him on the postseason roster because of Jose Guillen’s injury/drug investigation.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
I think you fell into the chasm.
Or, straw man, really.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
by kdl on Jan 4, 2012 9:27 AM PST up reply actions
Why the hell would he trade Cain if the Giants are in the thick of the pennant race? “Hey, fans, we just traded everyone’s favorite pitcher but look at all these shiny prospects we have that’ll be great in 3 years!” It’s not going to happen and shouldn’t. There’s no “win now!” in this kind of trade
by Dingoes Ate My Baby on Jan 4, 2012 10:02 AM PST up reply actions
Well, let’s just hope Montero isn’t the centerpiece of a trade.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
Montero, Banuelos and Betances and then you can waste Montero or Belt for a 30+ year old middle reliever in another trade.
Belt for a middle reliever? I’d rather pay Cain and keep Belt.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 8:55 AM PST up reply actions
Not only that
We have NO arms coming up the pipeline soon, and Surkamp remains to prove himself. I figure he can be a cheap Barry Zito, which is fine, but after that, we are YEARS away from talking about anyone else.
Obligatory Tebow mention:
John Elway has some advice for Tim Tebow when the Denver Broncos quarterback plays in his first playoff game Sunday: Don’t be afraid to “pull the trigger.”
So many ways to go on this.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
I'm still reading this Jon Bois gif thing.
It’s my favorite thing ever.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
lol Cliff Lee.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 9:37 AM PST up reply actions
lol pogs
they were the sh*t
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 9:43 AM PST up reply actions
I used to wish so hard that I understood how to play. I thought, “Slamming one thing into other things can’t be all the rules. There has to be more. How do you win?”
In retrospect, I’m pretty sure you won by slamming one thing into other things.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 9:47 AM PST up reply actions
The winter meetings one is killing me
Kickham where it hurts
by say hey nation on Jan 4, 2012 10:15 AM PST up reply actions
The guy falling into the fountain thing? That was one of the few I’d actually already seen, but it is definitely a classic.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
Also, I love the hockey Gatorade ones.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
Agree
Those were some off my favorites, along with the hockey finger flick.
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
It looks like Brian Sabean too.
Kickham where it hurts
by say hey nation on Jan 4, 2012 10:21 AM PST up reply actions
Isn’t it expensive for the network to haul around a life size wax figure of Jeff Van Gundy as a sort of fetish?
Though it is clearly well-informed, we find his argument unconvincing; however, the possibility that we are too stupid to comprehend it deserves serious consideration. Germane Literature: The Cutting Edge 13:2, 4/2006
Oh man
Amazing
Don't think he can cut it in the bigs? Brock Bond will be the bigger man and walk walk walk away.
LADY IN #11 WHAT ARE YOU DOING????
Don't think he can cut it in the bigs? Brock Bond will be the bigger man and walk walk walk away.
i'm dying from the horse one
Proud adoptive father of the fastest guy in the Giants system, Jarrett Parker
One of the best moments in Giants history, 11/1/2010
Crazy pills. Would you like some?
Why would the Yankees go after Messers Cain and Hamels when they can just sign the likes of Edwin Jackson for only $15-17M per year?
Yep. That’s right. Scott Boras client Edwin Jackson is asking for this princely sum, and the Yankees are apparently interested. If $15M is the going rate for I’m-just-like-Jonathan-Sanchez-I-walk-too-many-guys-but-have-a-no-hitter types like Jackson moving forward, then we may as well lock Cain up immediately.
From the article
The Yankees passed on Mark Buehrle, who signed with the Miami Marlins, and have no interest in giving Edwin Jackson the five-year deal he seeks.
Blerg
Jackson’s BB% the 3 years is around 3%. Jonathan Sanchez has been around 5%. Lincecum has had a higher BB% the last 3 years than Jackson.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 9:49 AM PST up reply actions
He also has a career ERA of like 4.4.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
Then clearly
I’m-just-like-Jonathan-Sanchez-I-walk-too-many-guys-but-have-a-no-hitteris a perfect description.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 11:40 AM PST up reply actions
Like Sanchez, Jackson has had one very nice season in an otherwise unremarkable career. Interestingly, both pitchers have a career ERA+ of 97, both have the type of stuff that is occasionally but not consistently described as electric, and yes, both have thrown no-hitters.
Perhaps Jackson doesn’t walk as many batters as I had thought, but would you really give this guy $15M per season? He’s just not that good.
by biff pocoroba on Jan 4, 2012 11:53 AM PST up reply actions
He’s a 4th starter on a contending team. Ish.
Boras’ platform is that he’s only 28, and has room to develop and grow. Betting 5/75 on that is lunacy, unless you’ve never heard of Oliver Perez.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
What?!
Edwin Jackson is much better than a 4th starter on any team.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
Not the Giants! Nor the Phillies!
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
Okay, I take it back.
A contending team that employs the likes of Bartolo Colon.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
Ohhhh you mean, teams who win 97 games with the best record in the AL?
Why have people been trying to pretend like the Yankees have a horribly flawed team?
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:06 PM PST up reply actions
Because
their starting rotation is pretty awful and covered up by their offense. It is really no different than the Giants offense v. pitching.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Yeah, I was just looking some stats up to add.
ERA FIP xFIP
3.73 3.87 3.84
Clearly their pitching is a mess.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:12 PM PST up reply actions
MEANWHILE, still in reality,
The Giants were 2nd best in all of baseball in runs allowed and 2nd WORST in runs scored.
This is clearly a case of “I heard they had Bartolo Colon and Freddy Garcia” without notcing that Colon had a 4.00era and Garcia had a 3.62. Garcia’s FIP was a littler worse than his ERA while Colon’s was a little better.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:17 PM PST up reply actions
Is that all pitchers, or just the starters?
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 12:18 PM PST up reply actions
I think it’s all pitchers. It’s from Fangraphs team leaderboard page
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:20 PM PST up reply actions
Reality is more than numbers
Yankees had a great bullpen that pitched a lot.
Yankees’ only starter that went more than 200 IP was CC. The second highest IP total was AJ Burnett at 190 IP (and a 5.15 ERA).
All the rest of the guys had about 5.5-6 IP average
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
So if you don’t take a limo to the airport does your vacation suck? No, they don’t run Roy Halladay out there every single day, but they had a pitching staff that managed to limit scoring at an above average rate while scoring lots of runs leading to 97 wins. That is not a horribly flawed team.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:23 PM PST up reply actions
By the way, that post is unintentionally hilarious. Read your subject line and look at what you then wrote.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:24 PM PST up reply actions
I DON'T BELIEVE IN STATS, I BELIEVE IN WHAT MY EYES TELL ME
BESIDES MORRIS WON MORE GAMES IN THE 1980S THAN ANYONE ELSE
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
I do think that Jack Morris belongs in the Hall, though. I even think that the stat you used is a fair one for stating his case.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 12:30 PM PST up reply actions
Wins are a pretty terrible statistic, and using selective endpoints makes them worse. There may be an argument to Morris being in the Hall, but it’s not “the most wins from 1980-1989.”
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
Yeah, of course.
But I tend to gravitate toward the more amorphous definitions of the word “Fame.”
So while I certainly wouldn’t make that stat the centerpiece of my Morris-to-the-Hall platform, I don’t think it’s entirely dismissible either.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
Why not the guy who led the league in wins from 1985 to 1995? Selective endpoints are just silly.
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
I guess.
A decade is a pretty long time. I’d warrant most pitchers who have led the majors in wins for any given set of ten years are in the Hall or at least (like Morris) nearly so. I mean, correlation =/= causation and all that, but I’d imagine the correlation’s pretty strong.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 1:11 PM PST up reply actions
Well, yeah. I mean, wins are a decent measure of a pitcher’s career if the career is long enough. But they’re nearly worthless on a single season basis, and there are better stats out there.
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
So we agree!
ish.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 1:27 PM PST up reply actions
Jack Morris is famous for one game only. I don’t think he was ever considered a particular great pitcher during the 80s.
Really I think the best snapshot to view how he was viewed during his career is to look at the 1984 CYA. Morris won 19 games (2nd in the league behind Mike Boddicker’s 20) for the dominant team in the major leagues (and really DOMINANT). Most years that’s a recipe for a CYA. Morris finished 7th in voting, and that included two different Tigers pitchers in front of him (Willie Hernandez and Dan Petry!).
He consistently played on great teams, and certainly in the Detroit years I doubt if many people would have mentioned him in a general discussion of the best or most important core of players on those Tigers teams.
As for his hallowed Big Game mentality. His post-season career is the same mottley stuff as his regular season career. Some times he was good; some times he was awful.
I didn’t like the Jim Rice vote, but Morris is the only guy I can think of in the last generation who I legtimately believe would make the HOF a lesser institution by being included, and he might well be the only such player who was ever voted in by the writers as opposed ot the Veterans Committee.
All good points. He's definitely borderline, and he's not my HOF crusade (that's Tim Raines).
Wiki has the best argument against my point about his winz:
While he gave up the most hits, earned runs and home runs of any pitcher in the 1980s, he also started the most games, pitched the most innings and was the winningest pitcher of the decade.
The “Maris Asterisk,” basically. He had more chances.
But this HAS to be hyperbole:
the only guy I can think of in the last generation who I legtimately believe would make the HOF a lesser institution by being included,
Even with the assumption that you’re only talking about borderline candidates, so perfectly defined a line seems impossible.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 1:54 PM PST up reply actions
Willie Hernandez
I don’t know how many of you caught The Mike Krukow Show on KNBR a week or so back, hosted by fill in Jim Kozimor, where Krukow talked about his first shot at the big leagues with the Cubbies. A little like what we’re seeing with today’s Dodgers, the 1977 Cubs were being sold due to financial strain brought on by a divorce. Apparently they were selling off valuable pieces to streamline payroll and the team wasn’t really any good.
But check out that bullpen backing a 25 year old Mike Krukow….Willie Hernandez, Bruce Sutter, Donnie Moore, and an aged Ramon Hernandez (along with Rick Reucshel’s brother Paul, for what it’s worth).
The Cubs developed some nice arms back then (Lee Smith would be a Cubs rookie in ’80).
by biff pocoroba on Jan 4, 2012 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
WORST ROTATION IN BASEBALL
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 12:21 PM PST up reply actions
I was making fun of this before it was cool.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 12:21 PM PST up reply actions
Scoring 5.35 runs/game will solve a lot of problems for you.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
Especially when your “problems” are having a 3.73ERA (11th in majors)
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:14 PM PST up reply actions
Forgive me for not counting on repeat performances from Freddy Garcia and Bartolo Colon.
Regression by Nova would also not be unexpected.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
So, they’ll only win 94-95 games? OH THE HUMANITY!
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:17 PM PST up reply actions
It won’t be because of their starting rotation.
That’s kinda the point.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
Actually, as I read back on your comment, it actually implies that the Yankees have a good rotation.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:31 PM PST up reply actions
They had a rotation performed well. I do not think the pitchers that composed that rotation are good at this point, outside of Sabathia and probably Nova.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
They aren’t the best, but they’re certainly good enough. And, I know it was Calbear, not you who said it, their team is a far cry from being no different than the Giants but in reverse. The Yankees are the 2010 Giants in reverse: Spectacular offense, league average pitching.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:38 PM PST up reply actions
Perfect analogy
Quote from my adopted son Mike Krukow: "We're the Giants. We're San Francisco. And we're World Series Champions!"
Haha, what?
Edwin Jackson is, like, really pretty good guys.
11.2 fWAR over the past three years is well above average and better than most teams get from their #3 starter.
I’d give Edwin 15 million per season, though not over 5 years of course. But 3/45? I’d give him that.
No idea where the idea that Jackson isn’t good came from. He’s good.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
Seriously
From 2009-present, he’s 20th in the major leagues by fWAR.
20th! That’s good!
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
I mean, shit, I'd rather have Jackson than Beurhle, and look how much money he got.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
For comparisons sake
Buehrle, 2009-2011: 10.6 fWAR, age next season: 33
Signed 4 year, 60 million dollar contract, widely seen as reasonable.
Jackson: 2009-2011: 11.2 fWAR, age next season: 28
LOL WHY WOULD ANYONE GIVE HIM 5 75 HES SO TERRIBLE
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
I don’t think that’s really the case here. A long eyeball of his career stats isn’t all that nice looking. Whip in the 1.4s. SO/BB under 2. ERA almost 4.5. Even looking at his last three years, the WHIP and ERA haven’t always been shiny. His BBR page is something you actually have to spend some time with, I think, to see something especially favorable.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 12:18 PM PST up reply actions
At a glance, I see good years since 2009 with sub-4 ERAs for select teams — nearly 200 IP each season, too. I know he’s got a great fastball and command issues and he’ll be just 28 next season. Above average.
Well, my estimation is that this makes you a better eyeballer than I would expect out of others. It takes a certain presence of mind to isolate your glance to the last three years and still gloss over things like 4.47 and 1.437, and even 1.395 and 5.16, and even four teams in three years, and even the sub-7 K/9 rates. There’s plenty to like in those years, I’m not arguing, but I can easily see how simple it would be to eyeball that page and not be impressed.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 12:30 PM PST up reply actions
We’d all be better judges of players if we simply ignored everything that happened more than three, maybe four years ago.
I just scroll down with my eyeballs and wait for the ERA to go decrease. His page is a little annoying because of all the split stats on account of all the trades. But I know just from the few times I’ve seen him that he isn’t some Ramon Ortiz-level flame-out, so, I was kind of expecting the numbers to at some point match a little bit of what I had seen.
So you're saying he's as good as Matt Cain. Unbelievable.
You will NOT be seeing me at the pancake social tomorrow!
This site is full of the shittiest fans I’ve ever seen. What a bunch of hatin’ Lakers fans.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 12:38 PM PST up reply actions
Which I’m not disagreeing with.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 12:35 PM PST up reply actions
I think his career stats don’t look that great because he’s still pretty young. He has put together 3 very good seasons over the last 3 years. You can’t blame a guy for not starting out like Timmy.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:26 PM PST up reply actions
There’s also the fact that he’s the perpetual trade piece.
Not that it says anything about him as a pitching, but I do think it fuels the perception. It says, “Not worth hanging onto,” whether or not it’s true.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
I don’t see how this conflicts with what I said in any real way. His career numbers make his page harder to look at. The last three years are nice, but spotted with little pits, even though those are less meaningful than they look at a glance. He’s a very nice player, even so.
I’m not blaming him for starting slow. I’m not trying to take away from him as a player at all. In all honestly, I’m not even talking about him. I’m talking about people who might wander over to his BBR page. I’m just trying to explain why I don’t think it’s crazy or even a “standard dismissal etc.” for some random person to glance at his BBR page and think, “So, what?”
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 12:35 PM PST up reply actions
He has been worth it the last 3 years. 3.6, 3.8, 3.8. Not just worth it, very consistent.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 11:57 AM PST up reply actions
Cain, Cole Lumped In Yanks' Re-Stocking
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 9:50 AM PST reply actions
Sign JD Drew for 1 year/ 3 million
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
Yeah, this doesn’t sound too bad, except everywhere he’s gone fans seem to end up hating him. Not a good sign.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 9:55 AM PST up reply actions
Cody Ross for the same
outfield: LF Drew, CF Pagan, RF Ross/Cabrera, Nate 5th OF
Damnit, it’s pretty depressing when THAT’S the outfield I’m pining for at this point
Don't think he can cut it in the bigs? Brock Bond will be the bigger man and walk walk walk away.
Drew is 36
and was a -0.6 oWAR in 286 PAs.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
And there’s no doubt in my mind that Drew is the type of LH hitter that would be psychologically spooked by the high fences and distant walls in RF and CF at AT&T. Drew is the type of player that looks for almost any excuse not to play every day.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
It is kind of odd that currently our 4th and 5th outfielders are our first basemen; one might even start the season in Fresno.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 9:58 AM PST up reply actions
What is odd about that?
San Francisco Giants
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
Kudos, You are a sick, sick man, but you are very good at it -- wcw
And Roy Oswalt for 1/10
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 10:09 AM PST up reply actions
Salvage the offseason Sabes!
Drew for 1/3
Oswalt for 1/10
Trade Belt for Alexei straight up
Pagan CF
Sanchez 2B
Sandoval 3B
Posey C
Drew LF
Cabrera RF
Ramirez SS
Huff 1B
Lincecum / Cain / Bumgarner / Oswalt / Vogelsong
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
Schierholtz, then.
Drew’s the least dramatic of the three suggested moves.
The most delightful ecumenical contradiction in nomenclature.
Dursh nerf darsh narf. Poop.
And the Giants probably think so low of Belt that they wouldn’t even think to offer him up in a trade. Conversely, if they did, they’d suddenly be worried by how much other teams value him and wonder if they actually have something there. And then they’d hold out for more and get nothing, but then not even bother to play Belt because Bochy doesn’t like him.
I don't understand why there is a notion that
the FO thinks low of Belt.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Yeah, I think the FO likes him, Sabean might feel he was rushed a bit, but I think he believes in the talent. Bochy on the other hand
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 10:26 AM PST up reply actions
Emmanuelle Burriss has a guaranteed spot on the roster
and Brandon Belt is going to get sent to Fresno so Brett Pill can sit on the bench.
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
Kudos, You are a sick, sick man, but you are very good at it -- wcw
by jctGamer on Jan 4, 2012 10:27 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
1) Burriss plays MI
2) We have no idea what’s going to happen in ST. Giants have already stated that they want Belt at 1B and Huff in the OF.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
It doesn't matter where Burriss plays. He is Emmanuelle Burriss
He has no business being on a major league roster. That’s how this front office evaluates players.
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
Kudos, You are a sick, sick man, but you are very good at it -- wcw
It does not affect whether Belt plays or not.
They would still need a MI to fill that spot.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
A MI that is not named Emmanuelle Burriss
Point #1 is to highlight how poorly the front office evaluates players.
Point #2 is the result of point #1.
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
Kudos, You are a sick, sick man, but you are very good at it -- wcw
You guys stop mucking up my Roy Oswalt rasterbating with your Sabean buttcheek smooching and/or front office bashing!
This is an important “Zito not in the rotation” quest.
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 10:36 AM PST up reply actions
If it's Zito not inthe rotation you're looking for
I think I could be somewhat successful as a pitcher, similar to the last pitch or 2 the kid threw in Rookie of the Year.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 10:37 AM PST up reply actions
I would be absolutely unhittable.
In that not a single pitch I threw would come within swinging distance of a batter.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 10:41 AM PST up reply actions
I could get it in the strikezone, probably pretty regularly, just don’t expect me to top 65mph. Maybe come July I’d be able to hit 70.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 10:43 AM PST up reply actions
If I wanted 70 mph fastballs, I’d just leave Zito in the rotation.
ROY OSWALT!
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 10:49 AM PST up reply actions
Think how many Burrisses we could have for one Oswalt!
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
Q: Did you ever make an offer for Roy Oswalt?
Sabean: In a word: No. If we had signed Oswalt or [Carlos] Beltran, we would have been without [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss, [Emmanuel] Burriss and [Emmanuel] Burriss—obviously not being able to field a competitive team, especially from an experience standpoint, given our level of spending.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 10:59 AM PST up reply actions
TEAM IS BUILT ON PITCHING AND DEFENSE!!!
(well, except for that Zito guy)
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 11:23 AM PST up reply actions
Spell failure? You mean the 1992 classic
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 11:31 AM PST up reply actions
Really
cuz there are no good young players on the Giants roster.
Burris is there because he is a MI and has MLB experience (yes bad counts). Panik will likely fill that roster spot if he continues the progression.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Cheap and need is not an excuse for having a bad player on the roster
It’s even worse that they have had time to evaluate him on the MLB level like you said, he has proven that he sucks, and they OFFERED HIM ARBITRATION in order to keep him on the roster.
Because OMG STOLEN BASE AND THE ABILITY TO PLAY MULTIPLE POSITIONS POORLY.
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
Kudos, You are a sick, sick man, but you are very good at it -- wcw
Vroooom!
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 10:40 AM PST up reply actions
http://www.insidebayarea.com/top-stories/ci_19501136?source=sphere_article
For the most part, the Giants know the players who will tip their caps for the April 6 season opener at Phoenix. Barring unforeseen events, reserve spots are locks for Emmanuel Burriss, who will back up at all four infield positions in addition to the outfield, and Brett Pill, whose right-handed power off the bench is a commodity the Giants otherwise lack.
“His value is catching up after all his injuries,” Giants vice president Bobby Evans said. “He’s getting back to his game. We’ve seen things we haven’t seen in the past. Amazing play in the outfield. Even at first base, he showed a lot of utility and value. We think he’s earned it.”
Seriously
it’s the 25th man. 25th man.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
That’s not entirely true. Burriss has played both first base and left field.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 10:35 AM PST up reply actions
WS have Dunn and Konerko
You sure they want Belt? Is Alexi even on the block?
Blerg
by Myemail21479 on Jan 4, 2012 10:41 AM PST up reply actions
Ross then
Don't think he can cut it in the bigs? Brock Bond will be the bigger man and walk walk walk away.
Why do you want Drew?
the guy was awful last year and is going to be 36.5 in April.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Let me help you there
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
4) Profit!!
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 11:40 AM PST up reply actions
We have no money
Quote from my adopted son Mike Krukow: "We're the Giants. We're San Francisco. And we're World Series Champions!"
Hamels
The Yankees should probably forget about him as RJA will probably just pull a 10 year $20 million dollar contract out of his butt to pay for him
by Dingoes Ate My Baby on Jan 4, 2012 10:04 AM PST reply actions
Has this been posted yet this morning (obviously loved it)
There is a nugget of truth behind this Window obsession. Smaller-revenue teams have a tougher time signing premium free agents, or retaining their own top players past their initial six years of team control. That puts extra pressure on these poorer teams to bring up a bunch of great prospects all at once, then hope they get good at the same time before they get expensive.
But far more often it’s a bullshit excuse. It’s a vague, faraway goal that always seems several years out of reach. It’s a cover for cheap, greedy ownership, lousy scouting, drafting, and player development, and myopic trades. It’s a weak attempt to placate a fan base screwed over by years of management incompetence and indifference.
Or in the case of the Oakland A’s, their recent fire sale and justification for said fire sale, it’s a bold-faced ploy by one opportunistic owner to win territory from another opportunistic owner so that another city can hand out another $500 million check for another boondoggle stadium.
http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7422765/the-myth-small-market-window
Quote from my adopted son Mike Krukow: "We're the Giants. We're San Francisco. And we're World Series Champions!"
Agreed
The Marlins’ cry-poor fascade should have broke that myth.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
xxxxx
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
Kudos, You are a sick, sick man, but you are very good at it -- wcw
My family actually raised a pig in the house for like 2 months. Then the put in the pig pen until the bacon was ripe and ate it.
Kickham where it hurts
by say hey nation on Jan 4, 2012 10:22 AM PST up reply actions
This reminds me of that one episode in 30 Rock
Don't think he can cut it in the bigs? Brock Bond will be the bigger man and walk walk walk away.
Just wanted to say
If Matt Cain leaves, I will cry.
by S. Pickford #25 on Jan 4, 2012 10:24 AM PST reply actions
Facebook tells me it's the waitress birthday
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
Kudos, You are a sick, sick man, but you are very good at it -- wcw
I don’t know, but she’ll find it on her dresser when she gets home.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 10:29 AM PST up reply actions
Your money's on the dresser, chocolate.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 10:36 AM PST up reply actions
NSFW
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Matt Cain doesn't seem to be a guy who would enjoy the NY spotlight
then again, I will be whatever guy you want me to be for 125 million dollars.
yeshomo
Yankees
Yankees yankees? Yankees yankees Yankees.
Bye Travis and thanks for 2010! Good luck with the Brewers!
to be fair
This was from their “local paper” right? Just that the 5 minutes of Hot Stove I watched was also all about the Yankees and “Not being done” “Going to add a pitcher”.
Bye Travis and thanks for 2010! Good luck with the Brewers!
Yanquis?
Maugua does not care for the the Yanquis.
When the Grey Hair is dead, Magua will eat his heart. Before he dies, Magua will put his children under the knife, so the Grey Hair will know his seed is wiped out forever.
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
This guy clearly knows how to win.
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
Aaron Rowand without the goatee would look just like Lee Harvey Oswald.
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
Aaron was a patsy!
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 10:38 AM PST up reply actions
---
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
Lee Harvey Oswald without the OBP would look just like Aaron Rowand.
One way or another, this darkness got to give.
by bgunn on Jan 4, 2012 10:41 AM PST up reply actions 4 recs
/recd
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 11:10 AM PST up reply actions
My God, I never realized that craigslist had more scammers than the Giants FO.
Kickham where it hurts
helps digestion!
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jan 4, 2012 11:11 AM PST up reply actions
For legal marketing in the US
The little picture of the model should probably be captioned “serving suggestion” with the appropriate antonym for “serving”.
Though it is clearly well-informed, we find his argument unconvincing; however, the possibility that we are too stupid to comprehend it deserves serious consideration. Germane Literature: The Cutting Edge 13:2, 4/2006
BOCOCK!
Kevin_Goldstein Kevin Goldstein
The Blue Jays signed once very temporary Giants SS Brian Bocock
I think I’d explode if I were jerked back and forth and up and down as much as Bocock has been.
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
by rotorueter on Jan 4, 2012 11:29 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Explosion tea!
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
ISWYDT.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
it must be hard for bocock to keep his spirts up
Sometimes you just have to look death in the face and say whatever man
Proud parent of Jeff Keppinger's better half
by operation carrot on Jan 4, 2012 11:34 AM PST up reply actions
It’s so weird that teams continue to sign him. These are his career minor league offensive numbers: .227/.301/.307/.608.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
The market for MI this year has been pretty crazy.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
But why Burriss?
Seriously…Craig Counsel was paid $1.4 million at age 40 coming off of a OPS+ of 74 in 2010.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
What are you asking about Burriss?
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
People freaking out about Burriss being on the roster
my defense is that he is the 25th man and a MI. People don’t believe those are justifications.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Burriss is the only thing I’ve actually been rage-y about this offseason. The reason is that there is no evidence, anywhere, to explain the FO’s belief that he is suddenly going to “reach his potential” or whatever they said. That’s just poor evaluation and analysis. It’s irritating. And, if they’re just saying that because they think they have no other option than Burriss, then I’m irritated that they think the fans are stupid enough to believe their BS.
The FO is not saying, “he’s just the 25th man and he’s a MI.” They’re saying they expect him to be decent.
Also, people may disagree that those are acceptable justifications. I’m not sure I am following why that difference of opinion is not acceptable simply because the Blue Jays signed Brian Bocock.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
The FO is never going to say that he’s the 25th man and he’s MI. They are trying to sell him as viable.
They can disagree, I am just saying that the level of talent of the 25th man on a MLB roster is pretty darn low. It’s like the 12th man on the bench on an NBA team. His towel waving skills are more important.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
As Solidarity says below, Burris is no bat and no glove. I literally have no idea what he brings to the table. I’m allowed to think the FO is lame for acting like they don’t know that, whether they’re stupid or lying.
I don’t think your “defense” or whatever is crazy. But, I also don’t think that thinking the opposite is crazy, either. I think reasonable minds can differ here. You can keep saying the same thing over and over again, and you probably will, but good luck getting buy in.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
Calbear, I don’t always disagree with you, but your “25th man is entitled to suck” defense is not supportable.
Just play a Brandon or two, come on!
Calbear, I don’t always disagree with you, but your "25th man is entitled to suck" defense is not supportable.
This is basically how I feel about Crawford!
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
Shouldn’t that raise the bar?
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
We have considerably less data on Crawford. Odds are he will suck, but the book isn’t quite closed on him.
Burriss, on the other hand, has been worth 0.2 WAR in 651 PAs, and is two years older. He rates below average as a fielder, and way below average as a hitter (64 wRC+ to Crawford’s 60). If it weren’t for his baserunning skills, he’s be around -0.3 WAR for his career. He’s pretty much the definition of replacement level.
If everyone is healthy, he’s fine as a pinch-runner. But that’s about the only thing you can expect him to do well.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
Any time you can say,
Odds are he will suck, but the book isn’t quite closed on him.
about a dude who’s expected to be an every day player, you’ve got a problem with your roster construction.
Hope like hell.
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
I would have preferred they get another stopgap and give him a full year of PAs in Fresno to see what they have.
But I think he can be at least a 1-WAR player this year. Whether he will be remains a question, and yes I know that’s a problem.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
Yeah, it wasn’t a jab at your by any means. Herp derp, Giants FO.
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
I think he can be good. I just don’t think his path through the minors has done him any favors.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
I would be truly surprised if he were ever really league average, let alone actually good. His path through the minors hasn’t done him any favors, but he’s also never really hit anywhere that would make me think that he could put up an 80-85 wRC+ in the major leagues.
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
There’s a lot of noise with his minor-league track record. And by good, I didn’t mean a 4-WAR player. I meant a cheap 2-WAR player, which I would be perfectly happy with for the time being.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
Ah. I thought you meant good in an absolute sense rather than a surplus value sense.
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
Sure
I’m not trying to “convince” anyone…just listing my opinion. He is a warm body that happens to play MI. He is the 25th guy and easily repalcebale.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
He’s easily replaceable RIGHT NOW. not so much in the middle of the season, and I don’t really like burning off arms for the Jeff Keppingers of the world.
He is
Keppinger was going to be too expensive.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Burris will be bad if he starts too much
I see him as the DaRRRUN Ford like PR\DR, only not as fast, for something like when Sanchez gets on base with 1 out in the 7th or something. As a PH, he is terrible and I will not be happy if he starts over Fontenot anywhere in the IF unless there are injuries.
Blerg
by Myemail21479 on Jan 4, 2012 12:11 PM PST up reply actions
And not very good on defense.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 12:19 PM PST up reply actions
I’d rather have Conor Gillaspie, or a similar AAA player who is at least useful in one aspect or another. Someone who can hit right-handed, or someone who gives actual depth up the middle. Tyler Graham, maybe. Who knows.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
That’s where I’m at too. Get your speed guy from the 4th of. Graham, Christian or Blanco, don’t really matter. Get a guy who can hit a little and take a walk.
I think the problem is that they don’t have much in the way of SS in AAA. Gillaspie is not a SS, and Tyler Graham (who I actually like) is an OF. I think they need better MI depth. That’s why I don’t think CalBear949 is completely nuts. What I think is nuts is pretending like Burriss is good.
That all being said, if they play Burriss at 1B or in the OF, all bets are off.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
if they play Burriss at 1B or in the OF, all bets are off.
Which, as part of the “Burriss is suddenly good, it happened this off season when no one was looking, I swear” reasoning the FO is giving, is going to happen.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:02 PM PST up reply actions
That’s lame. Just about anyone can play 1B, and they do have some decent base stealers on the 40 man (Graham and Christian) if they’re looking for speed.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
He’s ok for the pinch running aspect if Huffy can manage some 7-8th inning singles. And its nice to have a guy who can play multiple positions. But if/when Freddy goes down and/or/if young Crawford struggles with the bat, somebody such as Ryan Theriot (horribly UZR rated for sure) who can mash lefties and platoon with the Hobbit will have been a better choice, for the so-called utility that Sabean/Bochy value so much.
Is he even a decent baserunner, though? Doesn’t he have “bonehead” speed? The Velez comp is apt. APT!
That’s a good point. 35 Sbs to 12 Cs in the majors, 147 Sbs to 44 CS in the minors.
I recently re-read the old BA scouting reports – one of them on Burriss raves about August Manager Roberto Kelly being aggressive with running and loving Burriss.
My eye says he is sort of a bonehead. What SB rate are we aiming for? 80%? Bochy tends to run guys in obvious situations, Ford/Burriss suffered from that a bit last year but I don’t know the exact stats on it.
Fangraphs rates him as having positive value as a baserunner. I don’t know if that takes the break-even point and all that into account, though.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
I think Fangraphs wOBA includes SB/CS and baserunning is everything minus SB/CS.
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
Reminds me of that speed demon that Charlie Finley kept around just for pinch-running.
Claudell Washington? Do I have that right?
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 12:28 PM PST up reply actions
Herbie Washington? And somebody else too.
Though it is clearly well-informed, we find his argument unconvincing; however, the possibility that we are too stupid to comprehend it deserves serious consideration. Germane Literature: The Cutting Edge 13:2, 4/2006
/wikis both
You called it. Herb Washington it is. Oddly enough, though, Claudell Washington was on those dynastic Swingin’ A’s.
He was also the guy who hit the foul ball that Ferris Bueller caught not too far off of where Steve Bartman would be sitting.
11 01 10
Veni Vidi Vixi
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Jan 4, 2012 1:21 PM PST up reply actions
On a team with a run scoring environment like that Giants have 70% is probably adequate. Especially if they are running mostly when the risk/reward slants in their favor.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:11 PM PST up reply actions
Why can’t anyone play MI anymore?
There are plenty of guys that can play middle infield, they just tend to all bat or all glove.
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
In Burriss’ case, he is no bat and no glove.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
Well played Sir !
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
No one’s glove can be that good. I mean, I get giving the guy a flier once. Maybe twice. It’s the fact that he’s now been in 4 teams’ organizations while maintaining those numbers over a 5 year career is what’s crazy to me. He’s only been to the big show with the Giants and Phillies (only 5 PA’s), though.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
I think there’s a part of the minor leagues that is developing prospects and another part that is a numbers game. Somebody has to play SS for pennies.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 11:44 AM PST up reply actions
I know they need filler guys. That was sort of my point with the last sentence of my other comment which was he’s only had 5 PA’s in the bigs with any team other than the Giants.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
It’s pretty hard at first.
Once more, coming to you by proxy.
by howtheyscored on Jan 4, 2012 11:40 AM PST up reply actions
Not sustainable
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
He's like Crawford but with experience at being a bad hitter at the major league level!
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 11:36 AM PST up reply actions
OT True story
My husband got into a flame war with Jason Grilli on LinkedIn. Grilli posted a help wanted ad and hubby said it sounded suspiciously scammy. Grilli got all defensive until another guy said he agreed with hubby. Then Grilli calmed down and asked why it looked scammy, and they discussed better ways of marketing yourself as a internet marketing company.
Turns out Grilli will probably play for the Pirates this year (obligatory LOL) so his venture is probably on hold.
Just play a Brandon or two, come on!
Weird.
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
LOL
I always thought it would be cool if Grilli owned a steak restaurant.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
I bet you’re lying that you’ve “always thought” that.
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
No
one of the first thing I though about when I heard his name is that it would be cool if he owned a restaurant called “Grilli’s Grill”
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
I DONT BELIEVE YOU
"Baseball is a red-blooded sport for red-blooded men. It's no pink tea, and mollycoddles had better stay out." -Ty Cobb
Mayor of Smug.
I bet you are lying about that.
The Golden Bear is ever watching
2011 Giants Adoptee: Orlando Cabrera (because everyone needs to be loved)
San Francisco Giants Won the 2010 World Series: Not a Typo
Nah, probably not
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
a Bar & Grilli
"There was no torture in the end. Only rapture." - Mike Krukow
Flags Fly Forever
"Orlando before Zod" doesn't have the same nice ring to it.
by nostocksjustbonds on Jan 4, 2012 12:16 PM PST up reply actions
His Twitter feed is pretty scammy.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
Who the hell would subscribe to Jason Grilli’s twitter feed? (no offense)
Just play a Brandon or two, come on!
This idiot, apparently.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
I’m not on twitter, so I’m an idiot, too. What criteria do you use to decide to follow someone?
Just play a Brandon or two, come on!
I have a friend who was a fan of him back in the day, and has met him a bunch of times. He’s a really nice guy. His Twitter used to be interesting and funny. It’s not so much now, but I haven’t bothered to unfollow him.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
Over at SJGiants.com
Poll: Who is the top catching prospect in the San Francisco Giants farm system?
TJ in the lead surprisingly.
http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/index.jsp?sid=t476
Giants Q & A with Jarrett Parker
http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20111215&content_id=26176250&vkey=news_t476&fext=.jsp&sid=t476
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
Cool, thanks. I’m a Jarrett Parker fan. Also, I think TJ is probably going to get the most votes in a poll on the SJ Giants website, because those fans watched him play all last year. Plus, he’s ranked higher than the others on most lists right now, isn’t he?
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
god isn't it nice that we'll likely have at least one expendable trade chip
between Hector Sanchez, Parker and TJ
And Susac.
"I see these guys walking around with rings on, and I want one. That's what it's all about." -Ryan Vogelsong
probably b/c of the power but
they also watched Gary Brown play all year
"There was no torture in the end. Only rapture." - Mike Krukow
Flags Fly Forever
"Orlando before Zod" doesn't have the same nice ring to it.
by nostocksjustbonds on Jan 4, 2012 12:18 PM PST up reply actions
Gary Brown doesn’t play catcher though.
by GuyWhiteyCorngood on Jan 4, 2012 12:19 PM PST up reply actions
thanks. der.
misread that one. my mind omitted the word “catching”
"There was no torture in the end. Only rapture." - Mike Krukow
Flags Fly Forever
"Orlando before Zod" doesn't have the same nice ring to it.
by nostocksjustbonds on Jan 4, 2012 12:26 PM PST up reply actions
That clears that up — I was so confused!
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
by kdl on Jan 4, 2012 1:01 PM PST up reply actions
Word can't express how much I'm enjoying the Bois GIF article
Quote from my adopted son Mike Krukow: "We're the Giants. We're San Francisco. And we're World Series Champions!"
Perhaps a GIF would do the trick?
Adopted father of Chris Lincecum, without whom (quite literally) Timmy would not exist.
A typical MCC discussion expressed in gif form
Dearest, Susan - The Patron Saint of Patience
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 4, 2012 12:35 PM PST up reply actions
And this a representation calbear949 in a typical discussion here.
Kickham where it hurts
by say hey nation on Jan 4, 2012 12:39 PM PST up reply actions
CalBear is the cart right ? Goofus is the guy that saves it at the end ?
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
Does that make DFARowand the guy that bails out at the end?
2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller
by Johnny Disaster on Jan 4, 2012 12:57 PM PST up reply actions
Perhaps...
/ golf clap
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
This is one of my favorites on the list
I'm a Giants Fan, but I'll always be rooting for Matt Downs
Adopted Son:Dan Burkhart , Future Backup To Buster Posey.
Why in the world would you post a gif of a child having a coronary?!?
Though it is clearly well-informed, we find his argument unconvincing; however, the possibility that we are too stupid to comprehend it deserves serious consideration. Germane Literature: The Cutting Edge 13:2, 4/2006
For the humor!
2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller
by Johnny Disaster on Jan 4, 2012 3:17 PM PST up reply actions
I'm home for lunch so I can see it now.
Should I bother to read all that blahblah? Because the gifs themselves don’t really need any.
Just play a Brandon or two, come on!
The blahblah is the best part.
@legaleagle88
Giants Baseball: Why Not?
I thought Nate Schierholtz was cool before it was cool to think Nate Schierholtz was cool.
by kdl on Jan 4, 2012 1:02 PM PST up reply actions
When they came for Brian Bocock I stayed silent..
When they came for Eugenio Velez I said nothing..
BUT NOW THIS?
Matt Eddy @eddymk 7m Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
Athletics sign power-armed RH relievers Travis Schlicting & Merkin Valdez and little LH reliever Fabio Castro. All minors deals.
Quote from my adopted son Mike Krukow: "We're the Giants. We're San Francisco. And we're World Series Champions!"
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