When I Fell In Love With Vroom...

by Puster Bosey on Apr 27, 2011 2:11 AM PDT

I went to spring training for the third year in a row this spring, and had a really great time (despite getting rained out the second game!) One of the more memorable points was when we walked over to catch a little bit of batting practice on the minor league field. It was fun getting able to get a little bit of conversation with the players even. Telling Zito I liked his socks almost as much as his 'stache. Attempting to get Shawon Dunston to smile for a picture. But the friendliest and most engaging of the players that I had a chance to "talk" to was Darren Ford. Fans asked him about his background in track and I broke the ice with a "Darren, you think if I ran 30 and you ran 40 you could still beat me?" to which Ford simply laughed and replied with a "definitely." I definitely believe him after last night's game.

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if ford is ever a star, footraces against fans for charity would be a great PR event

by kornstar2004 on Apr 27, 2011 2:55 AM PDT reply actions

Interestingly

Just yesterday the Baseball Today podcast had an email that got them randomly talking about the 1976 Oakland A’s, who I think they said had the all time record with 341 SB (which really is an incredible figure — essentially all 9 spots in the batting order had to average 38 SB for the season).

And what was remarkable about that team, aside from the SB they got from players like Phil Garner (35), Sal Bando (20), Campy Campaneris (54), Claudell Washington (37), and Don Baylor (52!), but rather the TWO Designated Runners that they had on the bench: Larry Lintz appeared in 68 games, stole 31 bases, and scored 21 runs, but was allowed only 4 PA for the year (putting up a highly respectable .000/.667/.000 line!)

And then there was Matt Alexander. Alexander stole 20 bases and scored 16 runs in 61 games played. But amazingly they let Matt hit 30 times that year, and his .033/.033/.033 suggests that was at least 29 times too many.

Alexander was really a pretty terrible player. In 9 years he hit .214/.294/.262 over 195 PA and while he stole 103 bases in his career, he was also caught stealing 42 times.

Larry Lintz (who was from Martinez and went to school at San Jose St) was actually sent to the plate quite a few times early in his career with the Expos. In 6 seasons he batted 756 times posting a .227/.336/.252 line — Larry knew how to work a walk! On his career he stole 128 bases and was CS 38 times. According to BRef, Larry was a 2 Win player for his career.

Of course, the first Oakland DR was famously Herb Washington, who appeared in 105 games in his career and never had a PA. He had 31 SB, 17 CS. In the 1974 postseason, Herb was 0-2 in SB attempts during the AL championship series, and was picked off 1B in the World Series.

MY DAD WAS WRONG!
MY BOY NEEDS TO THROW HARDER!

by Roger on Apr 27, 2011 5:01 AM PDT reply actions

Looking back at that roster makes me think how much fun the incredible expanding pitching staffs have taken out of the game.

MY DAD WAS WRONG!
MY BOY NEEDS TO THROW HARDER!

by Roger on Apr 27, 2011 5:05 AM PDT up reply actions

Yeah I heard that too

I couldn’t help, but think that the Giants would be the perfect team to bring back the DR, however I think that the DR would need to also be a pretty good defensive player as well. Consider that even though his average is below .250, PtB’s OBP is around .360. Since he usually gets pulled late in games for a defensive replacement wouldn’t it be great to be able to bring someone off the bench who could turn PtB’s late-inning walks in to doubles, or at the very least keep them out of double plays before taking over for him in the field? I like Schierholtz, but with Ross playing right and Rownads hitting somewhat it might mean that Ford is a better fit for the Giants this year than Schierholtz.

Proud member of the cesspool of ethical bankruptcy known as the McC.
Proud adoptive parent of Brett Bochy, he's my boy now Bruce!

by Giant Torture on Apr 27, 2011 5:44 AM PDT up reply actions

I can't figure out how this happens

4 PA for the year (putting up a highly respectable .000/.667/.000 line!)

Like, that would have to .500 or .750, right? Or am I missing something fairly obvious?

Juan "Doesn't Cheat The Game" Perez, future CF for the World Champion San Francisco Giants.

by marcello on Apr 27, 2011 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions

Simple - One of the PAs was a sacrifice bunt which does not count against OBP or BA.

2 were some combination of walks and HBP and only one was a non sacrifice bunt out. Just to note, sacrifice flys do count against OBP but not against BA.

by puck_017 on Apr 27, 2011 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions

Sac bunts don't count against OBP?

I thought they did. Have I been woefully misinformed this whole time?

Juan "Doesn't Cheat The Game" Perez, future CF for the World Champion San Francisco Giants.

by marcello on Apr 27, 2011 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions

Just Sac Flies.

MY DAD WAS WRONG!
MY BOY NEEDS TO THROW HARDER!

by Roger on Apr 27, 2011 7:19 PM PDT up reply actions

Well that's stupid as all hell

If anything, it should be the other way around, but really, both should count against OBP.

Juan "Doesn't Cheat The Game" Perez, future CF for the World Champion San Francisco Giants.

by marcello on Apr 27, 2011 8:26 PM PDT up reply actions

Really?

The SH is managerially ordered: the player has no discretion. The SF is a dubious scoring category, which has gone in and out of the rules over the decades, originating in the idea that the batter is “giving himself up”, which seems silly on a fly ball to the outfield.

Professional baseball analyst since 1980.
Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehn.—Goethe

by owlcroft on Apr 28, 2011 1:34 AM PDT up reply actions

Also, a sacrifice bunt is a sacrifice regardless of what base the runner is on. If you hit a ball to the warning track with a runner on 3rd it’s a sac fly; if you do the same thing with a runner on 1st or 2nd, it’s just an out.

"If it's weird, you know it's probably Wilson's." - Matt Cain
Farewell, Andrew Romo. Don't forget to write.

by EliminateMe on Apr 28, 2011 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions

Not always

And I don’t really care if it’s managerially ordered, you still made an out.

Juan "Doesn't Cheat The Game" Perez, future CF for the World Champion San Francisco Giants.

by marcello on Apr 28, 2011 10:21 AM PDT up reply actions

Yes, you did; but . . .

. . . why should that be charged against your performance record when you had no alternative? The six categories of event-scoring (AB, BB, HBP, SH, SF, CI) have, except for the now-you-see-it-now-you-don’t sac fly, been around a long time. Why shouldn’t a walk be added to one’s batting average? You got on base. Why shouldn’t a hit-by-pitch be added to your BA (same argument)? Because someone decided that that’s not what that stat seeks to measure.

What OBP seeks to measure is a batter’s ability to get on base when not artificially constrained. If it were otherwise, we’d have to add reached-on-error into it, and no one does. (In fact, there’s a much better argument for that, because it still bears some thin relation to ability, notably speed.)

Professional baseball analyst since 1980.
Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehn.—Goethe

by owlcroft on Apr 28, 2011 5:12 PM PDT up reply actions

Why aren’t walks part of Total Bases?

MY DAD WAS WRONG!
MY BOY NEEDS TO THROW HARDER!

by Roger on Apr 28, 2011 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions

Because they aren't any kind of hit?

Professional baseball analyst since 1980.
Wir sind gewohnt, daß die Menschen verhöhnen was sie nicht verstehn.—Goethe

by owlcroft on Apr 29, 2011 3:28 AM PDT up reply actions

It was a rhetorical question. I was just adding to your list of “things that are because they’ve been that way for a long time.” Certainly walks are an acquired base.

MY DAD WAS WRONG!
MY BOY NEEDS TO THROW HARDER!

by Roger on Apr 29, 2011 5:04 AM PDT up reply actions

I'd love to see a race between

Darren Ford, Jarrod Dyson of the Royals, Dexter Fowler of the Rockies, and Michael Bourn from the Astros. It’s fun watching Ford do just about everything (even him getting picked off is entertaining, I must admit).

On the ball hit to the gap in right-center last night, it looked like there must’ve been movie magic or something going on for him to be under it so easily. Incredible. Just wish there was some evidence the guy could hit.

You want optimism? My glass is half full of emptiness.

by DanielSmith on Apr 27, 2011 11:34 AM PDT reply actions