The Giants will never compete in a seven-game series
by Fire Sabean on Apr 28, 2010 4:46 PM PDT
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A lot of people are and will be cursing out Bruce Bochy and Brian Wilson for this game. Tim looked a bit tired, but I think he could have gone at least one more batter. Brian has been perfect all year so he was due to blow it. You can also argue that the pitch before the 3-run hit definitely should be a strike. But it wasn't called and we lost the game. That's it. Bochy should have let Tim pitch one more, the game wouldn't have been decided at that point. TO SUM IT UP:
- Velez is still terrible
- Nate for league MVP
- Pitching staff rocks
- Us vs. the "best"
- We will do this all year
Velez is still terrible: Please don't be shocked that Eugenio Velez sat down and ate dinner with the left-field wall, then dropped the next batter's routine pop fly as he went with the "one-handed I'm too kewl for school" style. Velez has always been terrible and should never see any outfield playing time or at-bats.. Yet BOCHY subbed him in in the eighth over Bowker; Velez is terrible. If you follow FIRE-SABEAN you would know we broke that story a long, long time ago. Not to mention, he was at-bat in a 7-6 game with runners on 2nd and 3rd with one out in the bottom of the 11th. He manages to get Uribe out at home with a groundball to first base. YES! 
Nate for league MVP: -Nate Schierholtz deserves a tip of the cap -- which is a long time coming as he should have been out there over Velez/Bowker from the get-go - but that's a different beast in itself. He has always had one of the best arms and bone structure I have ever seen and he finally showed it off this series. That play on Ryan Howard where Howard jogged into second and got tagged out was awesome, and also a snapshot of big-leaguers these days. When Rowand is healthy I'd love a Bowker, Rowand, Schierholtz outfield just once -- but we know that will never happen. Ever. Anyway, I'm pumped for Nate.
Pitching staff rocks: Specifically, starting pitching rotation. Unbelievable, night in and night out. No complaints, none whatsoever.
Us vs. "the best": If you gave me infinity-to-one odds that the Giants would win the series against St. Louis and Philadelphia I wouldn't have given you a nickel, so either way it's a pleasant surprise. Still, the team needs to play at a high level constantly to even be mentioned in the same breath as the aforementioned squads. Here is why, even though we won both of the series, the Giants are not on the same level as the teams we just beat.
Teams like Philadelphia and St. Louis have outstanding pitching AND hitting all the time. They are the two teams that pop up when you think about tops in the National League.. Yes, the Giants seemed to hit better lately (even against all-star pitchers), but again, consistency needs to be seen or this team will always be those "almost there" Giants. You can't argue, however, with a +.500 record.
But you can argue with the way we have been guided here by our front office. You can argue the reason we have no hitting is because of the lack of deal-finishing ability good ol' Sabes has. You can argue that this team should be better. Sure we took an April series against both of those teams, but that's all we've taken. It's still early and this team still needs to learn a lot (sound like last year?).
But it was a valiant effort and hopefully we still have some confidence left going into the Colorado series. Still, this one hurts -- a la Dodgers v. Giants.. Romo.. you know the rest. Our hearts can't be broken again, the team must step up and realize it's one game in 162. We have our first series against the Rockies this weekend, it's a lot bigger than this game.
We will do this all year: Bottom line and back on track: The Giants will do this to us all year because of the players Sabean has put together. Can't complain about the lineup, but seriously, this will happen all year. Unless we fight the fight and FIRE SABEAN AND BOCHY.
We have a decent team, no one is arguing that. But we can't climb out of deficits and we can't fully depend on our pitching because sooner or later in the playoffs a hot team will run all over us.
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT, Go Giants.
BRUCE BOCHY GRADE: F. Tim could have had one more hitter, Velez could have stayed in the minors.
CONCLUSION/CLIFFS ON WALL OF TEXT: The Giants will never compete in a seven-game series because our bullpen will have breakdowns and against teams that have been there before and have a relentless onslaught of talent. We, on the other hand, have pitching. Go pitching!
This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.
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Chill. It was one game. Don't get so panicky all of a sudden.
My thoughts on the game:
1) Lincecum should have been left in there to get one more out, if not finish the inning. He exited after having thrown 106 pitches.
2) The Giants will win a 7-game series IMHO because of their ability to rally. They scored one run in the 10th to even it up and almost did so again in the 11th.
3) Velez…wtf man. It’s Bochy’s fault for leaving him in their as a defensive sub. I mean, Velez? A defensive sub?
4) Romo should not pitch when the game is on the line. Affeldt’s 3.12 ERA is also a bit worrisome.
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Are you serious.
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You "broke the story" that Velez is terrible, huh?
I’m eagerly awaiting your investigative report on “Water: Leading Cause of Wetness”.
Adoptive parent of Kevin Frandsen, now stopping gaps in Boston...I mean Pawtucket.
It was a joke
brah, take is easy OK! Obviously Velez broke the story on the fact that he’s terrible.
I didn't like Wilson's post game interview
sounded like he was trying to blame Nate. Why couldn’t he just say,
“I didn’t get it done, credit to Werth for getting that ball in play. Let’s get back to work.” And shut the fuck up.
I find Wilson to be rather dickish, amirong?
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
well in his defense, Nate played the bounce pretty bad. Had he fielded it cleanly, you only get one, maybe two runs in and you’re still ahead.
Also it’s hard to find any kind of fault in Nate’s game during this series so I’m not trying to start a witch hunt. I’m just pointing one thing out.
I know,
the fact is he had a choice: try to make the catch or be sure to cut it off. He made the wrong choice. Next time he won’t.
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
I don’t like Wilson’s personality in the least bit. I find him to be a pretty huge douche. That said, I can easily ignore that aspect of him – he’s a talented pitcher, and I like him out there on the mound for us.
by Missing Barry on Apr 29, 2010 9:56 AM PDT up reply actions
I am less than surprised to see this line of reasoning from “Missing Barry.”
I’m unaware of any douchey aspects of Wilson’s personality, beyond his penchant for Ed Hardy shirts. But, yeah, if he is a douche, being our douche is worth a lot of bonus points.
Proud parent of Will the Thrill, standard-bearer of The Giants Way.
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Apr 29, 2010 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions
You know, I thought that same thing. The first thing that popped into my mind when I read Wilson’s post-game comments was “I did my job.”
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Brian Wilson
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“ITS NOT MAY FAULT EVER STOP PICKING ON ME”
by E Ticket on Apr 30, 2010 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Velez has one legitimate role
to be a pinch runner on third base.
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
/Tries to score on a ball in the dirt, fielded cleanly by catcher
I've got just three words for you: Duck The Fodgers
flannery grabs him
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
Ian left out the part where Velez runs into Flannery first.
It was fully implied though.
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Bochy: What’s this fancy stat here?
IT Guy: That’s how often they get on base. I do not know why you keep asking me, I am here to fix your server.
I also left out the part where he yells at Flannery to let him go and keeps trying to head for home.
Post-Game interview with Flannery:
“I was saying ‘No, No, No!’ and he heard ‘Go, Go, Go!’”
Here’s a question for the ages:
Who would you rather have on the basepaths: Velez or Ruben Rivera?
I've got just three words for you: Duck The Fodgers
If we’re talking about playoffs….well, three of the only factors from regular season performance that correlate with playoff success are power pitching (meaning high K’s), bullpen and defense. We have all of those going for us. I like the Giants playoff chances. I don’t like the Giants regular season chances. Nobody wants to see us if we creep into the playoffs – the pitching is just too scary. Did I mention offensive performance doesn’t correlate nearly as well with playoff success?
The 2005 White Sox concur.
I feel prickishly demanding!
I couldn't be prouder of my recent adoptee - Tim Lincecum's dealer. He provides the secret fuel behind both Cy Youngs. Also, he taught Timmy the change-up.
by giantsfansince1981 on Apr 28, 2010 6:01 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah
I know it’s a lot of pitching and whatnot in the playoffs. But after the Phils familiarize themselves with a team and pitchers I think they can get more comfortable.
I agree with all your points, I just see a lot of Cain games come playoff time (plus added pressure on a lot of young players)
Good pitching beats good hitting, after all.
Proud parent of Will the Thrill, standard-bearer of The Giants Way.
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Apr 29, 2010 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions
“The first rule of the Tautology Club is the first rule of the Tautology Club.”
:P
by withclubsauce on Apr 28, 2010 8:41 PM PDT up reply actions
NOt only should he have been called out on strikes
The same pitch was called a strike vs the giants at least twice, later in the game in key situations.
Affeldt has regressed this year HBP's BB's then coming in too good.
He did pitch nicely to Howard. Timmy does not have to challenge Howard, Nobody was even touching his changeup. Nobody. I think LIncecum’s last pitch called ball 4, moved a lot, but it was probably a strike. One out in the ninth, 3 run lead, and poof on a chalk line. A little more fair and its an out, a little more foul and he is still at bat.
huh?
[Schierholtz] has always had one of the best arms and bone structure I have ever seen
Adopted Giant: Henry Sosa
I hadn’t noticed that. Now I’m really curious.
I feel prickishly demanding!
I couldn't be prouder of my recent adoptee - Tim Lincecum's dealer. He provides the secret fuel behind both Cy Youngs. Also, he taught Timmy the change-up.
by giantsfansince1981 on Apr 28, 2010 7:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Strange comment......rambling post.....
other than that it’s all good
by ScottinMarin on Apr 28, 2010 8:41 PM PDT up reply actions
I was about to make fun of this, too!
Back on the market.
by positiveuphemism on Apr 28, 2010 9:55 PM PDT up reply actions
man love
Nate DOES remind me of Kirk Gibson.
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
Reasons that Giants will always compete in a 7 game series:
Tim Lincecum
Matt Cain
Barry Zito or Jonathan Sanchez
Tim Lincecum
My Son was the third most valuable Giant position player by WAR in 2009. A little sad, a little happy.
I predict that history will look kindly on the 09 offseason, even if we were pissed at the time.
This, and also +1
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
Odds are they won't compete in any 5-game series either.
THE GREATEST OF ALL TIME (for 3 days in 1995).
by Mike Benjamin Hit King on Apr 29, 2010 12:07 AM PDT reply actions
exception taken
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
Please stop pointing out the obvious
then directing us to your blog for more rants with poor grammar and outrage directed at anyone in a Giants’ uniform. Sorry, but I’m glad Timmy was pulled. He was tired. He looked tired, and he started missing up in the zone, which is when pitchers get rocked, and sometimes hurt.
by tyrannoman on Apr 29, 2010 9:00 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
this
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
No offense, but I don’t see your line of thinking at all. An interested fan wants to bring up a topic for discussion – oh well, it does get tiresome if it’s brought up often (example: rosterbation) – but if that’s the case, just throw them a link or multiple links to show them all the previous discussion, no need to insult the guy. I also don’t quiet understand the sentiment I’ve seen around here against linking to another Giants blog – I don’t see where he’s “directing us to his blog” (on second reading I do see a quick mention of it), and even if I did…..you can simply choose not to click the link or read his blog if you aren’t interested, what’s the big deal? Maybe some others ARE interested. Let other Giants fans try to increase their readership – if people are reading, that means they want the content…..
(Also, the point of grammar is to clearly and concisely say exactly what you mean – if you can understand what’s being said, is there a need to criticize grammar?)
by Missing Barry on Apr 29, 2010 10:01 AM PDT up reply actions
Sorry about that, I'd like to have
conversations with real fans that aren’t 700 posts deep. I forget, but I think I posted this in “Fanposts” where fans express their opinion. My previous two posts I didn’t even have a link to the site, nor have I spammed it at all. Nice run-on sentence also:
He looked tired, and he started missing up in the zone, which is when pitchers get rocked, and sometimes hurt.
LOL POOR GRAMMAR LOL!! OMFG!!!
by Fire Sabean on Apr 29, 2010 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions
This
As far as stats go, pitch count is pretty unreliable. Yes, he’d thrown just 106 pitches; but even those who thought he should’ve been left in admitted he looked gassed. Maybe it was the pressure of having to really bear down to so many quality hitters. Maybe it was the fact that, at least anecdotally, his velocity seemed up a tick from his first four starts II haven’t checked pitch/fx to verify this yet). Maybe it was one of any number of other factors that combine to make pitch count a quick n’ dirty guideline rather than anything especially predictive. Point is, bringing him out and putting in a closer who’s been lights out all year to get two outs was a no-brainer and the right thing to do.
Bochy did make a couple of questionable decisions. Using Velez was the biggest, but I also questioned having Ishikawa try to lay down a sac bunt — to set it up for the currently punchless Mark DeRosa, no less. And personally, I would’ve either stuck with Wilson in the 10th or gone to Romo for the 9-1-2 guys. I guess if the inning was prolonged, we could’ve gone to Affeldt against Utley and Howard, but I was surprised he started the inning.
Whatever. It was a bad loss. Moving on…
"I'm not sure what the hell charisma is, but I have the feeling it's Willie Mays." --Ted Kluszewski
by Rick Parker (Lewis) Can't Lose on Apr 29, 2010 9:14 AM PDT reply actions
Yeah you make all quality points..
I guess my thinking is, Tim’s changeup is straight stupid.. He had a three-run lead with one out and a runner on.. A home run still would have held the lead, he can get groundballs with a curve and in one pitch it coulda been over.
I feel he should have had one more hitter, but as sad as it was I did let out a little laugh when Velez hit the wall. I couldn’t help it.
by Fire Sabean on Apr 29, 2010 10:23 AM PDT up reply actions
I was really disappointed by this loss. I can’t watch Phillies games despite living in Philly (thanks, MLB blackout rules!), but with a 2-0 series lead, up 7-1 in the 7th or 8th I went to the gym yesterday and started plotting how I could get a hold of a broom so when one of my coworkers showed up to work the next day, he’d have a broom with a Giants hat on it leaning against his office door…..then I checked the score after the game, and all my hopes came crashing down. What a disappointment. It’s a long season though, these things happen.
by Missing Barry on Apr 29, 2010 10:28 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah they do
But when everyone on MCC and Twitter is questioning Bochy’s move to pull Tim, or to put in Velez as a defensive replacement) then it could have been avoided. Move Derosa to left, so you have Dero, Torres, Nate and then have Velez play the infield or something. But he has looked lost out there SO many times and this just topped it all off, please tell me you saw the highlights?
by Fire Sabean on Apr 29, 2010 10:37 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I saw the highlights. I thought we traded Fred Lewis?!
by Missing Barry on Apr 29, 2010 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions
I’d hardly say that “everyone” around here is questioning Bochy’s move. Perhaps you meant SFGate?
Proud parent of Will the Thrill, standard-bearer of The Giants Way.
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Apr 29, 2010 4:39 PM PDT up reply actions
Neither the Phillies nor the Cardinals have great pitching
and the Giants do. I agree the pen is not great. But neither is the Cardinals nor Phillies’; in sum the Giants pitching is dominant. And they will win series against the Phillies and Cardinals because of it.
And they will go to the World Series.
Print the freakin tickets !!!!
The Giants lost last night because of a couple of truly freak plays, and a bad player who is never gonna play for the Giants again. Get over it.
if Freddie Sanchez, Mark DeRosa and Aubrey Huff are the answer, I guess I just didn't understand the question.
The Cardinals have two excellent but beatable pitchers at the front of their rotation, and an so-so bullpen with a fluky closer.
The Phillies have Doc, plus J.A Happ and Cole Hamels who both seem to wobble between excellent and a bad case of regression to the mean (there’s a lot of literature out there on the webz suggesting that Happ is lined up for a big sophomore slump), and their bullpen is weakened from last year with the departure of Chan Ho Park, plus the well documented woes of their late relief.
Both these teams, like the Mariners, have a dandy front end of the rotation and problems at the back. I think the Phillies are far and away the best team in the NL on paper, but when you take them out of their rhythm, they flounder, as we saw in the two series against the Marlins and Giants.
Adoptive father of the enigmatic Michael Sandoval, and living vicariously through his proximity to Joe Mauer and the Panda.
Most teams have great pitching
when facing the Giants offense.
by Every6thDay on Apr 29, 2010 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
LOL so true
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This will happen all year...
So you’re saying that we will win the rest of our series and come away with two wins for every one lose?
I’ll take it. Way to go Sabean and Bochy! Keep up the good work.
YEAH111
I was definitely not talking about the mishandling of the game, the Velez sighting or the Ishi bunting..
by Fire Sabean on Apr 29, 2010 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions
We can all second guess a decision and every one is doing it right now with this game. Bigger picture, this is one of 162 and with any hope it’s the last straw for Velez. But if a thousand things go differently in the ninth we don’t have this conversation at all so it’s pretty much a crap shoot on a lot of decisions. I’m not second guessing your decision to slam people that are probably going to get us into the playoffs this year by winning two out of three from the elite teams in the NL.
I’m just saying I’ll suck it up and take one bad decision in an otherwise stellar game. It’s not time to fire Bochy or Sabean.
I’m just saying I’ll suck it up and take one bad decision in an otherwise stellar game. It’s not time to fire Bochy or Sabean.
Ha, I’d go and say the decision wasn’t even a bad one, but the time to fire Sabean and Bochy was a long time ago. Better late than never (though it doesn’t make much sense to me to do it in season, wait until after the season)….
by Missing Barry on Apr 29, 2010 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions
Going with your whole "just one game" theory
It’s just six games against two teams in APRIL.. As for “it’s not time to fire bochy or sabean” .. you have got to be trolling.
Trolling? Why because I don’t agree with you? It’s called conversation, we don’t have to agree on everything.
Anyhow, had Wilson gotten the out there wouldn’t have had anything to write about. Had Nate fielded the ball clean and limited the damage, there wouldn’t have had anything to write about. That’s part of baseball and right now we are playing better than most teams.
So these past few weeks make up
for the years the Brian has been a complete and total f-up?
by Fire Sabean on Apr 30, 2010 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions
I get it, you want to fire Brian Sabean.
Now get this, I don’t care that we had a few bad years. He maintained a perennial winner around Barry Bonds and then took three plus years to retool and rebuild a team that looks like it could be set to win for a long time to come. He obviously was hamstrung by an organizational philosophy that forced him to do one thing. The philosophy changed and they are doing a new thing and right now, it looks like it’s working.
Don’t forget that we finished the season last year on the verge of the playoffs and that early in this season we look to be building on that.
Your ideas are intriguing to me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
Adoptive father of the enigmatic Michael Sandoval, and living vicariously through his proximity to Joe Mauer and the Panda.
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by Lars The Wanderer on Apr 29, 2010 11:45 AM PDT reply actions
I'M A JOURNALIST!
…and a kinda touchy one, at that.
Proud parent of Will the Thrill, standard-bearer of The Giants Way.
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Apr 29, 2010 4:45 PM PDT up reply actions
Heh.
I have a theatre degree but have kinda stopped answering ‘yes’ when people ask if I’m an actor. Actually, it’s a Drama degree; anybody see God’s Country at SFSU back in early 2003? Didn’t think so.
Proud parent of Will the Thrill, standard-bearer of The Giants Way.
by WhereThere'sAWillieThere'sAMays on Apr 29, 2010 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Anyone seen "Remember When" at Crest Theatre?
Didn’t think so
by Fire Sabean on Apr 30, 2010 12:58 AM PDT up reply actions
Keeping it brief:
We can’t know how this team will do in a seven-game series, because October is still 5 months away. We won’t know what this team will look like in September. Posey? Franchez? Wellemeyer? Bowker? We have no idea. And we still can’t know if any of this will be sustainable.
So, to borrow a phrase from the inspired wordsmith George Lucas, “Only the Sith speak in absolutes.”
Adoptive father of the enigmatic Michael Sandoval, and living vicariously through his proximity to Joe Mauer and the Panda.
The positive aspect of losing this game
I can draw one very positive thing from this very disappointing loss. Velez’s error was one very big step toward being DFA’d or sent down when Rownad is ready to come off the DL. Velez being gone will save other wins in the future.
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