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Woah.
Cool for them.
Just need a 1st baseman now.
Who is still available?
by AmorVincitOmnia on Dec 8, 2010 10:50 PM PST reply actions
They do have $ after being rejected by pretty much everyone
I could see them trying to get Prince
"You think someone that big would be more well endowed" Aubrey Huff's mother on Pat Burrell
I thought he was going to punch me and I was totally accepting of it. I was planning a reason to thank him if he did." Brian Wilson on Buster Posey
Follow me: Twitter.com/gobroks
Woah.
That would be awesome for them.
I’m really pulling for them… Always have been.
Knock the Sox and Yanks off.
by AmorVincitOmnia on Dec 8, 2010 10:57 PM PST up reply actions
Once again
the word is spelled WHOA. This abomination must stop.
/goes back to keeping kids off the front lawn/
"I can't very well tell my batters, 'Dont hit it to him.' Wherever they hit it, he's there anyway."
- NY Mets manager Gil Hodges on Willie Mays
Also this story made me rage on Twitter. Yay
"You think someone that big would be more well endowed" Aubrey Huff's mother on Pat Burrell
I thought he was going to punch me and I was totally accepting of it. I was planning a reason to thank him if he did." Brian Wilson on Buster Posey
Follow me: Twitter.com/gobroks
What in the hell was Sabean offering that the Twins didn’t take it over this? That’s a Henry Sosa/Steve Edlefsen kind of package, unless I have the names wrong.
I imagine he wasn't interested after he signed Tejada...
IDK though. I will say that after seeing what Hardy went for it makes me like the Tejada deal much less. And yes I know that revisionist history
"You think someone that big would be more well endowed" Aubrey Huff's mother on Pat Burrell
I thought he was going to punch me and I was totally accepting of it. I was planning a reason to thank him if he did." Brian Wilson on Buster Posey
Follow me: Twitter.com/gobroks
I think the revisionist history is totally fair though. If we’re giving Sabean extra points for the Huff signing in light of the Konerko and Pena contracts, why can’t we take points away for the Tejada signing?
Thing A
"Correlation between inability to use the reply button and general crappiness of analysis: pretty high." -Sleepy Freud
the Twins might have been demanding Runzler or similar back when there were more teams involved
that said, I don’t think Tejada should have kept Sabes from getting involved in some way.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
"Out, out, Fred Lewis!" - JCTillam Gamerspeare
Runzler for Hardy would have a pretty great trade for us, though. Runzler is still just a pretty good relief prospect who’s going to try to start for the first time in his career next year. He’s really not that valuable.
On paper yes
Maybe the Giants are really optimistic about the conversion and feel like Runzler is a top starting pitching prospect.
by hammystyle on Dec 9, 2010 2:05 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
It’s tough to doubt the Giants when it comes to developing pitchers.
by KrazyKrabMeat on Dec 9, 2010 8:45 PM PST up reply actions
I don't know
They’ve played this whole bullpen-starter bouncing game before, with Valdez ans Sanchez, and it really didn’t turn out well for either pitcher. Valdez had problems anyway, of course, but Sanchez’s development was probably legitimately slowed by being shunted off to the bullpen in 2006. It’s probably at least part of the reason why he was still considered a prospect/project at age 27.
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
…then again, look what happened the last time Sanchez went to the ’pen and then came back to start.
Valdez’s big problem (IMHO) is that he has no movement what-so-ever on his fastball, and despite it’s velocity, it rarely fools anyone. I think it would be difficult to argue how that would be a product of “bullpen-starter bouncing.” If his issues were more about conditioning or using more types of pitches to get outs, then I could see where you’re going with this. Valdez is just a really good BP pitcher.
by KrazyKrabMeat on Dec 11, 2010 10:51 AM PST up reply actions
I think the issues isn't necessarily the bouncing
Valdez had other problems, his arm was destined to explode no matter how we was used. I just used him as an example because the Giants seemed to be the last ones to figure out that he was never going to start.
The problem I had with Sanchez and (now) Runzler is that the decisions seem to be based on what the roster looks like and not what the player is suited for. Nobody wins when you put a player in a position to fail.
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
Well Valdez used to have a pretty good splitter
But whenever he would throw it his arm would explode
"You think someone that big would be more well endowed" Aubrey Huff's mother on Pat Burrell
I thought he was going to punch me and I was totally accepting of it. I was planning a reason to thank him if he did." Brian Wilson on Buster Posey
Follow me: Twitter.com/gobroks
To me there are a couple of things at work here
1. JJ Hardy was going to get paid 6-7M in arbitration. The Twins know this. The owner knows this. He doesn’t want to pay it. The rest of the league knows this, but the GM probably convinced the owner to tender a contract
“Yo man, don’t worry I got this. I’ll get a good return on Hardy.”
“Ok, if you say so. But this better not come back and bite me in the ass. If I end up getting stuck with paying anything on Hardy’s contract, I’m gonna fucking take this shovel, turn it upside down, and stick it straight up your candy ass”
2. When the Padres made a trade for Bartlett, the Orioles were the last team left that is serious about paying 5M+ to the starting shortstop in the market. I would be surprised that this was a case of down bidding between Boston and Minnesota.
“Here, take Scutaro, if you will take his whole contract, we’ll take…”
“No NO NOOOOO. You really want JJ Hardy. Look, man, if I don’t get this done, my Boss is going to fucking have my ass. You wouldn’t want someone protruding large metal object up your upper colon, would you? Of course not. So C’mon man, help a brother out. Just give me something, anything. Two Relievers? I’ll take them.”
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
I wish I would stop cheating. fuck. this is jctgamer's fault -- jponry
So in other words, we signed Tejada too early?
There's a First for Everything:
Edgar Renteria, The First World Series MVP in Giants History.
Brian Sabean making a move too early? Boy, that’s never happened before.
Ain't no Posey like a Buster Posey cause a Buster Posey don't stop...hitting.
Giants baseball: We're stupid enough to WIN that (TM)
it worked out w/ Renteria
that one time
"There was no torture in the end. Only rapture." - Mike Krukow
2010 Giants: World Series Champs
Neal before Zod!
Official Sponsor of the 1997 San Francisco Giants
by nostocksjustbonds on Dec 9, 2010 11:59 AM PST up reply actions
Cause and effect
If we didn’t sign Tejada, there wouldn’t be only Orioles in the market for a starting SS, and the price wouldn’t have come down.
And if Tejada accepts a deal somewhere else to play 3B, all of a sudden both the Os and the Giants are left without any leverage or fallback position.
Obviously any links in the above post are probably NSFW
The baseball gods do not always punish the wicked but they will not just allow people to spit in their faces -- Joe Posnanski
I wish I would stop cheating. fuck. this is jctgamer's fault -- jponry
meh
I think its very possible Renteria would’ve signed with either the Orioles or the Padres if not here. Even if he had taken a 3B job, we still couldve dealt for Ryan from the Cardinals and signed Renteria. I don’t think those two would’ve been much worse than Tejada.
Thing A
"Correlation between inability to use the reply button and general crappiness of analysis: pretty high." -Sleepy Freud
given Rent’s inability to stay off the DL the past two seasons, I’m pretty sure I don’t want to depend on a RentaRyan for my starting SS
Some say that some cannot say because the Stig can make some not say what they want to say and all i want to say is i don't know what the hell i'm trying to say.
Its not ideal, but neither is counting on Tejada. I’m just saying its not as though we would’ve been forced to start Burriss at SS if we had waited on Hardy and missed.
Thing A
"Correlation between inability to use the reply button and general crappiness of analysis: pretty high." -Sleepy Freud
Except
The Padres got Bartlett for a couple meh prospects, so the Giants would have had other options. Hardy and Bartlett went for very little, and the O’s probably had less leverage than the Giants and O’s would have since Hardy was the last viable SS option and the Twins could have kept him.
Ain't no Posey like a Buster Posey cause a Buster Posey don't stop...hitting.
Giants baseball: We're stupid enough to WIN that (TM)
Good points
Although I don’t think that the Sox were ever that desperate to trade Scutaro – certainly they were never going to give him away for a package that was as lacking as the one that the O’s just gave the Twins.
Also, you need to mention that the writing was on the wall when the Twins won the posting for Nishioka. There was no way that they could afford both Hardy and Nishioka and still put together a bullpen and a good DH.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
*
Scutaro is almost assured of being a Type A Free Agent next offseason, so the Sox would get 2 very high picks for him in the 2012 draft. They also can easily afford to pay him his $6M salary this season, and needed to keep him around based on the strong possibility that Lowrie isn’t ready to take over SS full-time next season and that Iglesias is at least 1 full season in the minors away from being ready for the majors.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
Assured?
I don’t know how type A is figured, but he had a weak 2010 and probably won’t start in 11.
by hammystyle on Dec 9, 2010 2:41 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I think it’s pretty clear Sabean never made an offer, isn’t it? There was a ton of talk about Bartlett and a bit about Scutaro, but we’ve heard absolutely nothing about Hardy.
Well, it’s pretty clear that he never made another offer after he signed Tejada.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
I imagine that the Twins were asking for too much in Sabes opinion, when they had their initial talks back in November.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
I really doubt the team made many serious inquiries with the Twins. Sabean said at the Tejada signing that they were willing to sacrifice some defense to get his bat. With Hardy you’re paying about the same contract and sacrificing some bat to get his glove. If you follow the organizational “if/then” flow chart, sounds to me like they probably considered Hardy, gave him a thumbs down and moved on.
MY DAD WAS WRONG!
This bugs me
Hardy should absolutely be a Giant next year if he was available, and with this news I have a sneaking suspicion he was. The only way he shouldn’t have been in SF is if the Twins demanded Belt and the Red Sox offered to pay us to take Scutaro.
I’m not legally allowed to be mad at you until 2011, Sabean, but you don’t have to take advantage of that.
Ain't no Posey like a Buster Posey cause a Buster Posey don't stop...hitting.
Giants baseball: We're stupid enough to WIN that (TM)
Meh on Hardy
Better than Tejeda, but not by so much that you want to give up talent rather than just sign the other as an FA. Giants just won it all, it wouldn’t surprise me if the Twins wanted a more important player from the World Champions than they wanted from a crap team like the Orioles. Besides, trading with the Twins probably brings back bad memories for Sabean.
Buster Posey: Let's enjoy him before he goes to the Yankees because he wants to win the World Series. Wait, what???
by rxmeister on Dec 9, 2010 2:31 AM PST via mobile reply actions
I’m torn. On one hand, I know that without Miggy signing, it would have cost more. Perhaps Runzler+Surkamp. Runzler is a better reliever than the two given up, but it seems like better reliever profiles a bit like Runzler. Surkamp is the kind of guy the Twins would be after hard.
Sorry if I didn’t wipe that post properly after pulling it out of my ass.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
Runzler + Surkamp is so much more than two unimpressive and old relievers
Juan "Doesn't Cheat The Game" Perez, future CF for the World Champion San Francisco Giants.
I know, I’m assuming that Tejada went somewhere else and we’re bidding against the Orioles.
The Rays wanted Reimold and Simon from the Orioles for Bartlett, and if we’re both down to one SS option in Hardy, I could see the Twins wanting a package like that.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
Its not like Hardy wouldve been the only guy on the market. I think it wouldve been worth risking losing out on Tejada to wait for the price to fall on Hardy. Even if you miss on both you can still bring back Renteria and/or trade for Scutaro or Ryan. I don’t really believe that us signing Tejada brought the asking price on Hardy down all that significantly. I think getting very close to a deal with Nishioka brought it down.
Thing A
"Correlation between inability to use the reply button and general crappiness of analysis: pretty high." -Sleepy Freud
Sabean seemed upset when Uribe left, as you saw from his “he preferred the Dodgers to the Giants comment.” I’m not surprised he wanted to close the wound quickly, and Tejeda was certainly the quick response. It wouldn’t surprise me at all if the Rays and Twins attempted to gouge him, knowing he was more or less desperate.
Buster Posey: Let's enjoy him before he goes to the Yankees because he wants to win the World Series. Wait, what???
There was an article that said the Rays asked for Runzler and the Giants didn't bite
"You think someone that big would be more well endowed" Aubrey Huff's mother on Pat Burrell
I thought he was going to punch me and I was totally accepting of it. I was planning a reason to thank him if he did." Brian Wilson on Buster Posey
Follow me: Twitter.com/gobroks
Ahhh, what the fuck?
The Twins are morons, and we should have outbid this offer.
Juan "Doesn't Cheat The Game" Perez, future CF for the World Champion San Francisco Giants.
And I didn't need that comma
Juan "Doesn't Cheat The Game" Perez, future CF for the World Champion San Francisco Giants.
So what does the O's lineup look like now?
C Wieters
1B/DH Scott
2B Roberts
3B Reynolds
SS Hardy
LF Reimold/Pie
CF Jones
RF Markakis
Plus Josh Bell and LOL Jake Fox in the mix?
Aaron King, please pitch better.
McC Wiki - for all you newcomers out there.
If Scott gets hurt, who fills in as DH/birther?
by Monkeyking42 on Dec 9, 2010 12:25 PM PST up reply actions
Orioles sign Orly Taitz to minor league contract
with an invitation to spring training if they move it to Arizona.
"Guys, here's 20 wins right here" - Aubrey Huff on his red thong
/Win the inning
//Renteria - Still not a VD but I crush a lot
///Willism is Realism
by Scooter Ellis on Dec 9, 2010 8:24 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
Apparently they're interested in Adam LaRoche too
"You think someone that big would be more well endowed" Aubrey Huff's mother on Pat Burrell
I thought he was going to punch me and I was totally accepting of it. I was planning a reason to thank him if he did." Brian Wilson on Buster Posey
Follow me: Twitter.com/gobroks
considering LaRoche’s whole negotiating strategy is to get himself into favorable hitter’s ballparks, with no regards to whether the team has a chance of winning or not, a marriage between him and the Orioles is inevitable.
Buster Posey: Let's enjoy him before he goes to the Yankees because he wants to win the World Series. Wait, what???
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