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Farming the System: Giants Headed In The Right Direction

There has been grumbling in some quarters regarding the lack of trades or free agent signings by the Giants in this offseason—but people are missing the point.  And we're not talking about "If it ain't broke, don't fix it," because despite winning it all, the Giants can certainly stand to improve in anything and everything that doesn't relate to pitching up and down their lineup.

For the first time in what seems like an eternity, the team is following the tried-and-true approach of building a strong farm system and depending on it in lieu of trades or free agent signings.  When Brian Sabean arrived in 1997, he immediately returned the team to contention by bringing in a number of new players through trades or free agent signings—most notably the Matt Williams for Jeff Kent trade, which at the time was highly controversial.  

Sabean followed that philosophy for the better part of ten years, possibly due to the fact that the Giants' farm system wasn't really that strong.  In particular, he focused on drafting and signing pitchers, whom he would later use as prospect trade bait when dealing for established players to make a run for the roses during the years the team was in contention.

But after years of making sound moves, suddenly the wheels came off.  We all know the names by now: Marvin Benard, A.J. Pierzynski—and more recently, Aaron Rowand, Edgar Renteria and Barry Zito.  (Yes, I know Edgar came through big time in the Series, but he never really delivered with any kind of consistency that was deserving of his hefty and overpriced two-year contract.)  Sabean's efforts to surround an aging Barry Bonds with the right pieces during the middle years of the last decade were particularly futile.

But while all this was going on, the organization was slowly but surely building a strong farm system. The stellar starting pitching quartet of Lincecum, Cain, Sanchez and Bumgarner—as well as closer Brian Wilson—all came up through the Giants' system.  As did rookie sensation Buster Posey.  As has Brandon Belt, who many think is due to make himself a permanent fixture in the lineup.

While there don't seem to be any other names besides Belt ready to make an immediate impact, there are a number of players who, with a bit more seasoning, may be able to help in 2012 and beyond.  Look through all levels of the Giants' system, and you see an organization that now has one of the strongest farm systems in all of baseball.

Why does this matter so much?  First of all, it creates bargaining chips that can be traded for established players when the need arises.  But of greater importance is the fact that the team can let established players go when they become expensive free agents, and plug in younger players who can be retained for mere pennies early in their careers.

Or to put it another way, you can virtually fund and field an entire roster of young players for the same amount of money that it costs to sign one established star for a year.  Growing your own on the farm still remains the best—and certainly the least expensive—way to build a perennial contender and ensure success for many years to come.  More than anything else, Giant fans should celebrate this fact and look forward to at least the next few years.  Keep those blue-chip prospects coming.


This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.

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Comments

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Not sure that I would agree that the Giants have one of the strongest farms in baseball.

With the graduation of MadBum and Posey and Belt coming up soon the Giants look to have at best a middle of the pack system. I like Gary Brown, Zack, T Daddy, and to a lesser extent Crawford but none of those guys are blue-chippers.

The Giants had a nice run of early picks this decade but it will be much harder to find those stars if they continue to field a good team.

For the thirteen time in 3 or one evers, I found myself toothlessly thinking about Manny Ramirez.

by camwoody on Dec 17, 2010 3:57 PM PST reply actions  

I agree. And additionally, they really missed some opportunities in the dark ages (2004-2008) to replenish their system by becoming sellers at the deadline. They never had much to offer but it was almost like July 31 came and went each year while our winning percentage hovered around .450 and Sabean never tried to peddle our veterans to teams making playoff runs.

A little bit OT, but another missed opportunity was failing to give some of our AAA guys fair chances at becoming major leaguers. When your team is bad, its a good time to throw Bowker and Ortmeier types in for extended periods to see if they can adjust and become valuable. Giving them 150+ ABs near the end of the season takes away any uncertainty or excuse for not knowing the player’s value.

Here's to the Dodgers and their bucket of suck.

by Woody Wins on Dec 17, 2010 6:59 PM PST up reply actions  

And you can add Schierholtz and Frandsen to that list. You’re absolutely correct – being a near-last-place team has its benefits; most notably, the ability to give extended opportunites to young players, and higher draft positioning. It seems that Sabean sacrificed that first opportunity on the altar of Being In This Thing. Too bad, and we’ve been paying the price for the last 3 years.

And yes, I know we just won the World Series. I’m complaining about the process, not last year’s results.

"I can't very well tell my batters, 'Dont hit it to him.' Wherever they hit it, he's there anyway."
- NY Mets manager Gil Hodges on Willie Mays

by Lyle on Dec 18, 2010 8:19 AM PST up reply actions  

I completely agree

It’s likely that the Giants have one of the ten worst farm systems in the game. Outside of Belt, who is close to the big leagues or has an All-Star ceiling? Maybe Wheeler with the ceiling and that’s it. There’s a reason the Giants weren’t heavily rumored to be involved in any of the big trades of the offseason (Gonzalez, Greinke, Fielder). They don’t have many trade chips anymore. Have Sabean, Barr, and Tidrow done a good job drafting and grooming players? Yes, yes they have. Are they among the best in the business? Maybe. I don’t think so, but the argument could be made. Is this a great farm system? No.

In the end, America will be remembered for three things: the Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.

by cornball on Dec 20, 2010 11:13 AM PST up reply actions  

Our farm system is depleted now

Hell if you take out Belt it’s probably one of the worst in MLB. The giants have at best only 4 B-level and above prospects. And a couple of those B’s are probably B minuses at that

Brandon!
Belted deep to right-center field!

by Vaccaro on Dec 17, 2010 9:56 PM PST via mobile reply actions  

I don't think it's that bad

We’ve got more B prospects than that. But the lack of upper minors talent and the inherent risk with lower minors prospects is concerning.

Ain't no Posey like a Buster Posey cause a Buster Posey don't stop...hitting.

Giants baseball: We're stupid enough to WIN that (TM)

by quincy0191 on Dec 18, 2010 3:18 AM PST up reply actions  

On the other hand, WORLD CHAMPION SAN FRANCISCO GIANTS.

Ain't no Posey like a Buster Posey cause a Buster Posey don't stop...hitting.

Giants baseball: We're stupid enough to WIN that (TM)

by quincy0191 on Dec 18, 2010 3:18 AM PST up reply actions  

To this, yes

Brandon!
Belted deep to right-center field!

by Vaccaro on Dec 18, 2010 6:30 AM PST via mobile up reply actions  

It's not that bad

Because we have Belt. Without him it would be extremely weak. Behind Zack Wheeler there are no all-star/impact talents, and Wheeler still hasn’t even proved much other than his raw ability.

Brandon!
Belted deep to right-center field!

by Vaccaro on Dec 18, 2010 6:29 AM PST via mobile up reply actions  

I am interested in seeing what Neal can do in AAA

and I really wish the Giants could get a AA team that plays in more of a fair/nuetral enviornment and not just a pitcher friendly league.

by joe t on Dec 18, 2010 8:15 AM PST up reply actions  

Well

I see Belt, Wheeler, and Brown as All-Star impact talents, and Neal, Bucardo, and Peguero as potential fringe All-Star guys (ones who won’t be consistently in the discussion but will have a season or two worth of consideration). Plus, I don’t think that most systems have more than two or three guys like that anyway.

But it’s not really that weak behind Belt. Brown, Wheeler, Crawford, and Neal are all at least B prospects, and several others probably are now or could be in the next year (Peguero, Surkamp, Bucardo, Casilla, Adrianza, and more).

Ain't no Posey like a Buster Posey cause a Buster Posey don't stop...hitting.

Giants baseball: We're stupid enough to WIN that (TM)

by quincy0191 on Dec 18, 2010 1:15 PM PST up reply actions  

No way

Crawford Is a B prospect. He’s all glove no bat as of right now, more of a C+. I think Sabean and the Giants have done a great job of overhyping him tho. And Brown projects as more of a potential solid everyday CF with plus defense, not necessarily an all star although it may be his ceiling. Once again, I see only Belt and Wheeler as all-star to impact prospects.

Brandon!
Belted deep to right-center field!

by Vaccaro on Dec 18, 2010 3:22 PM PST via mobile up reply actions  

It depends on what you mean by projection vs. ceiling. Assuming that projection=most likely outcome, Wheeler doesn’t project as an All-Start or impact prospect; he’s basically Jonathan Sanchez. But his ceiling is really high. And Brown’s is too; Brown is a GG CF right now, and with his speed can post some excellent offensive numbers and steal a ton of bases. He’s not going to be knocking the ball out of the park, but he’ll hit lots of doubles and triples and steal bases; if Wheeler’s an impact talent, then so is he.

Crawford as a B is probably a little aggressive, but you have realize that he was hitting in the EL, which is death for hitters. He’s already an excellent shortstop, and the offensive bar for SS is pretty low, so if a B prospect is one who has a good chance to be a solid everyday player, then Crawford’s a B-. He could be in the majors now with his glove, the only question is the bat, and I think once you get him out of Richmond he’ll look a lot better.

Plus, it’s not like other systems are just overflowing with impact prospects. I don’t think many systems have more than 2-3 players they can say are potential perennial All-Stars, so the Giants aren’t far behind in that regard. And then you have to consider the Giants’ astounding ability to find and develop players; the system may look weak now, but last year we didn’t have much outside of Posey and Bumgarner, and now we’re looking at Belt and Bucardo and Peguero and a good recent draft (Brown, Rosin, Kickham, Hembree, Jones) that will infuse some more talent.

Ain't no Posey like a Buster Posey cause a Buster Posey don't stop...hitting.

Giants baseball: We're stupid enough to WIN that (TM)

by quincy0191 on Dec 19, 2010 2:12 AM PST up reply actions  

I have to disagree with you on Brown

He’s a college bat with no power who doesn’t walk. At all. If that doesn’t severely limit his offensive upside, I don’t know what does.

In the end, America will be remembered for three things: the Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.

by cornball on Dec 20, 2010 11:15 AM PST up reply actions  

How often must this point be made?

He has displayed his ability to walk in the Cape Cod League. In his senior year, he was batting .400+…so naturally he isn’t going to walk a lot.

by EricW on Dec 20, 2010 12:37 PM PST up reply actions  

I want to see him repeat that propensity to walk before I really believe it.

In the end, America will be remembered for three things: the Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.

by cornball on Dec 21, 2010 6:41 AM PST up reply actions  

Hitters who draw walks still draw walks when they have a high batting average.

Making calculations based upon statiscal histori-garbage rather than situation reality since 1980
Adopted Giant: Kaohi Downing, your next dominant reliever 1.47 ERA in S-K, with 34 K in 42 IP. Uh, just ignore his age and the walks, please!

by jcb9 on Dec 22, 2010 8:20 AM PST up reply actions  

I really look forward to see what he will do with the wood this year.

Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond, Brian Anderson.
Jeremy Affeldt induces strained obliques

by Giant among Angels on Dec 20, 2010 6:53 PM PST up reply actions  

I do, too. This season is going to be very telling for him. I’m not so optimistic on him, but stranger things have happened.

In the end, America will be remembered for three things: the Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.

by cornball on Dec 21, 2010 6:42 AM PST up reply actions  

wow

That would be amazing, but if they get 1 all star and a couple of serviceable big leaguers out of that crop it would be about all they can hope for.

by Bochy's IT guy on Dec 18, 2010 5:45 PM PST up reply actions  

I disagree strongly on two points.

First, despite Sabean’s announced policy to draft and develop pitchers and then trade that surplus for hitters, he never actually accomplished that.

Second,

First of all, it creates bargaining chips that can be traded for established players when the need arises. But of greater importance is the fact that the team can let established players go when they become expensive free agents, and plug in younger players who can be retained for mere pennies early in their careers.

  You have this backwards – your first responsibility is to develop inexpensive talented players for your own use. Only then do you use them as bargaining chips.

"I can't very well tell my batters, 'Dont hit it to him.' Wherever they hit it, he's there anyway."
- NY Mets manager Gil Hodges on Willie Mays

by Lyle on Dec 18, 2010 8:22 AM PST reply actions  

in all fairness

he said that using the young players were “of greater importance” than having them as trade chips.

by zeisenbe on Dec 18, 2010 1:30 PM PST up reply actions  

OK

Make that “developing inexpensive talented players for your own use is of greater importance…”

"I can't very well tell my batters, 'Dont hit it to him.' Wherever they hit it, he's there anyway."
- NY Mets manager Gil Hodges on Willie Mays

by Lyle on Dec 19, 2010 3:56 PM PST up reply actions  

This would’ve been a reasonable post two or three years ago. Now, though, our farm system is pretty damn weak.

Making calculations based upon statiscal histori-garbage rather than situation reality since 1980
Adopted Giant: Kaohi Downing, your next dominant reliever 1.47 ERA in S-K, with 34 K in 42 IP. Uh, just ignore his age and the walks, please!

by jcb9 on Dec 18, 2010 11:51 AM PST reply actions  

Trading prospects is not a bad strategy...

When you are in a window of contention. Its about trading future wins for current wins so you more efficiently distribute your success on the win curve. I think Sabean’s lack of trades is less about strategy and more about the lack of quality trade chips in the Giant’s system. It appears that besides Belt and Wheeler the giants are without impact talent at the minor league level. (Some may think Brown, but he can’t be traded this year anyway)

by Bochy's IT guy on Dec 18, 2010 5:43 PM PST reply actions  

The farm system is currently not very good because we just graduated 2 blue chip prospects.

I agree with the overall gist of this post, Sabean has a much different strategy these days and I agree with a lot of what he’s done lately.

by BustaTheRippa on Dec 18, 2010 11:28 PM PST reply actions  

i fear that the decent run of minor leaguers we had is mostly over

what bothers me is that draft where we had like 6 of the Top 50 picks and only Bumgarner looks like he’ll pan out…all of the middle infielders like Noonan, Gillaspie, even Culberson is more suspect than prospect, Tommy Joseph(?), Dominguez – i just don’t have much faith that they know what they’re doing in drafting and developing position players….Buster was a finished product and Belt was probably dumb luck….

plus they’re drafting late in each round now the last few years instead of around 5th-10th so i don’t think it’ll get much better soon…

and the international signings have kind of soured as well… :(

by repeat_in_2011 on Dec 22, 2010 8:06 PM PST reply actions  

The juxtaposition of the pessimism in that comment with the user name is jarring.

2010 World Series Champions!
Adopted 'nephew' to the ever avuncular and always awesome Jon Miller

by Johnny Disaster on Dec 23, 2010 7:37 AM PST up reply actions  

double reply fail

Still the father of two-time Cy Young Award winner Tim Lincecum.
"Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be." - John Wooden

by SFGuy on Dec 23, 2010 11:17 PM PST up reply actions  

doesn’t mean they can’t win though…i’m in favor of FA signings now anyway since the draft position will be lower and there might only be a 4-5 year window…

i just felt like the farm system was at its high point a few years ago when they had 3-4 Top 100 in MLB prospects in MadBum, Alderson, Villalona etc and we had a glut of all these high picks like Noonan, Culberson, Fairley, Williams, Gillaspie who hadn’t flopped yet…then they lost or got rid of Barnes and Snyder…i guess that’s the way it goes though…

by repeat_in_2011 on Dec 23, 2010 10:20 AM PST reply actions  

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