Reaction: Freddy Sanchez Trade
by Grant Brisbee on Jul 29, 2009 4:51 PM PDT
Email
PrintFreddy Sanchez is an upgrade. The Giants have received less production from their second basemen than any other team has received out of any position. With Ryan Garko and Sanchez on the team, 20% of the lineup went from "yick" to "meh?", which is a pretty substantial move.
But this was an awful, stupid, and unbelievably short-sighted move. Bengie Molina is on pace to become one of the worst cleanup hitters in the last 50 years. Think about how special that is. A lot of people have stunk in the last half-century, but we're watching one of the greatest stinks in the history of stink. As such, a productive-for-his-position second baseman and a productive-for-his-new-team first baseman isn't the boiling water to our contending-flavored ramen. The Giants needed someone who would have pushed Molina out of the cleanup spot.
...but getting a real power hitter would have cost the Giants one of their top prospects... So went the refrain, and a lot of Giants fans were fine with that. Hey, Matt Holliday's a nice player, but we sure as heck aren't going to give up Tim Alderson for him. Like, pshaw. Find me a legitimate slugger that's available without giving up Madison Bumgarner, Angel Villalona, Buster Posey, or Alderson, and that's the move to make. That slugger doesn't exist? Well, then we'll just hang on to our top four prospects, thank you. The angriest of the angry -- the "Sabean had better trade for a bat or I am THROUGH with this team" types -- generally didn't have a name in mind; they were thinking of an archetype that wasn't available.
Sanchez is a nice player. Good defense. His one down year was probably due to a low BABIP. He's under contract through next year. Yeah, that's an upgrade worth trading for. But, good gravy, not with one of the more valuable trade chips in the system.
And I'm not the world's biggest Tim Alderson booster, either. He'd have to put a couple of ticks more on his fastball to really be an elite prospect, though his curve and control were already fantastic. I don't think he was the next Tim Lincecum, and I'm not even sure that he was the next Jason Marquis. What kills me, though, is that if the Giants were willing to trade Alderson, they could have traded for something they really needed. A hitter who knows how to get on base more than the average player, or a hitter with power. Sanchez is neither. He makes the lineup better, but, hey, you know who else would have made the lineup better? Felipe Lopez. You know, the guy whom the Brewers received for a couple of minor league tweaks. And then the Giants could have traded Alderson for another hitter. A Scott Barnes/Tim Alderson package wouldn't have been enough for Victor Martinez, but it would have been a heck of a start.
But we didn't really even think Martinez was a real possibility, as that would have meant that the Giants give up one of their best prospects. Heck, that wasn't going to happen.
The Giants are a better team today than they were yesterday. The Giants are still very, very, very unlikely to survive three playoff series with the current roster, and that's assuming that they even make the playoffs. Both things can be true. Don't try and talk yourself into this one. The only way this trade earns more than a D- is if the Giants keep their remaining prospects while adding someone who pushes Bengie Molina to the sixth or seventh spot in the lineup.
Another way the trade is a success is if the Giants win the World Series within the next two years. Then it will be the best trade ever. I'll just hold my breath for that one.
Dammit. I think that, other than Alderson's value as a trade chip being totally undersold, the thing that makes me the angriest right now is that I'm almost certain that the words ".300 hitter" kept rattling around in Brian Sabean's brain. "Can I really pass up a .300 hitter? For a pitching prospect? I mean, the pitching is strong right now, and there's only one .300 hitter on the team right now. Another .300 hitter would be worth, like, five more wins, at least." Using batting average to evaluate the worth of a hitter is like using an Apple II+ to do your taxes, and I'm almost sure it's going on in the Giants' front office. Just a guess, of course, but it's not as if there's any evidence to the contrary.
Also, I believe that the Giants overpaid for Freddy Sanchez. I'll cheer his at-bats, and I'm still excited to watch an improved team make a playoff run, but this is just...wow.
909 comments
|
1 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Aurilia's positions are locked down with people who are actually GOOD.
Now retire.
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 4:54 PM PDT reply actions
He can’t really play any position other than first anymore.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
He can’t really play any position other than first anymore.
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all
If Dustin Pedroia played in Seattle, not many people would be talking about him.
GET THAT VORP SH!T OUTTA HERE!!!
everyone remember that story about how Edgardo Alfonzo told Pablo Sandoval to sign with the Giants’ because of how they treat players? Perhaps this is why. Rich Aurilia was a good Giant, and theyr’e treating him with respect. They’ll keep him on the DL until it’s time to expand the roster, and then they’ll activate him. Maybe the next FA the Giants’ are after will notice that and want to play here.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
Gotta say, Rx, I’ve never heard that story at all. And frankly it makes no sense as Sandoval signed with us before Alfonzo did, so I’m not sure why Edgardo would have held such a high opinion of us at that point. Which isn’t to say that it’s not true at all. Just somewhat odd.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Still makes no sense. Pablo signed with the Giants in 2002. Alfonzo was still a Met at that point.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Wrong!
May 8, 2003: Signed by the San Francisco Giants as an amateur free agent.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/sandopa01.shtml#trans
GROUGTHINK ALERT
Sniff
Welcome to the Warriors, Stephen Curry, the 2009 NBA Rookie of the Year.
Panda's and Curry in the Bey Area. Who would've known?
Conductor of the "We're Back!" Bandwagon!
shucks
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all
If Dustin Pedroia played in Seattle, not many people would be talking about him.
GET THAT VORP SH!T OUTTA HERE!!!
Hey.... but..... we swept the Pirates.....?
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 4:57 PM PDT up reply actions
D':
emperor nobody: "can ben copeland play third will the mcgwire throwback jersey be sponsored by balco labs i think i am having non-nerve-damage related chest pains well there’s holliday’s homer for may"
Clayton Tanner. I have nothing witty to add.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jul 29, 2009 4:57 PM PDT reply actions
I know monthly splits are of questionable value due to sample size, but....
April: .337 / .374 / .570
May: .330 / .373 / .459
June: .282 / .321 / .427
July: .193 / .220 / .246
Um, yeah.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
July seems……. uhh…… Aurilia-esque?
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 4:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I Like Freddie Alot. That Said, Sabes Overpaid By More Then I Am Comforable With.
by giantsrainman on Jul 29, 2009 4:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Judgment Day has been indefinitely postponed. :(
comics | art | Nattowear
wcw should approve, at least.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
of course his disapproval probably comes from the fact that he thinks Kevin Frandsen and Fred Lewis or something like that should have been enough to get this done
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 7:19 PM PDT up reply actions
And hey, Natto, could you adopt a Giant who sucks last year? Your guys keep getting traded before the deadline.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
D: D: D:
emperor nobody: "can ben copeland play third will the mcgwire throwback jersey be sponsored by balco labs i think i am having non-nerve-damage related chest pains well there’s holliday’s homer for may"
Clayton Tanner. I have nothing witty to add.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jul 29, 2009 5:01 PM PDT up reply actions
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
Speaking of which
I know we all love sharksrog. But the fact that he holds the most beloved Giant as his adoptee and he never ever posts here any more makes me think that maybe, perhaps, Timmy should go to someone else?
That’s not me, by the way. I’m happy with Angel. That is, until Sabean trades him for a relief pitcher.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
Just as well, Tim shouldn't be adopted
For he is a man dammit and Lincecum > all of us.
by Viva Jon Miller on Jul 29, 2009 7:17 PM PDT up reply actions
I wasn’t here last year. Who did Natto adopt?
emperor nobody: "can ben copeland play third will the mcgwire throwback jersey be sponsored by balco labs i think i am having non-nerve-damage related chest pains well there’s holliday’s homer for may"
Clayton Tanner. I have nothing witty to add.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jul 29, 2009 5:01 PM PDT up reply actions
Ray Durham
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
LOL
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Grant is pissed.
Dude, hide the good china.
Bengie: Like an Aurilia kidney stone, slow-moving and tough to get out.
Fact remains: The Giants have too many weak points in the line up for one or two hitters to make a difference. Kinda like having 4 pitchers spots that the opposing pitcher can use to get out of jams.
Do not meddle in the affairs of GM's, for they are subtle and quick to anger.
not true...
as long as those two hitters were great hitters, which neither of the two guys we got are
by NeifiChicken on Jul 29, 2009 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions
I am thrilled to have Sanchez on the team…… I hate the fact that we gave up such a good prospect AND didn’t get any money back.
I mean Fuck… all this talk of the Pirates eating salary. What would we have had to of given up to see that happen.
I think this is a classic case of two GMs playing chicken and Sabaen blinked first.
Sabean blinked.
You nailed it. I like Freddie; he’ll improve the team. But Grant’s right: we needed a bat with pop and we’ve overpaid. Whatever happened to the rumors of Bowker, Frandsen and Guzman for Freddie? Made up by our wishful thinking?
Don't believe everything you think.
SABEAN. YOU AND ME. PARKING LOT. AFTER SCHOOL.
I like cats. Wings is the greatest show of all time.
Tyler Graham is my favorite San Jose Giant because he has smart balls.
From the Buc Dougout:
“I keep refreshing the Giants’ SB Nation blog, just to see how pissed off the Giants fans are about this! It’s making me happier than the actual trade itself!”
Do not meddle in the affairs of GM's, for they are subtle and quick to anger.
EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY!!
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 5:01 PM PDT up reply actions
BUC DUGOUT. YOU AND ME. BY THE OLD OAK TREE. AN HOUR AFTER SCHOOL GETS OUT.
I like cats. Wings is the greatest show of all time.
Tyler Graham is my favorite San Jose Giant because he has smart balls.
AT THE BALLPARK
IS NEXT WEEK AGAINST THE PHILLIES GOOD FOR YOU?
Judgment Day has been indefinitely postponed. :(
comics | art | Nattowear
Let them be happy. Sixteen straight losing seasons and continually watching their best players get traded away. Tim Alderson is going to lead them to the promised land?
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
His arm will fall off at the shoulder before that happens
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 7:37 PM PDT up reply actions
Seems like the Pirates fans really like their new GM. He’s made a bunch of trades this year and seems to have done well.
Do not meddle in the affairs of GM's, for they are subtle and quick to anger.
by cybermaldonado on Jul 29, 2009 5:03 PM PDT up reply actions
He also picked Tony Sanchez high the first round, though.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
I’m a BC guy and I still think that was dumb. Tony is good, but no way was he one of the 10 best players available.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Sabes for their Gm, whatever his name is. STRAIGHT UP!
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 5:04 PM PDT up reply actions
Exactly!
It’s a horrible trade, and it gives us all yet another horrifying look under the skull of Brian Sabean. This is how the guy thinks: All-Star! .300 hitter! Proven veteran bat! And for that we give up a guy who could be terrific.
Foster for Duffy level trade? We won’t know for a few years. Anderson for Bagwell? It has that potential. But even without that level of angst, it’s bad.
I suppose the unanswerable question is ...
… as Grant mentioned, why the Giants didn’t get someone better if they were going to trade Alderson.
Still, the Giants just improved their chances of making the playoffs this year, and once into the playoffs any team has a good chance of winning. So you could argue that Sanchez measurably improved the Giants’ chances of winning the World Series this year. (2% is measurable.)
/whinny!
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Nobody here knows what the Giants’ could have gotten for Alderson. We’ve all heard the list of players the Giants’ were talking about, and I believe that any player on that list better than Sanchez probably got a call from Sabean offering Alderson and turned it down.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
My guess is that V-Mart would cost something to the tune of Alderson, Barnes, Neal/Villalona, and some C+ level arms from short-season…
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 5:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Thing is Alderson, Barnes and Neal are equivalent to the prospects the Phillies gave up.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Considering what the Indians got for Lee and Francisco
Thing is Alderson, Barnes and Neal are equivalent to the prospects the Phillies gave up.
Totally agree. Victor would have been GREAT and worth the price!
Don't believe everything you think.
I don’t know. I’m pretty high on Neal. I’ll take that trade in a heartbeat if Posey isn’t in the system. So much of V-Mart’s value is tied up in him being a catcher.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:41 PM PDT up reply actions
didn’t Sabean come out recently and clearly say the Indians wanted Bumgarner for Martinez?
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
I think so. I can’t keep all of the rumors straight.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Na, the Phillies gave up way more talent than those three guys. Their #2, #3, #4 guys and a guy considered a young Papelbon
?
They kept their 3 best prospects and Happ
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
They they were the 2/3/4 guys entering the year. Now they’re merely top 10.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 7:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Heh, at least Fat Princess for PS3 comes out tomorrow.
Will offset my pain and suffering I have experienced today.
Welcome to the Warriors, Stephen Curry, the 2009 NBA Rookie of the Year.
Panda's and Curry in the Bey Area. Who would've known?
Conductor of the "We're Back!" Bandwagon!
It’s like Sabes zeroed in on Sanchez and couldn’t explore other options. Maybe the Pirates being here at the trading deadline was the worst thing that could have happened. Instead of exploring other possibilities, Sabes just poked and prodded Freddy until he decided that it would just be bad manners to not make the deal.
Bengie: Like an Aurilia kidney stone, slow-moving and tough to get out.
that’s not true. If he was so zeroed in on Sanchez, how’d he tear himself away to make the Garko trade? Why did we hear rumors on Martinez, Nick Johnson, Halladay, Rios, Willingham, Scutaro, Teahen, etc. At the end of the day, after doing due diligence and kicking some tires, Sanchez was the best he could do for Alderson. And even though this will probably get me in trouble, I have invested a lot in Jesus Guzman, following him boxscore by boxscore in the winter leagues and at Fresno, and even though I don’t see a spot for him, my biggest fear is him going to Pittsburgh and becoming a star, much better than Ryan Garko. I’m glad he’s still here, but I just can’t get torn up about Alderson and his Zito fastball going elsewhere. Get Guzman an outfielder’s glove and start hitting him flyballs. He can’t be worse than Freddie Lewis!
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
It’s a salary dump, rx! Pittsburgh had to move the salary. The whole point of a salary dump is that you don’t have to give up anything — you just take on the salary. Why is this so difficult to understand?
Yes, I’m glad he’s here. But why go out of our way to overpay for him? That’s a valuable chip we now can’t use somewhere else. It’s just throwing away value.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Grant, my feelings exactly
Using Alderson & a couple other decent prospects could have netted a good hitter. If you add a Felipe Lopez and a Ryan Garko to a lineup with a good hitter, and suddenly the offense seems mediocre. Ah, mediocre.
Am I the only one that secretly hopes he’s not done, holding out hope he can add an impact bat?
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
How would he get said impact bat now? What is left to trade? That seems to be the thing, even if Alderson isn’t good or doesn’t end up being good, right now the perception is that he IS good, so I believe they should have gotten more in return.
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:04 PM PDT up reply actions
It wouldn’t tear me apart inside to trade Villalona for an elite bat in the right package.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 29, 2009 5:05 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I agree, but even I can see that he needs some serious work. He is young but, if I were a GM I would have serious misgivings about going after him.
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Turd sandwich for GM!
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 29, 2009 5:04 PM PDT up reply actions
Hey, remember when the one positive in our system was minor league pitching depth? Yeah.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
how many do you need? Pucetas, Martinez, Sosa, Bumgarner, the brothers Bucardo, Tanner, our number one draft choice, and I’m probably missing a few. The purpose of accumulating all that pitching WAS to turn them into some bats at some point. Sooner or later some of them had to go for some hitters. You might not like who they got, but they still have plenty of pitchers.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
There are serious questions about Sosa’s health. Pucetas is a fifth starter at best. Martinez too.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
Sosa is hurt. If everything works out with Pucetas and Martinez they are 5th starters. Bucardo Bros are a loooong way away and Tanner is a middling prospect.
I agree with most of this, but the Buccardo bros (or your own Short Season hypothetical wunderkind of choice) would only be one or two years away from where Barnes and Alderson are currently.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 7:13 PM PDT up reply actions
I really wish we could still add Willingham….. but what would he cost now?
I think we have just set the market for what all our other prospects are worth, and not in a good way!
Yeah I wonder what it would cost now, I read they would be asking for a lot. He fits into Sabean’s non rent-a-player philosophy
A lineup of
CF: Rowand
2B: Sanchez
3B: Sandoval
LF: Willingham
1B: Garko
C: Posey
RF: Schierholtz
SS: Renteria
Looks good to me next year. Not to mention it would give us a legit offense this year and a better chance. If we could get it done without Bumgarner/Posey/Villalona (now the big 3) I’d do it.
I’d offer Neal/Lewis/Bond for Willingham, dunno if that would work. Bond has an out of control OBP this year, i know nothing about his D.
Keeping on SWOOPing in the free world! Also, by the reflexive property of the rubber/glue playground comeback, I enjoy wearing hats on my ass.
by SneakToBetterSeats on Jul 29, 2009 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Bond is not in the same league as Neal or Lewis. Dude profiles to be a utility IF with the upside of Luis Castillo.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:18 PM PDT up reply actions
I like that lineup too
I just think it would cost too much to acquire Willingham. As others have stated, the FO situation in Washington is a mess. Plus, they are asking for way too much for their players. They wanted Jonathan Sanchez for Nick Johnson for pete’s sake!
I think if we traded for Willingham, we would have to give up some pitching and some type of hitter. Brad Snyder or Joaquin plus Lewis/Bowker might be a good starting point, but I’d imagine Washington would want a lot more unfortunately.
by Squire_Boone on Jul 29, 2009 7:30 PM PDT up reply actions
If we’re gonna overpay for Sanchez, then we’re gonna have to overpay for Willingham, too.
by Squire_Boone on Jul 29, 2009 6:58 PM PDT up reply actions
6:19pm: Kovacevic says that no money is being exchanged in the Sanchez deal, which makes it all the more impressive for the Pirates. Keith Law (Insider) recently ranked the 20-year-old Alderson the 26th-best prospect in all of baseball.
/sobs
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
He wasnt 26th
He was first alphabetically in the next 25. (26-50)
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
DON’T CONFUSE ME WITH THE FACTS.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
And yeah, 26th is high
But he was around 60th on some lists last year, and he’s had a very good run in AA, so 26th isn’t entirely ridiculous.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
Even so that’s too high.
It’s not like he’s Kyle Drabek or Jake Arrieta or Chris Tillman or Brian Matusz.
Again, Im not disagreeing
Im saying he would be at the back of Law’s list, rather than near the top
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
26th but in AA ball?
That means that out of all the AAA hitters and pitchers, this kid was the 26th best?
If he’s that good, why didn’t the Giants bring him up?
I don’t know who Keith Law is, but he can KISS MY ASS.
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 5:06 PM PDT up reply actions
The Keith Law hate is idiotic
He’s a smart guy and a good analyst; just because he points out the blinding stupidity of our front office and its maneuvers is no reason to blame the messenger.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
Question
More or less mad if Villalona was given up?
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
probably about the same.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 29, 2009 5:06 PM PDT up reply actions
maybe a bit more
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 29, 2009 5:06 PM PDT up reply actions
more
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:09 PM PDT up reply actions
less
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
I'm in the minority
But less… just because I don’t think Villalona is going to be anything more than an average player while I think Tim is going to be an above-average starter.
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all
If Dustin Pedroia played in Seattle, not many people would be talking about him.
GET THAT VORP SH!T OUTTA HERE!!!
More
emperor nobody: "can ben copeland play third will the mcgwire throwback jersey be sponsored by balco labs i think i am having non-nerve-damage related chest pains well there’s holliday’s homer for may"
Clayton Tanner. I have nothing witty to add.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jul 29, 2009 5:07 PM PDT up reply actions
More. Villalona has a far greater upside and hasn’t even scratched the surface of their talent. Alderson has a low ceiling but much higher floor, but I don’t think it was good enough that he would have been able to break into the rotation with Zito, Cain and Lincecum here and Sanchez and Mad Bum pegged for the other 2 spots.
Just to play Devil's Advocate
Whatever happened to “The Giants are more than one good hitter away from being a playoff team”?
I don’t really think just getting one good cleanup hitter would have made us too much of a stronger team. We needed some upgrades across the board, and thats what we got.
but you get “minor upgrades across the board” with middling to good prospects. The 26th best prospect in baseball is a great prospect.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 29, 2009 5:08 PM PDT up reply actions
The smart people...
said several times that we are THREE hitters away. Look it up. Also going from .700 to ,750 is not enough of an upgrade to really consider having acquired a hitter.
So now unless Sanchez’s knee acts up (ha ha lol fail trade!), the Giants infield is set for this year and next (with Garko arbitration eligible for three more years?). Molina is not signed for next year. LF and RF are up in the air. I agree with Grant that this team is not going anywhere this year. So next year, the Giants can make upgrades at C, LF, and RF and be WS contenders? Because obviously this trade is for this year and next. I just don’t see it. They have traded two of their better pitching prospects for one guy who will not be here after 2010, and another who they might not want to offer arbitration to. I just don’t see the plan here.
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:07 PM PDT reply actions
Lots of contracts expiring too (Roberts, Winn, Molina, Lowry) and given the OF depth (Bowker, Schierholtz, Torres, shudder Velez, Lewis) and considering Posey should be starting in 2010 I don’t see any reason to add FA. Especially considering we’re going to have to pay Timmeh the big bucks.
We have to do something to add offense. We have to take advantage of the Cain/Lincecum window while it’s here and we just don’t have the offense to do that right now. One of the OF spots, 1B or 3B need to be devoted to an impact bat this winter. I should say at least 1. Then add Posey, whichever of the lefty OFs prove to deserve a spot — but somewhere there has to be addition of power.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
If you look at the FA list for next year it’s not good, especially for power-hitting outfielders. Most of the potentials on that list look like they’ll resign with the teams that already have them or won’t sign at all. Many aren’t even close to worth the money they’d want.
I’d be very surprised if we didn’t retain Garko; my understanding is that a large part of why we got him is because of his contract status. Sanchez obviously isn’t going anywhere next year, and if you want to cut Pablo….
Rowand is the starting CF, there’s no question about that. RF should definitely be taken by either Schierholtz or Bowker (preferably Schierholtz), and that only leaves LF and C open. Acquiring a power-hitting C is going to be nearly impossible; V-Mart is the only guy available, and due to the dearth of good-hitting C’s and the fact that Posey will be ready by 2011 at the absolute latest, we don’t want the long-term contract one of those players would require. And like I said, we don’t want/can’t get any of the other OFs. I think any signing is just going to hurt us in the long run.
Hah, no. No way. Bringing Molina back would be a huge mistake. Sign some other journeyman catcher, please.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Me too. If Bengie is fine with being a stop-gap that doesn’t hit fourth, great. Unfortunately, neither side (Bengie or Bochy) would accept that situation.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Offer him arbitration
We either keep him for one more year, or get a pick.
DO NOT WANT! The guy is one of the three worst regulars in all of the majors. His OBP is ~.270. That’s effing awful. He is an awful hitter and a bad defensive catcher. Get him gone.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Get rid of Bengie
Have Bochy get the gear on!!!!
PLAYER/MANAGER!!!
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 7:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Any addition of power is going to have to come from the corner OF spots. I still like Willingham, but I don’t think we’re gonna get him this year. Due to his favorable contract status and the intractable nature of the Nats GM, I doubt we could get him in the offseason either. At least, not at a reasonable price.
by Squire_Boone on Jul 29, 2009 7:04 PM PDT up reply actions
Actually, there IS no Nats GM. Also, weirdly enough Jim Bowden is still buddying around with Ted Lerner’s sons and apparently worming into their ear. It’s just a screwed up situation. i can imagine trying to deal with them near impossible at this point.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
From everything I’ve read, trying to deal with them is impossible. They are overvaluing their players. This is a team that should be in fire sale mode, but they are acting like they are a .500 team.
by Squire_Boone on Jul 29, 2009 7:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Poor kid has to go play for the Pirates. (No offense)
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
That’s Zack I believe.
Original member of the Van Buren Boys
by NuschlerFace on Jul 29, 2009 5:09 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m wondering what our top 10 pitching prospect list looks like without Alderson and Barnes
We just traded who for who?!
1. MadBum
2. Wheeler
3. 2010 draft pick
4. 2011 draft pick
5. /shoots self
by NeifiChicken on Jul 29, 2009 5:37 PM PDT up reply actions
id relax
your 5th starter is throwing no hitters
zito bumgarner, cain and lincecum are set for the next 3 years
by GobbleforCyoung on Jul 29, 2009 6:37 PM PDT up reply actions
We don’t really have much of a 5th starter at the moment., actually. And barring another FA signing I’m not sure I see a big improvement coming in that regard next year either. Gotta hope Joey Martinez or Kevin Pucetas can get big league hitters out.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Matt Morris?
He’s a veteran with a track record?
by FireBrianSabean on Jul 29, 2009 7:48 PM PDT up reply actions
Just wait until Noah Lowry is healthy and comes back!!!!
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 7:51 PM PDT up reply actions
we were talking about minor leagues...
but while on the topic, Sanchez will have to throw another no-hitter to be throwing “no-hitters”
Bud Smith has a no hitter as well, it’s fun, but it doesn’t mean that much
by NeifiChicken on Jul 29, 2009 8:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Xanthan, how could you possibly forget J. Bucardo?!
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
take out Clark
Put in a Buccardo bro (probably Jorge)
Also I’d bet on one of King/Surkamp/Verdugo taking a setp forward next year.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 5:11 PM PDT up reply actions
And I’d also bet on a one or two of the short season pitchers (non-Buccardo division) making their way onto BA’s end of the year reports
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 5:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Bumgarner
JORGE!
Wheeler
bunch o’ other guys
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Oh and I like Eric Surkamp. Others like Clayton Tanner. Mostly power armed relievers after that.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
good call on Tanner. Sosa probably belongs in my top 5 pitcher list
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:21 PM PDT up reply actions
Sosa’s health status is unknown at the moment — that’s my pause in regard to him.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Yeah =(
I’m a huge Sosa fanboy so I’m still holding out some hope. But in all likelihood he’s going the Merkin route.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:57 PM PDT up reply actions
I’d also consider Camb Lamb and Edward Encarnacion depending on their end of year scouting report.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:58 PM PDT up reply actions
Camb Lamb is like Nicholson last year — a man playing among boys so there’s nothing really that you can get out of his stats. Encarnacion looks to have some tools but he’s like the RafRod of pitchers (without the glamour or the contract) — very young and raw as hell.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Clayton Tanner
emperor nobody: "can ben copeland play third will the mcgwire throwback jersey be sponsored by balco labs i think i am having non-nerve-damage related chest pains well there’s holliday’s homer for may"
Clayton Tanner. I have nothing witty to add.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jul 29, 2009 5:46 PM PDT up reply actions
I happen to like this trade...
As a NY resident who went down to Connecticut to see Alderson pitch, I have to tell you that in my opinion he didnt exactly have overpowering stuff…Now I know I am far from a scout but I just have to relay what I saw in person…He had a below average fastball, with a ++ curve and decent location but was hardly blowing away the opposition… I think Sabean could have gotten more for Alderson simply based on his “reputation” but in my humble opinion I see Alderson no better than Ryan Vogelsong….
We had to upgrade our weakest position and for that we had to trade away an area where we had strength….Sabean is still an ass in my opinion but under the circumstances this is a ++ trade (assuming the Giants medical staff know what they are talking about, which is a whole other story)
"Buy High-Sell Low"--The Brian Sabean Method Of Trading
by Mordy From Monsey on Jul 29, 2009 5:09 PM PDT reply actions
The big question it seems is how Alderson was valued by other organizations. The assumption by most seems to be that he was valued highly. I’m not sure that’s true.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions
If he isn’t, then it’s probably more prudent to hold onto him and hope his ++control translates to a major league rotation.
by AndOnTheDrums... on Jul 29, 2009 5:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Alderson is a great prospect because having plus control at his age is rare. Given the curveball, and assuming the fastball will develop (which is not by any means unreasonable) once he gets older and stronger (he’s only 20) puts him with plus control and a good fastball and plus change. That’s damned good and certainly worth more than Freddy Sanchez.
You know the Red Sox just gave up 2 players who weren’t in their Top 30 this year (nor going to be in their Top 30 next year) for Adam LaRoche. The Braves gave up a Gorkys Hernandez whose rep is in serious decline and nothing for Nate McLouth. It’s not about what we think of Tim Alderson. Look at what the market is bearing. There’s just no way Freddy Sanchez was that much more of a trade chip than LaRoche or McLouth. No way.
And, as John Hart was going on ad nauseum about today, trade deadlines come down frequently to simple point, we pick up the money and give you a stiff, or you pick up the money and we give you a decent player. We overpaid both ways.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Roger,
I thought you’d appreciate this more than anyone else…
Bobby Felmy came into the game tonight after Broshius pitched 2/3 of an inning and gave up 4 runs.
This may take a while.
So glad my wife’s leaving town tomorrow morning made me skip coming out tonight.
Wow — Broshuis, huh? He just started on Sunday. Why not bring in English on 4 days rest rather than Broshuis on 2? Pretty clear message to the guy that he’s just a piece of meat, I’d say. I can’t wait to read his next diary piece on BA.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
So glad my wife’s leaving town tomorrow morning made me skip coming out tonight.
yeah!!!! wait until the old bal and chain is out of town and then let THE BOYS COME OVER AND PLAY!!!! roger you dirty dawg.
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 7:52 PM PDT up reply actions
That scouting report of Alderson looks just like a scouting report of Adam Wainwright
WordUpThome: I CANNOT BELIVE THAT THIS PRODUCT IS NOT BUTTER
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons
by CaliforniaJag on Jul 29, 2009 7:56 PM PDT up reply actions
What frustrates me to no end is seeing other GMs make creative trades to get a valuable player, like for example giving up Andy LaRoche and a decent minor league pitcher, and turning that into Manny Ramirez. I don’t know much about who the Phillies gave up to land Cliff Lee, but it seems they had a few guys they didn’t want to lose for him, and they still got a really good pitcher. So why are the Giants so bad these days at making creative, valuable trades? I ask, because I don’t know.
I'm thinking but nothing's happening.
GIANTS ONLY DO ONE FOR ONE TRADES!!!
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Everyone knows the Giants are desperate for a bat ?
My adopted son Matt Downs . Ranked as the 24th best prospect in the Giants farm system by Baseball America !!
that’s the position from which I’d start, if I were an opposing GM, absolutely.
it’s true. and it’s widely understood.
"I would've been here sooner but I had to shake the Veleasels"
by The Gene Hackman on Jul 29, 2009 6:12 PM PDT up reply actions
And the Phillies are desperate for pitching yet they still got Lee without giving Happ, Drabek, Brown or Taylor. Impressive.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Yes and they gave up Carasco (spelled wrong) who is equivalent to alderson imo
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jul 29, 2009 6:41 PM PDT up reply actions
But your opinion is way outside of the bell curve. Scouting community doesn’t agree with you at all. Thus one of the quotes heard around after the deal (noted in the Fangraphs article) was, “so the best pitching prospect traded today doesn’t go for Cliff Lee. Good job, Cleveland.”
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
well madbum:alderson::drabek:carrasco
unfortunately cliff lee is worth a cockload more than freddy sanchez.
"he walked 18; new league record! Struck out 18, another new league record! He also hit the sportswriter, the PA announcer, the bull mascot twice..."
by i did my job on Jul 29, 2009 5:59 PM PDT up reply actions
and our two guys are (were) better than their two.
"he walked 18; new league record! Struck out 18, another new league record! He also hit the sportswriter, the PA announcer, the bull mascot twice..."
by i did my job on Jul 29, 2009 6:00 PM PDT up reply actions
TWSS
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 7:54 PM PDT up reply actions
+ a million
was going to add that to my rant in progress (below)
Still the loving, adoptive father of Hector Sanchez. And who doesn't love switch-hitting catchers with power and patience?
Alex Rios, still a possibility?
Welcome to the Warriors, Stephen Curry, the 2009 NBA Rookie of the Year.
Panda's and Curry in the Bey Area. Who would've known?
Conductor of the "We're Back!" Bandwagon!
Can you imagine what Sabes would give up THEN?
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 5:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Hey, I'll give it a shot
The Giants’ second basemen have hit .229/.285/.318 this season. Sanchez, if he finishes the season hot, is a two or three win upgrade. Alderson doesn’t have a great strikeout rate. Uh, I thought Vogelsong was a better prospect, and look how that turned out.
Crap, I’m not good at this. Ah, hell, I’m all-in. Start printing those playoff tickets.
Proud member of the Adopt-a-Giant program (Aaron Rowand)
Your 2010 Giants!
C: Buster Posey
1B: Ryan Garko
2B: Freddy Sanchez
SS: Edgar Renteria (ugh)
3B: Pablo Sandoval
LF: Not Fred Lewis
CF: Aaron Rowand
RF: Nate Schierholtz?
YES
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:12 PM PDT up reply actions
1st half – Bowker +Lewis
2nd half – Neal
Randy Winn is in time out until his OBP gets back over .330.
Neal
invited to camp, shines, and we pick up aurilia for another year and start him in left, his range at 3rd and 1st is lacking.
sad but true
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 7:54 PM PDT up reply actions
Perhaps Matt Holliday in LF and Scutaro in SS?
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
because there are none
unless you like Holliday(ugh)
find one
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2008/12/2010-mlb-free-a.html
and don’t say Jason Bay – Redsox are probably going to resign him
You make a compelling argument. Tell me more about these power hitters who are there.
I'm thinking but nothing's happening.
by JRPhillips on Jul 29, 2009 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
just pop a natty ice and look at it again, man
Kevin Pucetas lurks in the shadows, waiting for his time to shine.
by Sammy Danger on Jul 29, 2009 5:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh, I believe you, guy!
You’re obviously correct. I’m just curious, you know… Who THEY are.
I'm thinking but nothing's happening.
I love how nobody is planning on acquiring a power hitter in a little thing called Free Agency
Please review the statement your whole argument is based off of. And please, don’t confuse free agency with trades.
I'm thinking but nothing's happening.
On this board
You’d damn well better have the wherewithall to back up whatever blanket statement you’ve made, because other people here HAVE done their research.
I’ve made similar mistakes here.
I'm thinking but nothing's happening.
please tell me you’re trolling
"he walked 18; new league record! Struck out 18, another new league record! He also hit the sportswriter, the PA announcer, the bull mascot twice..."
by i did my job on Jul 29, 2009 6:02 PM PDT up reply actions
The angriest of the angry — the “Sabean had better trade for a bat or I am THROUGH with this team” types — generally didn’t have a name in mind; they were thinking of an archetype that wasn’t available.
by Grant Brisbee on Jul 29, 2009 5:32 PM PDT up reply actions
Extreme lol
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
dude
rick aurilia will be a FA!!!
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:33 PM PDT up reply actions
Is that like Palin and what newspapers she reads?
“They are there” isn’t the same as “______, _______, and _ are available and sign-able”
You're delusional
Also, I looked at that list and realized “OMFG we’re gonna sign Ankiel to a 5 year 70 million dollar contract”
Ahahaha what.
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
Thats the whole list
There arent secret free agents
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
Giants sign James Bond
Will play left field and wear #07
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
Yes that was the joke.
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
Unless we're talking about the Yomiuri Giants...
MLB usually doesn’t allow 3 digits on a uniform. Man you guys are the worst audience ever. Jeez.
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
secret Free Agent man, secret… Free Agent man…
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Fixed
"OMFG we’re gonna sign Ankiel Andruw Jones to a 5 year 70 million dollar contract"
Meet my new son: Sundrendy Windster, on the Curacao-SF express (via Arizona).
Out of curiosity...
who are the FAs next year.
Also, I don’t find it likely we are going to have that much money to spend (Lincecum arb, Zito, Sanchez option)
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
That is a whole lot of Ewwwww
My adopted son Matt Downs . Ranked as the 24th best prospect in the Giants farm system by Baseball America !!
You really think Buster is ready?
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:13 PM PDT up reply actions
don’t be a buster
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:14 PM PDT up reply actions
I know he has ability, but he is pretty young, isn’t he? I worry about guys who how have never had much failure.
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions
I worry about those guys too. everyone needs more failure. and pain.
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions
C: Buster Posey
1B: Ryan Garko
2B: Freddy Sanchez
SS: Edgar Renteria
3B: Pablo Sandoval
LF: Barry Bonds
CF: Aaron Rowand
RF: Nate Schierholtz
Welcome to the Warriors, Stephen Curry, the 2009 NBA Rookie of the Year.
Panda's and Curry in the Bey Area. Who would've known?
Conductor of the "We're Back!" Bandwagon!
by ejdacanay on Jul 29, 2009 5:14 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Bonds could still hit 40 hr, hells yeah.
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions
I don’t know about Posey leading off…
Duane Kuiper: Hall Of Fame broadcaster.
by Johnny Disaster on Jul 29, 2009 6:10 PM PDT up reply actions
or Edgar hitting cleanup…
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 29, 2009 7:14 PM PDT up reply actions
you idiots
that’s not a batting order, just a list of all the positions in order
I choose to watch the Giants try to score runs. Not because it is easy, but because it is hard.
Falling....Falling....
You fell….far, far down
/insert appropriate picture please
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 29, 2009 7:48 PM PDT up reply actions
LOL
emperor nobody: "can ben copeland play third will the mcgwire throwback jersey be sponsored by balco labs i think i am having non-nerve-damage related chest pains well there’s holliday’s homer for may"
Clayton Tanner. I have nothing witty to add.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jul 29, 2009 7:59 PM PDT up reply actions
I gotta say
This one is hurting way, deep down.
Like when you sit on a chair thinking there’s a whoopie cushion on it, only instead it’s a butt plug.
Matt Cain: Duck and Cover
How many times has that happened to you? If it is more than once, I recommend looking before you sit, or metal underpants. Both have worked for me.
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Actual LOL !
My adopted son Matt Downs . Ranked as the 24th best prospect in the Giants farm system by Baseball America !!
as opposed to fake lol
Congrats to my soul mate and birth brother Zach Wheeler on being drafted into greatness. Should I just buy my Wheeler jersey now, or wait till my next birthday?
aka an inward chortle
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 7:56 PM PDT up reply actions
If Freddy Sanchez offers us the same extension he offered the Pirate… I guess I’m almost ok with it.
No. No I’m not. But it’ll take the sting out of things a bit.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
sanchez offers extension
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Le sigh.
I’m calming down, but now at this point, I’m starting to feel like it’s playoffs or bust. Damn we’ve come a long way from the beginning of the season.
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
with these two small moves, still thinking bust.
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Cubs are looking scary right now. I think they’re our competition.
Brewers are below .500 now. Florida and Atlanta will kill each other and the Rockies will cool off.
wheels will fall off of the cubs within the next 2 months.
they’ll fall off of the giants too (do we have wheels?)
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions
Florida and Atlanta will kill each other and the Rockies will cool off.
Which is why we should have worked harder for Uggla, the kind of bat we actually need.
Don't believe everything you think.
still, small ugrade though. but very small.
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:14 PM PDT up reply actions
so small
I like cats. Wings is the greatest show of all time.
Tyler Graham is my favorite San Jose Giant because he has smart balls.
small. small.
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:16 PM PDT up reply actions
Not really
We went from having awesome pitching and shitty offense to great pitching w/o Johnson and less shitty offense.
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 5:14 PM PDT up reply actions
if it's playoffs or bust
they’re going to need to make another move
I don't want to make the playoffs
If we make the playoffs, Sabean keeps his job. i want us to lose lose lose. i want us to finish last in the NL West. I want Sabean fired, and if it means pissing away this season, I’m willing to take that psychic hit. i want Freddy Sanchez to blow out his knee Friday night. i want Ryan Garko to go 0 for his next 30. I want Sabean gone. Whatever that requires.
by Giantsfan4life on Jul 29, 2009 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions
you’re not a giantsfan4life josh
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Look we just went from no chance to win to a 1 % chance to win
But either way, we’ll be competitive enough that Sabean keeps his job. Which means we’ll never win, ever, in my lifetime or yours.
by Giantsfan4life on Jul 29, 2009 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions
bochy will win manager of the year too, you forgot that part
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions
I love the Giants so much I'll fucking kill them!
That’s how much I love them!
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
Heh, read this comment a couple minutes ago and I’m still giggling.
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
by GiantBrass on Jul 29, 2009 5:43 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
if anyone thinks these two moves will push this team towards a playoff run, i dunno boutcha
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:16 PM PDT up reply actions
I thought they were just salary dumping? Goddammit.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
that’s what sabean said
"I would've been here sooner but I had to shake the Veleasels"
by The Gene Hackman on Jul 29, 2009 6:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Was actually going to write up a fan post on this, but here goes instead
Lets start with the obvious: Freddy Sanchez is a good player. For the Giants, he is no doubt a significant offensive improvement, and he makes this team better this year. The problem, as is always the problem with Sabean, is the price – he overpaid drastically for a guy the Pirates were not going to retain next year.
Player A (at time of deal): 29 year old, hitting .305/.368/.416; has a wOBA of .343
- free agent at the end of the season, making $3.5M; acquiring team picks up about ~$1M in salary. UZR has him about +5/150 runs at 2b this year.
- traded for a 20 year old Low-A ball reliever (with good stuff), and a 25 year old AAA outfielder hitting 242/.332/.424 while playing LF. Needless to say, neither player sniffed the top 100 prospect list anywhere, and neither was on the top 10 of the average farm system of the acquiring team.
Player B: 31 year old, .296/.334/.442, has a wOBA of .336
- free agent at the end of the season if he doesn’t get 600 PA’s; if he does, a $8M option gets triggered, that his team wants no part of. Is being paid $7M this year, so acquiring team picked up about ~$2.5M in salary. UZR has him about +6/150 runs at 2b for this year.
- traded for a 20 year old in AA (making him one of the youngest pitches in the league) , who was the youngest pitcher in the CAL league (and lead the league in ERA) last year. This year, he had a 14/46 BB/K ratio in 73 IP, and a 3.47 ERA. The declining K-rate is certainly worrysome, but his age has to be taken into consideration. The player was rated #60 by BP, #29 by Jonathan Mayo (guestimating here – can’t find his list), #45 by BA. Taking the average, lets say he was a top 50 prospect.
In what world do you make this deal? It can reasonably be argued that Felipe Lopez, (aka player A), is a more valuable player than Sanchez; his OBP would be a significant boon for a team that ranks dead last in the NL in the category. Unlike Sanchez, his OBP is not BA dependent, and he is younger and cheaper. But what kills me is once again, Sabean’s complete and total inabiilty to recognize the OBP issue, and his willing to overplay for discredited value measures (BA and “ALL STAR”). I wish I had any evidence to suggest the Giants consider advanced metrics, or noted that the team has a huge sinkhole at C; but I don’t; all evidence suggests that they look at BA, RBI, and pixie dust.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
by Aadik on Jul 29, 2009 5:15 PM PDT reply actions 3 recs
Good post. Sure, it makes me cry. But good post.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
I'm already there
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
look, go back to the ESPN boards
I get it, you don’t do anything beyond BA.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
Felipe Lopez was also a great off season sign for the D-backs. i don’t know where Sabean was on him and Hudson.
I do know that the D-backs thought he wasn’t putting in enough effort- but who really is on that team?
Do not meddle in the affairs of GM's, for they are subtle and quick to anger.
by cybermaldonado on Jul 29, 2009 5:23 PM PDT up reply actions
You may want to re-post this tomorrow, cause it is all crazy all the time here. But I took the time and looked up Lopez, and I basically agree with you, and we could have gotten him for Fred Lewis or something. He wouldn’t have been a world-beater, but neither is Sanchez.
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:24 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, people like me are behind the outrage
But yeah, thought about it
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
You also could've had Lopez for an extra month of the season
WordUpThome: I CANNOT BELIVE THAT THIS PRODUCT IS NOT BUTTER
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons
by CaliforniaJag on Jul 29, 2009 8:01 PM PDT up reply actions
Food for thought: Greg Papa actually knows a bit more than the average talking head.
Agree? Disagree?
Billy Ripken is not a fuck face
Well, depends on the sport, I guess.
Judgment Day has been indefinitely postponed. :(
comics | art | Nattowear
shit, your dog knows more than Bip
that’s not a threshold now, is it?
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
disagree
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Is Matt Cain's ERA better than Haren's yet?
by High_On_Lincecum's_Godliness on Jul 29, 2009 5:18 PM PDT reply actions
Here's the part that really kills me
Dammit. I think that, other than Alderson’s value as a trade chip being totally undersold, the thing that makes me the angriest right now is that I’m almost certain that the words “.300 hitter” kept rattling around in Brian Sabean’s brain. “Can I really pass up a .300 hitter? For a pitching prospect? I mean, the pitching is strong right now, and there’s only one .300 hitter on the team right now. Another .300 hitter would be worth, like, five more wins, at least.” Using batting average to evaluate the worth of a hitter is like using an Apple II+ to do your taxes, and I’m almost sure it’s going on in the Giants’ front office. Just a guess, of course, but it’s not as if there’s any evidence to the contrary.
I honestly believe this is all that Sabean evaluated. I don’t think he understands anything beyond this.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
I really can't say
I’m at the point where its hard to believe any scouts or media about prospects……the success rate is just too low to go too crazy about any particular guys (outside of the obvious studs like Bumgarner putting up goofy numbers).
Conceptually, you’d like to get more than Sanchez for a top-50 prospect. And the Giants still can’t hit so unless there’s another trade I question the wisdom of the deal in general. But as far as trading Alderson, not TOO shook up about it……was very surprised to see the name but it wore off quickly enough.
Seriously. Sanchez was the one guy I really wanted and now I’m not too excited about getting him.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
If we get the extension, we could be looking at 10 wins over 3. whatever years for 25 millionish…
Is that worth Tim Alderson? Eh. Maybe.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
I think so. The compensation could net us something close to Alderson.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
Um, no.
If his option doesn’t vest (which it almost certainly will, unless his knee really is bad), and if the Giants offer him arbitration (which they won’t) and if Sanchez declines said arb offer (which he won’t), and signs with another team, then the Giants would get the type A compensation.
So, yeah, the Giants are not getting any picks for Sanchez, at least not this year.
the option is going to vest
he’s here next year for $8 million. We can just end the discussion there
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 5:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, no one can really say when he’s going to get back on the field. So…there’s that.
by AndOnTheDrums... on Jul 29, 2009 6:10 PM PDT up reply actions
the Giants doctor (who everybody probably now thinks is an idiot because he works for the Giants) didn’t think the knee was a problem
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 7:10 PM PDT up reply actions
I was referring to after next year. And I’d really doubt he’d accept arbitration. He would probably be entering his last big FA payday. Why would he accept?
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions
obviously it all depends on what happens between now and then
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 7:10 PM PDT up reply actions
By the way
Sanchez is currently Type B. I linked a chart from MLB Trade Rumors on another post regarding Molina; search the page for “Type A”.
WordUpThome: I CANNOT BELIVE THAT THIS PRODUCT IS NOT BUTTER
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons
by CaliforniaJag on Jul 29, 2009 8:31 PM PDT up reply actions
The absolute worse case scenario is if he doesn’t get 600 PAs and the Giants don’t exercise the club option (e.g. he gets hurt, the knee is really a problem, etc).
In that case, am I correct in assuming that the Giants get absolutely nothing for him walking because there’s no arbitration if you decline an option on a player?
I thought the option vested with an All-star appearance or trade? Am I wrong?
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
It’s $8.5M, or very likely above what he’d get on the open market now. His guarantee vests at 600 PAs; the club has the choice any time at that price.
However, if the club declines the option I’m pretty sure there’s no arbitration available. Sabean already said he’s back next year, but I’m more just looking at what happens if everything were to go wrong downside scenario.
fangraphs' take
Sanchez is a nice complementary player, but he definitely should not have cost an A-level pitching prospect. In five years, this (panic?) trade is going to hurt.
Hurts if true. But he’s not an A-level pitching prospect
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 5:25 PM PDT up reply actions
It feels like what happened to fuck the organization in the ass around 2005. Trading for veterans. wheeee
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Trying to put anger into words...
First off, the odds are against Tim Alderson. That said, as far as prospects go, he is about as sure a thing as exists for becoming a useful major league arm. Whether in the bullpen or as a starter, it’s very likely that he’ll contribute around league average numbers for next to nothing for six years in Pittsburgh. He was also a key part of the Giants being able to retain their two best pitchers (Lincecum and Cain) because we’re saddled by Zito’s contract until 2013. Without young, cheap pitchers like him, there will be no possible way to do this. Now, pretty much all our hopes hinge on Bumgarner and another pitcher emerging. Pucetas? Maybe. Sanchez will start getting expensive around 2012. Wheeler? Hope springs eternal, I guess. Someone we draft/sign in the future. Not really good planning here.
And for that, we get an above average secondbaseman. A momentous improvement for our team. One that we have to pay a lot of money to over the rest of this year and next. It’s very possible that he outperforms his contract. But we gave up one of the best young pitching prospects in the game to get him.
You always have to go for it if you have a reasonable chance. Do we actually have a reasonable chance right now? No. Do we have a chance? Yes. We have a pretty good shot at taking the wild card now. Our pitching is outstanding. Our hitting is now borderline average.
I don’t like hating on players, but Garko and Sanchez had better both have an outstanding two months or I will boo them mercilessly. For clarity’s sake, I want them and you to know that I’m not really booing them, but Sabean, whom I can’t legitimately boo, because he won’t appear before me in a public forum.
Gah, I’m rambling. But I really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really hate this move.
IF Sanchez and Garko both have good Augusts and Septembers, and IF the Giants make the playoffs, and IF Lincecum and Cain make October their personal showcase to the world that they are the best 1-2 combination in the game today, then I’ll be OK with this trade. Pretty much anything short of that and I’ll still be pissed.
Oh, and as someone who has pretty much always given Sabean the benefit of the doubt and defended him… that’s over. I’m hereby calling for your non-renewal of contract. No, that sounds way to benign. I want Sabean to be fired the day before the season ends, just so we can fire his ass instead of letting him walk.
Still the loving, adoptive father of Hector Sanchez. And who doesn't love switch-hitting catchers with power and patience?
Your point about Cain and Lincecum is a good one
Cain is signed, so that is not too much of a problem, but Timmy hits arbitration this winter and will destroy all records for pitchers. I think the Giants are paying at least 10 million for the next 3 years of Timmy.
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:34 PM PDT up reply actions
I don’t like the trade, I think it’s too much to give up. But I don’t think it’s worth rioting over and I’m happy to have Freddy Sanchez, he is a good player.
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 5:27 PM PDT reply actions
Like most fans, if we make the playoffs and get to see Tim and Matt in a short series, I’ll probably be OK with this. If we don’t win the wildcard, I’ll be pissed.
Still the loving, adoptive father of Hector Sanchez. And who doesn't love switch-hitting catchers with power and patience?
As much as I said “meh” to this trade, Sanchez and Garko are not getting the Giants to the postseason. It will have to be the pitching. The offense is only marginally better.
the pitching isn’t going to do it. 2/5th of the rotation are completely inconsistent and 1/5 is not major league level. Essentially we have two outstanding pitchers and then a hope and prayer. Hell St. Louis has the same thing but they have an offense to with it. It’s not enough.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
1948, actually, and that team had the best offense in the league. 1st in OBP, 2nd in SLG. By 1950 (when it was really true, they had like 3 SP pitchers on that team) the offense had gone downhill and they were a 4th place team.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
I agree, and that is really my biggest problem with this trade. With Randy Johnson’s injury I think this team has very little chance of making the playoffs, certainly not enough of a chance to give up a talent like Alderson to improve this team.
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 7:09 PM PDT up reply actions
thank you voice of reason
"I would've been here sooner but I had to shake the Veleasels"
by The Gene Hackman on Jul 29, 2009 6:15 PM PDT up reply actions
I fall in this category as well.
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 29, 2009 7:23 PM PDT up reply actions
agreed
Bowkermania has been put on hiatus for retooling.
by rightcenterfielder on Jul 29, 2009 7:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Bingo, Grant
Grant says, “What kills me, though, is that if the Giants were willing to trade Alderson, they could have traded for something they really needed.” I have seen Alderson pitch in person and I’m glad we got something for him. My guess, with his mechanics, he’ll blow out an elbow within the next four-five years. His arm is incredibly whippy, and Tom Seaver’s book, and my intuition tell me that is going to take a hefty toll on a lanky dude’s joints. I do agree that we should have coughed up Alderson (someone everyone else values highly) for something more valuable then a slap-hitting second baseman with a good glove. Either way… meh.
Brian Sabean is akin to a treatable form of cancer... just get rid of it before it kills you
Looking forward to free agency, why not, instead of signing a cleanup hitter for LF or wherever, why not sign a leadoff hitter there. Rowand is not an effective leadoff hitter. Assuming Molina leaves, why can’t Sandoval hit cleanup, and have a good leadoff hitter and Freddy hit in front of Panda. I’ll assume Carl Crawford re-signs, but what if?
Insanity is just a state of mind.
Sabean (Littlefield) and Ned can share their feelings about
how it feels to be prison raped at the deadline. Giant fans now have their very own Casey Blake to love/hate.
Alderson may not be Santana-good, but you don’t trade a 20 year-old, consensus top 50 prospect who is pitching well in AA, for a busted-up rental. You just KNEW Sabefield was going to do something stupid after they came off the road and he singled out all the young guys, and left the vets alone. This is what you get with Sabefield in a playoff race.
Go fuck yourself Sabean and start praying that Alderson goes Liriano and blows his arm out.
BTW…Go fuck yourself too Neukom. I guess the “Giant way” is to treat your fans to this ass-clown GM for many years of veteran gamerness and .500 seasons.
wow THIS
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah this is what I was ranting about earlier. We basically handed out two top 10 prospects for one season of a guy with a questionable knee, and a guy who will probably platoon.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, when you put it in those terms…./shoots self
"He is Tim Lincecum...the Most Interesting Pitcher in the World."
THREE YEARS of a guy who will probably platoon
I was okay with the Garko trade on its own. The trades on back-to-back days is like pissing all over a corpse after you set it on fire.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions
tap is angry
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:46 PM PDT up reply actions
I nearly put out my eye applying eyeliner and ranting about this earlier.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions
To be fair, not that I’m that inclined to be, the team is not required to have three years of Garko. They can just not offer him arb and let him go. At least that’s my understanding.
Well, yes. It’s three years total that they can have him. But if they traded away Barnes for two months of a platooning first baseman, we revisit the urine-soaked charred corpse and copulate with it.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions
That's right!
Look how well that went down with AJ!
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Was at the game this afternoon and then drinking not nearly enough beer at 21st Amendment when the trade broke. Had to borrow someone’s iPhone to watch MCC blow up.
I don’t think this is a good trade, either long or short term. And that’s coming from someone who has Freddy Sanchez on his fantasy team. The only way this is a remotely comprehensible trade is if Garko and Sanchez go nuts for two months and the Big Unit somehow comes back for the playoffs and we plan on winning lots of 2-1 playoff games. But as Grant says, you have to be really optimistic to think we can win three series that way.
Gah.
"He is Tim Lincecum...the Most Interesting Pitcher in the World."
It’s probably already been said, but now guys like Pucetas and Clark are going to be relied on even more to become better prospects. And they’re going to need Wheeler to sign soon too. Reactions are mixed in Fresno; some press box denizens like it, some field staff/media people do not.
Forgive me for being late. Wrapped up an interview and made up back up to the box just now.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:35 PM PDT reply actions
Well the site is in flames, there is smoke everywhere, and Grant grabbed a bat and said he had to go take care of something. Also, dogs and cats, living together.
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Nice
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 29, 2009 7:25 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m not sure I understand your first sentence. Who’s relying on them to be better prospects? wouldn’t we want to be better prospects whether or not Alderson and Barnes get traded?
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:32 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, of course we always wanted them to succeed at the ML-level. However, now there’s no back-up plan if they fail, especially for Pucetas who will likely be in the big-league rotation very soon (perhaps Friday or the middle of next week). Yesterday we could say, well if Pucetas and Martinez don’t pitch well, we can rush Alderson. Now we can’t.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
our new second baseman
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions
is he Mexican?
I might be moved to like him if he is.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:40 PM PDT up reply actions
He’s spanish
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm part Spanish
My dad’s mom was born in Spain, my dad’s dad is the Mexican one.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh right
He’s in California now, so he’s Mexican.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions
He was born in CA, so it’s a good possibility.
Judgment Day has been indefinitely postponed. :(
comics | art | Nattowear
Apparently a co-worker’s wife is his cousin. Oxnard? I think he said. Do not remember
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 29, 2009 7:26 PM PDT up reply actions
/checks
Burbank
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 29, 2009 7:28 PM PDT up reply actions
cool haircut bro
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:41 PM PDT up reply actions
The 40-man Problem
Who gets dropped on the 40-man? We’ll have to find a spot for Sanchez tomorrow and a spot for Nate when he comes off the DL…
Who gets the axe? Frandsen and … Guzman?
Adopted brother of Jason Jarvis.
Yeah
for some reason I thought he was already off the 40-man, but I see now that he’s still on there
Adopted brother of Jason Jarvis.
Also, (as briefly touched upon above) if Sabean had of signed a cheap Hudson or Lopez in the off-season, none of this would even have been an issue (also the Giants would have a better record now).
It’s because Sabean made the perplexing choice to start the season with Burriss at second base, that any of this is even an issue. And it cost the Giants Alderson: basically a freebie from Sabean.
Do not meddle in the affairs of GM's, for they are subtle and quick to anger.
no, Sabean wanted to have an internal competition between Frandsen and Burris for 2B…because the Giants’ we not supposed to be this close this season, they were supposed to be devolping youngsters. If Sabean makes one of those signings, then half the folks on this board freak out about another vet signing. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.
really?
Because I don’t think anyone here is really that high on either.
Now, I still think Frandsen should have just been handed the job and given 300 PA’s, but hey
by NeifiChicken on Jul 29, 2009 5:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Fair point.
However, if Sabean claimed there would be a fair competition- he lied. Possibly not giving Franny a chance has cost the Giants Alderson. Or, Alderson could have been traded for a good RH OF instead.
Do not meddle in the affairs of GM's, for they are subtle and quick to anger.
by cybermaldonado on Jul 29, 2009 5:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Hey, remember when the Pirates took on the rest of Matt Morris’ salary for Rajai Davis? What Goes Around Comes Around, Exhibit A.
"He is Tim Lincecum...the Most Interesting Pitcher in the World."
If karma were real we’d have a title by now.
Status: Feels so broke up. Wants to go home. || Still boycotting Johnsonville and Giants souvenirs or ballpark foods for repossessing my K Wall in right field.
by GiantBrass on Jul 29, 2009 5:44 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Schmidt’s arm
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions
What goes around . . .
Can we say we’re even and never ever go this way again?
Don't believe everything you think.
anyone else reading the pirates’ boards?
long story short: our pain and suffering is only sweetening the deal they got.
how good is the giants' starting rotation? our rotation is so good, our 5th starters throw no-hitters. uh.
by Golden Gate Review on Jul 29, 2009 5:45 PM PDT reply actions
schmidt
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Bonds
Original member of the Van Buren Boys
by NuschlerFace on Jul 29, 2009 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions
A Scott Barnes/Tim Alderson package wouldn’t have been enough for Victor Martinez, but it would have been a heck of a start.
Great post. I was going to make this same argument before I noticed my bus was coming and I needed to leave work. A package of Alderson/Barnes/Crawford/Kieshnick has to be in the ballpark for Martinez. It’s pretty similiar to what they got for Lee and Lee is more valuable. Adding Martinez is a significant improvement to the team, not these moderate improvements around the edges.
I bought into Sabean’s refrain of not giving up top young talent for marginal improvement. It’s what I would have said and it was what I wanted to hear. The fact that he was saying these things made me feel he has turned the corner. I was obviously wrong.
by AngelWillSaveUs on Jul 29, 2009 5:45 PM PDT reply actions
I hate this trade. This is exactly why we did not want Sabean doing the trade deadline dealing without a contract. Sanchez is just going to look like yet another old player, you watch, it won’t even take that long for him to look old. Heck, he has a bum knee right now. Way too much of an overpay for a decent complimentary player.
I'm not going to be a Negative Nancy about this one, but...
I’ll preface this by admitting that I wasn’t terribly high on Alderson — at least in comparison to others I’ve seen comment. I mean, I’ve seen him pitch, and came away impressed, but I try not to become too attached to any one prospect. That said, I’m still upset.
It kinda reminds me of Al Davis drafting Darrius Heyward-Bay over Crabtree. It’s not that DWB is necessarily going to be a terrible player, but Davis didn’t HAVE to use a top ten pick on his ass. He could’ve easily, easily traded down. Granted, this isn’t quite as monumental a fuck-up, but it’s the same principle. In my mind, Sabean didn’t need to deal Alderson, and if he was so willing to do so, then we should’ve gone after a real season-changer. Sanchez is an upgrade, but how much of an upgrade, really?
wah wah wahhhhhhh
how good is the giants' starting rotation? our rotation is so good, our 5th starters throw no-hitters. uh.
by Golden Gate Review on Jul 29, 2009 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh yeah forgot about Crabtree for like…. 3 hours…
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions
I just had a thought (may have been mentioned here already, but I don’t have time to read through all 150,000 comments. I’m at a goddamn Apple store right now.)
The Pirates were flying back to the East Coast after this game. The Giants probably figured they HAD to do this deal before the series ended, so that Sanchez wouldn’t have to waste a couple cross-country flights and he’d be theoretically available for the Phillies series this weekend. What do you want to bet the Pirates brass caught onto this and decided to play hardball with Sabean because they knew he’d cave at the last minute? I know he wasn’t going to be traded during this series, but when this afternoon rolled around, the Pirates, ironically, probably had all the leverage.
That’s all I can figure.
"He is Tim Lincecum...the Most Interesting Pitcher in the World."
Thanks, now this trade looks even worse.
"He is Tim Lincecum...the Most Interesting Pitcher in the World."
Obviously Sabean either thought Sanchez is a very good player or the scouts were telling him Alderson’s value has gone way down.
And (while I don’t like this trade much) both of those things may actually be true!
Saving countless runs with my Brian Horwitz
by lyricalkiller on Jul 29, 2009 6:03 PM PDT up reply actions
G$ hits it on the head for me, here:
The only way this trade earns more than a D- is if the Giants keep their remaining prospects while adding someone who pushes Bengie Molina to the sixth or seventh spot in the lineup.
Has to be part of something else. This can’t be all there is. Right guys? Right?
My whole thing is the strange treatment of Frandsen. He could’ve been the solution at 2b, but instead we wasted a chance of finding out on Burriss. Baffles me. Won’t lose sleep over losing Alderson, mainly because he wasn’t an untouchable and Brute alleviated any worries I might have. hum baby
On 5/7, the best part of waking is up LOLDGERS in my cup.
the pirates wanted frandsen, but sabean said “no, let me screw with his development a little longer”
by sliderinthedirt on Jul 29, 2009 6:07 PM PDT up reply actions
i know i’m a newbie, but i remember reading some acronym…
TINSTAPP anyone?
how good is the giants' starting rotation? our rotation is so good, our 5th starters throw no-hitters. uh.
by Golden Gate Review on Jul 29, 2009 5:57 PM PDT reply actions
Just curious — how recently have Law, Goldstein, Callis, Sickels etc raved about Alderson? I know he was top-50 before the season, but a few months (and a new level) can make a big difference for a prospect, especially one with an unconventional profile like Alderson. So are there more recent raves about him that can make me feel shitty about this all over again, or are we mourning based on outdated info?
Saving countless runs with my Brian Horwitz
I’m not that upset about losing Alderson as a prospect — he could be great, he could get hurt, he could struggle until he’s 27, whatever — but I don’t think that Sanchez is the best allocation of that trade chip.
by Grant Brisbee on Jul 29, 2009 6:07 PM PDT up reply actions
exactly
Alderson is a good prospect, and should have gotten a more valuable asset.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
It's also not quite as obvious, but very very possible...
…that none of the other 28 teams in baseball agree either.
It takes two to trade, and the thing that makes all the pissing and moaning about every deal so fucking hard to read is that it’s almost all predicated on knowledge of the course of negotiations. The course of negotiations with everyone else in baseball. Knowledge that the whiner can’t possibly have.
My son is Madison Bumgarner, the Spacebat of pitching prospects. My other son is a Porsche.
Meanwhile, Sanchez was on a team that didn’t want to get rid of him, and should have been available for a less valuable asset.
In a player-for-player equation, I sort of like the deal. In the “seriously? we couldn’t do better given all the other factors teams face” department, I hate it.
Saving countless runs with my Brian Horwitz
by lyricalkiller on Jul 29, 2009 6:14 PM PDT up reply actions
(er, “a team that HAD to get rid of him.” Sort of a crucial typing mistake there.)
Saving countless runs with my Brian Horwitz
by lyricalkiller on Jul 29, 2009 6:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Has it been said how much money the Pirates are kicking in for Sanchez?
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:02 PM PDT reply actions
For fuck’s sake. Seriously. Fuck. Wasn’t that a sticking point as well as the knee?
The Pirates have shed nearly $24 mil in trades with Wilson, LaRoche, Sanchez, and Snell.
Fuck. I may have a seizure soon.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:05 PM PDT up reply actions
I mean, I don’t give a brokedick motherfuck about what the Pirates do with their money, but we’re on the hook for $8 mil on top of the other fuckery?
I seriously have no words. Other than ones that start with F.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:07 PM PDT up reply actions
We’rent you the one upthread who admitted to pulling things out of his ass?
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Then maybe you should stick those things in your mouth so it’ll shut you up.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:16 PM PDT up reply actions
What the fuck does “undude” mean? If it means I’m not a dude, then you’re 100% correct.
Or, you can look at it this way: we’re paying $8 mil for a knee that may or may not be healthy. Meaning, he could platoon as well. One AP report says it’s unknown when he’ll make his Giants debut due to his knee.
We could have signed Orlando Hudson and had much less fuckery as a result. And that makes me very ill.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Yes I am goddamn livid. I’m spitting bullets. And Uggla has nothing to do with this. I don’t know what’s stupider, the trade or you arguing this with someone who gets paid to write about the minor leagues.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Wow. I feel your pain. You just sucked all the anger right out of me. I feel a calm now like I’ve passed into the eye of the storm.
Do not meddle in the affairs of GM's, for they are subtle and quick to anger.
by cybermaldonado on Jul 29, 2009 6:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Baron, you do get paid to write about the minors, and your opinion is one I respect most around these parts. However, none of know what the actual offers on the table were, from whom, and what other teams scouting departments evaluated Aldersen’s talet level at. The Giants’ have, in the past, evaluated their pitchers very well internally. Other than the Nathan/Liranio trade, the pitchers the Giants’ have traded haven’t done well. I remember being livid when Jason Grilli was traded. Feel a little silly about that now.
I said to BruteSentiment that it was mean for me to hope Alderson declines. For the sake of the Giants and my own sanity, I hope this. We don’t know what will become of Alderson, it’s true. Maybe they know something we don’t. But it’s still an awful trade, and while I’m very angry my evaluation of the trade stands.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions
If we werent’ getting fair value for Alderson, then fucking HOLD ONTO HIM AND LET HIM PITCH IN OUR ORGANIZATION.
by AndOnTheDrums... on Jul 29, 2009 6:53 PM PDT up reply actions
I may be in the minority but I think we are getting fair value.
But you’re talking about whether or not his value will increase. That’s a definite possibility. but I think there’s also a possibility that his value will decrease.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 7:02 PM PDT up reply actions
whoah, step down from your pedestal
I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken
by joeytothelimit on Jul 29, 2009 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions
yeah, I went there
Not advised, but neither is spouting nonsense and adding nothing intelligent to the discussion.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:27 PM PDT up reply actions
I can’t and don’t fault you for missing the fact that I’m female. You poked a hornet’s nest at the worst possible time with this trade. You’re certainly not the first person to ever say something dumb. I should be unleashing this anger on the front office.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:31 PM PDT up reply actions
don't put professional in quotation marks
I think he is a more complete pitcher than Bumgarner, for their ages and pro experience. I like that he has four pitches and throws them for strikes. His velocity isn’t the greatest in the world, but I think as he gets older and fills out that it possibly would come along. The bad stretch in Connecticut this year was a concern, but I was patient with him given his age and it being his first test at the level.
I was thinking he’d be one of the pitchers to step into the rotation at the major league level. I considered him an untouchable. But I admit to being out of touch with his progress in CT, and my editor at SF Dugout conveyed his concerns with Alderson during a recent trip. So maybe the GNIATS BRAS sees something we don’t.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:41 PM PDT up reply actions
You a fucking dick. BVCE lives this shit 24/7. She knows more than anyone else here what she is talking about. Show a little god damned respect.
You! A fucking dick.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
Wow! You’re quite the ass, aren’t you?
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
You're kind of a douche
She provided you with a valid answer absent of malice. She showed you more respect than you deserve.
by Lars The Wanderer on Jul 29, 2009 6:46 PM PDT up reply actions
So far in this thread we've established...
1) that you don’t really know anything, but make sweeping statements as though you do.
2) You act like a dick when people point that out.
3) You act like a dick when people try to educate you.
4) You either don’t know how to use question marks….or you’re a dick all over again.
PROTIP: This isn’t sfgate or mlb.com. People here are well-informed and expect others to be the same. If you say stupid shit, we call you stupid. Either deal with it, get better informed, or bugger off.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
“This place sure is hardcore” = the new “In Play: Out(s).”
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
Tird most hardcore blog at best.
Bruce Bochy would like you to look at the career numbers and stop complaining.
This guy is the absolute definition of a troll. 100%
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
ILU
My day just turned around. You guys referred to the SOMEONE GOT TOLD flowchart, and I met Branch B Rickey.
I offer a mea culpa. I was acting too big for my britches, and I apologize. Just because someone’s an asshole doesn’t mean I have to be one.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 8:12 PM PDT up reply actions
DUDE.
Are you kidding me? Baron is like one of the authorities on the Giants farm system here and you are acting like an asshat.
emperor nobody: "can ben copeland play third will the mcgwire throwback jersey be sponsored by balco labs i think i am having non-nerve-damage related chest pains well there’s holliday’s homer for may"
Clayton Tanner. I have nothing witty to add.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jul 29, 2009 7:04 PM PDT up reply actions
We're paying $2m.
The option hasn’t vested, and if the knee is a real issue, it won’t.
My son is Madison Bumgarner, the Spacebat of pitching prospects. My other son is a Porsche.
yep
I don’t think we can do anything more to the raped, charred, urine-soaked corpse. But Sanchez’s option not vesting would be the next hypothetical atrocity committed to the corpse.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:43 PM PDT up reply actions
So it's bad if his option vests and bad if his option doesn't vest?
My son is Madison Bumgarner, the Spacebat of pitching prospects. My other son is a Porsche.
In a Nuschler?
My son is Madison Bumgarner, the Spacebat of pitching prospects. My other son is a Porsche.
As of now, 99% of everyone agrees we got the shit end of the deal
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
my name is ricky roma
/bets the other way
"I would've been here sooner but I had to shake the Veleasels"
by The Gene Hackman on Jul 29, 2009 6:18 PM PDT up reply actions
I think think that Grant really hit the nail on the head with his comments on this one.
The Giants are a better team now than they were, and Sanchez is WAY better than what we had going at second base, but if we gonna trade Alderson, we should have used him to address our biggest need – a cleanup hitter.
This is what frustrates me about all this anger and venting. None of us were able to hear the actual offers. I loved the idea of Alderson, but perhaps this is his market value. Perhaps all the VMart conversations began and ended with Bumgarner or Posey, nothing else will do. We just don’t know.
If that’s the market value for Alderson, I’ll take Adam Kennedy, Felipe Lopez, or Marco Scutaro for Not Alderson, and hold on to Alderson. Sanchez is better than those three, but not by much.
by Grant Brisbee on Jul 29, 2009 6:20 PM PDT up reply actions
yes, yes, yes
Young Studs for Old Bats: The Brian Sabean Porno Story
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 6:21 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m pretty sure Alderson would have gotten Willingham, who could hit third, pushing Pablo to 4th. So that would almost be like getting a cleanup hitter.
I heard it was Sanchez for Johnson.
emperor nobody: "can ben copeland play third will the mcgwire throwback jersey be sponsored by balco labs i think i am having non-nerve-damage related chest pains well there’s holliday’s homer for may"
Clayton Tanner. I have nothing witty to add.
by walkoff baltimore chop on Jul 29, 2009 6:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Hey, remember this?
2:20pm: SI.com’s Jon Heyman says the Giants are in serious talks for Sanchez. The teams are discussing John Bowker, Kevin Frandsen and Jesus Guzman.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
Some people were complaining too…
Goddamn.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
fran & bowker, not all 3. giants brass get it done (too tired for caps)
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 6:06 PM PDT up reply actions
I tried hard to convince myself that could be the deal, but there was no way the Pirates were taking that AAAA collection
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 7:00 PM PDT up reply actions
the Bucs Dugout take may add some perspective;
Is the upside here worth the risk? I’m not sure it is. I’m not sure it isn’t, either, but this trade still makes me a little uneasy. I know that every prospect guru is going to say this is a great trade for the Pirates, and I understand why they’re going to say it, and I hope they’re right. But I’m not really sure most of prospectdom’s chattering class really evaluates pitchers properly. That’s my humble opinion, at least
Baron
I read that the Giants aren’t getting anything extra in the deal.
F Sanchez
But more importantly, F Sabean!
by LinceCainGarnerSon on Jul 29, 2009 6:03 PM PDT reply actions
If it makes you feel any better...
Twins’ Liriano misses Wednesday start
MINNEAPOLIS — Twins left-hander Francisco Liriano was scratched from Wednesday’s start with soreness and swelling in his left forearm.
Manager Ron Gardenhire said Liriano informed the team of his condition Tuesday, and no structural damage was found during an examination Wednesday.
Gardenhire said the plan is to have Liriano rest for a couple of days and throw a bullpen session this weekend. If all goes well, he would likely start next Wednesday in Cleveland.
Liriano has been a disappointment this season. The left-hander is 4-10 with a 5.56 ERA, second worst among American League starters.
KARMA!
Joe Nathan
1.80 ERA 389.2 IP 227 SV 0.916 WHIP
Judgment Day has been indefinitely postponed. :(
comics | art | Nattowear
But, we got one hell of a catcher.
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
hahaha…. cries
how good is the giants' starting rotation? our rotation is so good, our 5th starters throw no-hitters. uh.
by Golden Gate Review on Jul 29, 2009 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions
emphasis on hell
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
I was watching a White Sox at Tigers game last weekend. AJ was booed there. So he’s hated in Oakland, San Francisco, Anaheim and Detroit.
He’s hated everywhere that isn’t the South Side of Chicago.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
They more don’t care in Minnesota. They’re pretty happy with their catching situation.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
karma for what?
Liriano has pitched 334 major-league innings with an ERA+ of 107. Maybe he’s done; maybe he’ll come back and make some more all-star teams. He’s still only 25. But regardless, that trade is a clear loss for Sabean even if you don’t count Joe Nathan.
We got one year of 86 OPS+ out of AJ and then kicked him to the curb. I think you could argue that the Twins would have gotten more value out of the deal if it had been AJ for Boof straight up.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Wow
I can’ believe they got rid of Alderson….Him and Bumgarner were supposed to backup Cain and Lincecum (and I guess Zito since we’re stuck with him)
Who is the 5th starter long-term? Sanchez? Sadowski? Sosa?
by GobbleforCyoung on Jul 29, 2009 6:09 PM PDT reply actions
Pucetas
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions
:D
Kevin Pucetas lurks in the shadows, waiting for his time to shine.
by Sammy Danger on Jul 29, 2009 6:29 PM PDT up reply actions
I got to the gym, jumped on the tread mill, turned on ESPN and saw Alderson on the ticker. My Heart started pounding, thinking o shit o shit.
I ran a bunch of possibilities through my head, maybe we got Sanchez plus prospect or Duke and Sanchez for Alderson and Pucetas. When I saw it was a one for one trade, I almost fell off the treadmill.
Minor White > Ansel Adams
The biggest bummer is that
Is that we totally SHOULD have traded for Sanchez, and we totally SHOULD have traded Alderson.
Just not for each other.
I hope trading season isn’t over. If this is it, then the Giants are half-assing it. We still need a cleanup hitter.
(Yeah i posted this in 2 thread, didn’t realize the other one was older)
I choose to watch the Giants try to score runs. Not because it is easy, but because it is hard.
If the Giants win the WC, he’ll get an extension.
Face it, we’re stuck with him.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:20 PM PDT up reply actions
If Freddy Sanchez is the second coming of Ricky Ledee, he could be out even if the Giants win the WC.
Let’s be fair: Freddie Sanchez is NOT Ricky Ledee (or even Michael Tucker).
Don't believe everything you think.
we have talked about this before. finding a better gm would not be that easy.
No one here gets out alive.
There are about 12 of them who post regularly to this site.
Young Studs for Old Bats: The Brian Sabean Porno Story
by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Jul 29, 2009 6:24 PM PDT up reply actions
If the Giants win the World Series, he’ll deserve one.
Or is the “WC” something else that’s not registering with me?
A playoff spot after a few years of missing the playoffs? Management will read that as SUCCESS!
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions
I want to go back to laughing at our collective misery
I am just angry and it’s not fun.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 6:32 PM PDT up reply actions
The killer there
The killer with that is that they will never ask the question of who was the GM who ate it badly enough that making the playoffs for the first time in years is a success
Sabean was staying regardless of the outcome this year. This team has already exceeded expectations.
He’s been here since the new ownership took over in 93. Once he’s not the GM, he’ll just be higher up in the organization as a team president type role/advisor.
If he were to be fired it would have happened by now.
I sort of have the opposite feeling — he’s gone no matter what. New management likes to bring in new underlings.
I’m more in line with “He’s coming back”. This is a team that doesn’t like to fire people. They let Dusty go after his contract ran out. Felipe Alou wasn’t even fired.
That’s kind of my belief, too. Although Larry Baer could be the mitigating factor to that.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
This is the start of the Brian Sabean era
In the past one could easily argue that Sabes had his hands (if not other parts of his body) tied by Peter McCheap. But that was then and this is now. This trade was pure Sabean. He’s made it official: he can’t keep his eye on the abll!
Don't believe everything you think.
That would really, really suck.
If the Giants won the Wild Card. Really awful. I’m sure you agree.
My son is Madison Bumgarner, the Spacebat of pitching prospects. My other son is a Porsche.
I wasn’t being flip. (FOR ONCE). I don’t think the culture of the ownershio and front office will see these smaller moves in such black and white strokes as we do. Not saying that we’re wrong for overreacting, but I’m not sure that this would be enough in their eyes for a complete front office overhaul.
You have clams in your ass?
Duane Kuiper: Hall Of Fame broadcaster.
by Johnny Disaster on Jul 29, 2009 7:10 PM PDT up reply actions
I have mixed feelings
I’m leaning against this trade, because I mean, it’s Alderson. But I always, always rag on the Warriors for eternally rebuilding, and the Giants have shown that they’re not going to do that with the Garko and Sanchez trades…
grits teeth
Bay Area fan going to UCLA.
He probably was
He didn’t have to play for the Pirates anymore; I’d think he wanted to be traded to 31 different teams (well, 30…Natinals)
WordUpThome: I CANNOT BELIVE THAT THIS PRODUCT IS NOT BUTTER
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons
by CaliforniaJag on Jul 29, 2009 8:16 PM PDT up reply actions
Dammit I can't count
28. WTF is this, the NFL?
WordUpThome: I CANNOT BELIVE THAT THIS PRODUCT IS NOT BUTTER
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons
by CaliforniaJag on Jul 29, 2009 8:16 PM PDT up reply actions
I truly despise Sabefield
He makes it so hard to be a Giant fan. If the team sucks, you can satisfy yourself with being able to see some prospects, and maybe, just maybe a little hope for the future.
However, you have to be O.K. with sucking
When you catch a little lightning in a bottle and find the Giants playing for something, you want to be happy, but that dark cloud is always looming. You KNOW KNOW KNOW that if Sabefield gets the slightest whiff of the post season, he will lose his mind and treat Giant fans to his carnival of stupidity. Quite obviously other GM’s know this too. Perhaps he still thought his beeotch Littlefield was still with the Pirates and figured this HAD to be a good deal.
This move could get Bengia out of the cleanup role. Sanchez can hit 3rd and Sandoval 4th. Sandoval has been a 2nd half player his whole career, destroys lefties (With power!) and has his highest BA of any month in August (.330 something). Once Schierholtz is back we can roll out
Against righties
CF: Rowand
LF: Winn
2B: Sanchez
3B: Sandoval
RF: Schierholtz
1B: Garko
C: Molina
SS: Renteria/Uribe
Keeping on SWOOPing in the free world! Also, by the reflexive property of the rubber/glue playground comeback, I enjoy wearing hats on my ass.
by SneakToBetterSeats on Jul 29, 2009 6:27 PM PDT reply actions
Not going to happen
Jesse Foppert: I Still Believe. Maybe a little less now.
"I've come to the conclusion that the two most important things in life are good friends and a good bullpen." ~Bob Lemon,
by AndYourBirdCanSing on Jul 29, 2009 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions
It should be...
LF Winn
2B Sanchez
3B Sandoval
1B Garko
RF Schierholtz
CF Rowand
C Molina
SS Renteria
But it will likely be:
LF Winn
2B Sanchez
3B Sandoval
C Molina
1B Garko
CF Rowand
SS Renteria
RF Schierholtz
:(
I like your preferred lineup
It’s how Earl Weaver would have wanted it, except that Wynn these days is also a #6 hitter. The Giants really needed a lead-off hitter with 40-bag speed more than a traditional clean-up guy.
wynn in unrated
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 30, 2009 6:30 AM PDT up reply actions
I don’t understand why we would hit our shiny new 1B in the seven hole? Seems to me we got him specifically for his bat.
Any type of mongering is A-OK in my book.
Garko has only demonstrated #7 power potential.
In “THE BOOK” the ideal lineup is
- — speed/.390 obp
- — contact/.375 obp
- — line-drive/.300 BA
- — power/.500 SP
- — power/.475 SP
- — line-drive/.275 BA
- — power/.450 SP
- — contact/.350 obp
- — (pitcher)
This theoretical lineup was from a time when offense was less easy to come by and 36 homers had a good shot at leading a league and striking out 100x was taboo for a batter.
If Garko didn’t move Bengie out of the cleanup role, Sanchez certainly isn’t going to.
Judgment Day has been indefinitely postponed. :(
comics | art | Nattowear
God damn it
I was almost starting to believe in Sabean too.
Barry Zito: Mike Hampton with a guitar
Positive Vibes
I talked myself into it a little bit. The main complaints seem to be that A) Alderson was a potential cheap rotation filler for the 2011 Giants B) Comparable options to Sanchez were got for cheaper and the main one C) If you were going to trade Alderson you should get someone better than Freddy Sanchez.
I can’t argue against A or B, but C I wonder about. I don’t think teams were going to part with an impact bat for a low-upside guy like Alderson. Barnes and Alderson IS NOT the start of a big trade for Victor Martinez. For that to work I’m pretty sure they’d require Bum or Posey and that doesn’t work for us. The Giants didn’t have a deep package like the Phillies where instead of trading the top guys they could trade four guys of around Alderson’s caliber for a blue-chip impact guy. So while I agree Alderson has more value than Sanchez, I don’t know by how much. So we overpaid for a guy who fills a huge hole and should make the team a lot better in the short term. I can live with that.
will MoLOLina be a type A or do you even think we would offer him arbitration at the risk of having him back next year. He is respected in the league as one of the better hitting catchers… they said it not me!
I would like to see Molina back if he is catching twice a rotation and Posey is catching the other 3 times
He won't do that
I WANNA START. I SHOULD CATCH THE ACE. WAAAAAAAH
- Bengie Molina
Kevin Pucetas lurks in the shadows, waiting for his time to shine.
by Sammy Danger on Jul 29, 2009 6:51 PM PDT up reply actions
As of July 25...
…Bengie Molina is a Type A free agent. But if you offered him arbitration, he’d probably accept. So being Type A means essentially nothing.
WordUpThome: I CANNOT BELIVE THAT THIS PRODUCT IS NOT BUTTER
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons
by CaliforniaJag on Jul 29, 2009 8:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Actually, I hadn’t realized that Molina had pushed himself up the rankings, and that’s good news.
The major concern about him is that you do not want him to sign a multiyear deal, and according to all indications that’s what he’ll start out asking for.
I’d have no objections to offering him arbitration and letting him stick around another year. He walks, great, you get the draft choice. He accepts? Worse case is that he gets slightly overpaid for a single year – no biggie, considering that’s the last year you’d want him around anyway – and less than you’re overpaying Renteria.
Glad to have a little good news today!
I was at the game last night and knew it was coming and I still puked in my mouth.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
I blame xanthan. We should have known Sabean would take that “Open Massive Stupid Trade” thread title seriously.
I blame Sabean’s laptop
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 29, 2009 7:39 PM PDT up reply actions
I would like to revise my 79 wins prediction
80 WINZ!
by Lars The Wanderer on Jul 29, 2009 6:35 PM PDT reply actions
*tear
It’s great to get out of the 70’s!
Mo'ped Money, Mo'ped Problems
by Scooter Ellis on Jul 29, 2009 6:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Brian Wilson is not being helped by helping himself this show
Any type of mongering is A-OK in my book.
Let's say Sanchez offers the Giants the same extension
A signs for 3 years, 20 Mil.
3.5 years of sanchez and a chance for us to figure out what to do at 2B. Is it a little better? Not saying it is good, but would it be better?
I actually think that might not be bad.
I’d go for it if a part of the salary is incentive-based. I’d prefer the third year to be a team option.
by RougeGorrila on Jul 29, 2009 6:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Better than Rowand's deal
Of course, that’s like saying getting hit in the ribs is better than getting hit in the groin.
3.5 years of Sanchez means we’re paying a 34-35 year old 2B that kind of money. And this isn’t the NBA where expiring contracts can bring you back talent in deals.
I left for a while to pick up the kids. Sometimes, this is a good way to cool down about these kinds of things.
I still hate this trade just as much, though.
In fact, I don’t think I’ve hated a trade quite this much since A.J.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
A bit of a positive spin
we picked up Alderson in the draft because of the compensation pick from the dodgers for signing schmidt, so we basically got the best years of jason schmidt and now three time all star freddy sanchez for armando rios and ryan vogelsong while keeping alderson away from the Bums.
Suck It Dodgers and Pirates!
Dodgers fans eat their young.
by redhornet78 on Jul 29, 2009 6:47 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Thank you for taking the sting away, even if it was for a second
by BleedBlackNOrange on Jul 29, 2009 7:35 PM PDT up reply actions
therefore
Suck it, Russell Martin!
Bowkermania has been put on hiatus for retooling.
by rightcenterfielder on Jul 29, 2009 7:35 PM PDT up reply actions
+1 Suck it, Russell Martin
Judgment Day has been indefinitely postponed. :(
comics | art | Nattowear
I kinda like this.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 8:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, it does make it feel a tad better, doesn’t it.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Brian Sabean Fleeced in Freddy Sanchez Trade - MLB Outsider
Interesting write-up regarding this trade. Stat heads go nuts!
http://mvn.com/aroundthemajors/2009/07/brian-sabean-fleeced-in-freddy-sanchez-trade.html
Any type of mongering is A-OK in my book.
Yep, that guys on it.
Even the folks who are saying that maybe Sanchez was all we could have gotten for Alderson need to realize that if that’s the case, his value isn’t really enough to give up SIX years of one of the top prospects in baseball.
God
What I love about that article is the Carlos Santana for Casey Blake trade being the benchmark for shitty trades. Dodgers suck!
Whatever
Alderson was a bit much, but Garko and Sanchez will definitely help
Not sure why Alderson and Barnes weren’t just traded for Martinez
Velez has two good games in a row and gets replaced lol
by GobbleforCyoung on Jul 29, 2009 6:49 PM PDT reply actions
A rick roll
Duane Kuiper: Hall Of Fame broadcaster.
by Johnny Disaster on Jul 29, 2009 7:23 PM PDT up reply actions
California Roll
WordUpThome: I CANNOT BELIVE THAT THIS PRODUCT IS NOT BUTTER
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons
by CaliforniaJag on Jul 29, 2009 8:20 PM PDT up reply actions
dont want to read all the comments on my phone
But lemme just say that this trade has fucking pissed me off. FUCK YOU BRIAN YOU SHITSTAIN. GOD DAMNIT how many young pitching prospects does he have to trade to realize he fucking sucks at it? Shea Hillenbrand is our new 2B
Extremely proud adoptive parent of Paul E. Stanley, deserved all-star and hacker extraordinaire
Thanks to roger
I've never been happier to have Crabs
by bondslegend on Jul 29, 2009 6:52 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
Sorry to inform you
The rabbling has ended. It is now dull acceptance.
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
YES IT IS OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG
Extremely proud adoptive parent of Paul E. Stanley, deserved all-star and hacker extraordinaire
Thanks to roger
I've never been happier to have Crabs
Just to console you
He didn’t trade Timmy. At least we still have that.
I'm on the bad trade side now
Damon Bruce says it was a good deal. I disagree with him on 99.999999999999999% of the time. So I now know it’s really horrible.
Did you listen to Ralph any this afternoon? It was pretty frustrating. It was basically about how Sanchez is a GAMER and Alderson was just a prospect and he might not ever turn out anyways. I got the feeling that Ralph would have said the same thing even if Bumgarner was traded.
PROSPECTS ARE UNPROVEN
Tim Roy wanted no part
But he had to say the usual generic crap
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
.466 OPS in July
Yup, he’s a gamer!
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
I never listen, because I detest sports talk radio, but it’s amazing how much of the company line he toes. Is this normal? I’m not hearing any diverse viewpoints from callers, either. Just one viewpoint, the Giants front office viewpoint.
Honestly, I don’t know. I don’t listen to the Razor and Mr. T Show that much, I just have it on in my kitchen at random times I seem. Ralph isn’t the greatest baseball mind.
somebody on Chronicle Live said “the future isn’t guaranteed” Uh, yeah dude, that’s why it’s called the future
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 7:16 PM PDT up reply actions
But right now is a gift; that's why it's called "the present"
WordUpThome: I CANNOT BELIVE THAT THIS PRODUCT IS NOT BUTTER
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons
by CaliforniaJag on Jul 29, 2009 8:21 PM PDT up reply actions
badabing!
I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken
by joeytothelimit on Jul 29, 2009 10:43 PM PDT up reply actions
I hate that “just a prospect” reasoning. Obviously, they are risky, but almost everyone’s a minor leaguer at some point. I suggest we work on a giant multi-team trade in which we give up proven major league professional hitters Aurilia, Uribe, and Renteria, in return for unproven prospects Laporta, Strasburg, and Heyward.
Also, the chronicle article re the garko trade didn’t even mention barnes’ name til like the last paragraph.
VOTE SANDOVAL
Adopted Giant: Henry Sosa
lol Damon Bruce
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 29, 2009 8:14 PM PDT up reply actions
The other day Damon Bruce actually said that Bumgarner had a curve ball like Zito’s.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
Not as bad
if the trade would have happened in April, along with Garko, so that the Burriss/Frandsen project would have never gotten off the ground. Maybe it’s a horse race with the Dodgers.
And Alderson wouldn’t have hurt quite so much…
Don’t worry, Brain can still make a couple of more moves before Fri. There’s still some prospects, and he’s gotta make sure he shows whoever is pulling the strings after the Mrs. Burns strategy that he’s da man.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
Did the Giants overpay...
Of course they did. But so what… They needed a second baseman. The position was a cess pool all year. Adding a .300 hitter is a definite upgrade. He may not be the power hitter we all wanted, but he’s a doubles machine in a ballpark made for that. How can anyone possibly be complaining about this deal.
Yes, you can argue the merits of trading a top 50 prospect, and if the Giants were any other team you might be able to. But SF has so many arms in their system and losing one who wasn’t the hardest of throwers isn’t going to hurt them as much as some of you seem to think. No matter what Alderson does through the course of his career, I’ll enjoy watching a .300 hitting all-star at second base for the next few years over anyone else this team could dig up to play the position. And while it would be nice to think about seeing Alderson as a fixture in the rotation a few years from now, with Bumgarner, Pucetas, Sosa, Clark, Tanner, Nicholson, Wheeler, Surkamp and a Bucardo or two still in the system, the Giants can afford to overpay for a much needed second base upgrade.
So what if they overpaid… It’s still a great move for the Giants!
by crazedcrustacean on Jul 29, 2009 7:06 PM PDT reply actions
it’s the GM’s job to assemble a team to compete for the World Series, and when the opportunity presents itself like this season where we’re close but not quite there, the stakes are a little higher. You have to trade talent to get talent.
I wanted to adopt, but all the good looking babies were taken
by joeytothelimit on Jul 29, 2009 10:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Note that Philadelphia — who’s opportunity is a heck a lot larger than ours right now, and who was presented with a much greater potential piece to their championship pie — refused to do what we did.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
That's because
they don’t care about going back to the WS. They went last year and have plans in October and all. Fall foliage FTW!
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:10 AM PDT up reply actions
To be fair the BJ wanted Happ, who was the best pitcher on the staff before Lee, for Halladay. So Basically that trade would had been replacing Happ with Holladay. Now Happ is no Halladay, but to swap the two would have done little, you still have Jamie Moyer AND Rodrigo Lopez pitching, now with Lee you have only one of those two pitching. IMO trading for Lee and keeping Happ is better than replacing Happ with Holladay (for this season)
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jul 30, 2009 8:27 AM PDT up reply actions
You paid $20,000 for a '76 pinto, but that's o.k.
because ANY car is better than walking. Tortured logic
ok, so if you really need something, you pay any price for it?
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 7:14 PM PDT up reply actions
so they say
at 6th and Market.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:10 AM PDT up reply actions
I though Rowand was supposed to be a doubles machine in a doubles park…
Do not meddle in the affairs of GM's, for they are subtle and quick to anger.
by cybermaldonado on Jul 29, 2009 7:18 PM PDT up reply actions
WE NEEDED A PITCHER AND GOT ZITO
GREAT MOVE
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
wow... they overpaid by a lot
that being said, we’re going to have a pretty decent team this year and next year, and I’ll enjoy watching. You never know how long the Tim-Matt magic is going to last.
Psycho killer, qu'est-ce que c'est?
best post of the night
People have to calm down a bit. The Pirates won this trade, but its not like the Giants got nothing
Yeah Alderson was a steep steep price. And he’s goign to be good for the Pirates.
But what is the point of having such a great pitching staff when your offense sucks so much???
The Giants already have one of the best starting rotations in MLB and they have THE best starting pitching prospect IN ALL OF BASEBALL.
Sanchez and Garko are going to help this team offensively and defensively
by GobbleforCyoung on Jul 29, 2009 7:18 PM PDT up reply actions
I think the point is
This offense is till going to suck.
If you’re going to trade your future, at least make a real dent in the present.
I wanted Sanchez because I thought a salary dump would cost nothing.
I overestimated Sabean’s competence.
yea… I’m trying to look on the bright side of things. I wouldn’t have done this trade… I have a feeling Sabean is trying to earn another contract by making the playoffs this year. Still, there’s something to be said for how the team is performing now, and Sanchez definitely makes us better. This is going to be a fun team to watch. Hopefully one of our young outfielders starts hitting better. Having Nate or Bowker (if he’s called up) catch fire could be great for this team.
Psycho killer, qu'est-ce que c'est?
that's fine
it will still be better though…STL won the whole thing with a shitty offense and Carpenter/Suppan/Wainright
by GobbleforCyoung on Jul 29, 2009 7:24 PM PDT up reply actions
I want to see some of the gems
A good laugh
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
This trade tells me
Brian Sabean values experience a lot more than youth and potential. If Pablo had struggled in April (had his slump right after the All Star break early in the year), Pablo would be in Fresno right now and Uribe would be the everyday third baseman.
he values defense too
and Bumgarner will probably get promoted in September for the playoffs
Sabean probalby thinks his job is on the line and is going for it
by GobbleforCyoung on Jul 29, 2009 7:23 PM PDT up reply actions
I have a bad feeling about this
namely that you might be right. Will Bumgarner be batting 4th, then?
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:12 AM PDT up reply actions
Pablo did struggle in April.
THE GREATEST OF ALL TIME (for 3 days in 1995).
by Mike Benjamin Hit King on Jul 29, 2009 7:29 PM PDT up reply actions
Scroll down to April
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/8326/gamelog;ylt=Agv4CVJTu55xMzdt0eymHuFCLcF
Two and a half weeks into the season, he was hitting below .250
And it’s not like the Giants care, but he didn’t have any on base skills or power at the time either.
GROUGTHINK ALERT
You know why Pablo got the pass for his poor start?
His .340 average in 2008.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
The response was to this:
If he started the season that way, he would have been sent down to Fresno.
GROUGTHINK ALERT
Sure, I know
But I was just saying that there was some validity to his statement. It might have been factually wrong, but the sentiment behind it was more or less true.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
Question: Is there a member of the Giants organization that has influence on the GMs perception of trade value of minor league players? If so, how much influence do they have, and who are they?
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 29, 2009 7:21 PM PDT reply actions
Tidrow was elevated to Ned’s old job, so officially the guy who gives the report would be Bobby Evans. But the ultimate “decider” on risk reward is probably Sabes.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Should we step away from the ledge?
Long time reader, first time poster.
Before I start I’d like to say that the collective wit, cultural awareness and baseball knowledge on this board is (IMO) unrivaled on the internet.
Now about the trade… I agree that we could of got more for Alderson in the offseason but I’m not convinced that we could of got (much) more right now. This is a sellers market. Supply and demand are way out of wack. It would’ve been the prudent move in the long term to just hold up making the trade. Barnes was also a steep price to pay.
But I believe the Giants brass has to win now. Either Sabean is getting a mandate from above or he’s trying to save his job. Either way, I can hardly blame the guy for the sense of urgency.
Who was available:
Willingham – based off of what the Nats asked for Johnson, I find it hard to believe that just Alderson would’ve done it
Uggla – n/a
Phillips – n/a
Scutaro – maybe
Additionally, I think our organization will quickly replace Alderson with similar or better pitching prospects. Jorge and Wheeler (we HAVE to sign him now) are well on their way.
We gave up too much value, but we dealt from a position of strength, we improved our chances of getting into the playoffs, and we still have a top third farm system.
Overall, we’re in a much better situation then we have been in a long time.
by Wonderful Terrific Monds on Jul 29, 2009 7:23 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I feel like Scutaro would’ve required a much lesser prospect and I find it hard to believe that the 8 million due to Freddy next year wouldn’t have landed Iwamura in the offseason.
Thing A
I don’t think waiting until the offseason was an option.
by Wonderful Terrific Monds on Jul 29, 2009 10:58 PM PDT up reply actions
On one level, no
but after they waited half a season to do either of these things that every last poster here agreed they needed to do in December, maybe it’s a good option.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:14 AM PDT up reply actions
I think you need to go through all the trades made in the last month and show me how it’s a sellers market. They’ve mostly been either quite balanced, or (mostly in the case of Pittsburgh’s moves, surprise surprise) weighted toward the buyer.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
I will be trying very hard
To not hold this against Sanchez. It’s not his fault.
I choose to watch the Giants try to score runs. Not because it is easy, but because it is hard.
Carney’s probably giving him pointers at this very moment.
Bowkermania has been put on hiatus for retooling.
by rightcenterfielder on Jul 29, 2009 7:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Devil's (Sabean's) Advocate
Do you guys not think that Sabean tried offering all the packages of AAAA and lower prospect players that he could before going with Alderson?
I choose to watch the Giants try to score runs. Not because it is easy, but because it is hard.
Two more days left until the deadline
He didn’t have to settle for this offer, yet.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
They start a tough series tomorrow night and waiting until the deadline would have meant not having Sanchez in the lineup until Sunday. He probably overpaid just to get it over with and get him in against the Phillies.
by crazedcrustacean on Jul 29, 2009 7:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I thought I heard Sanchez say he’s not likely to play this week anyway.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
for Sanchez?
yea I believe that. But why not trade for Scutaro for much less and then sign a guy like Iwamura in the offseason?
Thing A
He didn’t have to make the trade. He also could have decided to wait for better players to become available, such as next year or maybe free agency sometime. Or he could have gone after maybe lopez or scutaro. If sabean offered the jays jonathan sanchez and nate schierholtz for halladay and they rejected the offer, should he say “Oh well, they rejected the lower offer, I guess I have to give up lincecum and posey for halladay”? Sanchez is a decent player, but I doubt he’ll provide the giants with the long-term value they would have gotten from keeping alderson.
VOTE SANDOVAL
Adopted Giant: Henry Sosa
I feel very accomplished for having slogged through this entire thread
Back to grading essays. /sigh
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
part of me says "what the hell, why not go for it"
the other part weeps silently
Kevin Pucetas lurks in the shadows, waiting for his time to shine.
by Sammy Danger on Jul 29, 2009 7:36 PM PDT up reply actions
I feel the same way
I honestly don’t know how I’d feel about another trade at this point: I suppose it would depend on the terms of the trade. I’m not quite up-to-date as to who’s available (V. Martinez? The Natinals’ Willingham?), but if we’re seriously serious about this whole contending thing, then why not really go for it?
Dudes
I just got a tweet from someone and this next trade is going to KNOCK YOUR SOCKS OFF so just sit tight. Giants world series 2009!!!!
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 8:09 PM PDT up reply actions
At this point
We might as well do another deal.
Lets get someone who can knock Bengie out of the cleanup slot.
I choose to watch the Giants try to score runs. Not because it is easy, but because it is hard.
Gimme a crowbar and $10K and I can make it happen. Mortage is due, SF is expensive.
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 8:10 PM PDT up reply actions
Underbidding a contract, sneaky dude!
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 9:21 PM PDT up reply actions
if by "done" you mean not coming back next year
after this deal I hope so. If you mean “done” as in not engineering more moves to get rid of the overabundance of pitching prospects that made the Giants a model for other organizations… you might be right.
Of course, I’ll have to be eating a lot of crow when he trades Pucetas and Velez for Pujols.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:17 AM PDT up reply actions
Another Devil's (Sabean) Advocate
If we do go all the way and win the World Series this year….are people okay with this trade?
uhh, yeah
that is the goal
Kevin Pucetas lurks in the shadows, waiting for his time to shine.
by Sammy Danger on Jul 29, 2009 7:39 PM PDT up reply actions
That’s like asking if I’m OK with losing a toe because I found a diamond as I flushed it down a public toilet.
shitty decision making processes leading to good results does not validate the decision
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
Umm, what? If Sanchez is a vital part of a WS-winning team this year or next, the trade is worth, plain and simple.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
If we go to the WS I will pissed about this trade because it will be a total failure. Why ruin a good 55 year streak!?!
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 8:10 PM PDT up reply actions
Of course
I want to be able to celebrate like all my New England friends did in 04.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Boston was really nutty. I don’t think SF will be quite that ridiculous, but it should be spectacular.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Man I wish I’d been alive for that.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
Sabean
Who is a worse GM (who is currently employed) then Sabean right now? maybe Dayton Moore because of that Betancourt trade but I can’t think of anyone else off the top of my head
Grab Some Pine Meat!
omar minaya is pretty lolable
Kevin Pucetas lurks in the shadows, waiting for his time to shine.
by Sammy Danger on Jul 29, 2009 7:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Sabean should challenge Baggerly to a fight
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 29, 2009 7:46 PM PDT up reply actions
Again, Washington has no GM.
My Bucardo is better than yours.
A hot August weekday, before a small crowd, when the only thing at stake is the tissue-thin difference between a thing done well and a thing done ill. Insofar as the clutch hitter is not a sportswriter's myth, it is a vulgarity, like a writer who writes only for money.
Their GM is so bad, he doesn’t even exist!
by Squire_Boone on Jul 29, 2009 7:45 PM PDT up reply actions
I'll take him
for Brain straight up
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:19 AM PDT up reply actions
Goodbye Alderson, Hello Playoffs
Fred Lewis can stand under my umbrella.
31 May 2007, 21:38 EST - the last time Matteh's career W-L wasn't below .500
We are at war with Los Angeles. We have always been at war with Los Angeles.
Lowering the Quality of Internet Discourse Since 1985™
Goodbye Dignity, Hello Snuggie!
Matt Cain: Duck and Cover
by mjrboredom on Jul 29, 2009 7:46 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hello Old Crow, goodbye job and paycheck
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 8:11 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm pretty meh on the trade
A) If Sanchez plays well and the Giants go deep in the postseason, I’ll love the trade.
B) If Alderson becomes a stud starter and gives the Bucs multiple good seasons, I’ll hate the trade.
I’d say B isn’t really any more likely than A (TINSTAAPP, etc) even though Alderson is still quite young. By far the most likely scenario is “neither A nor B” in which case the trade just didn’t matter that much.
We maybe could have gotten more, but who knows. It’s very easy to overvalue your own guys. I do think it we could have gotten the pirates to throw in at least a little salary, though.
or how about
some AAA pitcher to fill the 5 spot in the rotation in case Johnson doesn’t come back? Or maybe an A pitcher they’ve soured on but might be salvageable?
That’s another thing I don’t understand- straight up? Not even a throw in from Pitt? Or maybe an exchange of give-up guys in AAA; maybe they have a position guy in AAA or AA that is better than an AA/AAA pitcher the Giants are giving up on.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:21 AM PDT up reply actions
Interesting
Freddy Sanchez in August
2005 .265 .333 .316 .650 (first full year)
Then …
2006 .355 .395 .473 .868
2007 ..374 447 .610 1.057
2008 .318 .341 .489 .829
2006, 2007 or 2008 production out of second base would be a huge boost in the arm this next month.
by Wonderful Terrific Monds on Jul 29, 2009 7:45 PM PDT reply actions
But how did Nick Swisher do?
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jul 29, 2009 8:12 PM PDT up reply actions
What makes me really sad, is that this is probably the last “major” move Sabean is going to make this season. Like Grant said, the Giant’s biggest need is a cleanup hitter, and Sanchez is no clean up hitter.
If Sabes can pull off a good trade for a cleanup hitter
All will be forgiven.
I choose to watch the Giants try to score runs. Not because it is easy, but because it is hard.
But he won’t. With this trade, he has shown other GMs just how much he is willing to overpay to get what he wants. Any deal for a potential cleanup hitter is going to cost far too much.
by Squire_Boone on Jul 29, 2009 7:51 PM PDT up reply actions
and
can’t involve Alderson.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:21 AM PDT up reply actions
No way. The Giants biggest need was a middle infielder. Pablo can hit cleanup. Garko hit cleanup for a potent offense on occasion. It’s just Bengie’s feelings and Bochy’s brain that’s keeping us from having a decent clean up hitter.
by SeeingStars on Jul 29, 2009 7:52 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
It’s going to take one of the new big 4 to get a cleanup hitter.
by Wonderful Terrific Monds on Jul 29, 2009 7:50 PM PDT reply actions
"BaronVonCurrentEvents"
She got pissed here. Good read, actually.
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
or Baroness
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:22 AM PDT up reply actions
Lets just think about this
Heres the deal we traded a “prospect” for a valued position player. I was really high on Alderson too I thought he would solidify (w/Baum) out rotation for years to come, but and correct me if Im wrong baron, didnt his ERA go from 1 something to almost 4 recently. I am not trying to start crap but I have a Giants fan for years and I want another play-off team and I think that Garko and F-sanch give us that chance this year and more than likely next and yo address the power hitter thing HELLO they don’t want to play here and if they did their homers would be flyouts and yes even mister holliday!
shit shit shit fail fail fail sabean fucking fail.
Prospective parent of new pick, Zack Wheeler. Projectable Righty stolen from the braves. Of course, I stalk my son's myspace: http://www.myspace.com/zackwheelerbaseball
"Obviously I’m not doing things like going toe-to-toe with a ninja. Find me a ninja, for one."--Brian Wilson
shhhhhhhhhhhhhh
It’s only Thursday.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jul 30, 2009 7:22 AM PDT up reply actions
Might as well goes balls out now....
and make a play for Victor Martinez, Josh Willingham and Roy Halladay.
I would have liked to see a pitcher thrown in with this deal. All week I’m hearing it’s Freddie Sanchez for Bowker, Frandsen and Guzman. What should have happened is, that we should have sweetened that deal by throwing in Alderson, and in return, got a pitcher like Zach Duke.
Sanchez & Duke for Guzman, Bowker, Frandsen and Alderson would have been a bit more fair… and filled our need at SP in the process.
Oh, and is there any chance the Giants aren’t done trading? Dye and Willingham are still available… who can bring the power we originally said we needed by the trade deadline.
OH, and if we get healthy and add one of those guys, I think we would have a pretty potent lineup:
1. Rowand – CF
2. Sanchez – 2nd
3. Sandoval – 3rd
4. Willingham – LF
5. Molina – C
6. Schierholtz – RF
7. Garko/Ishi – 1B
8. Renteria/Uribe – SS
There won’t be an easy out in that lineup. Still not potent with power, but good professional hitters and enough pop to give the pitchers some occasional breathing room.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
