Would you do it: Zito for Soriano?
by tenjay on Jul 14, 2009 11:38 PM PDT
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god yes
Congratulations and Thank you Jonathan Sanchez.
by GrahamCrakalaka on Jul 14, 2009 11:47 PM PDT reply actions
I have to agree with the orgasmic tone of that yes
"The BB's are out. The BB's are being arseholes to me." - Brian Wilson.
The idiom in McCovenese, or McCovenish maybe, is “in a heartbeat.” So yes, in a heartbeat (or whatever synonym you fancy). Soriano is a very good left fielder, statistically; and he has “pop.”
MORTGAGE THE FUTURE
just get rid of zito.
by i wish we were good on Jul 14, 2009 11:58 PM PDT reply actions
No doubt.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
I think Jim F. from Morriss, Ill. had to be on something
Or something…?
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all
If Dustin Pedroia played in Seattle, not many people would be talking about him.
GET THAT VORP SH!T OUTTA HERE!!!
... No.
The only reason I’d agree to get rid of Zito would be to eliminate his contract burden and freeing up those funds to sign Timmy and Cain to long-term deals. If another contract comes in that’s pretty much the same thing (not knowing Soriano’s contract but taking Jim F.‘s word for it) then I wouldn’t.
Actually, scratch “long-term”. I don’t trust contracts longer than five years.
by shanghaijim on Jul 15, 2009 12:26 AM PDT up reply actions
Congratulations
You’re the one in a million!
"The BB's are out. The BB's are being arseholes to me." - Brian Wilson.
You're a true patriot!
Wait, that’s a different sport alltogether.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
I forgot how crazy Soriano’s contract is:
signed 8-year deal worth $136M thru 2014 season on 11/20/06- + he receives an $8M signing bonus and salaries of $9M in 2007, $13M in 2008, $16M in 2009 and $18M each year in 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013 and 2014- + the deal includes a NO-TRADE clause- + he receives six premium tickets to the All-Star Game whenever he participates in it- + he receives six premium tickets for every home game during spring training, the regular season and playoffs- + he receives a hotel suite while traveling on the road- + he can earn award bonuses: $250K for receiving the most All Star votes, $350K for WS MVP, $250K for LCS MVP, $300K for NL MVP and $75K for gold glove- + as part of the deal, he will donate $25K annually to the United Way and another $25K annually to the Cubs Care foundation- + 2006 salary: $10M, 2005: $7.5M
Judgment Day is coming
comics | art | Nattowear
by Natto on Jul 15, 2009 12:23 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I wish I could forget how crazy Zito’s contract is.
Osiris, lord of the dead, and relief pitcher for the San Francisco Giants.
Zito’s getting paid more than $18 million per season either starting this year or very soon. We would save money here, upgrade our worst offensive position, and could open a rotation spot for two of Sadowski, Sanchez, Pucetas, Martinez, Miller, and Sadler.
Giants fans hate Zito’s contract so much that despite Zito’s likable personality, he has no support here. Cubs fans would probably also hate Zito’s contract, and trading for him to be able to deal Rich Harden is just about as stupid as stupid gets.
In short: Cubs lose proven everyday position player (albeit with crazy contract) for more expensive, far less valuable barely 5th starter who will at best alienate a large portion of their fanbase, and possibly encourage them to trade a starting pitcher with a far better track record simply to free up a rotation slot, further angering fans and sending the club’s playoff hopes into freefall.
I’m trying to think of any reason why the Cubs would want to take this deal.
by quincy0191 on Jul 15, 2009 12:46 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Exactly
And I would also add that I believe that Soriano would be much more easier for the Giants to trade away at some point over the next 1-3 years. He usually gets on a hot-streak once or twice in a given season (of course we’d have to throw in $5-10M to complete the trade), while I don’t believe Zito will ever be able to be traded away until maybe around 2013 if he happens to hit a hot streak then (very unlikely).
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
That is what we call a "cogent analysis"
"The BB's are out. The BB's are being arseholes to me." - Brian Wilson.
He was, and probably still will be, very good.
"The BB's are out. The BB's are being arseholes to me." - Brian Wilson.
he was when he played 2B for the Yankees
Oh yes, he was that good. His follies in LF have made everyone forget about his stellar numbers back then.
These are my principles. If you don't like them, I have others. -Groucho Marx
Hitting-wise his first two years as a Cub were about as good as his best years as a Yankee.
The thing is, he was never that good because while he was a Yankee, yes, he was a second baseman with a 120+ OPS+ which is great but he was an absolute butcher which made him less valuable than you’d expect (although still quite good.)
His first two years as a Cub, he put up similar offensive numbers while playing what has actually been a pretty okay LF (though not this year), which in the end appears to have been about the equivalent of playing a horrific second base. That said, he was about a 5 WAR player in his best years, so if you think he could bounce back to something like that, he’s probably worth his contract. Kind of a question at this point though, as he’s not exactly young (33) anymore. His BABIP is a bit low this season, though not so much that moving back up to his career norm would bring the rest of his offensive production back with it.
I dunno. I do think I’d rather have him than Zito. At least his actual good seasons happened much more recently.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
Wow... he has to donate a whole $50,000/year to charities. How can he afford to commit to that?
Forsan et haec olim meminisse iuvabit... Maybe.
by Mayor of 311 on Jul 15, 2009 8:10 AM PDT up reply actions
This was my thought too
For someone making more than 100 million dollars, this is chump change.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
Is this a joke?
That is the worst contract I ever seen? Jesus Christ!
The guy has had one good year of OBP – 351 – and that was with Washington
I guess it wasn’t a solid theory yet about position players breaking down at age 32-33. Actually, I’m saying the wrong thing. It wasn’t a solid theory yet because of performance enhancing drugs
by GobbleforCyoung on Jul 15, 2009 7:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Yes. I’d even throw in Rich Aurilia to sweeten the deal.
Osiris, lord of the dead, and relief pitcher for the San Francisco Giants.
Maybe Torres too.
not quite sure though, might have to get back to me in a week or so.
by i wish we were good on Jul 15, 2009 12:58 AM PDT up reply actions
Def.
Supporting San Francisco Dugout since 2005 and Manny Burriss since 2006, and bringing you all your California League needs since 2009.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jul 15, 2009 12:31 AM PDT reply actions
shoot.
id give up heroine to get soriano
Chuck Norris has only lost in one thing. 1 on 1 with Monta.
does that make you a hero?
49-39 - Giants Series Record: 17-7-4, 13-2 at home
Adopted Giant: Daryl "Dealio" Maday - 3.63 ERA, .259 BAA, crappy 1.68 K/BB ratio in Norwich. OK.
Nah- he's still hooked on the crack
"The BB's are out. The BB's are being arseholes to me." - Brian Wilson.
Yes, please.
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jul 15, 2009 6:38 AM PDT reply actions
Si se puede
Zito’s contract is technically one year shorter, assuming the option doesn’t vest. So there wouldn’t be a need to send money towards the cubs because they only have a 7 Mil buyout in 2014 (I can’t believe I just downplayed a 7 Mil buyout). But I would assume that they’d want a b-c level prospect if this were a realistic deal.
LOL the word "realistic" in this thread
"The BB's are out. The BB's are being arseholes to me." - Brian Wilson.
Acquiring Zito would allow the Cubs to trade Harden?
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
Woah, Harden has sucked majorly this season. Didn’t realize that
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
by Useful_Idiot on Jul 15, 2009 9:15 AM PDT up reply actions
I'd rather get Harden
Imagine the possibilities if we had Bocock, the Randy Johnson, and Dick Harden!
(Now if only we could convince Dick Pole to come back as pitching coach…)
"The BB's are out. The BB's are being arseholes to me." - Brian Wilson.
Why hasn't Harden been put into the bullpen, yet?
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
I would think that it would be better for him to pitch less than 100 innings a year than it would be to expect him to pitch around 200.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
I’d give Hendry a hummer to make this happen
by microwave donut on Jul 15, 2009 9:43 AM PDT reply actions
wow
Zito’s 2 years younger than Soriano. Soriano will be 38 when the contract is up????
My first thought was that this was a no brainer. My second thought was that Soriano was just having an off year, and would be better. But… the back end on the Soriano is even MORE brutal than Zito…
It’s pretty close. I think the Soriano will be more useful in 2010-2011, but 2012-14 will be likely much worse.
In the end, opening even a Zito sized hole in our rotation is probably not a great move.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
Soriano?
I don’t know, can he play centerfield?
Wait, are we still doing that joke?
I'm thinking but nothing's happening.
Oh hell no!
Just kidding, oh hell yes.
Saving countless runs with my Brian Horwitz
the proposed trade zito for soriano
in a ventricular fibrillation heartbeat. Get er done!
It's closer than you'd think
For 2009 so far, I’d rather have Zito, but Soriano will probably contribute more over the length of his contract.
According to fangraphs’ Wins Above Replacement:
2009 Soriano: 0.5 wins below replacement
Last 3 Years Soriano: 8.1 wins above replacement
2009 Zito: 0.9 wins above replacement
Last 3 Years Zito: 4.1 wins above replacement
And remember, Soriano’s contract is even bigger than Zito’s. Zito is a lot more likable too, imho.
Ultimately I’d probably make the swap, but it isn’t a slam dunk.
Soriano’s contract is less than Zito’s. $136M/8 years works out to around $17 million per year, while $126 M/7 years works out to $18 million per year. Also, since contracts are backloaded, Zito’s getting paid more than $1M/year more than Soriano for the final years of his contract (Zito tops out at $20M/year while Soriano gets to $18M/year).
Furthermore, Soriano plays our weakest offensive position, making it a huge upgrade for us, and Zito just sucks out loud no matter where you put him. There are many, many reasons for the Giants to do this and few (if any) for the Cubs.
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