Fred Lewis vs. Nate Schierholtz
This is probably an unfair time to write this -- Fred Lewis is cold, and Nate Schierholtz is hot. That makes a difference to this attention-deficient generation who can only remember the last two games I used to like to play when I was a kid were Clue and Battleship. Wait, where was I? Something about TV dinners, I think. I like dinner.
Three weeks ago, though, Lewis had respectable slash numbers as the everyday left fielder, and Schierholtz was hitting .237/.258/.322. There was never a fair time to compare them; they passed each other so quickly, so violently. But here goes:
Team X wants to give you a good second baseman, and they've locked their in-house sabermetrician in the cellar, so they want a deal centered around the shiny-low ERA of Kevin Pucetas. Along with Pucetas, Team X wants either Schierholtz or Lewis. You pick which one to keep.
(Also note that there are a lot more words and paragraphs and stuff after the poll. Click on "Continue reading this post" for the additional words.)
Points in Lewis's favor:
- Lewis's value is buoyed by his on-base percentage, which is a more consistent and predictable kind of value. When he's slumping like, oh, this month, his on-base percentage is still good enough for third-best on the team. That reflects much more on the collection of flailers the Giants have collected, but Lewis is one of the only hitters on the team who is willing to take a walk, and he's 12th in the NL for pitches per plate appearance. It's a stark contrast to Schierholtz, who swings at every pitch like there's a hit-and-run on with Bengie Molina as the base runner.
- The defensive numbers (clank) say that he's good (stumble) in left (clankstumble). Yeah, I'm skeptical too, but I'll keep quiet because I don't want to go to defensive statistics reeducation camp. It's probable that Lewis's plus speed allows him to get to some balls that others can't, even allowing for initial missteps. More importantly, though, Lewis's competition includes players like Carlos Lee, Adam Dunn, Raul Ibanez, Ryan Braun, and Josh Willingham. Clank, stumble, clankstumble indeed.
- Lewis had a fine year last year in over 500 plate appearances. He showed a good eye and extra-base power. That was in, you know, real major league games just last year. How quickly that can be forgotten.
- He works hard, and he's likable. I know that doesn't have much of a place in a facts-based discussion, but it should be noted. I like the guy.
Points in Schierholtz's favor:
- He's had a better minor league career than Lewis, with Schierholtz hitting .308/.355/.518 in 2,609 minor league at-bats, and Lewis at .282/.381/.420 in 2,643 minor league at-bats. It's hard, if not impossible, to know what those numbers mean without adjusting for league, so have a look for yourself at Schierholtz's minor league numbers and those of Fred Lewis. It's not like they played in different ballparks -- the only difference is the distribution of the at-bats (Schierholtz had more at-bats in high-A, and Lewis had more in low-A).
- Schierholtz is three years younger, and that makes a pretty big difference. Lewis is already 28; I've never heard a player's potential come up so much when he's just a couple of years from 30. Schierholtz has always been at the right level for his age, if not a little advanced.
- In a limited sample, Schierholtz has fantastic defensive numbers. If he were to ever play left field, the universe would collapse upon itself -- I'm guessing Bruce Bochy has a secret dossier from a physics think tank -- but by accounts both anecdotal and statistical, Schierholtz is a heckuva outfielder.
- Schierholtz projects to have more power. It's only recently showed up, mind you, but he's always had home run power in the minors. Schierholtz projects to be a better player by most of the forecasting models, actually. PECOTA has Lewis settling in as a .270/.350/.427 player over his career, with Schierholtz reaching .290/.330/.490. Before the season, ZiPS had .264/.342/.409 for Lewis's 2009 while coming up with .298/.331/.453 for Schierholtz. The difference in OBP is made up with Schierholtz's power, but probably all comes out to just a half-win difference over a full season.
These are two hitters with comparable value, even though they have different skill sets. Sometimes I think that if Schierholtz were a .250/.339/.452 carer hitter in the majors instead of a .312/339/.452, he'd get a lot more respect from internet baseball nerds around the world. If you have to choose between the two players, you're committing to one of two different ideas:
a) You're hopeful that Lewis can develop enough power to be an above-average corner outfielder, even though his career high is 12 home runs in any professional season.
b) You're hopeful that Schierholtz can develop enough plate discipline to be an above-average corner outfielder, even though he only has six unintentional walks in over 300 major league plate appearances. Also, he swung at a FREAKING PITCH THAT HIT HIM LAST WEEK. But who's counting?
Sorry. Gun to my head, I go with the youth and projection. Give me Schierholtz. That's not an especially daring pick right now, but it's probably the one I would have made before the season started too. I just wish there were a young outfielder in AAA who hit for power and average, and who can take a walk. What kind of mythical beast that would be!
Also of note: The correct answer -- keep Lewis and Schierholtz, and send Randy Winn to the Braves with a sack of cash -- is duly noted.
0 recs |
192 comments
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Comments
Schierholtz
We were born in the same hospital. Also, he is a better baseball player than Fred Lewis.
Original member of the Van Buren Boys
by NuschlerFace on Jun 29, 2009 11:27 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What hospital?
I’m not about to google this one
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
by Useful_Idiot on Jun 29, 2009 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
St. Mary’s in Reno
Original member of the Van Buren Boys
by NuschlerFace on Jun 29, 2009 7:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I voted for Schierholtz...
…even though giving up Lewis would make me sad.
Meet my new son: Sundrendy Windster, coming soon to a minor league near you.
by EliminateMe on Jun 29, 2009 11:30 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Prepare for the wrath of the Fredophiles
by Lars The Wanderer on Jun 29, 2009 11:31 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
McCovey Chronicles II: Wrath of the Fredophiles
This summer. Only in theaters.
(When did they start using that “only in theaters” line anyway? Like otherwise we’d expect the movie to be showing in bars or parking lots?)
Meet my new son: Sundrendy Windster, coming soon to a minor league near you.
by EliminateMe on Jun 29, 2009 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also,
are we talking about Teahen here? Or just 2nd basemen X
by Gob on Jun 29, 2009 11:34 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Schierholtz:because:
- The fact that he looks better at hitting LHP is exciting and bodes well for him being a productive everyday player
- The fact that he plays RF leaves LF open to aquire a bigger bat. (Also, I could imagine Nate in FL, but not Fred in RF.)
- The fact that his footspeed in underrated and approaches Fred’s.
- The fact that I like his bat to produce more consistent power
- The fact that he has a cooler nickname
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on Jun 29, 2009 11:37 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
If Nate is Florida, does that means Uggla is here?
If that is the case, bye Nate!
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 29, 2009 11:38 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Florida
America’s Australia!
Original member of the Van Buren Boys
by NuschlerFace on Jun 29, 2009 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Florida: America's wang.
(Homer Simpson)
Forsan et haec olim meminisse iuvabit... Maybe.
by Mayor of 311 on Jun 29, 2009 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Florida: Gods Waiting Room
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 29, 2009 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Canada: America’s Hat
The San Francisco Giants: Where old men go to die.
by GrahamCrakalaka on Jun 29, 2009 3:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like how nearly of your facts are opinions.
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
by rotorueter on Jun 29, 2009 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's a fact that those are my opinions
But when you get right down to it, aren’t my opinions pretty much accepted as fact?
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on Jun 29, 2009 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
In this case, you would be correct on each count.
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
by Lyle on Jun 30, 2009 5:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nate by default.
1) Mainly because I think Bowkermania would work rather well in LF.
2) And even is Bowkermania as issues LF in Mays Field is best corner outfield spot to hide a questionable glove thus making it easier to get a free agent up grade- should it me needed.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 11:42 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
This is a tough one.
At the moment, you have to give the edge to Schierholtz considering he’s younger, has more power, and is on a hot streak. I haven’t given up on Lewis though. If only he could get regular playing time again…
Judgment Day is coming
comics | art | Nattowear
by Natto on Jun 29, 2009 11:43 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Freddie is kind of old to be still developing his basic baseball skills. Nate is just a better all-around baseball player with more upside than Lewis, at this point.
well, it was really gary thomasson--the great, giant, fan
by greatgiantfan on Jun 29, 2009 11:44 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Fred simply doesn’t have enough cola for left field.
El Presidente Larry Baer's epitaph
"Nothing important ever happened without me."
by ResDog on Jun 29, 2009 11:44 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I voted for Fred, mostly because the lack of plate discipline up and down the lineup drives me crazy. If the starting lineup were constructed differently, I may have voted for Nate. Honestly, I don’t have a whole lot of hope that either one will be much of an asset to the team long-term.
Osiris, lord of the dead, and relief pitcher for the San Francisco Giants.
by neurofarm on Jun 29, 2009 11:45 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, that’s my answer too. The onslaught of hackers is dispiriting.
by Evan on Jun 29, 2009 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s really close and my brain says Schierholtz (VERY slightly, like by a millimeter) though I’d feel better about it if he didn’t have like a .020 isoD this year. I mean, there was a lot of discussion of Fred’s BABIP last year and how if it went down to normal levels, he’d be hitting .260-270. The difference there is that if Nate’s batting average drops below .300, all of a sudden, his OBP is dangerously low too. It’s easy right now to say that this is an easy decision or whatever but come on people, Nate is not actually a true talent .318 hitter. He’s got a .442 BABIP this month. I think we all know that’s not sustainable.
Their prOPS lines are currently .261/.347/.393 for Fred and .270/.300/.418 for Nate. I don’t know if it could be closer. I guess I’ll go with Fred because he needs some love and I think the on-base difference is important. Remember when no one cared that much that Bengie had one walk all season because he was hitting .350? Remember how much that sucked when he came back down to Earth?
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on Jun 29, 2009 11:46 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What my fellow Fred fanboy said.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
by Aadik on Jun 29, 2009 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
*fangirl
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on Jun 29, 2009 4:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
err, I didn't know that.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
by Aadik on Jun 29, 2009 5:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What am I voting for again?
You pick which one is traded… you can only keep one… don’t do what Donny Don’t does…
by pantalones on Jun 29, 2009 11:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I actually wouldn't mind getting rid of Lewis for very little at this point...
just because I think he’s taking up a roster spot that should go to Bowker. Yes, this is based almost entirely on the last few weeks, but the team has a chance to compete for the playoffs. If Lewis had the ceiling of RafRod then I’d be more worried, but at this point he sucks, I prefer Nate, and I want to see what Bowker can do.
Psycho killer, qu'est-ce que c'est?
by shikantaza on Jun 29, 2009 11:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
DING DING DING
We have a winner.
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
by Lyle on Jun 30, 2009 6:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think I screwed up...
clicked Schierholtz because the question in the post said to pick which one is traded… then the question in the poll suggests I’m only able to keep the one I click.
Anyway, I meant that I would trade Schierholtz, though I think that’s largely due to the framing of the question. I feel like another GM would probably be likely to give us more for Lewis, and that would be enough to make me trade him over Nate. I guess I’m just swayed by the shiny OBP, but I think that would make more sense to hang onto. Still, I kinda like both players even though it’s hard for me to imagine a really good team could start both and be productive offensively.
Idolizing Robb Nen since 2002...
by Smoke on the Water on Jun 29, 2009 11:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Good point. This whole poll is tainted thanks to Grant’s Palm Beach County-style ballot design. This one’s going to end up in the courts for sure.
by Evan on Jun 29, 2009 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
quick, hide Al Gore
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 29, 2009 12:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
“Which player do you not want to not keep if one player were to be traded and the other kept?”
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on Jun 29, 2009 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
My vote was found in Grant’s recycle bin.
El Presidente Larry Baer's epitaph
"Nothing important ever happened without me."
by ResDog on Jun 29, 2009 1:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
My vote will be riding around in car for the next few days.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 1:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
or floating in the bay
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 29, 2009 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
man, I hate it when I do that with the credit card bill! “but I know I paid that on time” yeah, I may have written the check on time but it rode around in the car for 2 weeks. d’oh!
by Merope on Jun 29, 2009 3:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The correct answer, of course, is to keep both and politely ask Rich Aurilia to retire immediately, at which time he will be offered the bench coach/front office/community relations position with the team.
"Are we bad? No. But right now, we are." Boulderskull, 4.16.09
by Kitspool on Jun 29, 2009 12:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm all for OFFERING him a coaching job, just so long as he is not GIVEN a coaching job.
I do not want Rich Aurilia coaching on this team. I think he has no useful mindset or approach worth teaching to players. I like him, good guy, and such like, but I don’t want him having any part of teaching or strategy.
Forsan et haec olim meminisse iuvabit... Maybe.
by Mayor of 311 on Jun 29, 2009 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he’d be an excellent person to teach Veteran Grit to the young guys as they get older. That and fake bunting.
"Are we bad? No. But right now, we are." Boulderskull, 4.16.09
by Kitspool on Jun 29, 2009 1:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly. Like I said...
Forsan et haec olim meminisse iuvabit... Maybe.
by Mayor of 311 on Jun 29, 2009 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This with Richie, the bereavement and all, is pretty tricky. No way the team can look good, damned if they do, etc
by allfrank on Jun 29, 2009 12:25 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Maybe it’ll make Richie think “Gee, life is fleeting; maybe I should spend more time with my kids.”
Do they even have kids?
by Merope on Jun 29, 2009 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s Schierholtz time to play and show what he can do. Lewis did ok last year but this year has shown that his defensive instincts are a problem. Now is the time to package lewis in a trade while he still may have appeal to some organizations.
by daniel9 on Jun 29, 2009 12:27 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
i like schierhotz but i think lewis has more upside. unless nate starts hitting for power, he is never going to be much more than he is right now. and i don’t think that is enough production from a corner outfielder.
No one here gets out alive.
by Bond16 on Jun 29, 2009 12:35 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Starts?
.625 SLG in the month of June!
(SSS disclaimers apply. Your mileage may vary. Void where prohibited.)
Meet my new son: Sundrendy Windster, coming soon to a minor league near you.
by EliminateMe on Jun 29, 2009 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't vote because I don't like either
Lewis would be an easy pick if he could play RF or CF. Schierholtz doesn’t walk enough to be a regular.
by superk1ng on Jun 29, 2009 12:38 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
None of the regulars walk enough.
Judgment Day is coming
comics | art | Nattowear
by Natto on Jun 29, 2009 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ll settle for them just working a pitcher that not on their own team.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
and I'm hoping we replace most of them
I’m okay with Nate starting this year, but he is not a long term solution
by superk1ng on Jun 29, 2009 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I voted for Lewis
but it doesn’t feel right. My heart is easily swayed by the “ooh shiny” of Nate’s recent efforts. I feel like once teams realize that Nate will swing at everything, they’ll start junkballing him, like they did with Pablo. I have no faith in Nate to adjust like Pablo, though, and then we’ll throw him in the Bengie/Uribe/Pedro pile. My brain says “take the more sustainable approach!!”, so that’s what I did.
Watch out San... oh, wait, Sadowski... uncle Pucetas is comin' for you.
by Sammy Danger on Jun 29, 2009 12:38 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
+1
Didn’t cast a vote because the word apparently hasn’t got out that Nate doesn’t walk, like Pablo. Now once everybody starts throwing him slop and he doesn’t flail miserably , then I would go with him because watching that ball bounce out of Fred’s glove yesterday pissed me off. I don’t care what kind of stat you can put up there that states he is even close to an average fielder.
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.
by WilliamVanLandingham on Jun 29, 2009 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Keep Schierholtz
Without a doubt!
Adoptive parental unit of Ehire Adrianza.
Godfather of Travis Ishikawa.
"I'm really proud to be on this team." - Nate Schierholtz
"Woo hoo" - Tim "The Kid" Lincecum
"Let's go get them in 2009!" - The Kid
"He got his pitch; he did not miss it" - Cainer
"Kung Fu Panda don't get hurt" - Cainer
by obsessivegiantscompulsive on Jun 29, 2009 12:38 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
schierhotz has never been given a chance in the majors for whatever reason
Reasons why we keep Nate over Fred:
- More Power
- Better Arm
- Younger
by cazzuno on Jun 29, 2009 12:40 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
schierhotz has never been given a chance in the majors for whatever reason
Reasons why we keep Nate over Fred:
- More Power
- BetterArm
- Younger
Fix’d
These are my principles. If you don't like them, I have others. -Groucho Marx
by RDreamer on Jun 29, 2009 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ll take Nate. More power, the same speed, and a cannon for an arm that can play in LF or RF. Hopefully he can learn to walk more in the next three years when he is FL’s age to get his OBP up
by m34josh on Jun 29, 2009 12:41 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Ideally I wouldn’t want either one starting in the outfield for my team. If Fred could actually play in CF he’d be a lot more attractive, but he can’t.
My problems with Fred are his frustratingly iron glove, his lack of power, and the fact that he tantalizes us with 5 tool potential but he’s almost 30 and is very very unlikely to get much better than he is right now. Also how many times is he going to get hurt because he has a bunyon?
My problems with Nate is that he does not walk, like AT all. I don’t think he’d really hit for that much more power than Fred at all. He may not strike out as much as Fred, but his value is that he has to hit .320 to even be semi-effective. He does play pretty good D though and I enjoy watching him gun people at the plate or 2nd base. Both unfortunately are at best platoon players….meh.
I don’t think either have any long term value to the Giants because I don’t see either being effective regulars. As for this season I prefer Nate, but I think Lewis still holds value for the team THIS year because he can walk a little bit, he has some speed (even if he doesn’t always use it well) and because I’d DFA Aurilia and bring up Bowker even if it meant carrying too many OF’s. At this point Winn and Rowand could each use 1 day off a week at least and Lewis and Winn shouldn’t play vs LHP so I think they could find ways to get Torres, Bowker and Nate/Lewis some playing time.
by Hobbes2d on Jun 29, 2009 12:45 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Both unfortunately are at best platoon players….meh.
I’ll quibble. I think if you’re not crazy about Nate, it would be fair to call him a “4th outfielder”, but I don’t think Nate is a “platoon player”. Platton players are guys who can hit either RHP or LHP but not both. Nate’s shown an ability to hit LHP, which would make him valubale as either a starter or, if he’s not good enough for that, a reserve.
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on Jun 29, 2009 1:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Piling on!!
9 hits in 25 P.A.’s with a sacrifice fly as a Pinch Hitter for a 25 year old would also suggest a very useful bench bat at almost any N.L. club would be glad to have.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I just hope BruBean gives Nate a chance, it would be a shame if we make him a bench player right away. Imaging if the Giants had Jayson Werth, he would still be in a platoon
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 29, 2009 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schierholtz – no question- better fielder, better hitter, period
by FANofDUBS on Jun 29, 2009 12:49 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Schierholtz – he’s younger.
Randy Winn is in time out until his OBP gets back over .330.
by oldjacket on Jun 29, 2009 12:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Question:
Game on the line, tying run at 3rd, less than 2 outs…who would you rather have at bat?
Yeah, me too. Bye, Fred.
"There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live - too rare to die."
by younghutch on Jun 29, 2009 1:04 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Question:
Game on the line, 9th inning, no outs, down by 1…who would you rather have at bat to start a rally?
Yay for OBP. :)
by Missing Barry on Jun 29, 2009 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Answer:
Shoot the hostage.
"There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live - too rare to die."
by younghutch on Jun 29, 2009 1:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fact: Joss Whedon co-wrote this script
by SoFa King Mike on Jun 29, 2009 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hot and cold streaks aside
No Question, Fred Lewis.
He is significantly less likely to make an out that Shierhotlz
by FairweatherFan on Jun 29, 2009 2:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hot and cold streaks aside No Question, Fred Lewis.
He is significantly less likely to make an out contact than Shierhotlz
"There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live - too rare to die."
by younghutch on Jun 29, 2009 3:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He is significantly less likely to make an out defensively than Shierholtz
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jun 29, 2009 3:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Significantly?
Shierholtz OBP ML Career (sss): 339 MiL: 355
Lewis OBP ML Career : 354 MiL: 381
and IMO, I think Nate has a better “2 strike approach”. Of course, I missed the game he swung at that one that hit him.
Plus Down by one, the power plays more. Down by 4, and it’s all about base runners.
co-dad of IshikaBOOM w/AfDC.
Ishikawa, let the boy hit against lefties.
by kennv on Jun 29, 2009 10:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Starting RF: Nate Schierholtz
Package Fred Lewis with a reliever and a pitching prospect for the bat we need.
If Winn goes to Altanta who plays CF if Rowand is injured?
Torres
Copeland
Timpner
Bueller
by wilriv21 on Jun 29, 2009 1:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Trick question – Rowand won’t get injured.
Sheesh.
But the answer to your question is, of course, Gary Matthews, Jr….(snurk)…(giggle)…(snort)…(bwahahahahahahahahaha). Sorry, I thought I could say that with a straight face.
"There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live - too rare to die."
by younghutch on Jun 29, 2009 1:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
/was going to respond, but broke hands crashing into a wall in gamerific fashion
Psycho killer, qu'est-ce que c'est?
by shikantaza on Jun 29, 2009 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why would Winn go to Atlanta? We’re not going to trade anyone significant if we’re in playoff contention. Just won’t happen.
by Hobbes2d on Jun 29, 2009 1:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Depends what you call significant.
102/115/136 in 61 P.A.’s vs LHP from a 35 year old should concern anyone. Not necessarily panic but it is a concern. He is still doing quite well vs RHP (313/369/445 this year compared to 290/349/421 career as left handed batter) so it is not like he is completely crashing. And how much longer at this current pace vs LHP before other teams see him as just a platoon player?
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I don’t like Winn hitting vs LHP this year, but he’s still a pretty important player to the Giants if they have any realistic hope of contending for a playoff spot.
Also even if he was hitting from both sides, Idk that he’d be all that attractive to a lot of other teams.
by Hobbes2d on Jun 29, 2009 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very good "D" can play all 3 outfield spots well. As long as the asking price is not out of hand contending teams like those kind of 4th outfielders. (see Kotsay ’08 for most recent example.) And that is not counting times like the Braves, or Cubs were one (or more) of the their starting 3 are having big issues.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 2:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If this team’s second-best hitter gets hurt, it doesn’t matter who the back-up is, the team isn’t going to make the playoffs.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
by cornball on Jun 29, 2009 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

These are my principles. If you don't like them, I have others. -Groucho Marx
by RDreamer on Jun 29, 2009 4:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Crap...
I just looked at stats over june (50 PA min)..
RK PLAYER…………… AB……2B…. HR…..RBI….BB BA OBP SLG OPS
1 Ichiro Suzuki……….104…….6………1…….. 2……4 .404 .431 .529 .960
2 Pablo Sandoval……87……..9………8…….18….11 .402 .465 .782 1.246
3 Scott Rolen………….78……..7………2…….11…..4 .397 .435 .564 .999
4 Nate Schierholtz…..56………4………3……. 8……2 .393 .417 .625 1.042
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 29, 2009 1:19 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Shiny!
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
by cornball on Jun 29, 2009 1:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bumgarner and Posey for Scott Rolen!
by pantalones on Jun 29, 2009 1:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You mean Scott Rowand, dontcha?
"There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live - too rare to die."
by younghutch on Jun 29, 2009 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Indeed
Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jun 29, 2009 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schierholtz
He’s younger, is a good defender and he’s younger.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
by cornball on Jun 29, 2009 1:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Nate
Nate hasn’t had the ABs that Lewis has had in the big leagues and I think we kind of know what we have in Freddie. With Nate…. who knows what we got unless we give him the same chance to be a full-time player that Lewis has had.
Would love to see an outfield of Bowker, Rowand, and Nate….. with Winn and Torres on the bench!
by OTTOMATIC on Jun 29, 2009 1:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I’d do something like this:
vs RHP: Bowker, Rowand, Winn
vs LHP: Torres, Rowand, Nate.
by Hobbes2d on Jun 29, 2009 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Vs tough RHP: Bowker, Winn, Nate – would be nice too
by OTTOMATIC on Jun 29, 2009 2:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schierholtz
He’s younger, he’s played on a big stage in Beijing, and he’s a twin for Randy Couture

"I think I was the best baseball player I ever saw." - Willie Mays
Tommy Lasorda is the Antichrist
by tommylasordaistheantichrist on Jun 29, 2009 1:50 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
No he isn’t
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
by Useful_Idiot on Jun 29, 2009 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They were born from the same womb at the same time. That’s a twin.

"I think I was the best baseball player I ever saw." - Willie Mays
Tommy Lasorda is the Antichrist
by tommylasordaistheantichrist on Jun 29, 2009 4:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Stop squinting.
Duane Kuiper: Hall Of Fame broadcaster.
by Johnny Disaster on Jun 29, 2009 4:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nope
I don’t see it
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
by Useful_Idiot on Jun 30, 2009 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schierholtz
I’m done with Lewis after he dropped that pop up against the Brewers. That was too much for me to handle.
by 49er16 on Jun 29, 2009 1:52 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Fred Savage Jerry Lewis:
http://www.whatdoestheinternetthink.net/index.php?s=fred+lewis&st=google
Nate Schierholtz:
http://www.whatdoestheinternetthink.net/index.php?s=nate+schierholtz&st=google
Barry Bonds:
http://www.whatdoestheinternetthink.net/index.php?s=barry+bonds&st=google
by DINGERS.EXE on Jun 29, 2009 1:59 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I've been swayed
I actually like the notion that Lewis can work a count, which is rare for this team. That’s his value to this team, but I’d be interested in knowing if anyone has looked up the average number of pitches per player (average of pitches Lewis sees versus the average Nate sees… Maybe even how many someone like Panda or Winn or Renteria sees).
I'm thinking but nothing's happening.
by JRPhillips on Jun 29, 2009 2:05 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Of course there is a fine line between the benefit of working a count and looking at a called strike three yet again (and yes, I’m looking at you, Fred Lewis).
"There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live - too rare to die."
by younghutch on Jun 29, 2009 2:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Personally, I’d trade either of them and doubt I’d suffer seller’s remorse. Therefore, Lewis’s K’s while taking additional pitches (maybe taking additional pitches?) seems slightly more valuable for this team.
I'm thinking but nothing's happening.
by JRPhillips on Jun 29, 2009 2:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Scaredy-circuit!
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
by Lyle on Jun 30, 2009 6:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Today's Line-up, thanks to Schulman
1. Rowand CF
2. Winn LF
3. Sandoval 3B
4. Molina C
5. Schierholtz RF
6. Renteria SS
7. Ishikawa 1B
8. Uribe 2B
9. Lincecum P.
by ryanmiles on Jun 29, 2009 2:16 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I don’t really know why Downs is sitting.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on Jun 29, 2009 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uribe is probably better.
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
by rotorueter on Jun 29, 2009 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’re probably right. 2B stinks on this team.
by xanthan on Jun 29, 2009 2:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought you were avoiding this thread!
Judgment Day is coming
comics | art | Nattowear
by Natto on Jun 29, 2009 2:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Eh. Dude is, sadly, scarily, hitting way over his head right now. I’d rather see what Downs can do.
Obviously neither of them is really a very good option.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on Jun 29, 2009 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
ZIPS thinks Uribe will maintain a 700+ OPS this year, even after the BABIP regression.
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
by rotorueter on Jun 29, 2009 2:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
prOPS has him at like .631.
I don’t know if that stat was like proven to be crappy or not though.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on Jun 29, 2009 2:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
prON has him at like 7 inches + this year
by jctGamer on Jun 29, 2009 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
prAWN has him in the ocean
GROUGTHINK ALERT
by groug on Jun 29, 2009 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
prOSTATE has him bringing up the rear
by Lars The Wanderer on Jun 29, 2009 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
outstanding.
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
by rotorueter on Jun 29, 2009 2:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
prOGRESSIVE has him a personalized insurance policy
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
by CB30 on Jun 29, 2009 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
prOZAC is unreliable, it makes Uribe seem better than he actually is.
by sayheybk on Jun 29, 2009 2:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I lead the league in
prOCRASTINATION.
But not prOCREATION, sadly
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
by Useful_Idiot on Jun 29, 2009 3:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He hit a homerun yesterday. I think you can do the math from here.
by ryanmiles on Jun 29, 2009 4:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Molina back at cleanup
Awesome. He totally deserves to hit there based on performance this year.
GROUGTHINK ALERT
by groug on Jun 29, 2009 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
needs more tenticals
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
by zenbitz on Jun 29, 2009 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

These are my principles. If you don't like them, I have others. -Groucho Marx
by RDreamer on Jun 29, 2009 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You feel like a 14 year old Japanese girl?
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 29, 2009 3:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A very sad 14 year old Japanese girl with luminous hair.
Duane Kuiper: Hall Of Fame broadcaster.
by Johnny Disaster on Jun 29, 2009 4:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except for Molina at cleanup, I dont mind this lineup. Well, move Renteria to 8th, and slide Ishi and Uribe up a slot. And I would like to add Albert Pujols also.
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
by CB30 on Jun 29, 2009 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't mind this lineup
Except for every single aspect of it.
"Are we bad? No. But right now, we are." Boulderskull, 4.16.09
by Kitspool on Jun 29, 2009 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m gonna go ahead and call a Bengie homer today while Yadier makes an error.
Mo'ped Money, Mo'ped Problems
by Scooter Ellis on Jun 29, 2009 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
nah and nah
Chris Dominguez: Bringing dingerz back to The Bay (In a while)
by CB30 on Jun 29, 2009 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hah, you’re a funny fella.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
by cornball on Jun 29, 2009 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Neither Do I
I like Uribe at second for the time being. Free swinger, makes dumb mistakes, but you feel more comfortable with him at the plate than Downs.
And I also vote for Schierholtz. I was rooting for Lewis in the beginning of the year and I want him to do well (great personality like the post said) but overall, you just feel Schierholtz offers more at the plate than Lewis can. Sure Lewis is more patient, but at times it gets the best of him and he’s backward K’ing before you know it.
by objesguy on Jun 29, 2009 3:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Molina back in the #4.
Again.
Still.
Forever and ever.
With out ever ending.
Can’t we try him in #5 and ride Nate’s hot(er) stick for a bit?
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure we can. Will we? No.
El Presidente Larry Baer's epitaph
"Nothing important ever happened without me."
by ResDog on Jun 29, 2009 2:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
/ CRIES!!!
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 2:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure we can try him, but he would probably get acquitted.
Forsan et haec olim meminisse iuvabit... Maybe.
by Mayor of 311 on Jun 29, 2009 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is that like a quitter?
Like stopping Molina from hitting #4 while he hits like a pitcher?
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t even remember what it’s like to have a legitimate 4 hitter
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
by Useful_Idiot on Jun 29, 2009 4:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for proving you are indeed full of shit Bochy. “Schierholtz is not a cleanup hitter but he’s our hottest guy and so I wanted him hitting after Pablo.” The next day Molina is back in the cleanup spot despite being arguably our worst hitter.
Fuck you Big Head.
by Hobbes2d on Jun 29, 2009 3:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well hell, why would you even put Molina-out-machine in between the 2 hottest hitters on the club? Does Botchy think good at bats will magically rub off on Molina? Or is it because him doesn’t wanna hurt da big ole catchers widdle feewings?
bat him 5th – when is he going to take those “days off” again?
by Merope on Jun 29, 2009 3:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So we can increase our GiDPs. We ae behind last year number and that must be fixed.
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on Jun 29, 2009 5:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
C’mon, it’s not like Schierholtz went 4 for 5 with a homer hitting cleanup or anything…
Meet my new son: Sundrendy Windster, coming soon to a minor league near you.
by EliminateMe on Jun 29, 2009 3:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It sure would be sweet if any Giant did
by wilriv21 on Jun 29, 2009 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I said Schierholtz
But that’s because I have no memory beyond the last month.
GROUGTHINK ALERT
by groug on Jun 29, 2009 2:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Grant, must I choose?
I was real excited when Lewis had his September call-up in 06. The stats say 5 for 11 but it impressed me way more than that after years of waiting. I want to keep him longer, and I wonder if the bunion is affecting how he moves and fields. And if it will ever get better, foot injuries never get a rest it seems. The lousy results against lefties are a real problem too.
As for having too many outfielders—remember, Nate can play thir rrrrr aaarrghh
/strangled by masked intruder leaping thru monitor/
cheering for Adam Witter, who will hit bigleague dingers some day.
Still yelling "Go, Antoan"
by foothillsfan on Jun 29, 2009 3:04 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
that is pretty impressive, you were able to type out what happened while dieing.
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 29, 2009 3:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We need a bunion expert. No podiatrists out there?
by m34josh on Jun 29, 2009 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
really
when it doubt, take the younger dude. I think the trade value of Fred Lewis is on the order of 2 or 3 boxes of batting practice baseballs, used, but hey, it’s your poll.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
by zenbitz on Jun 29, 2009 3:27 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Nate by a very small margin
But the problem is that you’re assuming that they have the same trade value. There’s no way that’s true – I’m sure that Nate and his shiny AVG would get us a lot more than Lewis.
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry.
:-(
by Cookyman on Jun 29, 2009 3:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Now look at me. I'm wet nurse to a last-place, dead-to-the-neck-up ball club, and I'm choking to death!
by zodiac_chiller on Jun 29, 2009 3:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Nate is The Balls.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
by cornball on Jun 29, 2009 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Big Hit + Defensive Presence = Nate
I’d take Schierholtz. Not because I undervalue OBP, but because the 2009 Giants have not had a problem with getting men on base – it’s been getting them in from 2nd, or even 3rd, that has been one of their most consistent obstacles thusfar. There have been far too many times where the Giant’s have lacked the ability to get the “Big Hit” that will break a game open. The ability to get hits and even put the ball in play is crucial to a team in that situation.
Also, Schierholtz’s superb defense is a huge plus for years to come. The combination of AT&T’s where-is-the-ball going to go right field fence and Winn’s likely impending trade/free agency/retirement makes Schierholtz more valuable to our team’s future. He has great speed, an even better arm, and, above all, has demonstrated his ability to be a defensive playmaker, making him an easy choice over Lewis in my mind.
Don’t get me wrong, I like Fred Lewis, but Schierholtz just seems to have all the tools the Giants need for the future.
by GrooveGiant on Jun 29, 2009 4:04 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
because the 2009 Giants have not had a problem with getting men on base
Wrong wrong wrong. They have been super LUCKY/CLUTCH (Clucky?) at getting their paltry few men on base home. This is why they are “overperforming” and such. They have the worse OBP in the majors (/checks… true), 3rd worst SLG, and 3rd worst ISO (SLG-AVG). They have scored 10 (BP) – 20 (BtBS) few runs than you would expect from their component stats.
The reason they don’t seem to get anyone home from 2nd or 3rd (or 1st) is because they make too many outs. Other than a HR (something they are also terrible at) you usually need 2-4 NON OUTS in an inning to score at least 1 run. So getting 1 guy on base is not enough… you need MULTIPLE men on base. Men on base/trys = OBP. Giants have bad OBP. Giants are bad at scoring runs. QED.
I know, back in 1968 you could get a single – steal second – 3rd on FC – Sac Fly/WP runs but that don’t cut it in 2009. Steroid ban or not.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
by zenbitz on Jun 29, 2009 4:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
the 2009 Giants have not had a problem with getting men on base
you are very wrong about that.
Randy Winn is in time out until his OBP gets back over .330.
by oldjacket on Jun 29, 2009 4:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Totally misspoken (err, mis-typed). The Giants have had a problem getting men on base, but have had more of a problem getting the big hit to bring those men home.
by GrooveGiant on Jun 29, 2009 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The problems are related, methinks.
The Giants have trouble getting hits —> the Giants have trouble getting hits with players in scoring position.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 29, 2009 6:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or, whatever jponry said right below this.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 29, 2009 6:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
As zenbitz said, I know it seems like the Giants get a ton of men on base and then never score, but the opposite is true. They don’t get many hitters on base but they’ve manage to convert the ones they do at a very good rate – I believe they’ve been the best clutch team in baseball so far this year.
OBP is definitely a huge need on the Giants.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on Jun 29, 2009 4:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t doubt you guys – that easily could just be the way it seems when watching :/
I’d love to see stats about them bringing guys at base in to score. Can anyone provide something like this?
by GrooveGiant on Jun 29, 2009 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, part of the thing is that, as fans, we expect them to get it done every time – especially those 3rd base less than 2 outs situations. But the fact is that even the best teams don’t get that done all the time (you want a shock? every teams’ fans think they’re the worst in the league at getting the run home in those situations precisely because they don’t get it done every time.)
in any case, as per Fangraphs, the Giants have a Clutch rating of 4.20 as a team this season – second in the majors only to the Tigers. Thanks to this, they’ve scored runs at a better rate than you would expect given the component statistics of the team.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on Jun 29, 2009 4:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s really interesting – thanks for the stat, jponry
by GrooveGiant on Jun 29, 2009 4:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Make it simpler - guess which team has the lowest BB in baseball?
The Giants.
Guess which Team has the lowest OBP in baseball? The Giants.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
by Aadik on Jun 29, 2009 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
which one do you trade?
Randy Winn.
Yes, I know veteran no-trade clause blah blah blah. Stop ruining my rosterbation fantasy.
I like Randy Winn. But put Nate in RF and send Winn somewhere for some not-horrible 1B or 2B (presumably with a bullpen guy and some money).
Let Fred and/or Bowker platoon/rotate with Torres. Send Molina away and let Pablo catch (and probably make all-star games) until someone else comes along in a year or two, at which point Ishi or Uribe gets dumped.
QED
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jun 29, 2009 4:22 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
There is something wrong with Fred's eyeballs or brain.
Fred Lewis’ vision is screwed up. He can’t “see ball hit ball.” Rather, he guesses on every pitch, and defaults to not swinging at all. This strategy has worked out OK thus far, but it clearly manifests itself as his high pitch per PA, his high BB rate, and his high Kc rate.
This, combined with his perceived Marvin Benarditis, make me believe that he suffers from poor vision, and make me want Nate to get the bulk of the at-bats and innings in LF.
Winn is another story…
by bondo on Jun 29, 2009 4:35 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think if that were true, he’d pretty much never even make contact with the ball. You can’t guess wildly at a pitch you’re having trouble seeing and hit with any kind of regularity.
Hi pitch counts, BB, and Ks are all indicative of his approach, which tends to be to hit almost exclusively to a very small strike zone. It has its upsides and its downsides.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 29, 2009 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shierholtz...
Catches the baseball! And he’s younger. And he’s shown already that he has better power than Lewis. Lewis is not a natural baseball player like Nate. Lewis is a converted baseball player so he does not have anywhere near the experience Shierholtz has playing the game.
Not jponry.
by jpo on Jun 29, 2009 5:03 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Joe Nathan was a shortstop before he was converted to be a pitcher. Brian Wilson has much more experience being a pitcher.
I don’t like your argument.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 29, 2009 6:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Truthfully, Randy Winn should be the one sitting
and I like the guy, but he really should be the 4th OF on this team. The Giants are dead-frigging last in OBP and BB in baseball – is taking away one of the few guys with patience (because Melonhead would never bench one of his beloved veterans) a particularly good idea? This team has been extraordinarily lucky in the “clutch”, and that’s likely to regress going forward; Fred losing AB’s will contribute to that.
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
by Aadik on Jun 29, 2009 5:17 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Gotta be Nate!
Oakland Raiders Fan
Golden State Warriors Fan
San Francisco Giants Fan
San Jose Sharks Fan
MMA Fan
USC Trojan Fan
by i love sports101 on Jun 29, 2009 5:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
schierholtz has the better facial furniture
it roams free, unfettered by vanity or razor, like a wolf on a moor.
this, incidentally, is the best way to judge a prospect.
by bobnothing on Jun 29, 2009 6:22 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Lewis has the better smile. If not for Lewis, the post-Bonds/Durham Giants would be without a genuine power-smiler. Just think about that.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 29, 2009 6:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The face of the post-Bonds Giants is Barry Zito’s blue steel.
by SeeingStars on Jun 29, 2009 10:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
BAM!

Judgment Day is coming
comics | art | Nattowear
by Natto on Jun 30, 2009 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
CALM EYES!!
Yes, This is still a 79 win squad.
Fuggen Rox! You might want to try beating The Bums more than once in 10 games. Try it. You might find you like it.
by daveinexile on Jul 1, 2009 7:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I love Fred
But I’m going for bigger risk/bigger upside with Nate.
Also, all you Fredophobes can STFU AND STFD.
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all
If Dustin Pedroia played in Seattle, not many people would be talking about him.
GET THAT VORP SH!T OUTTA HERE!!!
by baetown415 on Jun 29, 2009 9:43 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The guy I'd like to get rid of is Rowand
He had his hot streak for the season. An all lefty hitting outfield of Schierholtz in center, Lewis in Left, and Bowker in Right for next year. Randy at a much reduced rate could be the 4th outfielder, and and Stan Javier Jr. (Andres Torres) can be the defensive replacement if needed. Rowand would be a decent player on a team already loaded with better players, but on this team he is similar to guys who cost 1/25th of his salary. Same with Winn except, Winn is a second half player and a switch hitter. Rowand tends to be a May/June hitter.
by bradleybear on Jun 29, 2009 10:01 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
One more year of Bengie
I think we should sign Bengie to one more year before we let him go. He needs to play in fewer games, maybe 5 games a week instead of 6 or 7.
by bradleybear on Jun 29, 2009 10:03 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
It kind of feels like choosing between Terry Whitfield and Max Venable to me. I guess if Nate Schierholtz keeps being hot then he’s turned a corner. I feel like he’s been in and out of the Giants lineup for years though and has never done much.
by parisspleen13 on Jul 3, 2009 11:38 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

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