Post-Game Recap: The Gravitational Pull of a True .500 Team
by Grant Brisbee on Jun 16, 2009 10:03 PM PDT
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PrintSean O'Sullivan's game log, courtesy of First Inning:
I might have updated it on my own. And I'm not sure if that's 100% accurate, as I turned the game off to spend time with my loved ones.
So here again is the curse of the .500 team. Close to contention, periods of extended fail, and always the twain shall meet.
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I’d be very curious to see how well he does in his next start, when he’s facing an actual major league lineup.
Anagram of "knowing how to win" = WOW, I KNOW NOTHING
by Stuttering John Tamargo on Jun 16, 2009 10:07 PM PDT reply actions
His next start will be for AAA as he was sent down after the game. His teammates at Salt Lake City will ask how was it to face a major league team. O’Sullivan will say “Major League team?? I faced some team called the Giants”
“Apparently, in the majors your control doesn’t have to be all that good.”
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Tim tomorrow!
:\
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
Yeah, season five was pretty okay. It holds up well in reruns. I wouldn’t get this excited about it, though.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:41 PM PDT up reply actions
It also had the virtue of having the absolute best episode of anything ever.
Uncharacteristic for the show because it wasn’t remotely funny, but unbelievably amazing.
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which show is it you speak of?
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jun 17, 2009 7:55 AM PDT up reply actions
It’s a Firefly reference. It’s always a Firefly reference.
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I would just google Glory and Season Five. I think after doing that, it might dawn on you.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 17, 2009 11:53 PM PDT up reply actions
unrelated
some positives for the night – bowker just hit his 10th jack in the bottom of the ninth to tie the game vs the river cats.
Bad Sp, Bad offense, Bad Bad Bad
Miller did do a nice job in relief though
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jun 16, 2009 10:09 PM PDT reply actions
On the plus side, Timmy Day tomorrow. Downs looks pretty good, light years ahead of Burriss, and Alderson went 7 scoreless vs Trenton.
Seeing Downs last night was odd. Here comes this “older” prospect that has patience at the plate, seems to have reasonable power, good bat speed, and can play a little defense. Did he really come up through the Giants system ? I more used to scrap heap guys with serious flaws or one tool players like Velez.
Downs is not Chase Utley, but has performed at every level so far. Could be a useful piece like this former Giant whose career line is .257 / .329 / .403 / .733 / OPS+ 105 over eleven seasons with the Giants. Care to guess whom ?
"One percent of ballplayers are leaders of men. The other ninety-nine percent are followers of women."-John McGraw, NY Giants Baseball Club
My adopted son Matt Downs . Ranked as the 24th best prospect in the Giants farm system by Baseball America !!
WINNNER
"One percent of ballplayers are leaders of men. The other ninety-nine percent are followers of women."-John McGraw, NY Giants Baseball Club
My adopted son Matt Downs . Ranked as the 24th best prospect in the Giants farm system by Baseball America !!
This team gets very facepalmy on days when they lose.
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You had me at "blech"
Oh, you didn’t write “blech”? You should have; sums up this game in a single word. What a putrid performance.
Noonan. Nooooonan!
by Giant Fan in Singapore on Jun 16, 2009 10:16 PM PDT reply actions
Giants Score Run
Emmanuel Burriss continues hitless streak, ruining offense.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
There's 3 ways to do something: the right way, the wrong way, and the Max Power/ Ginats Way...
by natteringnabob on Jun 16, 2009 10:16 PM PDT reply actions
Also, a big F You to the A's
Noonan. Nooooonan!
by Giant Fan in Singapore on Jun 16, 2009 10:19 PM PDT reply actions
Yeah, that sucked.
I really find it bizarre and difficult to explain that the Giants become (even) worse offensively against lousy pitchers. It’s like some sort of (not) fun house.
Well, wouldn’t your confidence deflate if your teammate gives up 6+ runs in an inning, especially if the most overpaid one did the same thing the night before?
by SoFa King Mike on Jun 16, 2009 11:25 PM PDT up reply actions
It’s sad what will happen to this team when he turns back into Juan Uribe.
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It’s weird that the capital letters make so much of a difference, but they do.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Aaron Rowand's leadoff hitter shiny is rapidly fading
In the last four games, he’s 1 for 15 with 8 strike outs.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
and probably Whiteside
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jun 16, 2009 10:33 PM PDT up reply actions
MOARILIA!
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:23 PM PDT up reply actions
You meant to say NOMOARILIA ! correct ?
"One percent of ballplayers are leaders of men. The other ninety-nine percent are followers of women."-John McGraw, NY Giants Baseball Club
My adopted son Matt Downs . Ranked as the 24th best prospect in the Giants farm system by Baseball America !!
You make up weird slash and I don’t appreciate it.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 17, 2009 11:54 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m resigning myself to the fact that he’s just streaky. His streaks are long. And when they stink, they stink. But when they’re good, they’re kind of awesome.
But ohgodthesuckisawful.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:22 PM PDT up reply actions
whats frustrating to me is that lewis and winn have the same ops but lewis is benched and winn stays in no matter what. renteria has been almost as bad as burris but they panic with burris instead. molina has the 3rd worst obp in the game for qualified hitters, yet he still hits 4th. aurilia is done, yet he doesnt get cut. there’s just such a favoritism to savvy old crappy veterans that still reigns supreme within the organization.
I agree about Winn and Lewis, but demoting Burriss at this point isn’t “panic.”
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
That's where you are wrong
Both are doing worse than the vets, by a good margin:
Lewis since 5/26: .178/.213/.267/.479
Winn since 5/26: .250/.293/.353/.646
Burriss since 5/11: .188/.231/.228/.459
Renteria since 5/11: .245/.299/.274/.573
Even if I do it from the other’s worse perspective:
Lewis since 6/6: .111/.111/.167/.278 (that’s even worse than pitchers)
Winn since 6/6: .205/.256/.282/.538
Burriss since 6/2: .083/.105/.111/.216 (again, that worse than pitchers)
Renteria since 6/2: .268/.259/.286/.544
So I would not call it panic. Neither has hit particularly well since mid-April, with spurts of goodness sandwiched between lots of lousiness and end with putridness of sub-300 OPS. I mean, that is horrendous hitting, a hitter only has to hit .150 with singles to beat either of them.
Not that Renteria has been that good either, he’s looking like a bust right now, after having a decent April. But it appears that his physical problems is behind that. He was hitting .256/.336/.355/.691, not good but average for SS, when he missed a number of games due to injury. He has hit .247/.289/.270/.558 since then. It appears that the injury has affected him and he should really sit for a while and let it heal a bit more, his OPS just gets worse and worse since then.
Aurilia just had a horrendous April and first half of May. Since May 15th, he has hit .282/.349/.410/.759. If he didn’t start hitting in mid-May, I think he would have been released by the end of May, as that was lousy hitting, on par with the above: he was .152/.196/.152/.348 on May 14th.
Molina, well, really, we had no better candidates when the season started, and only recently has Sandoval look like he could take that spot and hold it without letting the pressure get to him. But he’s on such a nice streak, it would be a shame to swap them and see what happens. Still, I would have no problem if Sandoval started batting clean-up and Molina 5th, I would like to see that.
Adoptive parental unit of Ehire Adrianza.
Godfather of Travis Ishikawa.
"I'm really proud to be on this team." - Nate Schierholtz
"Woo hoo" - Tim "The Kid" Lincecum
"Let's go get them in 2009!" - The Kid
"He got his pitch; he did not miss it" - Cainer
"Kung Fu Panda don't get hurt" - Cainer
by obsessivegiantscompulsive on Jun 17, 2009 10:17 AM PDT up reply actions
The right answer (free from arbitrary end points) is that Randy Winn has both hit and fielded better than Fred Lewis. Though not by a whole bunch.
Randy Winn is going to catch that. And he'll do it real classy-like too.
I’d say fielded a lot better.
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Kevin Frandsen, come back!
regardless of who you put in LF
you’re going to get plus defense either way
That could still be debatable with Lewis I think. I’m aware of the stats, But also am aware of how those stats work and could have some flaws for a young player like that.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
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Kevin Frandsen, come back!
If they lose tommorrow with Lincecum against Palmer. I may have to kick some cute furry animals
The artist formerly known as Set-up man
Palmer’s undefeated this year. There’s only so much a team can do against a juggernaut like that.
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You certainly can’t defeat it. I mean, that flies in the face of everything “undefeated” stands for. Physics tells us it can’t happen. That, and chemistry.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:25 PM PDT up reply actions
There's precedent
Remember Lincecum v Livan?
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
uugh
When this offense is bad, It’s BAD.
Is it just a coincidence that this team seems to get routinely mystified by AAAA pitchers?
by FairweatherFan on Jun 16, 2009 10:38 PM PDT reply actions
Here's the list
Of pitchers that have beat us by allowing 2 or fewer runs this season with their respective season FIP’s.
Gallardo – 3.83
Young – 5.48 <—- WTF
Billingsley – 2.92
Stults – 4.2 <—- WTF
Davis – 4.78 <—- WTF
Marquis – 4.24 <—WTF
Dempster – 4.03
Jimenez – 3.34
Stults – 4.2 <- Again
Young – 5.48 <— Pwned Twice. How bad must he be in all of this other starts that he owned us twice and still has a horrible FIP?
Gaudin – 4.39 <- F this guy
Bell – hmm, he certainly didn’t start this game
White – 4.55 <- Who?
Carpenter – 2.87
West – 5.22 <—- Really?
Scherzer 3.97
A few good pitchers in here, but over all not exactly murders row…
by FairweatherFan on Jun 16, 2009 10:53 PM PDT up reply actions
More like Shoplifter's Row
Forsan et haec olim meminisse iuvabit... Maybe.
by Mayor of 311 on Jun 16, 2009 10:57 PM PDT up reply actions
“San Francisco Giants offense: Making AAAA pitchers look like aces since 2007!”
by deuce deuce on Jun 16, 2009 10:59 PM PDT up reply actions
So it was your fault.
New rule: mods can’t go to games.
by positiveuphemism on Jun 16, 2009 11:17 PM PDT up reply actions
McC Night At The Yard should be fun
Zach Duke will throw a no-hitter (it’d be a perfect game if kenshin showed up) and five separate Pirates will hit four homers each.
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Zach Duke will throw a no-hitter (it’d be a perfect game if kenshin showed up) andfivetwelve separate Pirates will hitfoursix homers each.
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all
If Dustin Pedroia played in Seattle, not many people would be talking about him.
speaking of which
when is it again? Goofus? The Diary went off the main page
Jonathan Sanchez. He's left-handed, like Barry Zito. His fastball breaks 80, unlike Zito.
They’ve won half of the games that I’ve been to this year.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:26 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m pretty much ready to send Sanchez down soon.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
He’s had exactly one start this year where he walked less than three guys.
This is bad.
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Never mind
He didn’t walk anyone tonight!
Good job, Jonathan!
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But he loves that show! John Stamos inspires him to always look his best.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:29 PM PDT up reply actions
He has to be hurt, right? I mean, I’m pretty confident that he’s just not this terrible. If there isn’t something wrong with him physically and if he’s not prone to performance exhancing anxiety attacks… well, then, I’m mystified by this run of shitpitch he’s participating in.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:28 PM PDT up reply actions
Tonight he wasn’t getting any swingthroughs on his fastball. For all the faults that Sanchez usually has, he’s been very consistent with that this year. I’d say that was the difference, but I couldn’t say why.
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I’d say that was the difference, but I couldn’t say why.
I couldn’t say why it happened. Clarity is good, I guess.
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His career ERA is over 5 and you think he might be hurt because of this start? Sanchez is always awful or semi-brilliant, usually awful.
I don’t remember him ever being as bad as the last few starts, though. Although that could just be my memory.
Also, I’ve been quite outspoken about thinking that his arm might explode after any given pitch.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 17, 2009 12:23 AM PDT up reply actions
he was good last year
very unlucky towards the end of last year but he was still very good.
He’s been a complete mess this year though.
Yeah, WBC
I was not happy that Sanchez decided to pitch for his country instead of for us. He had a great start to 2008, this was a pivotal year.
Adoptive parental unit of Ehire Adrianza.
Godfather of Travis Ishikawa.
"I'm really proud to be on this team." - Nate Schierholtz
"Woo hoo" - Tim "The Kid" Lincecum
"Let's go get them in 2009!" - The Kid
"He got his pitch; he did not miss it" - Cainer
"Kung Fu Panda don't get hurt" - Cainer
by obsessivegiantscompulsive on Jun 17, 2009 10:20 AM PDT up reply actions
Or maybe people are just way too high on Sanchez and don’t want to admit that maybe he just isn’t up to snuff.
I don't think there's anyone who won't admit that he MIGHT not be up to snuff
It’s people who say he sucks who have already cast judgment.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
It’s never been about him being up to snuff. It’s always been about the possibility that he’ll harness his stuff one day.
Right now, he seems to be moving in the opposite direction, and that is fairly alarming.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 17, 2009 11:55 PM PDT up reply actions
WBC
It’s gotta be.
(I hope)
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
I BLAME THE WBC FOR EVERYTHING
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If this is true
(and I’m not in any way implying that it’s not) then what does it say about the A’s?
by paboperfecto on Jun 17, 2009 8:28 AM PDT up reply actions
Pablo Sandoval singled in the second for San Francisco’s first hit off O’Sullivan and a career-best 10-game hitting streak, but the first baseman also committed three errors in the first three innings—including two on Izturis’ chopper to start the third. Abreu singled home Izturis moments later for a 2-0 Angels’ lead.
"That’s probably more an aberration than anything," manager Bruce Bochy said. "He’ll play third base tomorrow."
If Aurilia’s at 1B, I might hurt somebody.
I’m hoping for Ishikawa, mostly because I miss him swinging and missing at curveballs aimed at his feet.
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And then walking back to the dugout looking like he’s holding back tears.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 16, 2009 11:33 PM PDT up reply actions
It’s at the bottom of the game story, so in case you miss it: Bruce Bochy said Pablo Sandoval would start at third base in Wednesday’s series finale, with Travis Ishikawa probably at first base.
by deuce deuce on Jun 16, 2009 11:47 PM PDT up reply actions
All hail Travis's return!
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
Yeah!
He has been hitting .386/.471/.500/.971 since the threat to sit him.
He has hit .333/429/.500/.929 since he had to sit so that Sandoval could turn his bat into a hitting machine.
Hopefully he can keep up the good hitting.
Adoptive parental unit of Ehire Adrianza.
Godfather of Travis Ishikawa.
"I'm really proud to be on this team." - Nate Schierholtz
"Woo hoo" - Tim "The Kid" Lincecum
"Let's go get them in 2009!" - The Kid
"He got his pitch; he did not miss it" - Cainer
"Kung Fu Panda don't get hurt" - Cainer
by obsessivegiantscompulsive on Jun 17, 2009 10:23 AM PDT up reply actions
this comment is useless without plate appearances
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
Probably.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 17, 2009 12:24 AM PDT up reply actions
Lineup Prognostication for tomorrow
1. Torres CF
2. Renteria SS
3. Winn LF
4. Sandoval 3B
5. Schierholtz RF
6. Ishikawa 1B
7. Whiteside C
8. Downs 2B
Brand new adoptive daddy for the Big Unit. Congrats go out to my son for his 300th win. Only 211 more wins until he catches Cy Young!
or rather today
Brand new adoptive daddy for the Big Unit. Congrats go out to my son for his 300th win. Only 211 more wins until he catches Cy Young!
by Speedforthewin on Jun 17, 2009 5:15 AM PDT up reply actions
Suck it Martin Dodger fan
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jun 17, 2009 7:55 AM PDT up reply actions
….Huh? Is this a taunt? At least taunt us about something that’s currently happening.
How long did it take for you to think of that joke?
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As long as I angered one Giants fan’s day, my job is complete.
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Me – 1, Giants – 0. Game, set, match
We’d troll Tru Blu, but no one would notice
by Lars The Wanderer on Jun 17, 2009 5:02 PM PDT up reply actions
On behalf of sane and coherent Dodger fans
I apologize…I honestly don’t know what joke he was trying to make above.
When “go ahead and ban me” is in your opening post to the site, that’s not a good start.
We’re all fans of baseball, so there’s no reason we can’t get along. Go Dodgers.
by Eric Stephen on Jun 17, 2009 6:03 PM PDT up reply actions
It’s okay. How much can you really expect out of a Bruin?
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 17, 2009 11:57 PM PDT up reply actions
That was a joke. I actually kind of like UCLA. Their student body is to Cal as A’s fans are to the Giants.
It’s kind of cute!
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 17, 2009 11:58 PM PDT up reply actions
Boldness?
What we’re really seeing here is a team with no decent 4 or 5 starter, and no major league offense to speak of. It’s scary to think what this team would be like if it had a 4 and 5 starter with real stuff and a little bit of control, and at least a corner infielder and corner outfielder with 25-HR, 90-RBI production.
If the Giants are really in the mood to continue their “boldness” streak, may I suggest:
1. Send Sanchez down for the rest of the season to regain a noggin and build up some offseason trade value;
2. Trade Rowand now before his slump destroys his remaining trade value for the year;
3. Bring up one of the kids for the Number 4 starter slot, and move Zito to #5 where his suckitude belongs;
Last night’s game, namely Pablo’s errors and Bochy’s subsequent moving of him back to 3B only highlights the Giants’ real problem with him: he isn’t cut out to be a corner infielder and the only place for him is at a spot already earmarked for Buster Posey, perhaps as early as next year. Putting Pablo at 3B and returning Travis to 1B is just another band-aid borne out of lack of other good options.
Despite this recent good romp through less-than-stellar competition only glosses over the ongoing problem: they have only 3 good starters, sometimes less if the Unit has a bad day, and not a single consistent hitter who can do damage day in and day out, except two guys who play the same position (Molina and Pablo). And did I mention that Richie is still on the roster to pop up with men on base?
If the team envisions itself as a wild-card competitor this year, the only way to ensure it is for Sabean to make a series of trades before the pack drives up the price, to get them corner infield and outfield bats. And yet I don’t think he will, unless it will be to rent someone like Huff or Beltre, who would cost them a young pitcher or two (Pucetas/Sosa), a deal that probably should not be made.
Matt Cain's drinking buddy
I think you're freaking out a bit
Zito has pitched pretty well overall this year. Last start was a bit of an an aberration from the rest of the year. Yeah, he makes lots o’ money, but he’s pretty okay as a 4th starter. Without looking at any data, I would also presume that Sanchez is about average for a 5th starter. The problem is that many Giants fans get used to Lincecum and Cain, and also realize that every day, every pitcher has to pitch well for this team to win the game. I think it just might be time for Sanchez to be sent down to the minors for a stint, but I would disagree that their 4th and 5th starters are not decent.
Rowand is not going to be traded, especially in this economy, unless the Giants eat the contract. Just because he’s had a hot streak does not mean teams are going to be that interested. Get used to seeing the guy in CF, he’s going to be there a while.
RE: Pablo…yes, the Giants certainly have a corner IF problem, but unless you want to try Posey at a different position, they have no choice but to plug Pablo in one of them. And last night aside, he’s played pretty decently at third.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jun 17, 2009 9:01 AM PDT up reply actions
UTG, Sanchez is not
above average for a 5th starter. Even #5 starters don’t get shelled before the 5th inning to the tune of 5-7 runs. Zito on the other hand, over the course of a season is producing at a level consistent with a #5 starter, notwithstanding the stupid contract.
As far as Pablo is concerned, the other choice they have which you didn’t mention is to trade Molina and plug Pablo in behind the plate for the remainder of the season, something they would only do if they make a deal or two for corner infield rentals to offset the loss of Molina’s run production.
Matt Cain's drinking buddy
to be fair...
I didn’t say he was above average for a 5th starter, I said he was average…I could be wrong, of course, but I have a tough time thinking of other 5th starters around the league that have better stuff and have been consistently better than him.
Even if Molina is traded, that still poses a problem for subsequent years and how to deal with him and Posey. One of them is going to have to play a position other than C. I’d prefer it be Posey, as Pablo’s long-term health would probably be better served at C [BODY BIAS], but because of his high-prospect status, will probably get to play the position he wants and is comfortable with. I guess they could trade one of the two, but the team is so starved for hitting that it would seem counterproductive to get rid of one, unless you can trade hitter-for-hitter at different positions.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jun 17, 2009 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions
UTG, you are correct,
you didn’t say “above average”; my apologies to you.
As for the Molina situation, I’ll defer to you and others about what he would bring back to the Giants in picks as a Type A, notwithstanding the arbitration pitfalls that await them, since Molina may not be wild about leaving. I totally agree with you about Pablo and Posey, and note that Posey has already demonstrated the ability to play infield positions well enough, with a gun for an arm. The conventional thinking seems to be that Posey needs to work his way up and through Fresno to learn now to call a game behind the dish (to the degree any catcher actually calls a game these days) before coming to SF. This problem would evaporate should he be slotted for an infield position instead and Pablo be plugged into C right away.
I think the Giants may take a long, hard look at putting Pablo behind the dish in 2010 and bringing Posey (and his bat) up to the bigs next year at an infield slot (3B). That wouldn’t stop them from renting corner infield help this year to get the wild card slot, and then reaping whatever pick they can from the departing rental(s).
Matt Cain's drinking buddy
Where are you getting your numbers?
The Hardball Times did a study to determine what the average #4 and #5 starters look like. The #4 starter had an ERA in the high 4’s from what I remember, and that is where Zito is right now. And that does not represent his season very well, he was one of the better starters in the rotation for a good stretch from mid-April to until recently.
Likewise, I recall that #5 starters in that study had ERA in the 5’s and 6’s. Sanchez is right in the mix. You harp on him right after his poor outing, but almost every pitcher has a bad outing like this every season. And if you check other team’s worse starter, I doubt that Sanchez is that much worse than most other team’s #5 starter.
Besides, we don’t have anyone really ready to come up. We lost Misch, and while Pucetas could come up, it would be better if he just sat in AAA until September. If Martinez was well, he could have been an option, but he’s not well yet. And I don’t think Sadler is ever going to amount to much, either as starter or reliever, if he hasn’t figure it out over the past couple of years, I don’t see him doing it this season.
I think that the Giants best move is the one intimated by Baggerly the other day, skip Sanchez’s rotation spot once or twice, give him so time to work on things plus get his head straight, then give it another go at it. That helped Cain clear his head. If he’s regressing even more by the ASG, then we should look to optioning him down.
Adoptive parental unit of Ehire Adrianza.
Godfather of Travis Ishikawa.
"I'm really proud to be on this team." - Nate Schierholtz
"Woo hoo" - Tim "The Kid" Lincecum
"Let's go get them in 2009!" - The Kid
"He got his pitch; he did not miss it" - Cainer
"Kung Fu Panda don't get hurt" - Cainer
by obsessivegiantscompulsive on Jun 17, 2009 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions
You forgot secret option #3
BRING UP WHEELER
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on Jun 17, 2009 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions
OSG, a team
in a wild card race with little consistent offense cannot afford for its #5 pitcher to go out and throw batting practice every fifth day, and that’s what Sanchez is doing lately.
Unfortunately, as Baggarly pointed out today, Sanchez is out of options (thanks to the way Sabean handled him), and they are stuck with him on the major league roster. Since Sanchez doesn’t have the mental toughness to get over this without getting a little distance from it, we’re stuck with him as a long reliever or off-and-on #5 starter the rest of the season. And if you are tossing away a win every fifth day, you are putting too much pressure on your 1 and 2 guys.
And please spare me the stats on Zito’s season so far. When he posts those numbers consistently against teams in the upper half of the division, then let’s talk about it.
Matt Cain's drinking buddy
in a wild card race with little consistent offense cannot afford
the offense isn’t “not consistent” it’s BAD. And that’s not Sanchez’ fault. Obviously, if there was some Zito-clone that could replace his innings that would be an improvement.
But complaining about your 5th starter is a little silly. Everyone’s 5th starter is bad… otherwise, they would be 4th starters.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
Even #5 starters don’t get shelled before the 5th inning to the tune of 5-7 runs.
Um, this happens to aces at times.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
Dirty
Regarding Sanchez’s suck, couldn’t it simply be a case of pitcher who struggles to get his mind right on a good day reacting to the fact that his name has been swirling around the trade-bait stratosphere for the past three weeks? He’s probably pissed at the Brass and pissed at himself and unable/incapable of settling in and doing his job.
I don’t know what the answer is, but, considering the situation, it makes some sense that he’s been awful of late.
Pablo's not fat. He's just got body.
by LeMasterBlaster on Jun 17, 2009 9:13 AM PDT reply actions
No
Sanchez is a pitcher who does not give his chance a team to win that often. In his last 10 starts the Giants are 2-8. Not so good. Since there is no value in trading Sanchez the Giants should send him down to AAA. The Giants can then either promote another pitcher, trade or select one off the FA list to give a better opportunity to win every fifth day.
While in AAA Sanchez can work on his command and mental approach to the game.
I missed the game but Kruk on the radio this morning called out Sanchez for not fighting through his struggles during last night’s game, specifically mentioning a ball just past the pitcher’s mound that Dirty half-heartedly reached for (and missed). Kruk said the worst thing a pitcher can do is act like he doesn’t want to be on the mound, or like he expects not to make another start, because then he loses his teammates. Kruk’s been on his case all season for his lack of mental makeup.
"Are we bad? No. But right now, we are." Boulderskull, 4.16.09
I honestly don’t usually buy into criticism about a player not caring, etc… but Sanchez honestly looks like he doesn’t give a shit 75% of the time.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
Gumby shoulders when someone takes him deep, half-hearted stabs at comebackers, not giving a stank-eye to the Blue when he doesn’t get a call, * no fist pumps after striking someone out-
Did I miss any ?
"One percent of ballplayers are leaders of men. The other ninety-nine percent are followers of women."-John McGraw, NY Giants Baseball Club
My adopted son Matt Downs . Ranked as the 24th best prospect in the Giants farm system by Baseball America !!
Thinks 7 walks in 5 innings is worthy of *thumbs up!
Randy Winn is going to catch that. And he'll do it real classy-like too.
Kruk may be right on this one. Sanchez just looks distracted and not invested in the game. There was some discussion above about whether Sanchez has some injury to explain his crappy performance. I don’t think it’s physical at all – he really doesn’t have his head in the game. So yeah – maybe he needs some time in Fresno to get his head on straight. He’s not doing the team any favors by trudging out to the mound every fifth day and not giving a shit.
It's my blarg! Quick Pitch
by can of corn on Jun 17, 2009 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions
Are you Steve Phillips?
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 17, 2009 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions
That’s the defensive wall we humans put up when we feel we are imminently in danger of losing our jobs. Kruk also said this morning that Sanchez looks like someone who is just waiting for the hammer to fall. Sanchez is expecting to get yanked, demoted, shipped off, traded… etc…
That could very well be the reason, but to be honest, I expect a professional athlete to still try to look like he gives a damn about what he’s doing. If he is expecting to get yanked or demoted, maybe the professional athlete’s competitive nature would prompt him to work harder to counter that. If he thinks he’s going to get traded, maybe he’d like to show potential suitors that he’s ctually interested in playing the game.
And if he can’t do these things, then maybe he doesn’t have the stuff of a professional athlete. He’s certainly not a 5th starter.
It's my blarg! Quick Pitch
by can of corn on Jun 17, 2009 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions
hopefully there’s some sort of mentor type around for Sanchez, someone who understands how to talk to him. Otherwise we have another case of great potential gone awry.
So Sanchez=Estes?
Yeah, I’d say that the potential for that is pretty good.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's [no, make that Rowand's] contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
That may be a good comparison, actually. I’ll have to take a closer look at that one.
It's my blarg! Quick Pitch
by can of corn on Jun 17, 2009 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions
line up
CF Torres
SS Renteria
LF Winn
C Molina
3B Sandoval
RF Schierholtz
1B Ishikawa
2B Downs
P Lincecum
what’s it going to take for Sandoval to bat 3rd or 4th? We should be trying to get him as many ABs as possible
+ (to the MF'n) 1
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jun 17, 2009 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions
But Winn’s our best pure hit….I think I just peed a little.
by Bay Area Sports Guy on Jun 17, 2009 11:49 AM PDT up reply actions
He had Sunday off, and only played half a game on Monday.
Randy Winn is going to catch that. And he'll do it real classy-like too.
he’s going to be very well rested
Randy Winn is going to catch that. And he'll do it real classy-like too.
I need to start resting more.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 17, 2009 11:59 PM PDT up reply actions
ugh the Lakers victory parade is on tv right now
I’m going to be sick
The East LA fans are always up to a good ’ol hearty celebratory riot
Giant Dirtbags: John Bowker, Steve Hammond. MIA List: Todd Jennings, Brian Anderson
Wronghanded Affeldt pitches right
by Giant among Angels on Jun 17, 2009 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions
Anything sweet and innocent is fair game!
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on Jun 17, 2009 11:31 AM PDT up reply actions
What do you guys think about dynamic pricing?
$24 for bleacher seats (which turn into $30+ after “convenience fees”)?!?!
I love Lincecum as much as the next fan’s girlfriend, but WTF?
by Bay Area Sports Guy on Jun 17, 2009 11:50 AM PDT reply actions
I think it’s okay. Gets us non-Timmy games mid-week for a good price.
It's my blarg! Quick Pitch
by can of corn on Jun 17, 2009 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I got to see a day game against the Nats for $8 this season, but I just wonder where it’s all going. Does this mean if the team contends for the playoffs all the prices are going to get jacked up in September? My guess is yes.
by Bay Area Sports Guy on Jun 17, 2009 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions
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