Matt Cain is finally figuring it out
by UnleashTheGore on May 8, 2009 8:45 AM PDT
127 comments
Matt Cain: Home-grown pitcher. Lover of the chick-flick. Favorite of the McCoven. Congratulations, you seem to be figuring it out, in this, your fourth full year in the big leagues.
The morning boys on KNBR today said it so eloquently...you're pitching like you're 34 instead of 24. No longer are you succumbing to the grip of defeat in each game. No longer do you infect your teammates with the low-run-scoring disease that becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy for each start. You, sir, have elevated your game and have learned how to win!
I mean, look at your stats. Not only are you dominating the most telling statistic of all--the winning percentage--but your ERA is over a run lower than the last two years! It does not matter that most every other statistic thrown out there by the Saber-goobs shows you being about the same as the past couple years or a little worse. You are figuring it out. You have finally become a gamer.
So, to the McCoven, I ask you: how is it that Cain has reached new levels in his game and learned how to become a winner? Was it hanging out with the reigning Cy Young award winner, who showed him what it takes to win a game? Or was it Zito, the obviously superior pitcher who found a way to win more games than him last year, that taught him the way out of being just a #3 starter? Please, share your insights.
(Or, just consider this a "praise be to Matt Cain for finally getting some wins behind this friggin offensive juggernaut of a team" thread)
This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.
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is it bad that I’m actually worried about him? D:
BB-rate up to 4.5 now and his K-rate down to 6.6…
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 8:47 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I was actually...
going to post the exact same thing :-(
Flossing a dead horse
by kenshin1 on May 8, 2009 8:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He stopped walking people in the last couple of innings yesterday and got more Ks… obviously he has figured something out and will fix his peripherals now. :D? :D?
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 8:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
7 of his 19 walks have come in 4 innings.
I’m hoping it’s just early season troubles but really I’m not sure.
by superk1ng on May 8, 2009 8:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think he had some problems with a lot of walks early on last season too… and then he sort of found it at some point. Hopefully the same thing happens this year.
Yeah, 29:23 K/BB ratio in April last year and then 157:68 the rest of the year. So. Let’s hope the same holds true this year (I know it’s May already SHUT UP)
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 9:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah. He was literally one pitch away from disaster yesterday when Helton hit into that DP. Is this the new mature Matt Cain, or did he just get lucky there? Certainly the guy has had more than his share of bad luck the last couple of years, so maybe it’s just luck evening out, as he’s now getting the big out and actually getting some runs to work with. So far this year it looks like Zito is the tough luck pitcher, as he has three consecutive starts where he’s carried shutouts into at least the seventh inning, and didn’t get a single win. I’d wait about a month or two before we can tell if it’s a newer, better Matt Cain.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
by rxmeister on May 8, 2009 9:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe the pitch to Helton in the first was a 3-1 breaking ball. Helton was way off balance on the swing. Of course, when you can’t throw a fastball for a strike you might as well try a breaking ball.
We're all basically Pedro Feliz.
by SF Pete on May 8, 2009 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Only really listened to that inning...
but Miller made it sound like he was throwing a lot of curveballs, and that they were the pitches he was especially having difficulty locating.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on May 8, 2009 10:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s exactly what was happening. He’s gotten into a bad habit where he tries to start nearly every batter with a gimme curve-ball. He was missing badly with those early on and had some problems with his fastball, as well (though not as drastic). When he tightened up on that curve, things started to go better for him.
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When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
by cornball on May 8, 2009 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Changeup
According to Baggs it was a change:
Molina thought the biggest pitch of the game was the 3-1 changeup Cain threw to get Todd Helton to ground into a double play in the first inning.
"He was looking fastball and it fooled him," Molina said. "One of the few times."
Meet my new son: Sundrendy Windster, coming soon to a minor league near you.
by EliminateMe on May 8, 2009 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, it could have been. it looked like it broke in a little but Helton was way out in front of it.
We're all basically Pedro Feliz.
by SF Pete on May 8, 2009 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, his walk rate really seems like the product of a few flukey innings and SSS.
Randy Winn is going to catch that. And he'll do it real classy-like too.
by oldjacket on May 8, 2009 9:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
HE HAD NO CURVEBALL CONTROL
It was all over the place
He was pitching with basically a Fastball all day
Pretty impressive performance without a full bag of tricks
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by merkin on May 8, 2009 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
My first comment was by eye, now here are some stats FWIW
Brooks Pitch FX Tool
For what its worth
20 Curveballs = 7 Strikes
11 Changeups = 3 Strikes
65 Fastballs = 43 Strikes
5 Sliders = 4 Strikes
Tommy Lasorda HATES GIANTSBOARD.COM
Cut and Pasted Blog redundancy can be a good thing
Say Hey! Say Who? Say Willie, that Giant Kid is Great!
by merkin on May 8, 2009 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's make you worrieder
Average fastball velocity, past 4 years:
2006: 93.4 MPH
2007: 93.2 MPH
2008: 92.4 MPH
2009: 91.5 MPH
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 8, 2009 8:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
DIALING IT BACK FOR BETTER CONTROL
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on May 8, 2009 8:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
CRYING AND LAUGHING AT THE SAME TIME
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 8:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He was popping 95 when he needed to yesterday
Tommy Lasorda HATES GIANTSBOARD.COM
Cut and Pasted Blog redundancy can be a good thing
Say Hey! Say Who? Say Willie, that Giant Kid is Great!
by merkin on May 8, 2009 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Aired it out towards the end of the game
Tommy Lasorda HATES GIANTSBOARD.COM
Cut and Pasted Blog redundancy can be a good thing
Say Hey! Say Who? Say Willie, that Giant Kid is Great!
by merkin on May 8, 2009 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are those variations in speed as huge as they look?
Going from a 92 mph fastball to 74 mph offspeed that consistently seems like it would be really nasty.
Meet my new son: Sundrendy Windster, coming soon to a minor league near you.
by EliminateMe on May 8, 2009 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cain did throw more curveballs than usual yesterday, but most pitchers probably look like something similar.
For example, here’s a graph of Lincecum from his 1506 pitch complete game last season.
Lot’s of heat, but some variation, too.
by xanthan on May 8, 2009 4:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nasty yes
But those are Curveballs, and I personally think Curveballs are easier distinguish than a change up….
Lets say you have 92MPH Heat
Would you rather have
a 75 MPH change
or
a 75 MPH curve
The curve would be nasty, but the change would be virtually unhittable
IMHO
Tommy Lasorda HATES GIANTSBOARD.COM
Cut and Pasted Blog redundancy can be a good thing
Say Hey! Say Who? Say Willie, that Giant Kid is Great!
by merkin on May 8, 2009 4:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
With a good enough change, the batter basically needs to predict it coming before the release.
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by Useful_Idiot on May 10, 2009 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He can still pop the glove when he wants to (“reach back velocity”), but I think he’s realizing that locating the pitch more effective, as well as changing speeds with the fastball.
As Krukow would say, he’s learning how to pitch instead of just throw.
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on May 8, 2009 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He’s not really locating the pitches any better, just throwing slower. He already took a mile of his fastball last year, and it didn’t help either. If anything, it looked to me like yesterday Cain was trying to be more accurate, but after a couple of inning gave up and just started throwing hard like he used to. And it worked.
Matt Cain career numbers**:
When contact is made: .300/.293./.481, .330 wOBA.
When contact is not made: .000/.348./.000, .251 wOBA.
Basically, he’s an average pitcher when contact is made, and a ridiculously good one when it isn’t. Sure, pitching for contact will help him go deeper into starts, but is it really worth such a huge drop in his production?
I don’t particularly care if he’s pitching or throwing, I only care about results. If you have swing-through stuff, and we know that Cain does, in my opinion you should pitch for the strikeout. If you let batters hit the ball, bad things will eventually happen.
**I did the numbers by myself, based on BBR’s splits, but I’m pretty sure they’re accurate.
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 8, 2009 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Interestingly, I also hold batters to a career .000 average when contact is not made.
Barry Zito: Mike Hampton with a guitar
by JakeS on May 8, 2009 4:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey Cooky
Interesting, but let’s look a little closer
I think we can all agree that Greg Maddux was a very good pitcher.
Additionally, he was never famous for striking people out.
Let’s Compare
Cain
When contact is made: .300/.293./.481
When contact is not made: .000/.348./.000
Maddux
When contact is made: .305/.302./.436
When contact is not made: .000/.252./.000
Nothing magic happens when hitters make contact off Maddux.
When contact is made, they look comparable with the exception of slugging.
Not bad considering Maddux is a difficult comparison.
Where Maddux trumps Cain is when contact is not made, due to Maddux’s low walk totals.
For added fun lets look at Clemens….
Clemens
When contact is made: .307/.305./.459
When contact is not made: .000/.271./.000
Really, what its looking like the old Voros “Smoking” McCracken dealio….
What I think we should be saying is…..
Cain is poor when hitters aren’t making contact
If pitching to contact leads to a better K/BB ratio, then it’s worth it
If pitching to contact leads to a worse K/BB ratio, then it’s not worth it
I omitted wOBA, as my figures aren’t matching yours for some reason
Tommy Lasorda HATES GIANTSBOARD.COM
Cut and Pasted Blog redundancy can be a good thing
Say Hey! Say Who? Say Willie, that Giant Kid is Great!
by merkin on May 8, 2009 4:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cain is poor when hitters aren’t making contact
If “poor” means “not as good as Clemens or Maddux”, then there are a whole lot of poor pitchers around the league. Like, all of them.
If pitching to contact leads to a better K/BB ratio, then it’s worth it
Pitching to contact always leads to a 0/0 K/BB. Since every pitcher is much better when contact isn’t made, doesn’t it just mean that pitching to the strikeout should always be the goal? Or would it increase the pitch count so much that it wouldn’t be effective? I don’t have answers, I’m just wondering.
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 8, 2009 5:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If "poor" means "not as good as Clemens or Maddux", then there are a whole lot of poor pitchers around the league. Like, all of them.
Don’t have time to run the stats, but this is basically just K/BB ratio in a different form with a little HBP thrown in
K/BB Ratio 3:1 ~ 0.250
K/BB Ratio 2:1 ~ 0.333
K/BB Ratio 1:1 ~0.500
So in 2008 the NL has a ratio of 2.03
That works out to about 0.327 OBP when no contact is made
So that would make Cains K/BB ratio below average
Pitching to contact always leads to a 0/0 K/BB
If taken to the extreme, yes
So let me elaborate a little
….if pitching to contact leads to a decrease in walks that not offset by strikeouts in such a way that it leads to a worse K/BB ratio…it is worth it
Tommy Lasorda HATES GIANTSBOARD.COM
Cut and Pasted Blog redundancy can be a good thing
Say Hey! Say Who? Say Willie, that Giant Kid is Great!
by merkin on May 8, 2009 5:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
….if pitching to contact leads to a decrease in walks that not offset by strikeouts in such a way that it leads to a worse K/BB ratio…it is worth it
Well that’s not really pitching to contact, it’s just having better control. To me, pitching to contact means giving up on the strikeout and just making sure the batter put the ball into play.
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 8, 2009 5:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
thats just a question of definition
If pitching to contact means decreasing Strike Outs without decreasing walks, then no one would ever want to “pitch to contact”
Tommy Lasorda HATES GIANTSBOARD.COM
Cut and Pasted Blog redundancy can be a good thing
Say Hey! Say Who? Say Willie, that Giant Kid is Great!
by merkin on May 8, 2009 7:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Average Swing through stuff, past 4 years
2006 : 2
2007 : 1
2008 : 0
2009 : -48273428
by jctGamer on May 8, 2009 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
New Stat: STS
What’s the league average?
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by Useful_Idiot on May 10, 2009 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You beat me to the punch
Last night the boyfriend IMed me to say “Matt Cain is great but he walks too many people.”
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on May 8, 2009 8:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’re dating Dave Righetti???
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
by Lyle on May 9, 2009 8:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nolan Fucking Ryan walked people! Relax.
My ROCKIE HATRED is rapidly approaching my DODGER HATRED
by NuschlerFace on May 8, 2009 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course they walked peopel they were pre occupied by the fucking
Minor White > Ansel Adams
by say hey nation on May 8, 2009 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That does kind of sound like a dude on dude porn title.
STOP TALKING ABOUT MATT CAIN'S SUPPOSED SHORTCOMINGS! HE'S A BAD ASS THAT 29 OTHER TEAMS WOULD KILL FOR!!!
by NuschlerFace on May 8, 2009 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
and Nolan’s winning percentage was barely over .500. Clearly Nolan was not much of a winner either.
We're all basically Pedro Feliz.
by SF Pete on May 8, 2009 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nolan Ryan...
while great was also HUGELY overrated because he walked people.
Flossing a dead horse
by kenshin1 on May 8, 2009 10:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
umm…hell no!
Adoptive Parent of Francisco Peguero. He can throw, he can run, he can hit(fastballs), and he's Dominican. What else do you need to know?
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by haverecords on May 8, 2009 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, he was.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 12:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m never buying this stathead meme that Ryan was overrated. I’ve heard way too many former players say he was the toughest AB they ever had. A lot of batters just stuck the bat out there and hoped for the best…or kept the bat on their shoulder and hoped for the best.
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on May 8, 2009 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thank you.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on May 8, 2009 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cal Ripken was overrated…..
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Cut and Pasted Blog redundancy can be a good thing
Say Hey! Say Who? Say Willie, that Giant Kid is Great!
by merkin on May 8, 2009 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Randy Winn is not rated
Robby Thompson "hey Hinshaw, let me see your hat for a minute."
Alex HInshaw "Why?"
Robby Thompson ,"You'll see...."
by LargeFarva on May 9, 2009 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No one’s saying he wasn’t good, but people put him in the running for “BEST PITCHER EVER!!” and that’s just not anywhere near the case.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But there’s a difference between being tough and being effective. If I were a batter, I’d much rather face Bert Blyleven than Ryan, but Blyleven was clearly a more effective pitcher all through the 1970s.
by Evan on May 8, 2009 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes,
and Jim Rice should be in the HOF because of TEH FEAR.
Not saying that Ryan isn’t a HOFer – but he’s really – from an effective value stand point – not much better than Blyleven.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
-------
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by zenbitz on May 8, 2009 2:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What do you mean by “effective value?”
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
by Lyle on May 9, 2009 8:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So Ryan isn’t overrated because he’s rated so highly? Think about it – that’s not really a logical argument
If we’re trying to determine how good a player was, why not just look at the results? Why ask players how it felt like to hit against Ryan, instead of just looking at how they hit against him? We can tell, looking at his stats, that, once you’ve adjusted for era, hitters hit Ryan about as well as today’s hitters hit Roy Halladay. We can also tell that, compared to each one’s peers, that Halladay is a much better at preventing runs than Ryan was. Why does it matter if Ryan did it while scarring the shit out of hitters?
From an analytical point of view, it doesn’t matter. All that matters is how good the results he got were. And judging by these results, he was really good – great, probably a HOFer, but simply not as dominant as Maddux, Johnson, Martinez, Clemens, Seaver, Koufax, Gibson, Marichal, or Spahn, and maybe not even better as good as Perry, Carlton, or Blyleven. All three were great pitchers. Non of them is ever brought up as one of the absolute best. And neither should Ryan.
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 8, 2009 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
How does this analysis factor in the relative crappiness of the supporting casts?
Hi, I am Johnny Disaster.
by Johnny Disaster on May 8, 2009 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which teammate should I blame for Ryan’s career 4.7 BB/9?
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 8, 2009 5:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for answering my honest question so meaningfully.
My thought was that if your defense sucks, it makes sense to minimize balls in play even if that means walking people, especially if you’re pitching to give your team the best chance of winning instead of improving your stats. Or put another way, one could afford to be more aggressive in the zone if one were confident in the defense, thereby lowering walks.
A career spent on doormat teams might instill in someone a habit of never wanting contact, distorting the statistical record. Or not. This is why I asked.
Hi, I am Johnny Disaster.
by Johnny Disaster on May 8, 2009 7:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
OK, I see what you’re asking. No, I don’t really know how to adjust for this, but I doubt that it’s important. Ryan walked 6.2 batters per 9 innings in the minors, then he walked 6.1 in 4 year with the Mets, then 5.4 in 8 years with the Angles, then 3.9 in 9 years with the Astros, and eventually 3.8 in his last 5 years with the Rangers. That’s 26 seasons and 4 different teams. He was always a very very wild pitcher, regardless of the defense behind him.
Also, dude was throwing 100 MPH and striking out 10 batters per 9 innings, and was without a doubt the most feared pitcher in the league. I can’t think of anyone less likely to be afraid of being aggressive.
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 8, 2009 8:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So he’s the poster boy for effectively wild… explains the fear, certainly.
Hi, I am Johnny Disaster.
by Johnny Disaster on May 9, 2009 7:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jim Rice was the “toughest guy to pitch to” according to a lot of former players….. That’s why I don’t listen to most of what they have to say.
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all
If Dustin Pedroia played in Seattle, not many people would be talking about him.
by baetown415 on May 8, 2009 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What do players know about playing baseball anyways?
Bruce Bochy would like you to look at the career numbers and stop complaining.
by cheno on May 8, 2009 6:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nolan Ryan was a freak and isn’t a good point of comparison for anyone.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
by jcb9 on May 8, 2009 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
does his dad throw 80 MPH?
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on May 8, 2009 11:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nolan Ryan accompanied his walks with a strikeout rate well over 9.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 12:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two first names!
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
by Useful_Idiot on May 10, 2009 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I love this
He’s always going ot be a loser, but i like him as our loser.
by Giant Voodoo on May 8, 2009 8:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Not unless we get him for Cecil Fielder!
by SoFa King Mike on May 8, 2009 9:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Reminder: Cain's most impressive stat
24 (his age)
by KrazyKrabMeat on May 8, 2009 9:28 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I’m really worried about him. K’s down, walks up, velocity down…
It’s only a matter of time :(
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
by MonkeyChow on May 8, 2009 9:34 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn’t worry, he always struggles early on and his velocity is trending up.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips
Proud father of Juan Carlos Perez. Think Albert Pujols at second.
by marcello on May 8, 2009 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
To elaborate
Look at his K/BB trend over his career:
April/March – 1.53
May – 1.83
June – 1.98
July – 1.98
August – 2.30
Sept/Oct – 2.43
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips
Proud father of Juan Carlos Perez. Think Albert Pujols at second.
by marcello on May 8, 2009 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow, that is what one might call a trend.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
by cornball on May 8, 2009 11:38 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m in a much better mood now. Thanks :)
Proud father of Barry Zito. As long as he keeps throwing strikes, that is.
by MonkeyChow on May 8, 2009 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No worries, I go through the same thing with Cain every year and I always have to remind myself that it will be ok.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips
Proud father of Juan Carlos Perez. Think Albert Pujols at second.
by marcello on May 8, 2009 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This
Haven't been to The Examined Life? No wonder your life feels so empty.
"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK
by Josh from Hollywood on May 9, 2009 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Plz be right marcello
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all
If Dustin Pedroia played in Seattle, not many people would be talking about him.
by baetown415 on May 8, 2009 4:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damnit Monkey Chow! Don’t say it.
Robby Thompson "hey Hinshaw, let me see your hat for a minute."
Alex HInshaw "Why?"
Robby Thompson ,"You'll see...."
by LargeFarva on May 9, 2009 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, Post Fail
Robby Thompson "hey Hinshaw, let me see your hat for a minute."
Alex HInshaw "Why?"
Robby Thompson ,"You'll see...."
by LargeFarva on May 9, 2009 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two starts ago, his walk rates were significantly down compared to previous years. Hello, small sample size.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
by jcb9 on May 8, 2009 9:42 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
His K-rate was significantly down too though. That said, it has risen and I’m sure soon he’ll be back to a 7-8ish K/9 and a 3.5ish BB/9. STILL. I WORRY, OKAY?
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, as of two starts ago, his K rate was down, his BB rate was down, he was giving up fewer home runs but a higher batting average.
The velocity is worrysome, but with everything else we can’t really draw any conclusions yet.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
by jcb9 on May 8, 2009 9:46 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pitching to contact?
Hi, I am Johnny Disaster.
by Johnny Disaster on May 8, 2009 11:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does anyone know if he has been throwing a significantly higher percentage of curves? Or more curves earlier in the count? If so I would tend to think you might be onto something.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on May 8, 2009 12:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, he has been throwing quite a bit more curves so far this year, no clue on the early in the count part though.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips
Proud father of Juan Carlos Perez. Think Albert Pujols at second.
by marcello on May 8, 2009 1:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This makes me real optimistic.
It could mean at least 1 of 2 things. Trusting his infield defense and /or really using his league wide reputation to his advantage. Either way is a very good thing.
OT: I forgot fangraphs had that info. Thank you for the reminder.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on May 8, 2009 4:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This
by FairweatherFan on May 8, 2009 9:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Panic!
At the Disco.
Psycho killer, qu'est-ce que c'est?
by shikantaza on May 8, 2009 10:22 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Band that makes oldjacket feel old.
Randy Winn is going to catch that. And he'll do it real classy-like too.
by oldjacket on May 8, 2009 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s not you. It’s just shitty music.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on May 8, 2009 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thank goodness that’s all it is.
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
by Lyle on May 9, 2009 8:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m actually going to Alaska now… I’m posting from Bellingham, Washington, and I’m about to jump on a ferry for 3 days. That will get us to Haines, Alaska, and we’re going to drive the rest of the way to Anchorage.
Psycho killer, qu'est-ce que c'est?
by shikantaza on May 8, 2009 12:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was in Alaska about 3 years ago. It is beautiful country. You’re lucky.
by Lars The Wanderer on May 8, 2009 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can you see Russia yet?
Haven't been to The Examined Life? No wonder your life feels so empty.
"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK
by Josh from Hollywood on May 9, 2009 11:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Make sure to create a fanpost to tell us everything you’ve learned about foreign policy after seeing Russia
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
McCC = McClain Chronicles
by Useful_Idiot on May 10, 2009 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
PANIC ON THE STREETS OF LONDON, PANIC ON THE STREETS OF BIRMINGHAM
by satyricrash on May 8, 2009 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I saw a band on Rock Band the video game called “Fiasco! At the Waffle House.”
We're all basically Pedro Feliz.
by SF Pete on May 8, 2009 3:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Concern! At the Roller Rink
Meet my new son: Sundrendy Windster, coming soon to a minor league near you.
by EliminateMe on May 8, 2009 4:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Revulsion! at the Blog
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
by Lyle on May 9, 2009 8:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
you’re pitching like you’re 34 instead of 24.
even young Giants play like old dudes…
Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal
Official Sponsor of the 1997 San Francisco Giants
by nostocksjustbonds on May 8, 2009 10:26 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
His underlying peripherials aren’t great, but I’m not overly worried yet.
by xanthan on May 8, 2009 10:26 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
sigh...
I will never understand your soft spot for Cain :-(
Flossing a dead horse
by kenshin1 on May 8, 2009 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t have a soft spot, but I just can’t freak out about lower velo and some elevated walk rates in 38 IP.
by xanthan on May 8, 2009 11:03 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
your opinion is wrong, sir
I insist that you panic like the rest of us.
Flossing a dead horse
by kenshin1 on May 8, 2009 11:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's right on the keyboard, xanthan, easy to find
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on May 8, 2009 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is it wrong to like Matt Cain?
The absentee father of Edwin "Cue Ball" Quirarte, now that he is doin well in the minors, its time to get back in his life, and in his checking account!
by TexasRanger on May 8, 2009 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
why does kenshin hate joy and puppies?
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on May 8, 2009 12:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
One time he accidentally banned a joyous puppy from McC and still won’t just admit it was a mistake.
COME ON KENSHIN, WE ALL KNOW
GROUGTHINK ALERT
Chatterbalks dot com: Still with jokes. Now with updates.
by groug on May 8, 2009 12:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
in my defense...
the joyous puppy was totally being a dick.
Flossing a dead horse
by kenshin1 on May 8, 2009 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
kenshin is a perineal all-star.
Sergio Romo: striking out professional hitters since 2005. And winner of the 2012 NL Fireman of the Year Award!
by Lyle on May 9, 2009 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
third starter at best vortex is created! young people tell old people to get off of their lawn! old people rebel against the system! Your cat wants steak and your dog wants to has cheezeburger!
/throws himself off of bridge into waters infested by sharks and the ghosts of pitching flops past.
Psycho killer, qu'est-ce que c'est?
by shikantaza on May 8, 2009 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
I was always more of an Undertaker fan myself.
STEVE HOLM! refuses to be the odd man out.
by UnleashTheGore on May 8, 2009 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kane never had a fair chance at a push.
Judgment Day is coming
comics | art | Nattowear
by Natto on May 8, 2009 1:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He was better as Isaac Yankem DDS anyway.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that pie > cake, that Bochy is endowed by his creator with certain undeniable traits, that among these are veteran man-love, a gigantic skull, and the pursuit of the double switch.
Adopted Giant: Fred Lewis, who can still draw a walk.
by jcb9 on May 8, 2009 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well who fixes the Giants computers when they crash then?
Barry Zito: Mike Hampton with a guitar
by JakeS on May 8, 2009 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he is plugged in and not behind bars.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on May 8, 2009 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since Cain seems to be figuring it out.......
…..wouldn’t this be a great time to trade him for Prince Fielder?
\rimshot
Why isn't Sabean held accountable for leading the Giants into many years of mediocrity???
by oldrips on May 8, 2009 3:27 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Was it hanging out with the reigning Cy Young award winner […] ?
Don’t know about that, but he certainly spends a lot of time talking with Randy Johnson
in between their starts.
"The dreams ain't broken down here now, they're walking with a limp" --TW
by bgunn on May 8, 2009 3:41 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The walks worry me a bit, the velocity less so because the drop-off is so uniform. Sudden drops in velocity are often caused by injury but gradual ones over the course of a few years seem more method, less madness. As some have pointed out he may be dialing it back for the increased control, or it could even just be the fact that while still young Cain isn’t at his physical peak anymore and may just generate a little bit less arm speed than he used to.
Barry Zito: Mike Hampton with a guitar
by JakeS on May 8, 2009 4:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You know what would be funny? If Cain has his worst season ever this year, like 6.5 K/9, 3.7 BB/9, 4.50 ERA or something, but continues to get the good run support he’s been getting so far. He’ll finish the season 14-8, and everyone will talk about how he finally had his breakthrough year.
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 8, 2009 4:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I’m not laughing.
Haven't been to The Examined Life? No wonder your life feels so empty.
"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK
by Josh from Hollywood on May 9, 2009 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well not “ha ha” funny, more “oh crap something is wrong with Cain but hey look at that silly little piece of irony” funny.
Adoptive parent of Noah Lowry. Because he was awesome once, and, goddammit, he shall be awesome once again!
I hope.
by Cookyman on May 9, 2009 12:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The walks are what concerns me
But, like has been mentioned already, it is really early in the year.
What encourages me, though, is that he’s been able to work around it.
"Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense."
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's contract.
Adoptive father of "Poncho" Villalona: This Angel don't fly. Nothing about him is light.
by thehavenot on May 9, 2009 9:30 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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