Trading Molina?
by MonkeyChow on May 10, 2009 7:09 AM PDT
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PrintLiving in the New York area, I occasionaly turn on Yankees game, especially if the Yanks are losing. What took me by surprise was the fact that their starting catcher was none other than the famed masher Francisco Cervelli. Posada missed 100+ games last year, and now he is out with a hamstring strain. Their backup catcher, Jose Molina, is also on the 15 day DL.
Yes, none of these injuries are severe enough to cause them to trade immidiatly, but if Posada were to go down for the year, or continue to be bothered by these nagging injuries, isn't it possible that the Yankees would be willing to give up a great deal for Molina? They essentially HAVE to win this year, and Cashman will feel Steinbrenner breathing down his neck, calling for a playoff spot at all costs. If the Posada were out for an extended period of time, what do you think we could get from the Yankees for Molina? And who else might be in the market for a catcher at the deadline?
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We wouldn’t get too much, I don’t think. Trading Molina would cause us to lose a decent chunk of salary, especially so in this economy.
The best we could do is probably a Mark Melancon. Perhaps Juan Miranda. I don’t know much about the Yankees’ lower minor leagues.
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
The question is...
Why would you trade your most productive hitter at this point, when aside from Pablo, all your other hitters have trouble with hitting the ball out of the infirld?? I was a fan of trading Molina last year when we were out of it, but this season is showing some promise with all of our pitching!!
BTW, Timmy Alderson was yanked after throwing 6 2/3 no hit ball striking out 10 while only walking 1 in his AA debut…
"Buy High-Sell Low"--The Brian Sabean Method Of Trading
by Mordy From Monsey on May 10, 2009 12:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Because I am still of the opinion that we will be “out of it” before the trade deadline.
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
The main question is
will what you get for Molina at the deadline be better than the (potential) two draft picks you’ll get from him being a type-A free agent?
Still the loving, adoptive father of Hector Sanchez. And who doesn't love switch-hitting catchers with power and patience?
That’d be a fairly high-stakes gamble. If he ends up having a great year, then he’d get a ton of money if he accepted arbitration. Also, the potential loss of high draft picks for an old catcher could scare away potential suitors, ala Mark Grudzielanek, and nearly Juan Cruz.
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
I don’t think it would be a high stakes gamble. If he has a great year, he wouldn’t accept arbitration. The Mets, for example, have loved Molina for years, and they would love for him to get out on the FA market so that they could replace the anemic bat of Brian Schneider.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
Do you think the Mets would give him two years?
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
they might even give him three!! The Mets are worse than the Giants lately when it comes to signing older players. They gave Moises two years and they even gave Julio Franco two years when he was in his late forties.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
That's another gamble.
If either New York team signs him, there’s a good change that the Giants would only end up with a 2nd round pick.
I’d be interested to see what percentage of type-A free agents actually net their team a first round selection.
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
Why would we be trading Molina at the deadline? Yesterday’s game was a disaster, but this team has been playing well recently, and there’s no reason to think we’ll be out of it by the trading deadline. The only team better than us in the division just lost their best player for 50 games. The Giants’ will be looking to add on at the deadline to their pathetic offense, not trading not of it’s few useful parts. As stated before, the draft choices for an A type FA are better than what we would get.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
Time to take this stick to a hornets nest!
Let us say its 3-5 weeks from now and everything in NYY is pretty much as it is now. First 2 catchers stay too banged up. The rookie catcher (Cervelli) proves to be good with a glove side of things but can’t get off the inner state.
1. Would they consider a Swisher for Molina swap?
2. Would you accept it?
Where is my beer & chili dog?
I think the better question would be if Sabean would make this trade. Sabean had absolutely no interest in Swisher when he was available on the trade market this offseason. Not only would he say no to this deal, but he would get angry at the person who asked him this question!!
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
Sabean is always angry at "The Lunatic Fringe". It’s part of his "charm".
Sabean might have thought he might have other options last winter. And really just how confident were even the Lunatic Fringe that 3 of 4 (Sandoval, Lewis, Burriss, Ish) would do as well as they have? I imagine he was even less confident.
Otherwise it does fit the pattern of past Sabean mid season moves. A player(s) at, or near, MLB level for another player at the MLB level. I just wonder if the Yanks be desperate enough to do it figuring they go trade for corner Of from some were else.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
I don’t see how this fits the pattern of his deals. Most of his other deals were prospects for veterans. This one would be more like trading a valuable part of his offense for someone who is either equal value or less. It’s not a deal that improves the team this year, although it probably would in the long run. I would think he’d be looking to improve the offense at the deadline by offering pitching, not his cleanup hitter.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
Rios was near MLB level for Schmidt. Same could be said for the Accoardo for Chulk move. True coming away with the younger player would be different though. It just seems less of a stretch then swapping a valuable ( no sarcasm this time) MLB Vet for prospect(s).
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on May 10, 2009 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions
Rios was actually Rios and Vogelsong for Schmidt and John Vanderwal. That’s two younger players for two veterans. The veteran Shea Hillenbrand was actually the key player in the Accardo for Chulk move. I don’t see how Molina for Swisher would be a similar move.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
I am looking at the talent pool from which Sabean tends to willing to accept players as a return for guy on or near the 25 man roster. He really likes to avoid taking the risk of developing a player from another system that is not near MLB level (Especially if the parent club is near 500) those two trades show that.
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on May 10, 2009 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions
I’d love to have Swish on the team, though.
Merkin Valdez? Manuel Mateo? A rose by any other name...
A suitable San Franciscan replacement for Swagger.
Who saw that cumming?
NL West TempestTeapot
Nothing matters , and what if it did?
by victor frankenstein on May 10, 2009 10:10 AM PDT up reply actions
/ tips cap
Where is my beer & chili dog?
by daveinexile on May 10, 2009 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions
The Mets have a bigger need and Minaya notably loves Molina. I think we could get more value in a trade with the Mets. Mets need a catcher and pitching which makes them a good trade partner for us.
I’m interested in Dan Murphy, just like I was last year. Murphy currently sits at .308/.369/.473 after 90 AB’s. He plays LF/1B and I think was even seen playing 2B last season.
Trade them Molina and a paid-for Winn for Murphy and 1-2 of their top prospects (Flores, Martinez, Niese). We can sweeten the deal with pitching if need be.
Why they do it: Molina gives them a huge upgrade at catcher and Winn gives them a one-year replacement for Murphy (Between Sheff, Tatis and Winn they have the 3/5 OF spots locked down). If anything Winn is still more than serviceable as a late inning defensive replacement and even a base stealing threat.
Why we do it: We parlay positions of relative depth for young talent moving forward. Murphy would be a nice young OF with a little pop that is clearly ready to start in the majors. We can slide Sandoval to Catcher until Posey is ready. We could even give Murphy AB’s at 1B if we want Shierholtz to see more action in a Winn-less OF. Martinez is their OF prospect that is closest to the majors. He is starting to kill AAA pitching which would give us another OF near the majors. Flores is a 16 yr old SS that we wouldn’t see for 4 years or more, but he would be good organizational depth if Crawford doesn’t pan out.
I think I pulled my swagger muscle...
Martinez is their number one prospect though. Why would they trade him for someone who will be an FA after this season?
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
Multiple reasons.
Castro has been nothing but a backup catcher, and although he’s been swinging a decent bat, are they really going to rely on him as their main catcher while in “contention” mode? Molina would be a significant upgrade at catcher and would be a solid 7th hitter for their lineup. He could help stabilize that pitching staff and potentially squeeze a little extra out of their starters not named Santana. Plus I mentioned the possibility of sweetening the deal with pitching. That would be a necessity if we were to pluck a prospect like Martinez. They desperately need pitching. We could find a package that wouldn’t hurt our plans.
As for Molina’s FA status, he will likely be a type-A which is worth a prospect. And his abilities to help them now is worth another prospect (or ML hitter). And Minaya will have first crack at extending Molina if he is so inclined.
I think I pulled my swagger muscle...
They wouldn’t give up fmart for santana, there is no way they will give him up for Bengie unless we added a pitcher like Alderson or something
The absentee father of Edwin "Cue Ball" Quirarte, now that he is doin well in the minors, its time to get back in his life, and in his checking account!
by TexasRanger on May 13, 2009 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t mind having Murphy as long as he’s playing first. Citi Field is pretty similar to ATT in terms of the copious amounts of outfield grass. He’s been butchering LF in Citi: bad routes, bad glove. Put him at first and play Nate in RF. Sideways move in right, improvement at 1B.
Joe Martinez: My fingers are crossed and my palms are together for you.
When it's all said and done, America will be remembered for three things: The Bill of Rights, jazz, and baseball.
meh
as to Murphy, but +10000 for putting him at 1B. He makes Fred L. look like Willie M.
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
card carrying Bochy Hatter
by natteringnabob on May 12, 2009 11:29 AM PDT up reply actions
I would definitely rather keep Molina
His bat is necessary in this pathetic lineup, and I have a hard time believing that whatever we got back would be worth more then the draft picks he would bring in as a Type-A
Not so proud adoptive parent of the set-up man.
This is definitely not Howry do it!
Don't Worry
if you want to keep Bengie, our GM is the right GM for you. He won’t be looking to trade Bengie unless the Giants’ are hopelessly out of it at the deadline and it’s doubtful that this will be the case.
Proud new dad of Edgardo errr Edgar Renteria!!!
Sanchez and Bengie for Wright or Reyes
And I’ll throw in a Tim Lincecum bobble head doll.
Proud father of Dallas Mcpherson, the Babe Ruth of AAA.
another point no one has brought up yet -
trading away your starting catcher mid-season isn’t like trading away any other player – your starting catcher has a significant effect on the performance of all your pitchers, it takes time for a catcher and a pitcher to get used to each other, know each other’s strengths, weaknesses, and philosophy, etc. (look at what just happened to Minnesota’s pitcher when they were without Joe Mauer)
However good they looked in this last series, the Dodgers are going to be worse off without Manny for 50 games. We are going to be competing for our division title for most of, if not all of this season. We aren’t going to have Molina for too much longer, his contract is almost up, and other teams know it. (Buster Posey, everyone). We wouldn’t trade him for anything permanent, but finding a short term solution to our hitting woes is pointless if we are suddenly “out of it” like you cynics are saying we will be.
conclusion: any minimal short term advantage we’d gain by trading him would be outweighed by the costs of losing him
"Those boos really motivate me to make something happen." - Bonds
evidence for this?
your starting catcher has a significant effect on the performance of all your pitchers, it takes time for a catcher and a pitcher to get used to each other, know each other’s strengths, weaknesses, and philosophy, etc. (look at what just happened to Minnesota’s pitcher when they were without Joe Mauer)
I guess you mean the twins in 2007. I looked this up, and you might have a point here…
Split G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR SB CS BB SO SO/BB BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
Chris Heintz 21 640 580 100 192 35 5 18 13 1 41 104 2.54 .331 .377 .502 .879 291 14 7 4 8 5 .373 133 100
Matt LeCroy 4 148 136 11 35 8 0 4 8 0 11 23 2.09 .257 .318 .404 .722 55 5 1 0 0 2 .284 92 100
Joe Mauer 91 3250 2978 352 766 153 11 95 21 24 210 587 2.80 .257 .311 .412 .723 1226 67 28 20 14 12 .290 92 100
Jose Morales 1 24 21 5 9 1 0 2 0 0 3 5 1.67 .429 .500 .762 1.262 16 0 0 0 0 1 .500 231 100
Mike Redmond 56 2071 1873 257 503 100 11 66 23 16 155 375 2.42 .269 .327 .439 .766 823 42 15 10 18 13 .301 103 100
I am not sure I am williing to conclude much from Redmond vs. Mauer here – especially where you look at the BABIP… but apparently Chris Heintz can’t call a game…
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
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PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
booo! where is my fixed width font!
Split G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR SB CS BB SO SO/BB BA OBP SLG OPS TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+ Chris Heintz 21 640 580 100 192 35 5 18 13 1 41 104 2.54 .331 .377 .502 .879 291 14 7 4 8 5 .373 133 100 Matt LeCroy 4 148 136 11 35 8 0 4 8 0 11 23 2.09 .257 .318 .404 .722 55 5 1 0 0 2 .284 92 100 Joe Mauer 91 3250 2978 352 766 153 11 95 21 24 210 587 2.80 .257 .311 .412 .723 1226 67 28 20 14 12 .290 92 100 Jose Morales 1 24 21 5 9 1 0 2 0 0 3 5 1.67 .429 .500 .762 1.262 16 0 0 0 0 1 .500 231 100 Mike Redmond 56 2071 1873 257 503 100 11 66 23 16 155 375 2.42 .269 .327 .439 .766 823 42 15 10 18 13 .301 103 100
(preview button is for sissies!)
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
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PARPG- Indy post-apocalyptic roleplaying game currently in early planning stages.
I dont see them trading Molina this year. Who’s gonna play catcher? You want Steve Holm starting for the lats month of the season? Ya, Sandoval plays there but I would rather keep him at 3b to help his offensive production. Posey is nowhere near close. I dont see them resigning him, but I dont see them trading him this year either.
by GrahamCrakalaka on May 11, 2009 10:30 PM PDT reply actions
They might resign him for a year if he will accept
that way they can transition into the future.
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