Jim Callis on Eugenio Velez

Jim Callis has a list of the best minor league picks from the Rule V draft. Our very own Eugenio Velez made the cut:

9. Eugenio Velez (2005, Giants from Blue Jays). Velez won the low Class A South Atlantic League MVP award in his first season as a Giant, then led the Double-A Eastern League in steals in his second. He took over at second base when Ray Durham was traded last year and will battle for a starting job in spring training.

He will battle for a starting job in spring training. Granted I've been MIA lately due to some massive personal crap, but I missed that one.

6 months ago BaronVonCurrentEvents Comment 38 comments 0 recs |

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2B Is Expected To Be A 3-Way Battle Between Burriss, Frandsen, And Valez

This has been the stated plan by Giants management ever since we signed Renteria.

by giantsrainman on Jan 4, 2009 11:55 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Yeah

And my understanding is that none of those 3 currently has the upper hand. On potential, you’d have to say Burriss for defense, Frandsen for offense, and Velez for tools. Gut feeling = job goes to K-Fran.

The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!

by hairball on Jan 5, 2009 8:37 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Burriss has upside on defense, Velez has the upside on offense

And Frandsen is likely the most well rounded and likely to succeed player.

Low ceiling, but high floor.

McC's Outstanding Newcomer '08.

by FairweatherFan on Jan 5, 2009 10:34 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I think this sums it up well

My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman

by Goofus on Jan 5, 2009 12:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

i liked him when watching his minor league stats

but that doesn’t exactly tell the whole story. I haven’t been able to watch the G’s play but from what I’ve read on here, he’s not exactly gold glove material, nor is he really loved at the plate or on the basepaths. I really liked his stats in minor league ball, and would love to see him get another full season of playtime at the majors, but i don’t think the people here would really go for that (and for good reason, it sounds like). But hey, I don’t have to watch the pickoff at first plays, so it doesn’t frustrate me nearly as much

Also known to haunt as theghostoftravisdenker and theaccidentalghostofsergioromo.

by theghostofjasonellison on Jan 5, 2009 2:49 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

3 pseudo-prospects enter! 1 pseudo-prospect leave!

We don't really have that much pitching depth. We don't really have that much pitching depth. FOR GOD SAKE, VERUCA, DON'T GO FAKE TRADING JONATHAN SANCHEZ. We don't really have that much pitching depth

by oldjacket on Jan 5, 2009 5:13 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

Can we splice them all together?

The speed of Velez! The defense of Burriss! The GAMERTUDE of Frandsen!

Bay City Ball | Beyond the Box Score

by xanthan on Jan 5, 2009 10:54 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

the offense of a completely different player!

by oldjacket on Jan 5, 2009 10:56 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

The Frandsen gene would allow for mass amounts of HBP’s. That’s where the offense would come from.

Bay City Ball | Beyond the Box Score

by xanthan on Jan 5, 2009 10:59 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

can we keep Velez’s amusing lack of baseball smarts?

by oldjacket on Jan 5, 2009 11:06 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Like Ruben Rivera in fast forward.

When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on Jan 5, 2009 2:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Thing is

Speed of Burriss > speed of Velez.

..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.

by Cookyman on Jan 6, 2009 8:50 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Well, then we’ll keep the facial hair of Velez.

by oldjacket on Jan 6, 2009 9:44 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

/clank

Sergio Romo will gladly hand you a bench to sit on / GIANTSPACE™ / Adopted brother of the AnVil

by SoFa King Mike on Jan 5, 2009 7:08 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

A

with an

The clock doesn't matter in baseball. Time stands still or moves backwards. Theoretically, one game could go on forever. Some seem to.-Herb Caen

My adopted son Matt Downs . Utility Infielder with a Bat !

by nvsfg on Jan 5, 2009 7:32 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

Antelope with a gauntlet?

Tyler Walker, my son, it's time you left the nest. No seriously. Go.

by multiphasic on Jan 5, 2009 9:48 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

two gauntlets and a sword is what i think he was going for. And part of a hand in the background.

So, “A antelope with an two gauntlets and a sword and a part of a hand”, yes?

Also known to haunt as theghostoftravisdenker and theaccidentalghostofsergioromo.

by theghostofjasonellison on Jan 5, 2009 10:07 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I Think He Was Giving Us A View Of The Gloves Velez Uses To Play Defense

by giantsrainman on Jan 5, 2009 10:14 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

if I was Blake Dewitt I would be pissed

you know, being that they are equal defensive players and all

by FluLikeSymptoms on Jan 5, 2009 12:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

At risk of falling into the "Sarchasm"...

An Antelope with an “Iron Glove”.

You would not believe how many commercial products there are named iron glove. Everything from PC Software to Golf Club covers to actual gloves :-)

The clock doesn't matter in baseball. Time stands still or moves backwards. Theoretically, one game could go on forever. Some seem to.-Herb Caen

My adopted son Matt Downs . Utility Infielder with a Bat !

by nvsfg on Jan 5, 2009 12:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I’m pretty sure you fell into the sarchasm

My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman

by Goofus on Jan 5, 2009 12:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Unfortunately For DeWitt There Is Evidense That He And Velez Share The Same 2B Glove Manufacturer

by giantsrainman on Jan 5, 2009 12:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I think you may have just taught me a new grammar rule

so if the amount of evidence is inconsequentially small you spell evidense with an s?

by FluLikeSymptoms on Jan 5, 2009 2:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

However Small It May Be, You Have Not Provided Any Evidence (Just Opinion) To The Contrary

by giantsrainman on Jan 5, 2009 3:04 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I guess it’s true that me extracting my head from my ass and watching baseball doesn’t technically qualify as evidence (or even evidense)

by FluLikeSymptoms on Jan 5, 2009 3:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

By The Way, You Are Still Missing The Biggest Point I Was Making

By Picking Velez to compare with DeWitt I picked the worst (both statistically and by the judgment of both your eyes and mine) of the three Giants contending for the 2B job. I went with the numbers that put the Giants defense at 2B in the worst light I could find. But inspite of this and simular choices on my part at other positions the evidence still supports that the Giants overall defense is better then the Dodgers both last year and likely this coming year as well.

by giantsrainman on Jan 5, 2009 3:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

ENJOY THE GAME MORE!

McC's Outstanding Newcomer '08.

by FairweatherFan on Jan 5, 2009 3:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I assume you're talking about their UZR numbers

So here are a few points you should consider:

DeWitt has 193 innings at 2B. That is a very small sample size.

Notice that DeWitt has a very good score at 3B, where he has played most of the season. The difference in difficulty between 3B and 2B isn’t huge, and DeWitt has reasonable speed, so it is extremely unlikely that he really is a +10 at 3B and a -17 at 2B. DeWtt has almost 4 times as many innings at 3B as he has at 2B, so I trust the 3B numbers a lot more.

DeWitt has a much better rating at Tango’s Fan Scouting Report. He is listed as a 3B, but his position-neutral rating is still much better (61 compared to Velez’s 38. 50 is average). Velez does have a big advantage in Speed, and a small one in First Step, both of which are important at 2B, but they are dwarfed in comparison to the huge advantages DeWitt has in Instincts, Throw Accuracy, Throw Release, and Hands, all of which – especially the last two – are also important at 2B. DeWitt also has a slightly stronger throw according to the FSR, but that’s not very important.

DeWitt doesn’t have much MiLB experience at 2B, having played less than a third of his games there. Velez also played multiple positions in the minors, but more than half of his games were at 2B. That, combined with the fact that DeWitt is three years younger, probably makes DeWitt the more likely one to improve.

FWIW, CHONE projects DeWitt to outfield Velez at 2B by 17 runs (-12 for Velez, +5 for DeWitt).

..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.

by Cookyman on Jan 6, 2009 10:00 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Man, you just had to go and actually argue his point, didn't you?

All this time I had resisted actually arguing the merits of what he was saying because I thought it was a lot more fun to just point and laugh at his obviously stupid argument.

by FluLikeSymptoms on Jan 6, 2009 10:15 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Why Does Everyone Focus One One Small Detail Of The Arguement Rather Then The Big Piture?

The arguement was which team had the better team defense. All the stats from last year say the Giants were better then the Dodgers on defense as I provided in the original fanpost (and at El Lefty Malo) where this debate started. 2B was just a small component of this overall arguement. My point wasn’t that going forwand it was reasonable to assume that Velez was better on defense at 2B the DeWitt. My point was that even if we use Velez’s (the Giants worst 2B defender’s) numbers at 2B he wasn’t any worse last year then DeWitt was at 2B.

I accept that compared to 2008 the Dodgers have gotten better at both SS and 2B (full years of Frucal and DeWitt instead of Berroa, Garciaparra, and Kent getting most of the innings) while the Giants have gotten worse at SS (Renteria instead of Vizquel and company). But, the Giants should be at worst the same at the rest of the infield in 2009 compared to 2008 and likely actually better.

Bottom line the Giants large overall defensive advantage from 2008 should be reduced in 2009 but the advantage should still be in the Giants favor. That is my arguement, not that Velez is better or even the equal of DeWitt at 2B. My engagement in the discussion of Velez vs DeWitt at 2B was just to point out that there was evidence (their career and 2008 UZR’s at 2B) that Velez wasn’t as bad as some think and that DeWitt wasn’t as good as some think.

by giantsrainman on Jan 6, 2009 12:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

because when you say

there was evidence (their career and 2008 UZR’s at 2B) that Velez wasn’t as bad as some think and that DeWitt wasn’t as good as some think.

that is just so easy and fun to mock

by FluLikeSymptoms on Jan 6, 2009 12:36 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Fine, Mock The Truth If Doing So Is How You Get Your Jollies

by giantsrainman on Jan 6, 2009 12:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

it is actually

I just got done mocking some guy in my office who was trying to tell us the world is round (the dumb ass didn’t even provide any evidense)

by FluLikeSymptoms on Jan 6, 2009 12:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Come on man

the Giants large overall defensive advantage from 2008 should be reduced in 2009 but the advantage should still be in the Giants favor. That is my arguement, not that Velez is better or even the equal of DeWitt at 2B.

Nonsense. I don’t know/remember what your comment at El Lefty Malo was about, and I don’t really care. The comment to which I responded, your only comment regarding DeWitt in this thread, simply stated:

Unfortunately For DeWitt There Is Evidense That He And Velez Share The Same 2B Glove Manufacturer.

You claimed that DeWitt is as bad a fielder as Velez, or at least that there is “evidence” that he is. That’s all you said. Do you think that’s true? If you don’t, why are you arguing? If you do, what the hell?

..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.

by Cookyman on Jan 7, 2009 11:38 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

by oldjacket on Jan 6, 2009 1:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

No, he said with an, so the next word must start with an vowel.

They say some players get out of bed hitting; Pablo Sandoval doesn't wait that long

by bgunn on Jan 6, 2009 3:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

No one seems to realize that's a gazelle

Or I fell into the sarchasm as well.

When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on Jan 5, 2009 2:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs