The San Francisco Giants and Manny Ramirez: Sigh
by Grant
on Jan 2, 2009 11:25 AM PST
246 comments
Okay. I’ll bite.
No, they didn’t.
The Giants already had an offensively gifted, defensively challenged left fielder with baggage. They had the option to retain this mystery slugger (I’ll reveal his identity at the end of this post!), but chose not to. The production, they figured, was counterproductive to their new direction. The new direction had something to do with youth and building from within. We can argue about the merits of the choice and whether or not Mystery Slugger would have helped the 2008 Giants, but there was no ambiguity in the decision. The Giants chose to start Fred Lewis, even though Lewis was likely to be less productive with the bat. Age, baggage, and defense were all factors in the decision.
Now the Giants are supposedly chasing a defensive abomination with a Neptune-orbiting brain, and the proposed commitment would keep him on the Giants until he’s 40.
No, they aren’t.
Sure, this could be the front-page post that’s up when Manny Ramirez signs with the Giants for a 4-year, $80M deal, and it will make me look like a total jackass. More so than usual, even. But I’ll take that chance. The parallels between Ramirez and Bonds are just too great, and that’s the best frame of reference we have. And the constant, emphatic denials from the Giants front office, including a team spokesperson quoted in the rumor-laden article linked to above, have been constant and emphatic since the offseason began.
The appearance of the Giants’ involvement would benefit the Giants, Manny Ramirez, and Scott Boras. I’m not saying Brian Sabean and Boras are smoking a cigar somewhere, cackling about their devious plan. But Boras might know that a rumor like this would make it seem like the Giants aren’t being cheap, and it might tie up the Dodgers’ payroll for an extra year, which would also benefit the Giants. As such, Boras might guess that there would be advantages for the Giants if they were to not dismiss the rumor outright. Maybe he guessed right.
Or maybe the Giants plan on signing Manny, and then trading Fred Lewis, Nick Noonan, and Jonathan Sanchez to the Marlins for Dan Uggla! And then the Giants would trade Henry Sosa and Travis Ishikawa to the Pirates for Adam LaRoche! Then the lineup would be all:
Winn
Renteria
Manny
Uggla
LaRoche
Sandoval
Molina
Rowand
OMG 900 RUNS LOL.
Or maybe the Giants will steer clear of Manny Ramirez. Just a guess. And if it takes more than a two-year deal, they should. I don't want that guy clomping around the outfield and making $20M when he's 40. Dude can hit, but players in their late-30s don't need excuses to stop hitting. Just to be safe, Ramirez has several excuses lined up.
If I were convined that the .396/.489/.743 Manny were a good bet going forward, I'd be all for the signing. It's more likely that the .296/.388/.493 Manny from 2007 would be the player that shows up for the duration of the contract. Combine that with his defense, and you have an overpaid and immovable player who plays one of the only positions of depth on the team (corner outfield), and who doesn't fix a broken offense by himself.
Though that mockery mock lineup kind of appeals to me. It tantalizes me, as if it were a cool pitcher of offensive lemonade in a desert of sub-.400 slugging percentages. Cool, refreshing, offensive lemonade. Who needs the future, right? We have other outfielders and pitchers coming through the minors…
Spring training needs to start, dang it. We’re not hitchhiking anymore; we’re riding.
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Nah.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 11:36 AM PST
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Damn you Howie!
The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!
by hairball on
Jan 2, 2009 11:44 AM PST
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Who's the mystery slugger?
proud father of the newly acquired Brandon Crawford..
by Azmanz on
Jan 2, 2009 11:36 AM PST
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Kevin Mitchell!
Sergio Romo will gladly hand you a bench to sit on / GIANTSPACE™ / Adopted brother of the AnVil
by SoFa King Mike on
Jan 2, 2009 11:40 AM PST
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Jeff Leonard
Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal
by nostocksjustbonds on
Jan 2, 2009 12:59 PM PST
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Of more concern. . .
I think Grant’s got it right: this is a Boras-Sabean mindf@*ing of Nedo. Of more concern are reports that we want to sign Joe Crede. As has been pointed out numerous times, we already suffered through years of Pedro, and his back was sound. We should be very afraid of this rumor.
Don't believe everything you think.
by wcovington on
Jan 2, 2009 11:51 AM PST
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we should be afraid of a one year contract to Joe Crede when the plan right now consists of either a player who has rarely played the position like Pablo Sandoval or trading Jonathan Sanchez for other lousy defensive third basemen?? We actually should be afraid of NOT signing Joe Crede!!
Brian Sabean's dad- will make a few phone calls to help his son find a new job after next season
by rxmeister on
Jan 2, 2009 11:57 AM PST
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I'd rather Ty Wigginton
And I don’t really even want him.
Don't believe everything you think.
by wcovington on
Jan 2, 2009 12:05 PM PST
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Listen, I don’t really want to know what you’d rather do to Wiggington, and I’d prefer if you’d keep your kinky baseball sex fantasies to yourself from now on.
You know, unless they’re hot. In that case, post away!
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 12:26 PM PST
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Working on it.
need to remember who Ty Wigginton is…
by shanghaijim on
Jan 2, 2009 7:03 PM PST
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Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 2, 2009 12:15 PM PST
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"...a well connected source..."
I’m unemployed and bored – can I score off him/her?
Yesterday was a friggin’ circus here – for a rumor of interest.
Do we have anything left in the tank?
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 2, 2009 11:56 AM PST
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no more Manny talk until he actually signs. By the way, the latest is that Jon Heyman has confirmed the interest. Knowing him from his days in New York, he’s pretty reliable.
Brian Sabean's dad- will make a few phone calls to help his son find a new job after next season
by rxmeister on
Jan 2, 2009 11:58 AM PST
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Chris Haft just downplayed the Giants’ interest, so I guess you gotta decide who to believe
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
by Useful_Idiot on
Jan 2, 2009 1:13 PM PST
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When I first heard this rumor yesterday, I got quite excited. Not gonna lie. Our starting rotation plus arguably the best right-handed hitter in baseball…in a park where right handed pull hitters should be knockin ‘em out with ease…smells like a run at the World Series to me. But I sorta like our outfield. Well, Rowand bugs me, but he cares so darn much I can’t help but like him. He’d be the only OFer I’d wanna trade to make room for Manny, but who the hell wants his contract? So, obviously, Fred Lewis would be the easiest to trade. But I don’t wannnnnaaaaaaa!!! Plus, Manny’s a headcase and a shitty fielder. My thought would be…put his fat ass at first base. But that won’t happen.
SO…the rumor which is more news than rumor…that I’m much more hopeful for is Joe Crede. Lost amongst the Manny headline on mlb.com is a smaller headline that we peeped Crede’s medical records and liked what we saw. Yeah, he has back problems, but it might be worth the risk because it’d be one year, two years max…and probably not much more than $6-$7 mil. Healthy Crede is one of the best offensive 3B in baseball. I like this line-up lots:
Winn
Renteria
Sandoval
Crede
Molina
Lewis
Rowand
Burriss
by Wonderboy26 on
Jan 2, 2009 11:56 AM PST
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Too bad Botchey won’t pull Molina out of the 4-hole.
Proud supporter of the Fightin' Hydrants.
by Little Napoleon on
Jan 2, 2009 12:00 PM PST
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That’s definitely a Botchey move
Sergio Romo will gladly hand you a bench to sit on / GIANTSPACE™ / Adopted brother of the AnVil
by SoFa King Mike on
Jan 2, 2009 12:02 PM PST
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Unfortunately, Bochy doesn’t know about the pull-out method.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 12:27 PM PST
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coitus interrputus. . .
76% effective!
For WilltheThrill, this is Jon Miller saying goodnight. . . .
by WilltheThrill on
Jan 2, 2009 1:16 PM PST
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Hey, that’s 50% more effective than my current method!
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 1:39 PM PST
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Nah
I’m pretty sure that never having sex is at least 95% effective.
..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.
by Cookyman on
Jan 2, 2009 2:01 PM PST
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I’d ask for some Neosporin if I wasn’t completely burnproof!
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 2:03 PM PST
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That's not Neosporin!!!!
The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!
by hairball on
Jan 2, 2009 2:10 PM PST
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I’d swith the batting order a little and bet Frandsen wins the starting 2B job:
Lewis
Renteria
Winn
Crede
Sandoval
Molina
Rowand
Frandsen
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on
Jan 2, 2009 12:03 PM PST
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General Goofus
From “Revenge of the Swith”
The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!
by hairball on
Jan 2, 2009 2:11 PM PST
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Not first base
My thought would be to put him at DH, and hope no one notices
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
by Useful_Idiot on
Jan 2, 2009 1:14 PM PST
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...
You like this line-up “lots?”
New Years Eve was a couple nights ago…
by positiveuphemism on
Jan 2, 2009 2:00 PM PST
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.323
Joe Crede has never had an OPS of higher than .323. Just how is it that when healthy he is one of the best offensive third baseman in baseball? If Joe Crede is your cleanup hitter, you very likely have offensive problems. Why are you batting Aaron Rowand seventh, when he is likely a better hitter than Crede?
by sharksrog on
Jan 2, 2009 11:18 PM PST
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Sorry to be picky but you mean OBP, not OPS.
Not even Omar Vizquel had a .323 OPS
Barry Zito - Mildly half-OK! Sometimes.
by Revolution1 on
Jan 2, 2009 11:28 PM PST
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Me Thinks You Ment OBP Not OPS
Neifi Perez managed in every year he played to keep his OPS above 323.
by giantsrainman on
Jan 2, 2009 11:29 PM PST
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did you mean OPB?
Because a .323 OPS would be really low. I mean, you could actually confuse someone.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
by zenbitz on
Jan 5, 2009 9:52 AM PST
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Pretty sure you mean OBP, not OPS
because a .323 OPS is really low, in case you didn’t know.
by bondslegend on
Jan 5, 2009 12:13 PM PST
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One of best offensive 3B in baseball. . .?
What stats are you looking at? I was in Chicago (at their unbelievably ugly ballpark) and I saw Crede hit 2 homeruns against the Twins. He still finished with 17 for the year and his on-base always sucks. He’s not even league average.
Don't believe everything you think.
by wcovington on
Jan 2, 2009 12:03 PM PST
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HEALTHY Crede, I say. Ya know, the one that one a Silver Slugger award a few seasons ago.
by Wonderboy26 on
Jan 2, 2009 12:20 PM PST
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No Crede!
Look at his stats. In his best season, he put up a .323 OBP with a .506 SLG. Some nice pop, but Crede is a career .306 OBP guy who has back problems and had 20 errors in only 92 games last year. No thank you. Pablo will put up better numbers, and probably fewer errors, even over a FULL season at 3rd base. IMO.
by Gregjitsu on
Jan 2, 2009 12:34 PM PST
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Thank you.
Don't believe everything you think.
by wcovington on
Jan 2, 2009 12:36 PM PST
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I think I agree with this
The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!
by hairball on
Jan 2, 2009 2:12 PM PST
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Better numbers yes, fewer errors? Probably not.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 2, 2009 4:18 PM PST
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Please don’t try to say Pablo will defend better then crede
Why does Sabean always look constipated?
by TexasRanger on
Jan 3, 2009 12:26 AM PST
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lemonade...
that cool refreshing drink.
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on
Jan 2, 2009 12:23 PM PST
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Lemon flavored Kool-Aid
Sergio Romo will gladly hand you a bench to sit on / GIANTSPACE™ / Adopted brother of the AnVil
by SoFa King Mike on
Jan 2, 2009 12:24 PM PST
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tenative 'yes'
depending on how much and how incentive laden. (20/yr max, and very)
by Viliphied on
Jan 2, 2009 12:24 PM PST
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ZOMG! THE ROAD TO 600!
Sergio Romo will gladly hand you a bench to sit on / GIANTSPACE™ / Adopted brother of the AnVil
by SoFa King Mike on
Jan 2, 2009 12:25 PM PST
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I read that as twenty years and telekinetically punched you. After re-reading, I apologize, but I still wouldn’t sign him.
by cornball on
Jan 2, 2009 2:40 PM PST
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That was then, this is now.
We all agree Bengie’s not a No.4, but Crede is not the answer. I’d rather put energy (and $$) into trading for a Dan Uggla or JJ Hardy or simply ride out the storm with what we’ve got.
Don't believe everything you think.
by wcovington on
Jan 2, 2009 12:25 PM PST
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Do "MBM" stats figure in at all?
I count 24 instances of Manny Being Manny, (the Oakley sunglass incident not being on the linked list) with at least a third of them coming last season, and half coming in the last two seasons. So, his power may be dropping but his essential Manny-ness seems to be waxing ever stronger.
Why couldn't McCovey have hit the ball just three feet higher??
by tobias on
Jan 2, 2009 12:35 PM PST
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MBM is a force that cannot be reckoned with.
I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!
Jeremy Affeldt Ready To Make His Father Proud
by Giant among Angels on
Jan 2, 2009 12:37 PM PST
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Manny Being Merlot might be another sign that he’s ready to move to Northern California.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on
Jan 2, 2009 3:08 PM PST
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Link Fail
I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!
Jeremy Affeldt Ready To Make His Father Proud
by Giant among Angels on
Jan 3, 2009 6:56 PM PST
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We must join with him, Gandalf.
It would be wise, my friend.
by shanghaijim on
Jan 2, 2009 7:05 PM PST
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Manny-ness
And, really, I long for team-ness for which Manny has no passion. Next.
Don't believe everything you think.
by wcovington on
Jan 2, 2009 12:38 PM PST
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I do not want him in a box
I do not want him with a fox
I do not want him in a car
I do not want him near or far.
I do not want MBM
I do not want him, Grant-I-Am
by Lars The Wanderer on
Jan 2, 2009 12:44 PM PST
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Would you like him out of LA?
Would you like him by the bay?
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on
Jan 2, 2009 3:26 PM PST
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I would not like him
here or there.
I would not like him
anywhere.
by Cainer on
Jan 2, 2009 3:38 PM PST
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I’d prefer the Giants pass on Manny and let the Yankees sign him so their payroll is 11 kajillion dollars.
My plans for 2009: getting married and attending Tim Lincecum Bobblehead Day.
by Kitspool on
Jan 2, 2009 12:45 PM PST
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As long as they stay under 12 kajillion dollars, I think it’s perfectly fair.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 1:00 PM PST
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I can make you some offensive lemonade if you’d like, Grant.
by Natto on
Jan 2, 2009 12:47 PM PST
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DON’T DRINK IT IT’S NOT REALLY LEMONADE DEAR GOD LISTEN TO ME I KNOW!
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 1:01 PM PST
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Actually, he made it out of limes. I mean, of all the low-down, dirty, cost-cutting moves. He could at least call it limeade and run an honest business, but nooooooo….
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 2:04 PM PST
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Now we know what soylent yellow is
The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!
by hairball on
Jan 2, 2009 2:13 PM PST
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But I’m allergic to limes! For pity’s sake, man, I’ll blow up like a puffer fish with particularly swollen glands.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 4:06 PM PST
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Personally, I kind of wouldn’t mind blowing up like a puffer fish so long as it comes with the little spikes.
Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense.
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's contract.
by thehavenot on
Jan 2, 2009 5:42 PM PST
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Grant's Lineup
2 problems with the #3 hitter:
1. Emmanuel Burriss does not yet deserve to be called Manny.
2. He should not be hitting int the 3 hole.
by Link on
Jan 2, 2009 12:50 PM PST
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LF Answer
Goofus
Sergio Romo will gladly hand you a bench to sit on / GIANTSPACE™ / Adopted brother of the AnVil
by SoFa King Mike on
Jan 2, 2009 1:01 PM PST
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You know, I was thinking that he only makes that catch 9 out of 10 times, but I’ll be damned if he hasn’t gone up there and snagged it coming up on 100 times in a row.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 1:02 PM PST
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Yeah
But I bet if people were in the stands, he’d trip over his back pocket or something.
Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense.
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's contract.
by thehavenot on
Jan 2, 2009 1:05 PM PST
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But I bet if people were in the stands, he’d trip over hisbackhot pocket or something
by Lars The Wanderer on
Jan 2, 2009 1:08 PM PST
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I’d be high-fiving them with my free hand whilst making the catch.
It’s all about giving the fans something to cheer about.
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on
Jan 2, 2009 3:33 PM PST
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That would be especially awesome because of the glove being on the hand closest to the stands.
Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense.
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's contract.
by thehavenot on
Jan 2, 2009 5:45 PM PST
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Eh.
Video exists of his core flexibility.
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 2, 2009 6:24 PM PST
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Child's play...
Goofus would go behind-the-back for the barehand high five.
They say some players get out of bed hitting; Pablo Sandoval doesn't wait that long
by bgunn on
Jan 3, 2009 1:07 PM PST
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I can't stop LOL'ing
which sucks, cuz I have a sore throat. Knock it off!
The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!
by hairball on
Jan 2, 2009 2:15 PM PST
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Wheelin' it big!
Imagine how high I could jump if I bent my legs a little…or was wearing Air Jordans!
That’s pretty funny stuff, SoFa King.
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on
Jan 2, 2009 3:32 PM PST
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f-f-f-f-f-f-f-four years????!.
I wouldn’t mind Manny for two years.
If the Giants do sign Manny for four years that would single handedly destroy all of the good of the off-season, I say.
On the other hand, I don’t think I’d mind trading Lewis, Noonan, Sanchez, Sosa and Ishikawa for Uggla and Laroche.
Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense.
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's contract.
by thehavenot on
Jan 2, 2009 1:02 PM PST
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is that trade for uggla a realistic possibly?
if so hes a much better solution for the bat we need
by cuse7284 on
Jan 2, 2009 2:06 PM PST
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OMGBBQ!1!!
The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!
by hairball on
Jan 2, 2009 2:16 PM PST
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It’s gotta be realistic. It came from a realiable source.
Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense.
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's contract.
by thehavenot on
Jan 2, 2009 5:48 PM PST
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Looking at it another way
This is all Boras trying to get the Dodgers to budge. There’s no way in hell the Giants offered that.
Plus, Who the F is Dennis O’Donnell? Has he ever had a scoop? Or is he just the type of local sports reporter that would jump at a chance to get his name in the public domain with a huge scoop? If Boras let him know what was going on (wink, wink), there’s no way he wouldn’t report it. Hell, his confirmation is (1) a Denver Post article saying the Giants are “aggressively pursuing Manny” and (2) a denial from the team!
O’Donnell heard a rumor and reported it. He probably heard it from Boras or Boras surrogate and didn’t think twice about journalistic ethics before spewing it into the ether.
Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal
by nostocksjustbonds on
Jan 2, 2009 1:08 PM PST
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Looking at it another way
This is all Boras trying to get the Dodgers to budge. There’s no way in hell the Giants offered that.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t that actually “Looking at it the same way”?
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 2, 2009 1:41 PM PST
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No, he looked at it using a different amount of words than Grant did.
Catcher are base running. Hitters are offense.
Only [hella] games left until the end of Zito's contract.
by thehavenot on
Jan 2, 2009 5:50 PM PST
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O'Donnell
does PBP for niners’ Preseason games. How can you not know this?!?!?!!??!!?!!!!?!?!?!!?
by bondslegend on
Jan 2, 2009 8:49 PM PST
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Strategery?
any chance Sabe’s and Boras have a deal…
Sabes: makes an “offer” for Manny to drive $$$ & YRS up for the dodgers
Boras: makes a sub avg 1yr contract for Crede
by cazzuno on
Jan 2, 2009 1:14 PM PST
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Are the Giants increasing payroll?
they’re close to $90million right now. Adding $20m a year would necessitate increasing the payroll (at least for 2009) substantially over what it has historically been. Are they willing to do that?
Maybe that’s the “Giants Way”, but I doubt it.
Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal
by nostocksjustbonds on
Jan 2, 2009 1:27 PM PST
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No
The Giants should stay away from ANY player that quits on his team. It is ok to drive the price up on the Dodgers however it is not ok to sign the bum.
by wilriv21 on
Jan 2, 2009 2:45 PM PST
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Funniest 2009
EVER!
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
by zenbitz on
Jan 5, 2009 9:53 AM PST
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another trade
dugout central suggests a trade senario for Beltre..better than Manny?
by daniel9 on
Jan 2, 2009 4:11 PM PST
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For all the talk of “Manny quit on his team”, he put up a .394/.536/.930 June for the Red Sox, then a .473/.587/1.060 July for them….
For all the crap the media gives to guys like Bonds and Manny, all I have to say is I hope Renteria “quits” on us by putting up a .400/.580/.950 line…
Hopefully Manny ends up somewhere other than the NL West. I’d enjoy it if the Yankees sign him.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 4:32 PM PST
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.400/.550/.950 is what I meant of course
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 4:33 PM PST
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may I ask why you forgot to mention he told the Sox he was injured and when they asked for an MRI he declined? He sold his soul to the devil and put himself in front of his team.
by wilriv21 on
Jan 2, 2009 4:43 PM PST
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its generally done avg/obp/slg
Can't get enough of the Oakland A's? Visit Oaktown Awesomer's
by iamawesomer on
Jan 2, 2009 4:57 PM PST
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Well I don’t know about A’s fans but Giants fans are smart enough to see the first two numbers add up to the third one and figure out its OBP/SLG/OPS. Thanks for the correction, though.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 4:59 PM PST
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If we’re that smart, we can add up the OBP and SLG % ourselves.
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on
Jan 2, 2009 5:36 PM PST
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He also took three straight strikes looking against Mariano Rivera and walked back to the dugout like he did it on purpose. I don’t like him at all. Bring back Barry!!!
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on
Jan 2, 2009 5:41 PM PST
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Because if he took days off at the same pace all season as he did those months, he would still end up with 450ish AB’s. I’d rather have 450 AB’s of .950+ OPS than a 162 game season from Rowand. Or anyone else on the Giants, really.
At the end of the day, for as much crap as people give Manny, he is the ultimate professional hitter, just like Bonds. He works his ass off to be the best hitter he can be, and it shows. Give me a hitter who works as hard as he does to improve his plate discipline and pitch recognition and forgets to run out a groundball every once in a while over a Pedro Feliz (or Aaron Rowand)-like hacker who never refines his approach at the plate but runs out ground balls and other “gamer” stuff.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 4:54 PM PST
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Agree that Ramirez is a very talented player and better than any Giants player. My concern is worrying about whether he will decide to play and when he wants to play. Ability is only one concern a team must have as they procure players. Teams must also concern themselves with cost, health, willing to play within their system, passion etc The player must show up EVERYDAY ready to play.
by wilriv21 on
Jan 2, 2009 5:11 PM PST
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I get your point, I just think it gets turned into a bigger deal than it really is because the media is stupid. My point is despite the fact that he didn’t try as hard as he could, he was still producing at an All-star/MVP type level. It’s frustrating to know he could do better, but at the same time, he was STILL better than almost everyone in the league.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 5:16 PM PST
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Yeah, but you’re going to pay a guy $20 million a year to a guy 36-40 years old. If you couple “less than 100% effort” with an age-related decline, it would be really easy for that to blow up in your face.
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
by Goofus on
Jan 2, 2009 5:40 PM PST
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Yeah, I’m less concerned with “Manny being Manny” than I am “Manny being mortal.”
by Grant on
Jan 2, 2009 5:57 PM PST
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I definitely don’t want to sign Manny. In a better world, we’d have Winn in CF, Lewis in RF, and a spot in LF to fill but we do not, so this signing does not make sense.
In this better world, it would still be stupid to sign Manny. We can get the same player for much cheaper, who Giants fans already like a lot. Barry.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 6:03 PM PST
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Let's be waking up just a little here.
Doan’ get me wrong , I’m pro Barry – but the man’s been out of baseball for over a year and was declining even then. Rapidly. He’d be a liability on both sides of the plate.
I’m on the fence with a short Ramirez contract but I’d rather not tarnish my Barry memories any more than they are.
And since it’s All About Me that pretty much settles it.
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 2, 2009 6:30 PM PST
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True there is no precedence for a 45 year old that hasn’t played in a year succeeding, but if anyone can do it, it’s Bonds. .480/.565/1.045 for an OPS+ of 170 in 2007…he was also a better fielder than he got credit for the last few years on the Giants (though obviously he isn’t good by any means). I’m bitter baseball took away our last chance to see him – I want to see what he can do one last time.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 7:00 PM PST
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Liability on both sides of the plate
I was unaware he was a switch-hitter.
Or perhaps you meant on the front and back side of the plate? Yeah, I don’t see him coming in to relieve or strapping on the gear to catch. ;)
Leading the Pro-Aaron Rowand contingent on the McC!
You can ridicule me in 2009 if you like...
by ThrillisGone22 on
Jan 3, 2009 1:27 AM PST
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Y'know , I actually thought about that.
Then I didn’t.
Now that you’ve brought it up I’m thinking about it again.
Can you guess what happens next?
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 3, 2009 7:46 AM PST
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Sure.
But effort isn’t just what you see on the field. Effort is also working out in the offseason, staying in shape, not stuffing your face with Ho Hos.
Manny by all accounts, at least from his Boston days, works very hard in the offseason at staying in shape. For example, doing running with tires early in the morning, even in winter.
ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524
by rfloh on
Jan 2, 2009 6:27 PM PST
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Manny will wind up back with the Dodgers
the Dodgers just reworked Andruw Jones’ contract, which frees up the money they need to sign Manny. Since Boras is Andruw’s agent as well, it’s obvious he’s working with them to make it easy to sign Manny. The good news is that for the Dodgers’ to do this just to sign Manny they must be broke.
Brian Sabean's dad- will make a few phone calls to help his son find a new job after next season
by rxmeister on
Jan 2, 2009 5:04 PM PST
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Unfortunately I agree that’s where all the signs point. The Dodgers are the only team with any real interest in him (hence the Giants rumors to drive interest/price up for the Dodgers). Manny back to the Dodgers makes them the division favorite, Manny to anyone else arguably makes the Giants the favorite.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 5:06 PM PST
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Agree
But if SF can “assist” Ramirez getting an extra year or $5MM then that is ok too. Now time to turn our interest to the “other” Ramirez.
by wilriv21 on
Jan 2, 2009 5:24 PM PST
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Horacio?
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on
Jan 2, 2009 5:42 PM PST
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Richard?
http://crime.about.com/od/serial/p/nightstaker.htm
I loooove L.A.
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 3, 2009 7:51 AM PST
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pass
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on
Jan 2, 2009 5:57 PM PST
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Rebound
I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!
Jeremy Affeldt Ready To Make His Father Proud
by Giant among Angels on
Jan 2, 2009 6:11 PM PST
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no rebounding. this is warriors country
We don't really have that much pitching depth. We don't really have that much pitching depth. FOR GOD SAKE, VERUCA, DON'T GO FAKE TRADING JONATHAN SANCHEZ. We don't really have that much pitching depth
by oldjacket on
Jan 2, 2009 6:25 PM PST
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no winning either this is giants country
by wilriv21 on
Jan 2, 2009 6:29 PM PST
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not from where you're posting.
(Insert obligatory Vic/Blanks joke here)
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 2, 2009 6:32 PM PST
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I need in on this joke
I’ve seen the picture twice now…
by bondslegend on
Jan 2, 2009 8:54 PM PST
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Yes
but what is the inside joke??? I know how the McCoven work. I want in!
Please.
by bondslegend on
Jan 2, 2009 9:34 PM PST
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I WANT IT AND I WANT IT NOW!
Barry Zito - Mildly half-OK! Sometimes.
by Revolution1 on
Jan 2, 2009 10:44 PM PST
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people who lack patience get Veruca’d
We don't really have that much pitching depth. We don't really have that much pitching depth. FOR GOD SAKE, VERUCA, DON'T GO FAKE TRADING JONATHAN SANCHEZ. We don't really have that much pitching depth
by oldjacket on
Jan 2, 2009 11:01 PM PST
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isn’t veruca’s ‘fatal’ flaw that she’s greedy, and NOT necessarily that she’s impatient?
if anyone was impatient it was Augustus Gloob.
just sayin’.
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on
Jan 5, 2009 1:58 PM PST
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Gluttonous, too.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 5, 2009 3:55 PM PST
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Man, as of right now, McCoven is really 50/50 on this Manny guy
I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!
Jeremy Affeldt Ready To Make His Father Proud
by Giant among Angels on
Jan 2, 2009 6:48 PM PST
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we want the talent but not the player
by wilriv21 on
Jan 2, 2009 6:53 PM PST
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Is that like having your cake and eating it too?
I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!
Jeremy Affeldt Ready To Make His Father Proud
by Giant among Angels on
Jan 2, 2009 6:56 PM PST
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..or throwing it away
I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!
Jeremy Affeldt Ready To Make His Father Proud
by Giant among Angels on
Jan 2, 2009 7:14 PM PST
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we want the talent but not the position – id take him in a heartbeat if he was a corner infielder
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 6:56 PM PST
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JT SNOW COULD TURN HIM INTO A GOLD GLOVE 1B
guaranteed!
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on
Jan 2, 2009 7:41 PM PST
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we may be 50/50 on getting him, but I guarantee he’ll make things very interesting around here. Every atbat would be a happening. Nobody is going to get up and go in the kitchen to make a sandwich when Manny is batting. (unlike the rest of the lineup)
Brian Sabean's dad- will make a few phone calls to help his son find a new job after next season
by rxmeister on
Jan 2, 2009 7:59 PM PST
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I remember those days.
Lots of stuff burned in the kitchen , ran out of hot water , etc.
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 2, 2009 11:03 PM PST
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Plz let this be true…this guy could help us get a WS Championship!! He helped the Red Soxs win 2 Championships & helped the Bums to the NLCS.
J. Wonder
by FutureGM83 on
Jan 2, 2009 7:20 PM PST
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He was also part of a batting order that featured hitters like David Ortiz as opposed to Bengie Molina. We are quite a ways from winning a World Series and we do not need to mortgage the future to try to win it at this point, especially since we actually have a future for the first time in years.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 7:23 PM PST
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How Does Signing Manny Mortgage The Future?
I can unstand many of the reasons to be against this but this reasoning excapes me. If we sign Manny it seems pretty clear to me that we will also be trading one of Rowand or Winn with Lewis moving to RF and the one we keep in CF. So, just which prospect is it you think this blocks? Surely you don’t think the 2nd round pick we would be giving up would be mortgaging the future do you?
by giantsrainman on
Jan 2, 2009 7:43 PM PST
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It really depends on the contract. Knowing Sabean, the 7 years, $126 million is going to kill us for years.
I hope this year we find out if Schierholtz is big league material or not. I’m all for trading Rowand or Winn but my impression (complete uninformed speculation of course) is there’s no real market for them. With 4 more years of Rowands contract, 5 of Zito’s, and up to potentially 4 of Manny’s, that’s a lot of money that could be locked up in players who probably won’t really contribute 3 years down the road.
My last post came off more pessimistic than intended. I wouldn’t necessarily be upset about signing Manny, I just don’t think it’s the right move. And if we do make the decision to go that direction, I’d rather have Bonds for much cheaper.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 7:55 PM PST
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Dave Roberts also helped the Red Sox win a WS
Doesn’t seem to be helping us much.
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on
Jan 2, 2009 7:42 PM PST
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Are You Really Saying Roberts Contributions in 2004 Where Comparable to Manny's?
by giantsrainman on
Jan 2, 2009 7:44 PM PST
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YES. Without him they don't win the world series!
• His contributions to the ALCS were far more significant. In Game 4, the Sox trailed 0-3 in the series and were down 4-3 going into the ninth inning with Mariano Rivera on the mound for the Yankees. Kevin Millar led off with a walk, and Roberts came in to pinch-run. He knew what he had to do. There were no signals from the dugout, just a wink from Terry Francona on his way in. He danced off the bag while Rivera threw to first three times, then threw ball one to Bill Mueller. Roberts broke for second, and slid in just under the tag. Mueller singled on the next pitch and Dave was able to come around and score the tying run. He was replaced in the field the next inning, so he was only in the game for a few minutes. But his stolen base was the most important theft in Red Sox history, and allowed the game to continue into the twefth inning, when David Ortiz’s walkoff blast won the game.
• The following night, in Game 5, the Sox were in a simliar position. A loss would still end their season, and again they were down 4-3 in the eighth inning. Just like Game 4, Millar walked, and Roberts pinch-ran. This time he didn’t even need to steal. Tom Gordon was so preoccupied with holding him at first, that he gave up a single to Trot Nixon. Roberts raced to third on the hit, then scored the tying run on Jason Varitek’s sacrifice fly. Again, Dave’s baserunning had saved the season, and this time Ortiz won it with a walkoff hit in the fourteenth.
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on
Jan 2, 2009 8:01 PM PST
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Where can we find easily accessible stats for the series to show Manny did a lot more than steal a base and go first to third on a single?
Don’t have the stats but I’m going to guess sans-Manny those situations never even come up. The steal was a big play and all but you can’t reasonably argue it was as important as a middle of the order hitter that was playing all series.
by Missing Barry on
Jan 2, 2009 8:04 PM PST
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All I am saying is
Manny is not going to win us the World Series! And that the Red Sox do not make it to the world series without Dave Roberts!
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on
Jan 2, 2009 8:22 PM PST
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The hell with both of them.
Let’s kidnap Big Papi!
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 2, 2009 11:05 PM PST
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Jeez, you're right.
He hit .300/.400/.333 in that series.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 3, 2009 8:52 AM PST
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This time he didn’t even need to steal. Tom Gordon was so preoccupied with holding him at first, that he gave up a single to Trot Nixon
..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.
by Cookyman on
Jan 3, 2009 11:03 AM PST
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Where's the rest of my comment?
The point was, anyway, that you can’t just assume that anything good that happened happened because Roberts was on the bases.
..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.
by Cookyman on
Jan 3, 2009 11:05 AM PST
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HE STOLE TEH BASE ONSE!
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 3, 2009 8:49 AM PST
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All the Giants need is to go back in time
and grab the entire 2004 Red Sox roster and bring them into 2009.
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 2, 2009 8:41 PM PST
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No Millar. But I can’t stop thinking about Billy Mueller.
by shanghaijim on
Jan 3, 2009 4:57 AM PST
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Mueller. Hope they bring him in as a coach. Make me happy.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 3, 2009 8:54 AM PST
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He gave me my first fan autograph ever
August … 6, I think, 2000. It was trading card day. They beat … the Pirates? I’m too lazy to look it up. Was hanging around the 2nd Street player’s gate staring at Dusty Baker’s motorcycle when Mueller came out all fresh-showery and started signing. Gah, release him, Colletti … give him back …
by shanghaijim on
Jan 3, 2009 7:35 PM PST
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Probably not my first..
But I got his autograph after a SJ Giants game, along with a bat. Must have been 4/12/1994.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 4, 2009 7:02 PM PST
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I rather keep Bonds
SF Loves him, he’s cheep, he’ll bring more people to the park, and should have a shorter contract.
Hasheem "The Dream" Thabeet or Brandon Jennings. A Warrior in 09.
With the 6th Pick in the 2009 MLB Draft, the SF Giants pick Donovan Tate.
Andre Smith in Silver & Black in 2009.
by ejdacanay on
Jan 2, 2009 7:48 PM PST
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Would be an interesting poll (not for just McCoven) but all SF Giants fans whether they would want the Giants to sign Barry Bonds.
by wilriv21 on
Jan 2, 2009 7:50 PM PST
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Man, enough Bonds. Been there, done that.
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 2, 2009 8:39 PM PST
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cheep, cheep, cheep
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 3, 2009 8:55 AM PST
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That's rather cryptic
What Cardinal are you suggesting would be a cheep alternative to Ramirez or Bonds?
by Sabertooth on
Jan 3, 2009 9:15 AM PST
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Anquan Boldin
/In Mesa , awaiting today’s annihilation
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on
Jan 3, 2009 9:37 AM PST
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Damn. I should put money on the falcons, come to think of it.
They are way better than the 1point spread that was going earlier.
We don't really have that much pitching depth. We don't really have that much pitching depth. FOR GOD SAKE, VERUCA, DON'T GO FAKE TRADING JONATHAN SANCHEZ. We don't really have that much pitching depth
by oldjacket on
Jan 3, 2009 11:21 AM PST
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Fuck the cards
their team is a total joke and should not be in the playoffs, let alone winning this game. Time for the Falcons to play like an NFL team for gods sake.
by bondslegend on
Jan 3, 2009 2:37 PM PST
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They are the most deserving team in the pathetic NFC West.
I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!
Jeremy Affeldt Ready To Make His Father Proud
by Giant among Angels on
Jan 3, 2009 4:53 PM PST
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No doubt
if ever there was an argument for record-based seeding, this season is it.
by bondslegend on
Jan 3, 2009 5:16 PM PST
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But then what’s even the point of divisions? I’m not saying that I disagree… I actually lean toward record based seeding, but I also think there’s something worthwhile about a system that isn’t completely fair (as we know, from my arguments for the unbalanced schedule in baseball).
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 4, 2009 10:42 AM PST
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I just realized my mistake here. I was actually talking about how the teams get INTO the playoffs (for instance, why San Diego made it in over New England), not how they are seeded once they get in. Yeah, the Cardinals hosting the Falcons is more than a little ridiculous.
The Chargers getting in over New England is still a bit screwed, but there’s something about that system that I like. It at least makes sense, and it creates some intrigue. Seeding the way they do just doesn’t make much sense.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 4, 2009 11:44 AM PST
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Yes
I have no problem with the way teams make the playoffs (though I do think that, even if you win a divison, you shouldn’t get in unless you’re over .500), because it does add a lot of excitement to the last few weeks. If divisions didn’t matter, then we’d have known the NFL playoff schedule in like week 14. I also have no problem with any system that keeps the patriots out, because fuck them and their fans and their cheating coach.
But yeah, the playoff seeding based on divisions is crap.
by bondslegend on
Jan 4, 2009 2:40 PM PST
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Not really cryptic..
I was saying that birds go “cheep, cheep, cheep,” while players who are less expensive than others would be “cheap.”
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 4, 2009 7:04 PM PST
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Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa. Slow down and start over, please. Is this some kind of complicated simile?
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 4, 2009 9:08 PM PST
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That’s not a cheep cheep at all.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 3, 2009 10:16 AM PST
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I didn’t want to seem like a nerd.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 4, 2009 7:04 PM PST
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Do you mean that as in, “more of a”?
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 4, 2009 9:08 PM PST
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Yes he had players like Ortiz…but who hit behind him so he can get those fat pitches? Whoever hits in front of him, my guess would be Pablo will make him even better! And who is Manny going to block in left field? Lewis? Nate? Manny isn’t blocking any of our big prospects!
J. Wonder
by FutureGM83 on
Jan 2, 2009 8:22 PM PST
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Well..
If he blocks Lewis then he blocks an above average hitter with average or better defense in LF.
If he blocks Schierholtz then he blocks someone that could be an average or better hitter with average or better defense in RF.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 3, 2009 8:56 AM PST
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Plus alot of money is coming off the books next offseason, when Winn, Roberts, The Unit, Howry & etc. is gone. So I don’t think we would be putting our future in jeopardy.
J. Wonder
by FutureGM83 on
Jan 2, 2009 8:27 PM PST
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Yep, $36M All Told For Winn, Johnson, Roberts, Molina, Lowry, and Howry
You do have to balance this with $1.6M Raise for Cain and Super 2 Arbitration Awards for Lincecum, Wilson, and maybe Lewis too. But There should still be at least $20M coming of the books net.
by giantsrainman on
Jan 2, 2009 8:38 PM PST
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I Am With You Here. This Would Indeed Be The Smart Move.
The only concern is that both the RedSox and the Angels are very likely to be hot after Holiday while we really on have the Dodgers to compete with for Manny.
by giantsrainman on
Jan 2, 2009 8:53 PM PST
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THIS
Rafael Rodriguez: Your number 8 organizational prospect before stepping a foot on American soil and has "looked just super so far," according to Felipe Alou...according to Baggs.
by BrianBokake on
Jan 5, 2009 1:27 PM PST
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Sanchez is arbitration eligible
and Rowand gets a raise as well.
"And you just don't get it, you keep it copacetic..."
by Blicks on
Jan 3, 2009 4:38 PM PST
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You Are Right About Sanchez But Wrong About Rowand
Rowand get’s 12M every year of his 5 year contract. In 2008 and 2009 it is $8M salary and $4M Signing bonus each year. 2010-2012 it is all salary.
I left out Frandsen too who also should become arbitration eligable after 2009. In addition, if we still have Taschner he will be going into his second arbitration year next year.
All that said I would still expect a net of $20M+ in savings.
by giantsrainman on
Jan 3, 2009 5:32 PM PST
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This is one case where I hope and pray Scott Boras says the Giants offer is too low and they move on. I would take Manny for one year but NOT four.
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 2, 2009 8:38 PM PST
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I’d accept two but no more.
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 2, 2009 8:40 PM PST
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2 With An 3rd Year Option That Vests With 1200 PAs Combined Or An NL MVP?
by giantsrainman on
Jan 2, 2009 8:42 PM PST
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Probably not. Thankfully Boras wouldn’t go for that.
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 2, 2009 8:43 PM PST
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I think you should photoshop a picture of Manny
and make it look like that stupid A-rod picture that you posted on here about 6,009,531 times.
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on
Jan 2, 2009 8:52 PM PST
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That Wasn't My Post That Was Someone Else's Mocking My Desire To Have The Giants Go After A-Rod
Personally I am against signing Manny. If the Giants are truely thinking along these lines I am in the camp that Barry could do almost as much and maybe even more for alot less in both dollars and years. My plan would be to sign Barry (after his trial in March if he is aquitted as I believe is likely) for this year and Matt Holiday for 2010 and beyond.
by giantsrainman on
Jan 2, 2009 8:58 PM PST
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I like Barry but what’s so wrong with Fast Freddy?
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on
Jan 2, 2009 9:06 PM PST
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Nobody will see this this late, but that's probably for the best...
I apologize for the unfortunate victim, but I found this amusing on a few levels, in a twisted sort of way. I would have posted sooner if I hadn’t had problems reclaiming my old account.
by Tamdrik on
Jan 4, 2009 7:48 AM PST
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WTF
That is so wrong on so many levels.
Sergio Romo will gladly hand you a bench to sit on / GIANTSPACE™ / Adopted brother of the AnVil
by SoFa King Mike on
Jan 4, 2009 9:17 AM PST
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At least a billion.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on
Jan 4, 2009 10:42 AM PST
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Clear out your desk. I want you out of the building by five o’clock.
by satyricrash on
Jan 4, 2009 12:46 PM PST
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Flagged as inappropriate
We're all basically Pedro Feliz.
by SF Pete on
Jan 5, 2009 10:20 AM PST
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Bad
so bad….
Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all.
by baetown415 on
Jan 5, 2009 11:00 AM PST
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Thanks, I hadn’t thrown up in my mouth yet today.
Rafael Rodriguez: Your number 8 organizational prospect before stepping a foot on American soil and has "looked just super so far," according to Felipe Alou...according to Baggs.
by BrianBokake on
Jan 5, 2009 1:30 PM PST
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One thing about if the Giants sign Manny
ESPN would talk Yankees, Red Sox then Giants.
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 2, 2009 8:46 PM PST
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Question
who gives a shit who ESPN talks about and in what order? They are idiots who know nothing about baseball, so why should we care what they think?
by bondslegend on
Jan 2, 2009 8:57 PM PST
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It seems to be mentioned a lot here and elsewhere about ESPN’s bias toward the Yankees and Red Sox.
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 2, 2009 9:38 PM PST
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There's no question
they have a bias towards east coast teams generally and new england teams specifically, but I just don’t get why it matters. I watch ESPN to get highlights and scores of games I miss. Beyond that, I really don’t get why their opinion is worth any more than yours or mine, they’re just lucky enough to get paid to talk about sports. They don’t actually know anymore than the average well-informed fan, and in many cases (Joe Morgan, John Kruk, etc) they know considerably less. Don’t mean to rant, but ESPN and talking heads in general kind of piss me off. I get much more actual information and knowledge here than I’ve ever gotten on TV.
by bondslegend on
Jan 2, 2009 10:56 PM PST
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well
look at it this way: it’s more money for the giants. The lay fan is more likely to care more about their team if they’re featured on ESPN every night. More likely to get nationally televised games, also more likely to make it to the postseason and the revenue that brings.
by Viliphied on
Jan 3, 2009 12:34 AM PST
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The Giants own part of a network
They own about 20-30% of Comcast Sportsnet Bay Area. One article was written about the economics of baseball and actually said some teams were healthy and quoted “like the New York Yankees with the Yes Network and the San Francisco Giants with Comcast Sportsnet”.
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 3, 2009 2:45 AM PST
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Nothing hurts..
Getting even more money though.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 3, 2009 8:58 AM PST
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That's precisely why
They must be forced to recognize that there are other teams than the ones north and south of Bristol CN. They’ve monopolized (until MLB.tv) baseball coverage, outside of the Fox postseason nonsense, and it’s detrimental, as you’ve pointed out.
by shanghaijim on
Jan 3, 2009 5:02 AM PST
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I take it you have not seen much of the MLB TV Network yet ?
I really like some of the special features ( Hot Stove, Inside the Moments, Prime 9, Icons), but there is entirely too much “Red Sox History and Yankee-ness” going on. I’m willing to give them some time, but they had better spread it around some. The Giants are one of the premier teams in the history of baseball. How about about a little love MLB !
The clock doesn't matter in baseball. Time stands still or moves backwards. Theoretically, one game could go on forever. Some seem to.-Herb Caen
My adopted son Matt Downs . Utility Infielder with a Bat !
by nvsfg on
Jan 3, 2009 10:46 AM PST
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Yeah, I am not impressed so far.
by Lars The Wanderer on
Jan 3, 2009 11:23 AM PST
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Mlb DOT tv
the online thing that lets those of us in minnesota watch giants games. That’s what he meant..i think.
by bondslegend on
Jan 3, 2009 2:39 PM PST
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Ah, thanks for the clarification. So the network is officially the MLB TV Network, while MLB.tv is the online thing, which I hear pays for half the GNP of Tuvalu.
by shanghaijim on
Jan 3, 2009 7:31 PM PST
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indeed
it’s totally awesome. I really wish the NFL would grow up and do something similar.
by bondslegend on
Jan 3, 2009 7:36 PM PST
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I am in Asia
and whenever I bring up baseball — to my own father, who knows me better — he always says, “Oh, and the Yankees [insert event irrelevant to the NL West here]”. You’d think the Philippines, with all the people who live, have lived, or intend to live in California, who once had a substantial professional baseball league in a sport far better suited to our stature and skills than basketfuckingball, would be more interested. But you’d be wrong.
Excuse me, rant. Anyway, short answer: MLB.tv does not exist here yet. But ESPN does, and when it does cover baseball, it’s the fricking AL East. I am actually glad my old dormmate Joe Nelson got signed by the Rays, so at least I have a minute stake in what happens in that division.
by shanghaijim on
Jan 3, 2009 7:29 PM PST
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Being a typical person living in america
I don’t ever think of people in other parts of the world when I go on my self-righteous rants. Those who live in your part of the world could always go to homertv.net if you wanted to watch baseball. I’ll just say I know someone who lives in North Dakota and doesn’t want to pay for Sunday Ticket to see his niners, and who may have taken advantage of this site’s provisions this season. They also have MLB and pretty much every other sporting event that’s on TV.
by bondslegend on
Jan 3, 2009 7:40 PM PST
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Eugene Espineli
FTW
Giants pitching coach Dave Righetti. "I treat Timmy differently from most pitchers: I leave him alone."
by natteringnabob on
Jan 4, 2009 6:22 AM PST
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Tim lovingly refers to him as “err…uh…that guy”.
by Lars The Wanderer on
Jan 4, 2009 2:01 PM PST
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On Saturday, they showed Game 1 of the 2008 World Series. While the January schedule does have a lot of Yankees and Red Sox, there are other stuff on the schedule. No Giants stuff, though.
And what was wrong with the Don Larsen Perfect Game? (Side note: Giant link there. The two starting pitchers played for the Giants. Brooklyn starter Sal Maglie was a NY Giant. Larsen played for the SF Giants.)
A McC newcomer but not outstanding.
by SFGuy on
Jan 4, 2009 1:47 AM PST
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Good point
I guess it’s annoying to have them dictating what teams people pay attention to, but in this day and age there’s really no excuse for a fan to be ignorant of the league. There are so many other ways to find out about sports, specifically baseball, that it should no longer matter what games/teams ESPN covers.
by bondslegend on
Jan 3, 2009 2:41 PM PST
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Giants will need to figure out
how to be competitive with the Dodgers after they re-sign Manny thanks to the reworked Jones contract. Because once Manny re-ups with the Dodgers, the Giants offense needs an upgrade to have a shot at the division. Yes, the Giants’ pitching will be better, but the Dodgers will have a better lineup and run production than the Giants.
Sabean is supposedly working on trades right now, and he’ll need them if/when the Bums re-sign Manny.
Matt Cain's drinking buddy
by Buck Henry on
Jan 2, 2009 9:37 PM PST
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It is not all about the offense
True the offense needs to be upgraded however SF pitching gave up a ton of runs in 2008. Sabean has addressed some of the pitching issues with the signings of Affeldt, Howry and Johnson. An improved pitching staff that yields fewer runs will help SF improve its record in 2009.
by wilriv21 on
Jan 2, 2009 11:17 PM PST
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So close....
428 to 429. A MCC rift, it would seem.
72-90 - TIMMY FOR CY YOUNG!!!
Adopted Giant: Daryl Maday - The roller coaster ride continues - Augusta to Norwich to San Jose, the latter of which has been a success so far. 1.59 ERA.
by rhys on
Jan 3, 2009 8:45 AM PST
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I believe it's time for a RUNOFF
Oh…damn.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
by WalrusMan on
Jan 3, 2009 8:59 AM PST
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Ramirez for 2 + option vs. Bonds for 1?
by Sabertooth on
Jan 3, 2009 9:19 AM PST
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How Many Times Have You Voted No?
4 or 5 times for me.
by Cainer on
Jan 3, 2009 11:44 AM PST
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Grant is a hard man to convine.
Proud adopter of Jason Jarvis: let's see YOU pass an online music course without cheating!
by Gaahl on
Jan 3, 2009 12:06 PM PST
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crede and uggla
getting manny makes some sense, and immediately adds about 50 guaranteed runs to the giants. at least. plus, they keep him away from the dodgers. but only if you can keep it at two years. what the giants SHOULD do, is trade for uggla (sanchez and burriss/velez/frandsen for him) and sign crede. then…
Winn
Renteria
Uggla
Crede
Molina
Sandoval
Rowand
Lewis
Lincecum
(or something like that)
by FreshPrince712 on
Jan 3, 2009 6:48 PM PST
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I do like Uggla’s bat, though I do not want to part with Sanchez’s arm (at least not yet).
I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!
Jeremy Affeldt Ready To Make His Father Proud
by Giant among Angels on
Jan 3, 2009 6:50 PM PST
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furthermore
in agreement with some statements above, manny keeps everything interesting. it probably puts the team over the top in a weak NL west. and, he sells tickets. so while it will take at least 20 million a year to get him, he’ll drastically increase ticket sales in a sagging economy.
by FreshPrince712 on
Jan 3, 2009 6:50 PM PST
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I just want to see everyone in 138 wearing Dread Wigs.
And on the 6th day, God created base-ball, and Barry put one in the water, and it was good.
"I think I just experienced my first Lincegasm."
by bigboneded on
Jan 4, 2009 8:57 AM PST
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Just sign Bonds
If they really want a bad defensive outfielder with power, why not sign Bonds to the one-year major league minimum salary his agent was pushing last year instead a commitment to Manny, for god knows how long, in the range of 15 to 20 million a year? Sure, Barry maybe in jail, but I’d rather take that chance than the chance of Manny hitting for the next four or so years like he has in the past. It would make for an interesting 2009 season either way.
by Sayhey on
Jan 4, 2009 9:57 AM PST
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Unfortunately
this will never happen. I wouldn’t mind seeing barry again, but I really doubt the team could possibly make this move.
by bondslegend on
Jan 4, 2009 2:43 PM PST
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Don’t we already have enough center fielders?
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
by zenbitz on
Jan 5, 2009 9:56 AM PST
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