Manny?
wait.... what?!
10 months ago
dogdays
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I would love it.
But I’m sure it’s just Boras being Boras…
You probably know it as MYANMAR, but it will always be BURMA to me!
by NuschlerFace on Jan 1, 2009 10:05 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
What does "Manny Being Manny" mean at AT&T?
Ghost ride the Chevron car in left?
by Rusty the Robot on Jan 1, 2009 10:11 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Good Hyphy Knowledge
Leading the Pro-Aaron Rowand contingent on the McC!
You can ridicule me in 2009 if you like...
by ThrillisGone22 on Jan 2, 2009 12:22 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't see this happening
Proud father of Eric Surkamp!!!
by The Thrill on Jan 1, 2009 10:13 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Smack your head against the wall.
Open your mind!
Oh , there’s my son…“Hi , Jack!”
Y’all catching Barkley’s candid asshattery in Scottsdale?
http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2008/12/31/20081231Barkley31-ON.html
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on Jan 1, 2009 11:20 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought the Giants were at their limit
On signing A and B free agents.
by Sabertooth on Jan 1, 2009 10:16 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
This
Assuming that is a correct interpretation of the rules, then it’s kind of funny how folks in the baseball world who should know better can still be manipulated by this kind of rumor-mongering.
The 2008-2009 offseason is driving me sane!
by hairball on Jan 1, 2009 10:38 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
not at their limit...
because edgar, randy, and howry were not offered arbitration, they don’t count as giants signing type
A or B free agents. technically affeldt is the only type a or b free agent the giants have signed. so no they are not at the limit.
by travis j bagdad on Jan 1, 2009 10:52 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Not True - They Giants Are At Their Limit
Here Is The CBA For You To Check
I see nowhere where not being offered arbitration excludes a player from the restrictions of this quota. But, I did find that being non tendored did indeed exclude a player from the restrictions of this quota.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 11:35 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
There is a little language
that implies he’s got a valid point. The CBA states that the club declining to offer arbitration loses all rights to compensation of said player.
I know that the statement doesn’t prove anything but common sense would lead one to believe that the Giants are still eligible to go after rated FA’s as the typeA/B ranking would go out the window. It is meant only to be a protection for the “former Club” and if they decline that protection the Type A/B designation is no longer relevant in FA dealings.
by dogdays on Jan 1, 2009 2:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
But The Quota Has Nothing To Do With Compensation
The quota is all above trying to matain competative balance by resticting the number any one team can sign. I just can see no other way to interpret the CBA other then that this year with 63 Type A/B Free Agents no team can sign more then 4 unless they lose more then 4. The Giants have already signed their 4 and I see no way they can be allowed to sign another.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 2:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
A and B limits...
From the No more big signings thread:
(a) Clubs shall be limited in the number of Type A and B Players,
as defined below, they may subsequently sign to contracts. The
number of signings permitted shall be related to the number of Players
electing free agency under this Section B. If there are 14 or less
such Players, no Club may sign more than one Type A or B Player.
If there are from 15 to 38 such Players, no Club may sign more than
two Type A or B Players. If there are from 39 to 62 such Players, no
Club may sign more than three Type A or B Players. If there are
more than 62 such Players, the Club quotas shall be increased
accordingly. There shall be no restrictions on the number of
unranked Players that a Club may sign to contracts.
(b) Irrespective of the provisions of subparagraph (a) above, a
Club shall be eligible to sign at least as many Type A and B Players
as it may have lost through Players having become free agents under
this Section at the close of the season just concluded.
I don’t see an exemption there for FAs not offered arbitration. Is there a clause somewhere else in the CBA?
by Sabertooth on Jan 1, 2009 11:20 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I know I asked this elsewhere...
…unfortunately I forgot where “elsewhere” is.
What differentiates an “A” FA from a “B” FA? Length of service?
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on Jan 1, 2009 11:24 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
A and B players...
Type A players are among the top 20% at their grouping, and a team losing a Type A free agent to another club receives a draft pick from that club. Type B players are among 21-40 in their grouping, and a team losing a Type B free agent to another club receives a “sandwich” pick between rounds of the amateur draft.
by Sabertooth on Jan 1, 2009 11:35 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Direct From The CBA
Type A Players: A Type A Player shall be a Player who ranks in
the upper twenty percent (20) of his respective position group.
Type B Players: AType B Player shall be a Player who ranks in
the upper forty percent (40) but not in the upper twenty percent
(20%) of his respective position group.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 11:39 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Muchas freddy Garcias.
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on Jan 1, 2009 11:57 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Not That I Can Find.
I have linked to the entire CBA above so that you can check for yourself.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 11:31 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Couldn't find it at first
But I see your post now on the “No more big signings” thread. So non-tendered FAs aren’t subject to the quota, do I have that right? I think I read only one of our FA’s had been tendered, meaning theoretically we still have openings for three more FA’s under the quota?
by Sabertooth on Jan 1, 2009 11:41 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You Are Confusing Not Being Offered Arbitration With Not Being Tendored
They are not the same. None of the free agents we signed were non tendored. You are correct that Affeldt is the only one considered to have been offered arbitration becuse he was signed in November before the deadline to offer arbitration. But I can find nowhere in the CBA where not being offered arbitration excludes a player for this quota.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 11:47 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Ah, OK
Can you explain the difference?
by Sabertooth on Jan 1, 2009 12:11 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
MLB players fall into 3 catagories if you will.
Players with less the 3 years of MLB service are not free to select free agency and thus can be tendored a contract for any amount equal to or greater then the MLB minimum ($400K in 2009). The team is also free to non tendor them and thus make them free agents.
Players with more then 3 years of MLB service but less then 6 years of MLB service quallify for pre free agency arbitation and thus can have an arbitrator deside if their desired salary or the team’s offer is more fair. They however are not free to decline arbitration and sign with another team. Their team however is free to non tendor them thus make them free agents ala Ty Wigginton.
Players with more then 6 years of MLB service who’s contracts have expired are eligable to file for Free Agency. Once they file for free agency their previous team then can decide to offer arbitration to them. if their previous team does make this offer and they are Type A/B then draft pick compensation applies. These players offered arbitration are free to accept or reject it. It is the Type A/Bs of this whole group (not just those offered arbitration) that the quota applies to. There is nothing in the CBA that says being offered or not being offered arbitration has any effect on the quota for these Type A/Bs in this group.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 3:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The number of signings permitted shall be related to the number of Players
electing free agency under this Section B.
It could be that “electing free agency” implies declining arbitration.
..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.
by Cookyman on Jan 1, 2009 12:49 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
If That Were The Case Then The Giants Limit Would Be 3 Not The 4 They Signed
Darren Oliver of the Angels and David Weathers of the Reds are the only Type A/B players that were offered arbitration and accepted. If they are excluded then there are just 61 Type A/B Free Agents and the limit would then be 3.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 1:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you misunderstood
What I originally meant is that, at least if you take “electing free agency” literally, only the signing of players who became free agents by declining arbitration (thereby “electing free agency”) is limited.
But, now I remember that even players who weren’t offered arbitration still have to file for free agency, which is also a way of electing it, so they’re not really different from those who declined arbitration.
It does, however, explain why player who were non-tendered don’t count – they’re the ones who really didn’t get to choose.
..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.
by Cookyman on Jan 1, 2009 1:55 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
So Wiggington or Crede the Giants could sign, but
Pat Burrell and Manny are off limits? I like how this CBA works.
by Cainer on Jan 1, 2009 2:11 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
If 63 or more players file for free agency, then there are no such limits applied. Furthermore, a team may sign as many type A and B free agents as it has lost, regardless of the limits above.
http://baseball.suite101.com/article.cfm/baseball_free_agency_rules
by TimLincecumIsGod on Jan 1, 2009 11:45 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
This Quote Does Not Agree With The CBA As I Quote Below
If there are from 15 to 38 such Players, no Club may sign more than
two Type A or B Players. If there are from 39 to 62 such Players, no
Club may sign more than three Type A or B Players. If there are
more than 62 such Players, the Club quotas shall be increased
accordingly.
Again, check the actual CBA.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 11:51 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Here Is How I Read This
01-014 Type A/Bs no more then 1 per team
15-038 Type A/Bs no more then 2 per team
39-062 Type A/Bs no more then 3 per team
63-096 Type A/Bs no more then 4 per team
97-120 Type A/Bs no more then 5 per team
Etc
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 12:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
this seems wrong
first of all the wording of the cba leads me to believe that all free agents are counted, not just type A/Bs. It says “the number of signings permiited shall be related to the number of players electing free agency.” the ‘such players’ in the section you quoted is referring to the sentence from the cba i just quoted.
also i’m not sure how you came up with the ranges for 4 and 5 type A/Bs per team. the only thing i can find in the cba is that it says that if there are more than 62 free agents the club quotas shall be increased accordingly.
i count around 182 free agents according to mlbtraderumors.com. if thats the case than it seems quite possible to me that they just lift the limit since that number is so much larger than the 62 they talk about in the cba
by TimLincecumIsGod on Jan 1, 2009 5:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
In A Discussion At MLB Trade Rumors I Just Came To The Same Conclusion
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/01/giants-aggressi.html?cid=143872222#comment-143872222
It is the total of all 6+ Year MLB Experience Free Agents available (not just the total of Type A/B 6+ Year MLB Experience Free Agents) that sets the limit on how many Type A/B Free Agents any team can sign.
I do think though that I am right about the 4 and 5 type A/Bs per team. after the first 14 each of the next two groupings referenced in the CBA just added 24 so I just projected this out by adding 24 two more times.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 6:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
takes some interesting math to add 24 to 62 and end up with 96 =D
by TimLincecumIsGod on Jan 1, 2009 6:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Fair Enough
It should have been 63-86 and 87-110 instead of 63-96 and 97-120.
by giantsrainman on Jan 1, 2009 7:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Here's another take:
http://baseball.suite101.com/article.cfm/baseball_free_agency_rules
“If 63 or more players file for free agency, then there are no such limits applied. Furthermore, a team may sign as many type A and B free agents as it has lost, regardless of the limits above.”
by MiGigantes on Jan 2, 2009 6:02 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
This Was Already Discussed And Is Wrong
The Language of the CBA states:
If there are more than 62 such Players, the Club quotas shall be increased
accordingly.
by giantsrainman on Jan 2, 2009 11:25 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Driving up the price for the Dodgers = woohoo
Actually seriously considering this = oh god no
by Sammy Danger on Jan 1, 2009 12:16 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Call me Nostradamus
but if we signed Manny, I can see the Giants becoming this year’s Detroit Tigers. Big expectations, big letdown.
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
by Useful_Idiot on Jan 1, 2009 12:21 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
"Negative vibes , Moriarity."
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on Jan 1, 2009 5:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I had to google that
It was before my time, apparently
Wall-E for Best Picture 2008
by Useful_Idiot on Jan 2, 2009 9:52 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
"Kelly's Heroes"
Uttered by Donald Sutherland , ah dew buhleeve.
I may not have quoted precisely , but that’s the gist.
Who has the fun?
Is it always the man with the gun?
- The Stranglers
by victor frankenstein on Jan 2, 2009 6:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
A one year deal would be awesome. Manny in a contract year is quite valuable.
by cheno on Jan 1, 2009 1:31 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
1 year 1 billion dollars
I see the future, and it is Pablo
by CB30 on Jan 1, 2009 8:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
GIants offer Ramirez 4-year deal
http://cbs5.com/local/giants.manny.ramirez.2.896827.html
Don’t ask me why I’m on CBS5 at 1:30 in the morning but I came across this little gem. Who the hell is this “well connected source” and why would he leak to Dennis O’Donnell?
by baybruin415 on Jan 2, 2009 1:35 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
As much as I wanna say “Fuck no”, a little part in my head is saying “But we’ll be the team to beat in the NL West!”.
Don't think, it could only hurt the ballclub.
by ResDog on Jan 2, 2009 6:26 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
We were the team to beat last season too, though. Remember how everybody beat us?
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jan 2, 2009 8:09 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Everybody except for the eventual World Series champion.
by Lars The Wanderer on Jan 2, 2009 2:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Manny Ramirez
Lets wait until a source other than Dennis O’Donnell has solid information about any contract offers before we get all wound up one way or the other. Interestingly enough the only sources that have anything to say on this are channel 5, some Denver CO newspaper and SI.COM. No local papers, not the Giants, not Scott Boras not MLB – not even Peter Gammons.
by dcpitcher on Jan 2, 2009 4:53 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Manny Ramirez
I would rather see the Giants sign Joe Crede and Pat Burrell for LESS MONEY than it would cost to get Manny. Manny would be fun and all but I thought we were going with a younger team????
by dcpitcher on Jan 2, 2009 4:55 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Signing These Two Benches Sandoval Who I Think Is Likely To Be Better Then Both - Bad Idea!
by giantsrainman on Jan 2, 2009 5:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Then You Are Benching Lewis Which Is Just As Stupid
by giantsrainman on Jan 2, 2009 6:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Or trading him or moving him to RF and trading Winn or moving Winn to CF and Lewis to RF and trading Rowand etc etc etc
by wilriv21 on Jan 2, 2009 6:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

















