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Ah, pitch counts. I meant to do a post next week on Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain leading the league in pitches thrown, but Bruce Jenkins's series on pitch counts made the topic current. Jenkins and I can agree on a couple of things, such as...

But when you have a young, healthy starter and you're making distinctions between 110 and 120 pitches, you've driven way off the road.

I agree. The difference between 110 and 120 pitches? Who knows? There isn't conclusive evidence that 120 is measurably worse than 110 or 100, so passing either of those arbitrary benchmarks shouldn't make anyone froth at the mouth. Jenkins doesn't want managers to be seduced by 100 pitches simply because it's a nice round number. Again, I completely agree. How tired is a pitcher? You can't tell that from a single number. Context, context, context.

But even though Jenkins wants to base his entire argument around context, the entire article breaks down because context isn't taken into account. Jenkins rails against some shadowy cabal of bespectacled nerds for daring to question the decision to leave C.C. Sabathia in for 130 pitches, but the raw number isn't what caused the most dissent. No one made a peep when Sabathia threw 122 pitches in a one-run victory against the Reds.

The loudest moaning was reserved for the fact that the Brewers were up by six runs going into the eighth inning. Jenkins brings up Mark Prior, noting that it was alright for Prior to throw 120+ pitches every night because the Cubs were going for it. But that wouldn't explain what Prior was still doing in this game. No, there's a much better reason why teams should let young pitchers like Sabathia and Prior rack up huge pitch counts when outcome of the game isn't in question:

Teeth-gritting gumption points.

Didn't you hear? They award a special trophy for teeth-gritting gumption points. Pitchers who accrue the most teeth-gritting gumption points can look their grandkids in the eyes. That's why Jenkins's entire argument revolves around "finish what you start" and blaming people who "have no idea how it feels to actually compete."* His argument doesn't revolve around research, like that of The Hardball Times, who noted that pitchers are still getting hurt in a pitch-conscious era. Jenkins doesn't draw our attention to the Reliever's Paradox -- if pitch counts are the last word, then why do 20-pitch-per game lefty specialists also fall to injury? Jenkins doesn't ask how 100 pitches -- a number that's significant only because it has one more digit than 99 -- became an arbitrary-yet-magical number.

Nope. Teeth-gritting gumption points. Gutting it out. Making sure you out-platitude the other guy. Don't be a sissy, sissy. Learn how to win. Kids these days, I'll tell you. Spoiled divas, the lot of them. That's what's wrong with the cautious mindset of the modern baseball man.

The argument goes something like this: Pitchers should throw as many pitches as they used to because a) that's how they used to do it, and b) remember when that was how they used to do it? Jenkins invokes the Ozzy Osbourne Defense. Hey, Ozzy used to snort piles of cocaine the size of Marvin Benard. But Ozzy's still alive, right? Ergo, nuts to moderation with that stuff. Jenkins lists pitchers like Mike Krukow (who went from 10 complete games to five wins the next year), Fernando Valenzuela (who went from 12 complete games to five wins the next year), and Dave Stewart (who went from 10 complete games to an ERA above 5.00) as examples of a purer era gone by.

Did the complete games cause the eventual ineffectiveness of those pitchers? Maybe, maybe not. And that's the point. The great pitch-count debate is stagnant for now. Every pitcher has a limit, but we don't know what that limit is. It probably shifts from game to game, from inning to inning. But there's a $50M difference between a healthy Matt Cain and a free agent like Carlos Silva, and that doesn't even take performance into account. Even if you want to go to the store and buy a new, full-price young ace if  the one you have breaks down, there might not be a comparable pitcher to buy. Every arm probably has a finite number of pitches in it, so maybe discretion is the better part of valor when it comes to a prized investment. If your bullpen isn't good enough to trust with a two-run lead in the eighth, it probably isn't part of a championship team, so don't let your starter throw 120 pitches every...single...game if you can avoid it.

Even with that general guideline, there should be a few reasons to ignore pitch counts. If the playoffs are on the line, your bullpen is a hydrant filled with kerosene, and the starter in question doesn't seem tired, then, yeah, toss out the book. Go for the win. There isn't conclusive evidence that x number of pitches thrown is automatically tantamount to rotator cuff pudding. Use common sense. Sabathia heading toward 130 pitches in a one-run game? I'm not wild about the idea, but if Sabathia feels fine, heads shouldn't roll for the decision.

But here are some poor reasons for tossing out pitch counts: outdated notions of duty, toughness, or cowardice. Doing it because you can, because there's something oh-so-special about the complete game that transcends any notion of prudence. Sabathia heading toward 130 pitches with a seven-run lead? Now you're just gunning for teeth-gritting gumption points.

So, you, with the flashing siren of panic that goes off every time a pitcher goes over 100 pitches: go away. You, with the appeal to the good ol' days and meaningless notions of toughness: go away. Both extremes of the debate need to go away. The rest of us will watch baseball and understand that there's a balance of risk versus reward. It's a balance that will have to do until some compelling evidence comes along and settles the debate.

* The "but you don't play the game!"-argument is always lame, but it's especially lame coming from a sportswriter. I could strike Jenkins out on three pitches. That doesn't mean I have the better argument. You don't need to be an aardvark to major in zoology.

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Display:

Jenkins Part II

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/08/26/SPJV122RC3.DTL

Grant, you might like this better. Operative word “might”.

P.S. Can you delete my fanshot on this?

by giantsrainman on Aug 26, 2008 11:11 PM PDT   0 recs

You can delete your own Fanshots/posts.

Farewell, Ray. We'll miss your smile and your sugar. Welcome, Steve Hammond "Eggs". Throw strikes.
comics | cartoons | Nattowear

by Natto on Aug 26, 2008 11:12 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Thanks, I Didn't Know

Do you know what is wrong with my links here?

by giantsrainman on Aug 26, 2008 11:16 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The SB Nation code is pretty picky with what it decides to convert to a link. Your best bet is to paste the link, select it, and click the link button (next to the picture of the tree above the comment box) to post the link.

Farewell, Ray. We'll miss your smile and your sugar. Welcome, Steve Hammond "Eggs". Throw strikes.
comics | cartoons | Nattowear

by Natto on Aug 26, 2008 11:18 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I Am Not Seeing A Link Buttom

I did paste the link but I do not see a way to select it either.

by giantsrainman on Aug 26, 2008 11:24 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

<a href=" http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/08/26/SPJV122RC3.DTL " >Do it like this

by bondslegend on Aug 26, 2008 11:23 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

How Do You Do This

In a comment. I don’t seem to have this option.

by giantsrainman on Aug 26, 2008 11:35 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

You copy the link you want from your browser, then look above the comment box- there’s bold, italic, strike thru, quote, and the next one is link. HIghlight the part of your comment you want to be the link, then click on the link button, then paste the URL you copied, then click submit. Like this.

by bondslegend on Aug 27, 2008 10:24 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Anagram of "knowing how to win"

WOW, I KNOW NOTHING

Anagram of "Giants pitcher Matt Cain" = TRAGIC MAN, ISN'T PATHETIC

by Stuttering John Tamargo on Aug 26, 2008 11:37 PM PDT   0 recs

That might be my favorite anagram of the entire time we’ve been doing anagrams. Even better than AGED AND SAD PENIS (I think that’s right) or something about Matt Morris having a dead Latin arm.

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on Aug 27, 2008 12:30 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

you're reading Bruce Jenkins?

Put the Comicle down and back away slowly.

by wcw on Aug 26, 2008 11:37 PM PDT   0 recs

This is what I see

You’re arguing against the article you expected to read, knowing that it’s that idiot Jenkins and it’s about pitch counts.

In reality, I was surprised that he did make an appropriate nod to pitch counts, and came up with a lot more ways to tell if a pitcher is losing it rather than just assume that the yardstick of the old days automatically applies.

"[Greg] Vaughn is in a funk so deep, George Clinton wearing a miner's helmet couldn't find him."
- Jim Baker, ESPN.com, May 2002

by achiappanza on Aug 26, 2008 11:44 PM PDT   0 recs

Grant’s arguing against the article I read. Jenkins certainly had a good point but it was buried in a big pile of lazy, dishonest “analysis” and geek quips.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on Aug 26, 2008 11:55 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

What I really loved....

…was hearing Ralph Barbierri’s views on the pitch count subject this afternoon while he was interviewing Jenkins. Not surprisingly, Ralph used all the extreme arguments you mentioned.

Oh, and the guy just can’t let got of Lincecum’s July 26th start where he ONLY threw 121 pitches in seven innings. If Ralph were the manager, Lincecum would have thrown 150 pitches if that is what it took to get a CG win. Hooray for team pride and grit!

by Squire_Boone on Aug 26, 2008 11:52 PM PDT   0 recs

If I told you this was a great, well thought-out post, would you accuse me of group think?

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on Aug 27, 2008 12:24 AM PDT   0 recs

Either that or something that has a similar spelling/sound.

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on Aug 27, 2008 12:31 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

a/s/l?

/yes, please/

by kwyjibo on Aug 27, 2008 12:35 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

So I admit...

I used to watch the Last Honest Sports Show.

Jenkins used to appear on there. Maybe I have made a mistake, but did he always look like this

I remembered him looking older and skinnier/wrinklier.

by kwyjibo on Aug 27, 2008 12:41 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Oh, so this is where we post groupthink jokes

I was wondering.

Didn’t want to post a joke out of place.

Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract

by thehavenot on Aug 27, 2008 10:45 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Think grope is better imho.

Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!

by daveinexile on Aug 27, 2008 10:47 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Jenkins' routine

Jenkins columns allow the Chron’s owners and editors to check a box on their to do list: “find simple-minded neanderthal to write about ‘doing things the right way’ and ‘having what it takes’ and ‘what nobody but me understands’ and the ‘essense’ and ‘beauty’ and ‘nature’ of the game, whatever game that is.”

He doesn’t need to know what he’s talking about, because he can tell what’s going on by looking into the eyes of some slow, fat, usually white guy who just intuitively plays the game (whichever game we’re talking about) right.

I read him for my weekly dose of journalistic car-wreck.

bringing you moral turpitude since 1963

by Idaho Nick on Aug 27, 2008 3:48 AM PDT   0 recs

Hopefully this Jenkins’ series can produce a good FJM soon…

Fairley odd parent to Wendell

by WTF on Aug 27, 2008 7:53 AM PDT   0 recs

I find it amazing...

How little – on both sides of this argument – the concept of the “high stress inning” comes up. Forget the gross total of pitches, five 20-pitch innings take more out of an arm than eight 13-pitch innings.

by Dailey247 on Aug 27, 2008 8:05 AM PDT   0 recs

Who says?

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 8:07 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm not disagreeing with you

Or agreeing with you. I’m just stating that I see no obvious reason why a “high stress inning” is worse than a couple of low stress ones.

It’s not as if the pitcher throws the ball any softer in the low stress innings. The body goes through the same movements regardless of the “stress” of the inning.

I fail to see why this would matter.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 8:20 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

But that's not true.

All the studies on the subject say that as a pitcher labors thru a long inning, his mechanics start to slip as he tires, potentially leading to injuries.

Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.

by delorean on Aug 27, 2008 8:36 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm just asking

Does a guy really get more tired throwing 20 pitches in 10 consecutive minutes than 20 pitches in two 5 minute chunks separated by 5 minutes?

Possibly, I suppose.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 11:26 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

That's how exercise works

It’s harder to do 20 straight pushups than go 10 pushups – 5 minute rest – 10 pushups.

Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.

by groug on Aug 27, 2008 11:29 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes and no

It’s not necessarily the cumulative tiredness we’re concerned with here. If you labor and throw 30 pitches in an inning, it’s possible/conceivable/likely that your mechanics will get sloppy by the end, possibly leading/contributing to an injury/

Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.

by delorean on Aug 27, 2008 11:30 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Then the answer is simple

Take a page from the Dodger’s playbook and take 3 minutes between pitches with men on base.

Also, get a better offense, to get the pitcher more rest between innings.

VAE PVTO DEVS FIO

by Bhaakon on Aug 27, 2008 8:52 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

One thing,

going through the same motions doesn’t mean that work is the same: Newton’s laws of motion, first and second laws.

Force == Mass * Acceleration.
Work == Force * Distance.
Power == Work / unit time

If a pitcher has to throw harder, to “reach back”, to get through that inning, he IS doing more work.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Aug 27, 2008 8:47 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

also, from my experience, it was always much harder to pitch out of the stretch than the wind-up, and i think most pitchers would agree. from the stretch, you lost a lot of the power from your legs since you’re concerned about being quicker to the plate to prevent base-runners from collecting easy steals. you end up getting more velocity from your arm and it really tires you out. so i do believe in the curse of the “high-stress inning”. lots of pitches from the stretch is not good.

by cornball on Aug 27, 2008 10:24 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I think you’re talking about two different things.

Yes, trying to deliver the ball in a hurry makes the body work less and the arm work more, but that’s because of the situation (runners on) not the delivery from the stretch, per se.

Taking the “rushed delivery” out of the equation, the windup and stretch are bascially the same delivery with different preludes. The forward motion doesn’t begin until the point where a RHP’s knee is raised and his momentum “falls” toward the plate. Everything that happens prior to that is incidental and the reason a lot of pitching gurus preach pitching soley out of the stretch. The windup might create body timing to get everything in the right place at the right time, but it doesn’t create power since it’s not creating any forward momentum.. It would be like saying, I run faster if I run backward before I start running forward.

Many pitchers practice more out of the windup, so it feels more comfortable. I’m convinced that Lincecum’s early struggles from the stretch were due to him rarely having to up until that point.

Zooperstars, they quack me up!

by Goofus on Aug 27, 2008 10:58 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

that should say “RHP’s left knee”

Zooperstars, they quack me up!

by Goofus on Aug 27, 2008 10:58 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

putting the "rush delivery" back into the equation

I’ve heard arguments that pitchers are much less deliberate out of the stretch than they were in the 70’s and eighties, hence the death of the stolen base.

If quickening the delivery does cause extra stress, and pitchers really have quickened their deliveries, it could justify a more conservative approach to managing pitchers.

VAE PVTO DEVS FIO

by Bhaakon on Aug 27, 2008 8:57 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes, I know this

I thought it was implicit in my statement that the same pitches are thrown regardless of whether or not the inning is a long one or otherwise, hence the same strain on the body.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 11:26 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Same pitches AND same number of pitches?

If the intensity is the same, but your volume is higher, ie, longer inning, throwing more pitches, more work IS done.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Aug 27, 2008 11:33 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes

But if you throw 100 pitches divided by 5 innings or 9 innings, and the selection of pitches is the same, then the same work is done.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 11:36 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes

rest is another issue.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Aug 27, 2008 11:38 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Common sense.

100 pitches over 5 innings means the pitches come in a shorter time frame. Over 8 innings, the pitcher gets approx 30 more minutes (3 half-innings worth) of time to recover.

What’s more tiring; running 5 miles in a row or running a mile, taking a 15 minute break, running a mile, taking a 15 minute break, …

by Matthew on Aug 27, 2008 11:17 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Depends whether you’re smoking cigarettes, drinking beer and having sex during the breaks.

Zooperstars, they quack me up!

by Goofus on Aug 27, 2008 11:20 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

If you’re not, then what’s the point of even taking a break?

Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.

by groug on Aug 27, 2008 11:30 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

lol

Zooperstars, they quack me up!

by Goofus on Aug 27, 2008 11:38 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

"and" Hmm, all three at the same time, huh?

You take much better breaks than I do.

Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract

by thehavenot on Aug 27, 2008 11:37 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

If that were the case, my breaks would only need about 10 minutes.

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on Aug 27, 2008 1:01 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Is it that drastic, however?

I understand that in the extremes this makes sense.

I would argue that 5 miles in a row Vs. 5 individual miles separated by 15 minute breaks is not a valid comparison.

Also, as a former long distance runner, I would MUCH rather run 5 miles in a row than 5 individual miles separated by 15 minutes. Those 15 minute cool downs will fuck you up bad.

Throwing 100 pitches over 1 hour vs throwing 100 pitches over 2 hours ? Yeah, maybe – I’m not a doctor nor do I have personal experience from which to speak.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 11:30 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

There's a HUGE body of research in sports science

that shows that resting, as long the rest period isn’t too long, between reps, allows an athlete to work harder in those reps / have it easier in those reps.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Aug 27, 2008 11:36 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm sure

Like I said, I’m not trying to be a keyboard expert on this – just putting some ideas out there.

I could see justification that a longer inning is more tiring on the pitcher, and as a result his mechanics begin to suffer leading to damage.

The first thing to go in any activity w/ fatigue is form/mechanics. Huge problem in swimming.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 11:38 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Distance running might not be the best comparison, but I think the point is valid. Recovery is a big part of athletic performance. Sometimes a pitching coach goes out just to give a pitcher a little recovery time if he’s in the middle of a high pitch inning.

If I ran four 50 yard dashes with 10 minutes breaks, I’d be in better shape to keep competing and have a better combined time than if I’d run one 440.

Keep in mind, breaks aren’t just for muscle and areobic recovery. You also get a chance to re-hydrate and cool-down in the shade on a hot day.

Zooperstars, they quack me up!

by Goofus on Aug 27, 2008 11:37 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Something worth mentioning

Is that damage due to over-use in terms of pitchers is, AFAIK, not muscle-fatigue related (which is something we are most familiar with as amateur athletes).

Instead, it is the result of repeated forces trying to separate the joints in the arm and shoulder.

These forces are generated by the muscles, obviously – but the pitchers arm is just a long for the ride.

Yank on those tendons too much, and they start to sustain damage. That is the problem w/ pitching over use as I understand it.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 11:42 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I Agree

My issue is that no one is doing enough to understand how this varies from individual to individual and trying to fugure out how the boundries of risk varies from individual to indivual.

by giantsrainman on Aug 27, 2008 11:47 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Well, you don't know that.

My point is just that it’s not as much an issue of “My muscles don’t feel tired, so I must be fine to pitch” as it is your tendons & ligaments are being damaged by the force of your muscles, which may feel just fine.

FWIW, I over-used my knee junior year in high school. I was a long distance runner and we had won CCS the previous year. I was really excited about the coming season and I over trained.

I developed tendinitis in my knee, and I haven’t been able to run aggressively since.

No muscle pain, no feeling of over-exertion, etc. But my joints couldn’t handle the load I was both mentally and physically capable of subjecting them to.

It just kinda started hurting a little one day and got progressively worse. 10 years later, it hurts as I am writing this.

I kinda wish I had taken it a little easier and maybe not run so many miles that week.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on Aug 27, 2008 11:52 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Exactly. So in the meantime, teams should exercise caution. Obviously, no one is recommending that teams limit their pitchers to 50 pitches. It just so happens that 100-120 pitches coincides with a start who is effective into the 7th, and with specialized bullpens, there aren’t too many reasons to extend a pitcher repeatedly beyond that.

by Grant on Aug 27, 2008 11:53 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The essence of the argument, here

Yes 100 pitches is arbitrary. Yes, we aren’t sure when a pitcher is starting to get into problem territory, exactly. But since we don’t know, we might as well set an arbitrary limit. This is okay so long as that limit is reasonable. 100 pitches is close to a full game and is close to the problem areas for most pitchers. Seems reasonable to me.

Do you really think that managers/GM’s would just use a completely arbitrary number for no good reasons?

Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract

by thehavenot on Aug 27, 2008 11:55 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes

They used their best reliever in the 9th just because of a stupid stat (saves) and they do this because they are afraid of being blamed if they don’t.

by giantsrainman on Aug 27, 2008 12:12 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

good point, actually

you can't block the Bocock

by oldjacket on Aug 27, 2008 1:44 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

+1

Agreeing with rainman is like being attracted to a friend’s significant other — you’re just being honest about a natural feeling, but that doesn’t mean you don’t hate yourself a little bit for it.

"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK

by Josh from Hollywood on Aug 27, 2008 2:09 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

You're argument is close to reality

But I would say they use the best reliever in the ninth because of a mystique about the ninth being the most difficult inning and such.

I also think that there are good reasons for this. I think it’s dumb that they are so rigid about the roles, though.

However, I disagree with your assertion that there are no good reasons for closers. There are. Just because there might be better reasons for using the relief ace in a different way, doesn’t make those good reasons disappear.

When something becomes so wide-spread as pitch counts and the closer role, there are usually good reasons; even if there are even better reasons for doing it another way.

Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract

by thehavenot on Aug 27, 2008 2:11 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The problem with the arbitrary limit of 100

is, pitchers are different.

By setting an arbitrary limit of 100 for everyone, you are assuming that pitchers cannot progressive increase their ability to handle higher workloads. Which is a strange assumption.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Aug 27, 2008 1:14 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

And how do you figure this stuff out?

Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract

by thehavenot on Aug 27, 2008 2:06 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Figure what stuff out?

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Aug 27, 2008 2:31 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Whether they can progressively increase their workload

Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract

by thehavenot on Aug 27, 2008 2:37 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs