Just a Dream or a Real Possibility??
by giantsrockdudes on Aug 22, 2008 12:00 AM PDT
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PrintGot to thinking about the situation in Phiily where Jimmy (MVP) Rollins called out the fans saying that they dont follow the game or some crap like that; anyway the Phillies have always been linked to liking the none other Matthew Cain. I know I know no one wants to trade Matt Cain but we have absolutley ZERO prospects at SS. Those Phils REALLY REALLY need pitching and they have many of offesnse to spare. I know that Jimmy Rollins current line is horrible like in the 250 with very few HR but everyone knows the guy can play. Lets put together a package of Winn and Cain for Rollins and maybe just maybe the Phils will consider it.
This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.
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+1
And really, again with the inane, repetitive trade matt cain posts?
Rafael Rodriguez: Pretty young!
by BrianBokake on Aug 22, 2008 12:58 AM PDT up reply actions
Hey now!
At least we’re consistently inane and repetitive. Surely that counts for something.
"Ain't got a hope in Hell - that's my belief." - Bon Scott
by victor frankenstein on Aug 22, 2008 2:58 AM PDT up reply actions
+1
"I can't describe how excited I am to be a Giant." Music to the ears of this excited parent of Buster Posey!
by GiantsFanInExile on Aug 22, 2008 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions
But he’s a etc etc at best blah blah laffs
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
Well...
lets give it consideration…..what are each players WAR, current salary and years left under team control?
Uncle Sabes...How much longer til we get there?
Cain has a VORP of 38.8 this year compared to Rollins VORP of 26.3. Both have 3 years left under control after this season (assuming options are picked up), Cain costing 13.15 & Rollins costing 23.5. Rollins is 6 years older than Cain
Rollins is a decent player, but Cain would be overpaying & even if it weren’t what would be the point of filling a hole by creating another one!
Proud owner of the most boring Username! Alex Hinshaw: Now showing in a bullpen near you!
Rollins is, who’s having a down year with the bat, is probably about a 2.75-3 win player right now. Cain should probably finish the year (if he doesn’t melt down) as a 3.5-4 win player. He’s also got a more favorable contract than Rollins and as others have pointed out, is much younger.
It’s a close deal, if Rollins goes back to a wOBA player of .360 or greater (2004, 2006-2007) he’s more valuable than Cain.
*smack*
"he walked 18; new league record! Struck out 18, another new league record! He also hit the sportswriter, the PA announcer, the bull mascot twice..."
Too early for a movie hijack?
Least happy happy endings:
I’m going to put down Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory and walk away.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
The Man with 2 Brains
Might as well have been the guerilla.
Don't think, it could only hurt the ballclub.
walk away. . .
right into my fist. do not denigrate that movie!
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 22, 2008 9:27 AM PDT up reply actions
I’m not denigrating that movie. It might be my favorite movie of all time. I’m just saying the ending isn’t all that happy, if you think about it. Wonka’s basically telling Charlie that he’s going to turn him into a brainwashed slave.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Aug 22, 2008 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions
My gicing him the factory, didn’t hel really make him a weird reclusive slave-owner?
I want an Oompa Loompa now, daddy!
Zooperstars, they quack me up!
The pay for the Oompa Loompas
Was saving them from Loompaland. They don’t need anything else.
P.S. I assume they eat candy. Or each other.
Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract
It seems weird that Oompa Loompas would need to be saved from a land that was named after them.
But really, I’m just not qualified to comment on the political and social climate of Loompaland.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Aug 22, 2008 3:05 PM PDT up reply actions
Born Killers (not Natural Born Killers)
overall just not a happy movie, but I really enjoyed it.
Giants! Giants! HELP US GOD!
Least happy happy endings?
The massage I got in the Tenderloin last night
Zooperstars, they quack me up!
Right now the pitching rotation has Barry Zito, Kevin Correia and Matt Palmer. Yeah, we should trade Matt Cain. This fantasy that the Giants have great young pitchers all over the place is fine for the national media, but Giants’ fans should really know better. We have a couple of great prospects in the lower minors, but that doesn’t mean they’ll be great when they get here, and even if they are, they’re at least two years away. Stop with the trade threads!!! Be patient and wait for the kids. Some Giants’ fans sound like they want Sabean to go out there and make another run with the old vets. Ugh!!
Brian Sabean's new dad: Firm believer in corporal punishment
Since jponry hasn't shown up,
Also, Rollins’ performance in 2008 isn’t really all that out of line with the rest of his career. His EQA, I’m using EQA instead of OPS+ since it includes SBs CS, GIDPs, the last 5 years from 2004: 273, 269, 275, 291, 268. Career, 269.
Last year was the anomaly, not this year.
Considering their respective ages, trading Cain for Rollins would at best be a lateral move. That’s acceptable if the Giants are a contending team, and finding a SS is of tremendous importance.
ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524
damn, the NO didn't show up.
ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524
EqA doesn’t take into account defense, so it’s not really giving credit to Rollins as the total player. He’s been an above average defender at SS. I’d say he gets 1-1.5 wins for his fielding alone, that’s not too shabby.
Still, I’m not saying I’d trade Cain for him, I wouldn’t, but Rollins is a nice player. I would hang onto Cain because he’s younger and cheaper, they both provide almost the same amount of wins.
Hm, 10-15 runs above average on D?
10-15 runs above average would make him one of the best D SS in MLB.
UZR from 2003-2006, year by year runs above average totals: 9 above average, 5, 7, 3.
2007, Zone Rating, 2 runs below average. RZR 4 runs below average.
He’s probably ~5 runs above average D wise.
And my point with EQA is to disagree with the idea that he’s having an anomalously bad year. He’s not. 2007 was the anomalous year. 2007 was completely out of line with the rest of his career.
ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524
And don't forget...
That Rollins turns 30 this year, likely to start declining in a couple years. Cain for the next three years is all upside, age-wise.
If the Giants trade Cain, the right place to start is a package of players like the A’s got for Danny Haren that includes a potential cleanup-type middle of the order bat; not a one-for-one swap for a 30-yr-old SS with a lifetime .330 OBP.
Disfrute Los Gigantes every day at www.leftymalo.com
I like Rollins. I do. But trading just Cain for him? No thanks. Leftymalo is right that J-Roll is likely to decline soon. And if I’m not mistaken their farm system doesn’t have much going on so trading Cain for Rollins and some prospects isn’t a great idea either.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 22, 2008 8:58 AM PDT reply actions
YOU MUST OBEY THE HAIR
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 22, 2008 9:17 AM PDT up reply actions
Fanpost Combo FTW!
I say we trade Cain for Henry Rollins! (elder statesman of punk rock)
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN
TV Party Tonight!!
…until FP Santangelo makes his first comment.
Brian Sabean's new dad: Firm believer in corporal punishment
i'd rather have Sonny Rollins
Mr. Garfield has become a sanctimonious prick in his old age.
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
He was always that way… he had no sense of humor when I told him his roadie’s band (The Nig-Heist) was more entertaining. That was 1984. Of course I was an obnoxious, drunken little bastard at the time.
by Johnny Disaster on Aug 22, 2008 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions
I’m absolutely open to the idea that the Giants should trade a starter for a shortstop. We don’t actually have SP depth, but in this landscape, decent SPs are a helluva lot easier to find than decent shortstops.
Having said that, I’d much prefer Sanchez for Hardy… I don’t want to see us pay for the MVP name brand, and I think Hardy is every bit as good as Rollins. Between his excellent defense and strong hitting for the position, Hardy was a six-win player last year, and has quietly been an eight-win player so far this year by WARP3. I don’t want to lose Sanchez, but I’d lose him in a friggin’ heartbeat for that.
I don’t agree that we have ABSOLUTELY ZERO prospects at SS. Even if you don’t count Burriss on account of he can’t hit and he has too many ABs to qualify as a rookie next year, there’s still Crawford. Who won’t be major league ready for years if he ever is, but still, he counts as a prospect. Just sayin’.
Has the situation in Philly reached a point where they desperately NEED to trade him? If so, maybe there’s some other deal that would bring Rollins here for three years without giving up something like Cain?
Wouldn’t Shiny shiny Winn be an upgrade over Jenkins?
Wouldn’t Molina be an upgrade over Coste and Ruiz?
Zooperstars, they quack me up!
Not yet,
but wait for the winter if they fall short of the division. Let the Philly bloodsports begin! Maybe we can find some way to get Brian Westbrook packaged in, too! (I’m sure he can play CF…)
Get the hell out the way Bengie, Pablito's hit the show!
Brian Westbrook = GAMER!
I mean, he sat down on the 1-yard line, eschewing a TD and personal glory, just so his team would have a better chance to run out the clock and win. If that isn’t Brian Sabean’s kind of player, I don’t know who is.
"I been waitin' a long time for this! I been waitin' since the f**kin' amateurs!" --WILL "THE THRILL" CLARK
by Josh from Hollywood on Aug 22, 2008 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions
I like these type of fanposts
Somewhat less established poster posts something either A) insane B) repetitive C) unintelligible or D) more than one of the above and we just completely take over the fanpost with posts that completely disregard the original content (after the initial “NO” responses). Then we never see or hear from the original poster again in his/her own fanpost.
These always give me a kick.
Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract
As a "Somewhat Less Established Poster"..
I agree with this comment. These types of posts are always “Chock Full” of McCoven ridicule, Goofus’s innuendo, and unrelated insane goodness. Good Show !
My adopted son Matt Downs. Bill Mueller without the two-flap helmet .
So the question is
How do we rank posters?
I think we need a top 100 posters list.
Or maybe a tier system, with A, B +/- and C posters.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Aug 22, 2008 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions
I deserve some credit
for never posting anything. I have a Comment/Post ratio of 294 (counting this one) to 0. That should get me into the top 100 with no negative scores.
Greetings, Marklar! I am Marklar! This is Marklar.
Why the hate?
By limiting my posts to 0 I have never duplicated another’s post, beaten a dead horse, or offered a single ridiculous proposal to trade our unwanted players for another teams good players.
Therefore, my restraint has been a positive, and there are many other posters that would have done well to exhibit a similar deference to the overall intelligence to the people who contribute to this site.
Greetings, Marklar! I am Marklar! This is Marklar.
As a not at all established poster
It looks like there’s a good amount of on-topic discussion… to go with the off-topic leavening. But as much as I like Rollins, I can’t get behind trading any part of the Lincecainchez Trinity at this point.
by Johnny Disaster on Aug 22, 2008 12:01 PM PDT up reply actions
This particular poster seems to just create posts and never come back to the discussion.
Let’s look at his peripherals. He’s got an P/C* ratio of 11-to-2. I don’t know if that’s sustainable and might be attributed to a small sample size, but those kind of numbers usually indicate the talent to be a major league douche.
*Post/Comment
Zooperstars, they quack me up!
by Goofus on Aug 22, 2008 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Hmm, My P/C* is pretty decent. .042
Might be time to get promoted :)
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Aug 22, 2008 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Mine is .0032! Suck it, everybody!
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Aug 22, 2008 2:22 PM PDT up reply actions
But with over 17,000 posts, it’s pretty clear that you’re hacking at slop daily and nightly
Zooperstars, they quack me up!
Only over 15,000 on McCC.
And hacking at slop nightly… isn’t that what I was coached to do???
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Aug 22, 2008 3:05 PM PDT up reply actions
You can’t walk off the Internet!
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
So
Are you claiming to be one of these type of fanposts?
Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract
No, and
I’d like to know what you think when an established poster posts something inane and all that. Are you THAT type of poster?
It’s just that your original post was a little condescending.
But so am I, so whatever.
bringing you moral turpitude since 1963
Well, I don’t really care about established or not. If one’s posts are okay then that person is okay with me.
There have been several of these types of fanposts recently, however. They are either insane or they repeat a common theme over and over or they are unintelligible or something else along those lines and then the poster never returns after we just take over the fanpost.
The reason why I included the “somewhat less established” part is because each and every one of these have been from posters who are somewhat less established. If this weren’t the case, then I would not have included it. It’s also important because only a less established poster would never return to his/her fanpost to defend it or capitulate or modify or whatever.
No need to get huffy over it. Most of the “established” of the MCC don’t care about it all that much. Neither should you or anyone else, really.
In fact, I don’t even think I’m all that established. I certainly post less than many of the central MCC figures.
As for answering your question directly, there haven’t been any by established posters. This is because established posters continue to comment in his/her own fanpost (which was a key part of my original post). As for inanity, I think a couple of mine have been close to it. Certainly I got a bunch of outcry from my own “trade Cain” post a while back. And my random crap post was a definite flop. But, see, I stuck around and replied to people. And they never got hijacked or taken over by the McCoven.
Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract
To anyone who wants to consider trading Cain
I suggest looking at the years that Clay Bucholz, Phil Hughes, Homer Bailey are having. All very highly touted prospects.
Bucholz is actually older than Cain. Bailey and Hughes about 1 1/2 years younger. Compare their careers with Cain’s at similar ages.
I’m not saying Cain shouldn’t be traded, just that unless a trade is a clear and obvious win, it would be idiotic. Many things can happen to highly touted pitching prospects, especially those still in A ball.
ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524
All the more reason Cain is extremely valuable.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Aug 22, 2008 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions
this
Holy crap we’re agreeing upon things. Is the world ending?
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 22, 2008 2:08 PM PDT up reply actions
That's my point
My point is that Cain is EXTREMELY valuable. He’s a 23 year old pitcher with a 120 ERA+ in 613.7 MLB innings who has great stuff.
I’ve opposed trading Cain for a long time. At the start of the season, when there were Cain trade proposals, I made the comparison of Cain to Bucholz / Hughes / Bailey et al, with the point being that Cain being this good, this durable in MLB, this young, should be taken into account.
ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524
He puts the suck in sucks.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Aug 22, 2008 3:06 PM PDT up reply actions
In a heart beat
We have nobody at SS. Bring the kid home. Cain is an amazing pitcher but with Timmy 2 & MadBum coming up quick we have a chance to get an MVP. He has power, speed, and average and would look great in the orange & black
The only SS to trade Cain for would be Hanley Ramirez
maybe Jose Reyes but he’s under contract for one year less than Cain, it’d be close.
Can't get enough of the Oakland A's? Visit Oaktown Awesomer's
Trade Rowand back
to the Phils, for whatever they can get. He’s not worth the cash to the Giants when they have Lewis able to play CF, and can get a true power bat for LF. If the Giants were going to trade Cain for a SS, it should be for the Brewers’ SS.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
>If the Giants were going to trade Cain for a SS, it should be for the Brewers’ SS.
Uh… that’s a no. Hardy’s good, but really. Cain is far, far better. You know, aside from sucking so much.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Aug 23, 2008 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions
I don’t understand this site’s selective use of the auto block quote with me…
>test.
>If the Giants were going to trade Cain for a SS, it should be for the Brewers’ SS.
>test
Huh?
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Aug 23, 2008 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions
I don’t know what your problem is
Browser, maybe?
Sometimes it’s different with different browsers for me
Like, it works with some but not for others.
Only 849 games until the end of Zito's contract
But i’ve only ever used IE (I know, I know… but I really have no problems with it), except a few times at work.
Even so, that’s as good of an explanation as anything I can think of.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Aug 23, 2008 6:20 PM PDT up reply actions
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