D-Backs get Adam Dunn
by Chulk on Aug 11, 2008 11:32 AM PDT
237 comments
According to MLB Trade Rumors, the D-Bags have just acquired Adam Dunn, which hopefully will shoot them ahead of the Bums in the NL West "race."
Dunn pretty much balances out Manny going to LA, as he's sporting a line of .233/.373/.528 this year with 32 bombs.
Ugh. And now I need like 20 more words. Let's see if I have enough now. Nope, so I'll keep going like this until I have the correct number of words.
This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.
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They got Dunn in an after-waiver deadline deal? Has he really fallen off that much?
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 11, 2008 11:36 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Not many teams in front of the D-Backs in the waiver line wanted to pay Dunn’s salary for the rest of the year. Can you imagine how many outfielders LA would have had if they tried to block this move? Juan Pierre as an overpaid 3rd pinch hitter would have been ree-deek-u-lus!
by Rusty the Robot on Aug 11, 2008 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pierre as an overpaid starting CF, LF or bench player is ridiculous in itself.
Bengie Molina: stretching doubles into singles since 1998.
by jasomack on Aug 11, 2008 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
further reductionism
pierre = ridiculous
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on Aug 11, 2008 12:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe the word everyone is looking for
is ridonkulous
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 11, 2008 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
[sic]
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 11, 2008 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow.
How did someone else not claim him??!
Arrrgh, the FJM guys are going crazy right now
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 11:40 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Dude that’s what I’m saying!
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 11, 2008 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can someone pleeze
explain how waiver position is determined? thanks….
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 11:42 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
it goes in reverse order of records (worst record gets first priority best record gets last priority) and for an NL player the entire NL has priority over the AL and vice-versa for an AL player. So if an NL player is placed on waivers it goes National-Cubs-Mariners-Angels and all the teams in between while if an AL player is on it goes Mariners-Angels-Nationals-Cubs.
by FluLikeSymptoms on Aug 11, 2008 12:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
HOLD THE PHONES
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8437824/Sources:-D-backs-fail-in-bid-to-land-Reds‘-Dunn
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 11:43 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
whoops
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Blocking move?
Or could they really not find the pieces to get this done?
by Lars The Wanderer on Aug 11, 2008 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Notwithstanding that the move may be dead now, but
doesn’t this mean that Dunn got past the Giants and the Dodgers in order to land with the D-Backs?
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 11:46 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
seriously, right?
why didn’t we claim him?
as far as the deal being dead, when I clicked the link Rosenthalol was saying it was done deal…
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on Aug 11, 2008 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
it said both!
pic’s getting resized, so… http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g70/de1orean/dunn.jpg
(obligatory “looks ‘shopped”)
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why on earth should the Giants claim him? (Unless you were being sarcastic.)
This just in: the Giants aren’t going to the post-season this year.
In a related story: players on sports teams are on a “roster,” and this “roster” has a limited number of spaces.
I'm adopting a true Giant and an awe-inspring gamer: tk. "Atta babe."
by Mayor of 311 on Aug 11, 2008 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
my bad
i forgot all the giants roster spots were filled with dudes with power and obp.
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on Aug 11, 2008 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No problem. Glad we could have this little chat.
I'm adopting a true Giant and an awe-inspring gamer: tk. "Atta babe."
by Mayor of 311 on Aug 12, 2008 3:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think you mena “Dunn deal”
Providing natural gas with every post
by Goofus on Aug 11, 2008 2:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i can’t believe i missed that.
thanks for picking me up, goof.
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on Aug 11, 2008 2:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No problem
My work here is dunn
Providing natural gas with every post
by Goofus on Aug 11, 2008 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sabean apparently looked into it.
Less arm, more talk. Raisingcain is a GAMER.
Adopted Giant: Henry Sosa
by raisingcain on Aug 11, 2008 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I heard he kicked the tires.
Proud father of Eric Surcamp! I sure hope we sign him.
by The Thrill on Aug 11, 2008 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He did his due diligence, but decided Dunn wouldn’t bring enough veteran savvy and warrior spirit to the Giants.
Less arm, more talk. Raisingcain is a GAMER.
Adopted Giant: Henry Sosa
by raisingcain on Aug 11, 2008 7:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He found Dunn’s swagger-detection skills to be lacking.
by rotorueter on Aug 11, 2008 8:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I want Adam Dunn
Most underrated player… ever.
I only have a signature because I recognize everyone else by their sigs, not their usernames..
by lmaozedong on Aug 11, 2008 11:46 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Disagree
I think Dunn is the most overrated underrated player ever.
by slcgiant on Aug 11, 2008 12:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why don’t you list-rank the others? I’m curious to see who you have over Dunn and under Dunn.
Providing natural gas with every post
by Goofus on Aug 11, 2008 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we're talking all sports
Ben Wallace has to win hands-down
STEVE HOLM: Better than Alfonso? Why yes, of course.
by UnleashTheGore on Aug 11, 2008 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jeter
Here's to Kemp, Loney, LaRoche, Hu, and Kershaw not panning out.
by Woody Wins on Aug 11, 2008 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Aren't we talking overrated?
I was trying to say Jeter is overrated.
Here's to Kemp, Loney, LaRoche, Hu, and Kershaw not panning out.
by Woody Wins on Aug 11, 2008 2:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We were talking about overrated underrated players. I think.
by Natto on Aug 11, 2008 2:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm confused. I concede the point.
Here's to Kemp, Loney, LaRoche, Hu, and Kershaw not panning out.
by Woody Wins on Aug 11, 2008 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
OT, but
I’ll nominate Kelena Azabuike as the most underrated Bay Area athlete. That dude is so quietly good.
Providing natural gas with every post
by Goofus on Aug 11, 2008 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Too bad he’s no longer in the Bay Area anymore.
by Natto on Aug 11, 2008 3:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Au contrair, mon fraire. They matched the Clips’ offer.
http://www.nba.com/warriors/news/warriors_resign_kelenna_azubuike.html
You must have been busy bangin’ some broad and missed it.
Providing natural gas with every post
by Goofus on Aug 11, 2008 3:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh cool. I don’t really keep up with Warriors news during the offseason and going to GSoM puts me into an instant coma.
by Natto on Aug 11, 2008 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
..that would be
mon frère
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
by Lyle on Aug 12, 2008 7:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow!
Rosenthal/FOX JUST edited that story—the title of the page still reads “D’Backs Fail in Bid” while the page headline says “D’Backs Land Dunn off Waivers”
!!!!
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 11:48 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
What prospects do the D-Backs have left to deal after emptying out on Dan Haren…
Giants Cove: You'll be a better person for reading
by Chulk on Aug 11, 2008 11:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
probably just salary relief
and a B prospect.
by Giant Voodoo on Aug 11, 2008 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hate the Reds...
50-66
Adopted Giant: Daryl Maday - Just got promoted to CT, and is now sporting a gleaming 8.35 ERA.
by rhys on Aug 11, 2008 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why couldn’t we do that?
Less arm, more talk. Raisingcain is a GAMER.
Adopted Giant: Henry Sosa
by raisingcain on Aug 11, 2008 1:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
ADAM DUNN HATES BASEBALL!
DIDN’T YOU PEOPLE HEAR?
Fairley odd parent to Wendell
by WTF on Aug 11, 2008 11:52 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Is that why he beats it like a rented mule when he hits it?
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
by daveinexile on Aug 12, 2008 8:37 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
this rules
because it makes Dodger fan angry.
Oh wait, Dodger fan doesn’t really follow baseball.
Never mind.
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 11:57 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
They follow it just enough to use homophobic epithets when they’re angry about their suckass team losing to our pathetic yet lovable G-men.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 11, 2008 12:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
to be fair...
...this morning i clicked over to True Blue LA, to get in some post-series jabs, and Andrew was totally cool about me rubbing it in. those poor dodger fans seem to have even less hope than we do.
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on Aug 11, 2008 12:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve found most Dodger fans still think Steve Sax is manning second base, and Pedro Gurrero is somewhere around the ouftield, usually, when he’s not hanging with O.J.
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 8:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even if you don't think
Dunn would be part of the Giants’ plans (high salary, low OBP), why wouldn’t you grab him to see if a deal could be worked out and to get the supplemental Type A pick for him when he leaves as a FA after the season?
It’s not like the Giants can’t afford to rent him for the remainder of the year, or that the fans wouldn’t mind seeing a legitimate power hitter the rest of the season, or that it wouldn’t be fun to deny the D-Backs this acquisition. Think of the damage the Giants might be able to do to other teams with Dunn the remainer the season.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 11:59 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, the
“remainder” of the season. And again, why not take a shot at it? It isn’t like the Giants’ farm system is any worse now than what’s left of the D-Back system.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 12:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Low OBP!? Dude has a .380 areer OBP. .373 this year.
by jcb9 on Aug 11, 2008 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Correct, I meant BA.
Sorry about that. Just the same, he would have been fun here for the rest of the season.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not only that, you’d get a couple of months to see what kind of effect having a single heavy OBP, heavy SLG hitter in the middle of the lineup would do for the team. Does it drastically change the dynamics of the lineup? Is it enough to start making the team competitive? Even if you don’t resign Dunn that’s some important info to have on what you need to do with roster construction moving forward.
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Aug 11, 2008 12:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
s'a valid point
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not only that, you’d get a couple of months to see what kind of effect having a single heavy OBP, heavy SLG hitter in the middle of the lineup would do for the team.
I don’t think we need to conduct an empirical experiment to know that it does. We can hang on to our money and prospects and still know what we know.
Is it enough to start making the team competitive?
I’ll take this as a rhetorical question to which the answer is no.
Trading away decent prospects/money for a few months of Dunn is a backwards move in the rebuilding game. We don’t know what it would have taken for the Giants to get him, so it’s silly to pass judgement on a possible trade that we knew nothing about the terms of.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
When you look at what the Douchebacks gave up...
it’s not much. Though I guess we don’t know everyone involved.
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They didn’t really trade any decent prospects for him though.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
by jponry on Aug 11, 2008 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you take Dunn, who sits? Lewis? Winn?
by Lars The Wanderer on Aug 11, 2008 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
According to his splits, he hasn’t been there since ‘06. In fact, he had only 5 at-bats while playing 1B that year.
by Lars The Wanderer on Aug 11, 2008 12:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
its not like 1B is a complicated position
and we seem to be giving everybody a crash course in it anyway.
by superk1ng on Aug 11, 2008 12:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You may be right. It seems they moved him to the outfield in ‘06 in favor of Scott Hatteberg. Can’t fault that reasoning.
by Lars The Wanderer on Aug 11, 2008 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I read that as the Giants plans are for high salaried, low OBP players
Which apparently is the exact opposite of Adam Dunn. And high salary, low OBP is exactly the type of players the Giants have preferred to go after.
"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler
by JRPhillips on Aug 11, 2008 1:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
the Giants’ would’ve had to work a trade under that scenario, thus giving up a real prospect or two for an upcoming draft pick. From what I’ve read, the upcoming draft is rather thin after the first 10 picks or so, so that may not be the best plan going forward. After kicking tires with dilligence.
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 8:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I figured Arizona would win the west already. This move just solidifies it.
by Hobbes2d on Aug 11, 2008 12:06 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
let's hope so
Also, i rilly need to know who was ahead of AZ in line for waiver claiming and passed on Dunn
Can anyone shed light?
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
can’t you just figure that out by looking at the W-L records?
Fairley odd parent to Wendell
by WTF on Aug 11, 2008 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
don' think so
MLBTR said that there were 8 teams ahead of AZ that passed, which suggests it’s not simply this year’s W-L record.
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think MLB Trade Rumors is just looking at the records and mistakenly counting the Reds as one of the teams
by FluLikeSymptoms on Aug 11, 2008 12:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
see my reply to your above post for an explanation, but in this case it would have gone:
1.Nationals
2.Padres
3.Giants
4.Reds
5.Rockies
6.Pirates
7.Astros
8.Dodgers
9. Diamondbacks
by FluLikeSymptoms on Aug 11, 2008 12:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
cheers, FLS
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
HAHA that means that the Astros lost Carlos Lee and STILL didn’t claim Dunn!
by rotorueter on Aug 11, 2008 1:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sabean is an idiot.
That is all.
Bengie Molina: stretching doubles into singles since 1998.
by jasomack on Aug 11, 2008 12:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
can’t argue with that logic.
Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal
by nostocksjustbonds on Aug 11, 2008 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
MLBTradeRumors now says
that Rosenthal is reporting that it’s a done deal, and the D-Backs in fact pulled this off. They apparently only had to give up a midling pitching prospect (we’re full of those) and a couple of PTBNLs.
This means that Sabean passed on him.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 12:14 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
And he's an idiot.
Bengie Molina: stretching doubles into singles since 1998.
by jasomack on Aug 11, 2008 12:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
epic idiot
we could have gooten comp picks or even resigned him
by CB30 on Aug 11, 2008 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
gooten tag
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
nein
der kleiner Riesen
Adopted brother of the AnVil / GIANTSPACE™ returns!
by SoFa King Mike on Aug 11, 2008 12:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i like "gooten" beeter. :)
Bengie Molina: stretching doubles into singles since 1998.
by jasomack on Aug 11, 2008 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because he didn’t pick up Adam Dunn, who can block a trade to any team (which I believe kicked in when the Reds exercised his option) and is a free agent after the year, for someone who might be part of our future?
I mean, I don’t think Dunn’s all that great, but I don’t think he would have wanted to come here and I don’t think that his presence for a month and a half would have helped us in any way for the future.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 12:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What the hell happened to that second paragraph?
I mean, I don’t think Sabean’s all that great, but I don’t think Dunn would have wanted to come here and I don’t think that his presence for a month and a half would have helped us in any way for the future. The comp picks would have almost certainly been worth less than the prospects we would have to give up, which would not be overly helpful.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is probably right. We don’t t really know enough to get excited about this non-move.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I do
knee-jerk reactions is what we do best! Didn’t you see the “DFA’d by accident” thread?
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yes
it figures heavily into my reaction to this news.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 12:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
OMEGZZ!!!
the wurlds r endingz!!!
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Groug, his presence would have
made little difference for the Giants this year except as entertainment value and to harm other teams still competing. But I’m not as sure as you are that what we’d give up would be worth more than the comp pick(s) coming back. They should have taken a shot at this, assuming that Sabean didn’t of course.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
it’s pretty easy for Sabean to pick up a phone and ask Jocketty what it would take to get Dunn, if we make a claim. Nobody here knows that Sabean didn’t do this.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 12:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
fuck work
let’s drink
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
or bowl
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on Aug 11, 2008 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
or toke
for that matter
"ever so cynical yet whimsical giants related signature"
by The Gene Hackman on Aug 11, 2008 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
can’t we drink, toke, and bowl more or less at the same time?
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 8:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No we don't
but since that’s actually a violation of MLB waiver rules I think we should at least assume he didn’t. The August waiver wire free for all is a silent auction—you put in your bid and you find out later what’s to be done about it.
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Aug 11, 2008 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
are you sure?
That’s not in any of the waiver rule primers I’ve read. But I wouldn’t be the first one to misunderstand the waiver rules.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pretty sure.
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Aug 11, 2008 12:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think
once you put in a claim, the two teams have the opportunity to talk abut what would get it done.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 11, 2008 3:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Then why would the Reds do it?
Why would they give up those comp picks for something that’s less than those comp picks?
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Walt Jocketty is a sly fox. I would not bet that this is the case.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Walt Jocketty: a look inside the mind
OH no! we’re losing ground on dem Cubby Holes. I need some outside guidance, a wise old sage to show me the way.
/hires recently fired bill bavasi
ergo, Walt Jocketty = stupid.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 11, 2008 3:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just because Bavasi was a terrible GM doesn’t mean he was never good at anything.
Or, on the complete flipside of that point, maybe Jocketty wanted Bavasi’s advice so he could know what not to do. “Pick up Jose Vidro? Sure Bill, we’ll think about it! [snicker]”
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 3:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
that second one is foolproof
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 3:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If this works,
Brian Sabean will be awfully popular in the offseason
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn’t say he was never good at anything.
I said he was never good at a specific thing.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 11, 2008 5:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think you can really say it’s completely stupid to hire Bavasi without knowing his exact role, which we don’t.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 10:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I doubt they signed him to be a paperweight...
...and that’s about all he’s really qualified for. So yes, completely stupid.
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
by Bhaakon on Aug 11, 2008 10:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We still don’t know who the PTBNL-ers are. They could be from this years draft, or late signees from last years draft. Jocketty is far from stupid, though we here at MCC think every GM not named Epstien or Beane are stupid.
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 8:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They could NOT come from this year’s draft. That, I believe, is the one thing we can safely say we know about the PTBNLs. Players cannot be traded (even retroactively as PTNBLs) within a year of being taken in the first year player draft.
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Aug 12, 2008 9:38 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’re right, they cannont be traded outright, but I believe they can be traded as PTBNL. I’m sure I read that in Keith Law’s column at espn.com. I’ll try to come up with documentation tonight.
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Giants should have taken a shot at this
for the comp pick(s), if nothing else.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
how does that work, exactly
Would they have been first-round picks? What type FA would DUnn have been?
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He’s definitely going to be a Type-A FA. You would get a first round pick (or a second round pick if a team in the top 15 signed him) and a first round compensation pick.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
by jponry on Aug 11, 2008 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
cheers, jp
Is it worth giving up a B prospect and $$$ (this year’s Dunn salary) for those 2 picks? If that’s a better deal, then Sabean definitley shoulda done it
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
He definitely should have done it anyway. Why the hell not?
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
if everything else is a wash
then it might have been worth it to put more butts in the seats and make this season more tolerable, not to mention the fact that we would have had the inside path on getting Dunn for next season, and could have made an offer before he files.
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 11, 2008 2:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
These aren’t the comp picks you’re looking for.
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
by Lyle on Aug 12, 2008 7:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
the thing is
Those PTBNL are not bound by the rules of the Waiver rules because they will be named after the season. Those two prospects could be pretty decent.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 11, 2008 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
sandwich picks, right?
and we would have had to give up something in order to get him, lest they just pull him back from waivers.
I’m not throwing Sabean under the bus yet.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
mmmm
sandwich picks….
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
With the first pick in the lunch draft, BVCE selects turkey sandwich.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 11, 2008 12:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chicken Sandwich! with pepper jack from Mr. Pickles.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 12:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mr. Pickles makes some damn fine sandwiches
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 11, 2008 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I jsut hope the Turkery, bacon, and avocado from Eric’s is still on the board when I draft…
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Eric’s DeliCafe? I went there for a first time in May and I died it was so good.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 12, 2008 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But then you were resurrected!
by Lars The Wanderer on Aug 12, 2008 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The sandwich had magic powers.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Aug 13, 2008 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But
Can he play centerfield?
/obligatory
Kevin Pritchard has Chuck Norris tied up in the trunk of his car.
by otis29 on Aug 11, 2008 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fixed: Speed and defense
opposite of Dunn successful
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn’t nate our future 3B?
Proud father of Eric Surcamp! I sure hope we sign him.
by The Thrill on Aug 11, 2008 7:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
OH MY FUCKING GOD YOU'VE GOT TO BE FUCKING KIDDING ME!
SHIT THATS FUCK!
This guy is EXACTLY what we need this year! God damit!
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:26 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You're a gamer!
Kevin Pritchard has Chuck Norris tied up in the trunk of his car.
by otis29 on Aug 11, 2008 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
ehhh
really?
I think you could argue that he’s what we needed at the beginning of the year, or maybe next year, but what does his presence here for the rest of this year get us?
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Something worth watching
and pix at the end, if he’s not resigned.
NINE GAMEZZZ OUT!!!
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree that it seems like a win-win
especially if the reds didn’t get much in return
anybody know if the PTBNLs could have possibly been any good in this case? Is it a foregone conclusion that they are not elite?
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 11, 2008 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
From what I know of PTBNL
I think they could be of any quality. I’ve heard they make a list, evaluate from that list and then will pick two once the season is over. I definitely believe we are severely underestimating the worth of these two prospects.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 11, 2008 3:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, if you guys want to get pissed off over something Giants related I think you should pick something other than this.
by FluLikeSymptoms on Aug 11, 2008 12:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bonds is available
Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal
by nostocksjustbonds on Aug 11, 2008 12:38 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Cecil Cooper says he would quit if the Astros brought in Bonds...
If Barry walks in, Coop walks out. Things are getting interesting around here.’’Bonds is not a fit for us. If he would come, I would go. I wouldn’t want to deal with it.’‘—Cecil Cooper
Carlos Lee goes down, probably for the year, and you would walk if they they replaced him with Bonds?? They should call his bluff, he wouldn’t walk.
Adopted Giant Brian Wilson: One of the few reasons to watch this year.
by sfgreg on Aug 11, 2008 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
cecil cooper is a fucknut
and a moron.
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 1:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And a crybaby.
Here's to Kemp, Loney, LaRoche, Hu, and Kershaw not panning out.
by Woody Wins on Aug 11, 2008 1:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
he can play 1b though...!!!
Fairley odd parent to Wendell
by WTF on Aug 11, 2008 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Come on
Just because Cecil Cooper believes that Barry’s presence at this late date on his roster would not outweigh the negatives he might bring doesn’t make Cooper a crybaby, moron, or anything other than someone with a different opinion than yours.
The Cubbies are 12 games ahead of Houston in the Central as I type this. The Astros would have to leap-frog both the Brewers and Cards to get into contention for just the wild card. Houston has apparently come to the realistic conclusion that are not “in it” this year. There is no baseball reason for them to sign Bonds, much less when you factor in the potential negative publicity and/or fan reaction in Houston.
Heck, maybe Cooper hates Barry’s guts and thinks he’s the devil incarnate; I understand arguing against someone’s opinion. I don’t understand name-calling.
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
by Lyle on Aug 12, 2008 8:38 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
FOOTBALL PLAYER
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
no, punter.
And I mean that in the nicest possibly way.
Disfrute Los Gigantes every day at www.leftymalo.com
by leftymalo on Aug 11, 2008 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
My thoughts
About which I know you care A LOT.
I believe Dunn to be criminally underrated. Dude is slugging a shitload.
Jocketty is an idiot if that’s all he got for Dunn.
The Giants could’ve used Dunn at the beginning of the year, and could use him next year, but picking him up only to let him walk and get comp picks next year seems risky.
I love this move cuz it fuXX0rz the Dodgers.
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:45 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Also
I’m looking forward to hearing Sabes say he “kicked the tires” on Dunn but couldn’t work anything out.
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Aug 11, 2008 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's only the "radical fringe" who wanted him anyways
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, man. I agree with that. This would've been silly.
And let’s be really honest with ourselves here: If Sabean had gotten Dunn, we would be screaming about (a) taking a roster spot away from a young player & all the consequences of that in lost development time, lost assessment time, etc., and (b) that this indicates a foolish attempt to go for the division title this year, indicating that Sabean just doesn’t “get it,” and all that.
This sturm und drang is silly.
I'm adopting a true Giant and an awe-inspring gamer: tk. "Atta babe."
by Mayor of 311 on Aug 11, 2008 1:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
not to mention that whatever mid-level prospect we gave up would have suddenly been everybody’s favorite mid-level Giants prospect
by FluLikeSymptoms on Aug 11, 2008 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would, at least
who gives a crap about two months of Adam Dunn?
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, but if I have a choice of watching seven weeks of John Bowker at 1B, or
seven weeks of Adam Dunn plus those comp picks, I’m taking Door Number Two Monty.
I already know everything I need to know about Bowker playing 1B. Having him finish the year in AAA is not a crime, nor is trading Winn in another waiver wire move to free up RF for Bowker or Nate.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
if the Reds are dumping salary, they aren’t going to take Winn off of our hands.No way this doesn’t further obstruct a young guy for the last two months.
All I’m saying is: c’mon people! Let’s wait until Sabean does something actually stupid before the panties all get into a collective bunch.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 2:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good point
And since it’s Sabean, it’s not like we actually have to wait a long time for him to do something stupid.
No, my Crazy Crab bobblehead is not for sale.
by Kitspool on Aug 11, 2008 2:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No we don't
Tyler Walker is still on the team and getting important innings late in games. Every day he remains on the team is something stupid. Then again Sabes will probably see he got the win on Saturday and point to that as a reason Walker still has value.
Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you're a mile away and you have their shoes.
by WilliamVanLandingham on Aug 11, 2008 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
AHHH!
stop the hatred of Tyler Walker. He’s gotten horribly unlucky with GB hits and his home run rate.
1.28 WHIP, 7.8 K/G, 3.3 BB/G, 3.83 xFIP (home runs neutralized)
The guy has been unlucky as hell: 21.0% HR/F (that’s ridonckulous; almost double the normal rate), 68.6% strand rate.
the dude has been better than his numbers and your anecdotal memory indicate.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 11, 2008 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
NO
we’d be getting excited about the HOM3R\/NS!!!!!!!!
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 11, 2008 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
d00d bt hve youz seenz his BA??!?!?
OMGZ HE suXX0rz11
by bondslegend on Aug 11, 2008 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Reds just hired Bill Bavasi to be a part of their front office.
Just sayin’.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
by jponry on Aug 11, 2008 1:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We Care A Lot!
Good Faith No More song.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's a dirty job
but someone has to do it.
Arizona thinks we're Washington which thinks we're Arizona.
by victor frankenstein on Aug 11, 2008 8:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rock
Hudson Rock
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 12, 2008 8:46 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hell, the Reds are picking up
half of Dunn’s remaining salary this year, so the ‘rental’ cost the D-Backs only half of his remaining salary and a mid-level pitcher who may not have been in their plans. A great deal by the D-Backs and something I hope Sabean at least explored. Again, it would have been worth it for the picks and to see what the team would have been like with one true power hitter in the middle of the order.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 12:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
this is a great deal for a team trying to win a division. Not so great for a team competing for 13th place in the National League.
by FluLikeSymptoms on Aug 11, 2008 1:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And you know… I think that any deal that makes the Dodgers less likely to win the Division is all right by me.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
by jponry on Aug 11, 2008 1:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you talking $?
Because SF kind of has a lot right now
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 11, 2008 2:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And would undoubtedly make more
with the sellouts that Dunn would generate
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 11, 2008 2:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
professional sports is the only business where if you have some money on hand the first thought is “we must spend this money!” That always amuses me.
by FluLikeSymptoms on Aug 11, 2008 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
well, pro sports and the Pentagon.
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 9:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
+2 PTNBL
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 11, 2008 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And with waiver rules
Any minor league prospects on the 40-man would have to be included as PTBNLs (I believe). So it seems pretty likely to me that we don’t know who the best prospects are who were traded in this dela.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
exactly
I have no idea what all the vitriol here is about. Consider:
(1) the Dbacks are trading future for present. For a non-contender within the division, this is good news!
(2) Adam Dunn’s contract allowed him to limit the teams he could be dealt to. I’m betting we were not on the lost of 10 teams, considering how he has played at the Phone Booth.
(3) The Dodgers are less likely to make the playoffs. Yes!
(4) Adam Dunn is a free agent after the season. If we want him that badly, we can pay him a bunch of $$ to show up next year.
(5) Groug’s point above about how much this is likely to have cost in prospects.
Get a grip, people.
by BigO on Aug 11, 2008 1:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Some of us disagree with groug about the prospects, but
we’ll agree to disagree.
Meet my three little friends: Timmy, Dirty, and Cain
by Buck Henry on Aug 11, 2008 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hopefully Sabean's tire-kicking consisted of
“Are we on the list? No. Oh, okay. Carry on then.”
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 11, 2008 2:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
As far as I know
the only rules for PTBNLs is that they can NOT have played at the same level as the player being traded for during the current season—in other words they couldn’t have appeared in the majors this year. They could certainly be somebody on a rookie league team somewhere (as long as they weren’t drafted and signed this year, but that’s a different rule entirely.).
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Aug 11, 2008 3:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
So any solid AAA prospects who are on the 40-man would be eligible to be PTBNLs and would have to be PTBNLs to be in the deal.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 3:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They would be eligible, but they wouldn’t have to be. And I think if somebody did a canvas of PTBNL over the last decade, they’re quite rarely 40 man roster players, although that’s just an impression. Wasn’t Travis Denker a PTBNL?
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Aug 11, 2008 6:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But a guy from one team’s 40-man who was traded without being a PTBNL, if he was (let’s say) named in the deal, would be exposed to waivers. The only way to get serious prospects off the 40-man would be to use the PTBNL method.
And I think Dunn is worth slightly more than Mark Sweeney.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 11, 2008 10:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, I believe what you’re saying is correct. I was just objecting to your assertion (or what I took to be your assertion) that the PTBNLs MUST come from the 40 man. And yes, clearly, Dunn is worth more than Mark Sweeney.
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Aug 12, 2008 9:36 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If a player is not on the 40 man roster
he doesn’t need to clear waivers to be traded. I can’t think of any reason why you wouldn’t just name the players traded if they weren’t on the 40 man roster.
C. Trent Rosecrans (? cannot vouch for his validity.)
http://thelotd.com/ctrent/blog/2008/08/11/players_to_be_named
believes the 2 players are from the group of Micah Owings, Max Scherzer, and Jailen Peguero.
by marklar on Aug 12, 2008 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Please...won't someone think about the PTBNL-ers?
The Reds could be getting two B level prospects in addition to the “mid-level pitcher”. Wait until all the returns are in before passing judgement.
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 9:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They’re still going to lose in the Divisional Series, won’t even sell that Arena Football stadium out either.
Without killing anyone
We've won it 3 times
by ChrisHero on Aug 11, 2008 1:32 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
PTBNL
these aren’t necessarily throw ins, right? like, couldn’t the diamondbacks have given a list of 5 or 6 B to B+ prospects that the reds have to choose from, but they didn’t make it official since the 48 hour window was almost closed?
i have to think the reds have pulled something better than “a mid-level prospect and salary relief”
Dodgers fans eat their young.
by redhornet78 on Aug 11, 2008 1:43 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Common misconception. PTBNLs are simply guys who parents are very lazy.
Providing natural gas with every post
by Goofus on Aug 11, 2008 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i laughed
a lot.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 11, 2008 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Irritation
What’s so irritating about it is that Dunn is one of the few left handed power hitters that I would want in Pac Bell, because when he hits it out, it’d be out of anywhere.
I’m sure it’s unlikely we were on his list of 10, but there’s a chance, and it would’ve been amazing, especially considering the Reds paid half his salary.
by dprodigy19 on Aug 11, 2008 2:23 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Eh, no biggie. The only annoying thing here is that, if we end up signing him as a free agent, it helps the Dbacks in the draft instead of the Reds.
by rotorueter on Aug 11, 2008 2:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
that's actually a decent point
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 11, 2008 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
At least if we sign him, they get a second rounder instead of a first.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
by jponry on Aug 11, 2008 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Urgh!
I don’t understand why we wouldn’t claim him, it’s a very poor decision. Firstly, i’ll ignore the 2 months of Dunn as not having much value to us, but focus on the other issues. By claiming him, it could go one of three ways.
1) They don’t pull him back from waivers & we get him for free. In other words we have to pay the rest of his salary & get either the chance to agree a long term deal or get 2 draft picks back. Certainly worthwhile for us, although the Reds wouldn’t have agreed.
2) We trade something for him. Now, depending on what the Reds ask for, we can make a deal if the players we are giving up aren’t worth (to us) as much as the two draft picks. We also get the opportunity to try & work out a long term deal. Just a comment on the value of the draft picks, we’d get a supplemental pick & with a first or second round pick. That’s actually quite valuable. As an example, in 2007 we got Alderson & Noonan with those picks & this year we got Gillaspie & Kieschnick with those picks. That’s a lot of value, and worth more than most of our players, so giving up value to get him, wouldn’t have been a bad idea, even if he didn’t re-sign.
3) We can’t work out a deal with the Reds. If the Reds ask for two much then we back off & he stays there, we’re under no obligation to trade for him.
So what exactly did we have to lose, we were basically offered an exclusive negotiating position to try & work out a deal, with no obligations and turned it down. The only way it’d make sense would be if we believe Dunn to have negative value (which is ridiculous) or that we don’t want extra draft picks (also ridiculous).
Proud owner of the most boring Username! Alex Hinshaw: Now showing in a bullpen near you!
by GiantFan on Aug 12, 2008 2:10 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
And if the Giants did get him they can test drive him a couple months to see if he will place First Base. If there are any off field problems etc.
Yes Dunn is a specialty player who is lacking in areas out side of his specialty. Yes his specialty is an area we are severally, drastically lacking in. What’s the hang up? Afraid he will do worse then Hillenbrand or bummed because could get him without trading a couple young arms?
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
by daveinexile on Aug 12, 2008 8:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I simply have to believe he rejected a trade to the Giants as part of his NT clause
Nothing else makes sense. Of course, this is Giantsland- and where’s that “Muwahahahahaha” coming from anyway?
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 12, 2008 8:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He couldn't have used his no trade clause
Because we didn’t claim him, therefore weren’t interested in bringing him in & couldn’t trade for him. I guess they could have technically inquired & discussed a trade with the Reds & were told he’d reject us with his no-trade clause, but i find that highly unlikely.
Proud owner of the most boring Username! Alex Hinshaw: Now showing in a bullpen near you!
by GiantFan on Aug 12, 2008 9:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can only imagine the hew and cry if the Giants’ woujld’ve made this trade. Pitchforks would’ve been passed out, discussion of giving roster spots to older player would’ve been yelled from the rooftops, and at least 20 posters would’ve called it a misguided attempt to win this year. Talk about dammed if you do and dammed if you don’t.
by tyrannoman on Aug 12, 2008 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree
There’s a clear split in this thread, and Dunn is far from “old”, although he is accused of having “old player skills”.
¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!
by hairball on Aug 12, 2008 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He’s older than Bowker and Ishikawa and he’s a known quantity.
If you want to find out something, find out what Ishikawa can do against major league breaking stuff or find out if Bowker can make an adjustment. It would be a huge waste of money and prospects to “find out” that what we already know: that Dunn is still a good hitter (though probably not one to age gracefully) and a defensive cipher.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 12, 2008 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would hit the effing roof if we made this trade.
Especially if we put in a a waiver claim and the Reds simply decided to dump Dunn’s salary onto us for the remainder of the season.
I think this team’s lack of offense has made 90% of the McCoven crazy and desperate.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 12, 2008 9:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So you wouldn’t take Dunn if all we had to do was pay his minimal remaining salary? That strikes me as strange. Why wouldn’t you want 2 good draft picks without giving up any talent?
Proud owner of the most boring Username! Alex Hinshaw: Now showing in a bullpen near you!
by GiantFan on Aug 12, 2008 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
$3 million can get you top flight latin American talent. I would take that over a sandwich pick minus cash.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 12, 2008 9:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s not just a sandwich pick though, Dunn will get you a sanwich pick & a first round (or second round pick) As i mentioned, in 2006 we got Alderson & Noonan with equivalent picks. Would you not pay $3 to get prospects of that talent? Sure you could use it to get a top flight latin american talent, but there aren’t that many of them around (2/3 a year) and so you’ve no guarentee’s to get one & certainly wouldn’t have the choice in the draft.
Proud owner of the most boring Username! Alex Hinshaw: Now showing in a bullpen near you!
by GiantFan on Aug 12, 2008 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, I could concede that maybe could have worked out for the Giants.
But there is a real possibility that every GM already knew what the price of Adam Dunn was and that it was going to be cash and the minor league equivalent of two high draft picks.
If those two PTBNL turn out to be nothing and nobody, then throw the hissy fit. But until then, evaluating a non-existent trade is impossible.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 12, 2008 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
fair enough.
For me the hardest point is did our front office even consider it? We will never know.
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
by daveinexile on Aug 12, 2008 10:20 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
True, you’re right they could have wanted more than 2 draft picks worth of quality, in fact they probably did & we’d have to move on. The fact that we didn’t acquire Dunn & he’s not sitting here as a Giant, isn’t an annoying thing. To be honest, i don’t think we’d have worked out a deal if we’d claimed him as they may have wanted too much. The annoying thing is that we didn’t even pursue the option of getting him.
Also, something to remember is, after the trade deadline, you don’t have to compete with others for a player, our poor record gives us the exclusive rights to trade for him, so we wouldn’t have to match the D’Backs offer, just match the Reds not trading him at all (in other words the two draft picks)
Proud owner of the most boring Username! Alex Hinshaw: Now showing in a bullpen near you!
by GiantFan on Aug 12, 2008 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You forget
to get those compensation picks we would have to offer arbitration to Dunn. What if he accepts and then stinks at Mays Field as his career numbers suggest he might. And if he doesn’t accept arbitration and we get the picks, word is that the 2009 draft is weak.
by marklar on Aug 12, 2008 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d say there’s pretty much no way Dunn accepts arbitration & takes a one year deal when he could get multi-year deal elsewhere, for probably more money.
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by GiantFan on Aug 12, 2008 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just to counter point you…
We have this bottomless bog over at First. Its been there for a over a decade. The organization throws bodies in an attempt to bridge it but they usually sink. Occasionally there is enough production ( on one side of the ball) to catch our breathe before the next body is piled on. Why would modest costing Dunn not look to be a viable body to risk at bridging the bottomless bog?
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by daveinexile on Aug 12, 2008 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Bowker & Ishikawa like everyone does to a degree & hope we give them shots in the majors. But even in their most optomistic predictions, they’re never going to put up the numbers Dunn can put up.
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by GiantFan on Aug 12, 2008 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
for two months
w00t
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 12, 2008 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
granted everything depends on price.
But would you rather see if the guy would play nnicely with others now and be able to end th arrangement in 2 months? or take a blind leap on 3-5 years everything would be fine?
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
by daveinexile on Aug 12, 2008 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dunn’s an established player, evaluating him based on two months in an S.F. uniform was what we did with Randy Winn and it’s not really a good process.
and 3-5 years for a guy getting close to 30 with old player skills? No thanks.
you can't block the Bocock
by oldjacket on Aug 12, 2008 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hmm Yes 2 months can be very useful. The management might have heard Dunn Reputation ( what ever it is) but be having him on the roster they get to see first hand what’s true and what false when it comes to interacting with the rest of the staff.
Mentioning Winn is interesting. One because they used the same route with Schmidt. They was executed rather well.
Second because at the time of the Winn contract the Giants were looking at the real possibility of no Bonds the next season and running and Ellision & Linden based O.F. with Moises Alou when healthy. I can’t say I blame Sabean for wanting a little stability there.
Which kind of leads to different point. The problems you refer to with Winn is generally because the front office then went and signed Roberts, Rowand and a manager that does not seem to believe a veteran can lose playing time. None of that I can lay on the initial signing of Winn. Even if his limited NTC is a bit more then goofy.
All that said I do respect your stance the Dunn does nto offer enough of a total package to make the risk worth while in you eyes.
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
by daveinexile on Aug 13, 2008 8:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well considering Bowker really should be at AAA and is an out fielder tell this year I really fail to see how more established player taking first base should not block him. Instead it would create compiteation and the chance to up grade. At least in theory*.
I use the words should not because Boulder Skull would probably insist on marching a Dunn out in LF and CF every day. But that is another rant.
Theory avoids thinking on Winn and Nate too much at this point in time though.
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
by daveinexile on Aug 12, 2008 10:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just guessing, but I think the PTBNLs from the D’backs are going to be worth more than we would have been willing to give up.
The Reds weren’t going to just give him away.
I wouldn’t risk offering arbitration to Dunn to try and get the picks.
I think it would be a bad move to try and change a player’s position from the outfield to 1B in mid-August. 1B is an underrated defensive position in that it saves throwing errors from the other IF positions. When JT was at first the Giants had one of the best defenses in the majors. I wouldn’t want to put a defensive hack there.
Dunn, for his career, has not shown that he can hit at Mays Field.
I am not a Sabean fan, but I think this non-move is one of his better ones.
by marklar on Aug 12, 2008 12:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You wouldn’t risk having Adam Dunn for one year? There are worse things you could end up with.
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by jponry on Aug 12, 2008 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
There are worse things,
sure, but those worse things wouldn’t cost us as much either. First off just to get him we have to make a waiver claim, and complete a trade. To get picks we have to offer arbitration. If he accepted and won, the money he got would be based on his leading the league in HRs. He played in Great America Small Park. I don’t believe he would hit as many HRs playing here. In fact I see him as unsuited to our park and not worth giving up prospects to get him.
If he accepts arbitration and wins we lose propspects and pay big bucks for Dunn for one year. No supplemental picks.
If he accepts and loses we lose propects and get Dunn one year for what the Giants want to pay him. No supplemental picks.
If he declines arbitration we get 2 supplemental picks for the prospects we lost.
No I wouldn’t risk it.
by marklar on Aug 12, 2008 6:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
According to the ticker on Baseball Tonight, Micah Owings is going over to the Reds in this deal.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Aug 12, 2008 9:28 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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