Quickly....
by Grant on Jul 8, 2008 12:52 PM PDT
72 comments
Illness prevented me from writing a coherent post today, but I was trying to write a piece about the Mercury News article today. A key quote:
Yes. Yes, it is.
I had a lot more on this article, but I just can't think right now. Open Trade Thread.
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First!
Cain for Crede!
Proud pappa of....STEVE HOLM!!
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 8, 2008 1:00 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Lincecum for Bill Hall!!!
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Jul 8, 2008 1:01 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The quotes about Randy Winn in this article make me apprehensive. Will Sabes trade for Randy Winn Part 2: Electric Boogalo?
The difference is that Schueler had pitchers who were impending free agents. Sabean’s pitchers are either young (Matt Cain, Tim Lincecum, Jonathan Sanchez) or carrying a $126 million contract (Barry Zito), making them highly unlikely to be traded.Sabean sees his situation as more closely related to 2005, when the Giants were 13 games under .500 – yet just 5 1/2 games out of first place – on July 31. They acquired outfielder Randy Winn from Seattle for pitcher Jesse Foppert and catcher Yorvit Torrealba.
Sabean will look for a similar deal in an effort to support the club’s bid to compete, but he is realistic about his chances.
So, we trade for marginal-ish player, who goes crazy over the remainder of the season, and then we extend him for years to come!
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:03 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The trade itself was pretty good
The extension, not so much.
Proud pappa of....STEVE HOLM!!
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 8, 2008 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
In all seriousness
I think the Randy Winn trade was a good one in a vacuum.
Yorvit is pretty much akin to the sort of MiL scrubs we have fighting for positions now. Randy has been a much better player over the last 3 years than Yorvit has and they will both probably be out of baseball at the same time, and since Foppert was garbage I think the Giants came out well ahead.
Extending Winn like we did was probably a mistake however.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jul 8, 2008 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
your assuming we could have used that money to a better end
you forget that it would be sabean spending it. chalk up a few extra mil for Barry Zito.
Idolizing Robb Nen since 2002...
by Smoke on the Water on Jul 8, 2008 1:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's not so much spending the money
As it is that now we have a Pretty good outfielder we would like to trade, but he has too big of a contract.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jul 8, 2008 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
but he has too big of a contract.
You can say that about the majority of veteran OF’s though. Look at Adam Dunn. Just wait till the Angels try to unload Torri Hunter, Gary Matthews Jr. Or the Mets Beltran etc.
Winn is less overpaid then a lot of other people are.
by Hobbes2d on Jul 8, 2008 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is Beltran overpaid right now? I’d say no. Dunn is pretty good, too.
The Hunter deal wasn’t great and GMJ was a terrible deal.
Point is, most of those guys are better than Winn.
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except no.
Beltran is making 18.5 million over the next 4 years (that’s including this season). Including a shitload of deferred salary. With his propensity for injury and inconsistencies at the plate, I don’t see how he isn’t overpaid at nearly 19 million a year over the next 3 seasons. Not to mention he gets 8.5 million a year from 08-11 in deferments. Ask the Mets if they feel like they’ve gotten their money’s worth. Or if the fans have felt that way.
Dunn is making 13 mill this year to hit .228. Yes he is still hitting HR’s and getting on base, but the Reds probably can’t even trade him since he has a full no trade clause. And he’s an adventure out in LF.
Hunter’s making 16 mill this year, 17.5 next year and 18 a year over the final 3 years of his deal. Is he twice the player Winn is? No.
So case in point, Randy Winn at 8.25 mill in 08 and 09 = bargain compared to what some of his peers are making, and also compared to the production they are putting up or aren’t putting up.
by Hobbes2d on Jul 8, 2008 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Find the sarcasm!
OK, you’ve convinced me Hobbes2d, Randy Winn is better than Carlos Beltran and Adam Dunn.
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is the internets, I do not possess my sarchasm meter.
by Hobbes2d on Jul 8, 2008 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can't see the contract being a huge issue
The Giants could just eat some of the money. I think they’re under budget right now, so it won’t really be a big deal.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Jul 8, 2008 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
and by your, i mean you’re. we could really use an edit option for those dumb grammar mistakes i always notice a second after i hit “post”
Idolizing Robb Nen since 2002...
by Smoke on the Water on Jul 8, 2008 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or maybe we could have use the extra cash to bring in another CF like Dave Rober…..
n/m.
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Roberts was and is a LF. I think you mean Steve Finley…
by Hobbes2d on Jul 8, 2008 1:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Finley gave us way more
than Alfonso would have. That was a pretty good trade, IMHO
Proud pappa of....STEVE HOLM!!
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 8, 2008 1:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Steve Finley is Steve Finley, therefore it was not that good of a trade.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
by jponry on Jul 8, 2008 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Remember when he got all whiny because he was starting to get benched after it was super clear that he was baked as a player?
Yeah, I don’t like Finley either.
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would have rather just DFA’d Alfonzo, tbh.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
by jponry on Jul 8, 2008 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
last year when the Giants played the Rockies Kruk and Kuip were discussing the fact that with Finley now playing for the Rockies he has played for every team in the NL West. Kruk, referencing his legendary Giant-killer status, said “and everywhere he has been he has killed the Giants” to which I replied “yeah, especially the year he played for the Giants.” I was quite proud of it, but much like most of my best jokes it came with me watching TV alone on my couch with nobody to appreciate it. Too bad I hadn’t discovered the Gameday Threads back then
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 9, 2008 12:03 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Did you black out the 91 games he played in center for us last year? I know I did.
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
All of last year is a big black out. Other than some of Cain and Lincecum’s starts.
by Hobbes2d on Jul 8, 2008 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Was it really that big of a mistake? Especially given we wouldn’t have been able to find a RF who would have produced the way Winn has. Don’t even say Schierholtz either, since he at best would put up Winn like numbers, sans the SB’s and lesser defense.
by Hobbes2d on Jul 8, 2008 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We really had no reason to extend Winn, he was on the books for the rest of ‘05 and all of ‘06. Sabean immediately extended him after his HOMERFEST of ‘05, which wasn’t really the true Randy Winn. I sometimes wonder how much HOMERFEST ‘05 influenced Brian’s decision making on Winn.
Winn isn’t a terrible option in CF, so maybe I secretly hate Dave Roberts as well. But we had no reason to extend him the way we did.
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you bitching just to bitch about something? I mean honestly what’s the problem?
I must say I don’t like the money he was extended for, but Randy Winn has been pretty damn reliable, and at the money he is making, relative to other OF’s of his experience level he comes at a fucking bargain. And he’s outperforming most of these other guys, at a lower cost.
Rowand will likely be in that same boat for the next few years. I didn’t like the amount of money he got, but relative to what other CF’s are likely to get over the next few years when they become FA eligible, he’s going to look like a bargain.
by Hobbes2d on Jul 8, 2008 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you bitching just to bitch about something? I mean honestly what’s the problem?
Yes, whats the deal with airplane food!
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree. Xanthan’s a bitch. I also agree that Winn’s extension wasn’t that big a deal. He and Kotsay signed nearly identical deals aat about the same time and obviously Winn did a better job of earning his money than Kotsay.
2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!
by Goofus on Jul 8, 2008 1:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bitch, please
2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!
by Goofus on Jul 8, 2008 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also
“But we’ve completely changed our tune. We’re not interested in the year-to-year planning we’ve done in the past. While you’d like to add a bat to the lineup, we’re not going to add (an impending) free agent.
This out of Sabeans mouth is at least encouraging. Might have to give him some more credit than we have thus far.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jul 8, 2008 1:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
“But we’ve completely changed our tune. We’re not interested in the year-to-year planning we’ve done in the past. While you’d like to add a bat to the lineup, we’re not going to add (an impending) free agent.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jul 8, 2008 1:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
In addition
"But we’ve completely changed our tune. We’re not interested in the year-to-year planning we’ve done in the past. While you’d like to add a bat to the lineup, we’re not going to add (an impending) free agent.
by Natto on Jul 8, 2008 1:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
109
“But we’ve completely changed our tune. We’re not interested in the year-to-year planning we’ve done in the past. While you’d like to add a bat to the lineup, we’re not going to add (an impending) free agent.
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com and on it I make jokes about things.
by groug on Jul 8, 2008 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just to play devil's advocate
"But we’ve completely changed our tune. We’re not interested in the year-to-year planning we’ve done in the past. While you’d like to add a bat to the lineup, we’re not going to add (an impending) free agent.
2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!
by Goofus on Jul 8, 2008 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Blame this damn blog software
Not me ;)
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jul 8, 2008 2:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is Sabean sending up a balloon?
Address the infield.
by wilriv21 on Jul 8, 2008 1:04 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
http://www.theinfield.com
Proud pappa of....STEVE HOLM!!
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 8, 2008 1:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
personally, I prefer The Outfield
by FluLikeSymptoms on Jul 9, 2008 12:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
sanchez for jack wilson!!
or, more seriously, some pitching (of the non lincecum, cain, sanchez, alderson, bumgarner variety) to take a chance on the oft injured Hank Blalock.
Idolizing Robb Nen since 2002...
by Smoke on the Water on Jul 8, 2008 1:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Bocock and Blalock FTW!
Proud pappa of....STEVE HOLM!!
by UnleashTheGore on Jul 8, 2008 1:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
when did Jack Wilson turn old?
Castillo hits doubles.
by kennv on Jul 8, 2008 2:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
not THAT old, maybe...
but not that good either. OPS numbers in the .600s for the 05, 06, and 08 seasons.
Idolizing Robb Nen since 2002...
by Smoke on the Water on Jul 8, 2008 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i didn’t mean the comment snarky. i had just realized the day before that Wilson wasn’t a “young guy” prospect that could grow into a consistent OPS 800 guy at short, but rather an guy sneaking past his peak years but the still the subject of much trade talk.
Castillo hits doubles.
by kennv on Jul 9, 2008 8:22 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think we should trade Grant for a fearless leader who can stay healthy. He’s the freakin’ Moises Alou of bloggers with a Zito-esque contract. Face it, this site is screwed, handcuffed and hamstrung for years to come.
2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!
by Goofus on Jul 8, 2008 1:17 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, really, Grant is always blowing a hammy when he tries to update the site. His days of being productive are long gone.
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who’s this Hammy guy? Can he play 3rd base?
2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!
by Goofus on Jul 8, 2008 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh lord I laughed hard at that one.
Tentatively adopting Dan Ortmeier. And Boom Goes the Dynamite.
by Andy from DC on Jul 8, 2008 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Amazing, well done sir. I almost lost it in the middle of a meeting.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
by marcello on Jul 9, 2008 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I still want to see what Wilson would fetch
plus the other usual suspects (everyone not named Lincecum) .
Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.
by delorean on Jul 8, 2008 1:28 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
YOU CAN’T TRADE WILSON, HE HAS SAVES! SAVES!
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wilson Saves!
Jesus has got nuthin’ on him!
2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!
by Goofus on Jul 8, 2008 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do you think Jesus would walk less hitters?
by xanthan on Jul 8, 2008 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but they would walk on water.
2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!
by Goofus on Jul 8, 2008 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
me, too
Contending teams probably looking for closers:
Tampa Bay (if the PRICE is right?)
Detroit (maybe, but they don’t have much left in the system)
Atlanta
Florida
Milwaukee (still got some nice prospects left)
Chicago White Sox (if Jenks goes down)
Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal
by nostocksjustbonds on Jul 8, 2008 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I assume you were kidding about Price, right?
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
by marcello on Jul 9, 2008 9:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thats what she said...
Tentatively adopting Dan Ortmeier. And Boom Goes the Dynamite.
by Andy from DC on Jul 8, 2008 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
There should have been a fanshot about this.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jul 8, 2008 2:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I'll make one.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jul 8, 2008 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whew...
done.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jul 8, 2008 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What the heck is a fanspot anyway?
by paboperfecto on Jul 9, 2008 6:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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