Trade Deadline "Strategy"

by j14 on Jul 4, 2008 11:04 AM PDT

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/07/04/SPV611JSSA.DTL

Full story is above but here is the short version

-Lincecum, Cain and Sanchez are not going anywhere!

-No rental players!

-Durham, Aurilia and Omar (like anyone would want him) are available!

-Molina and Winn are not...

My thoughts:

The first three points seem pretty obvious to me, but why is Winn not available? I guess Nate getting some real playing time isn't going to happen until possibly the trade deadline next year when Winn's contract is set to expire... Great job Sabes, make the kid waste another full season.

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Comments

Winn

I just don’t see the Giants getting much for him – certainly not a high level prospect. It’s kinda like the Correia situation. He’s probably more valuable to the Giants than he would be to another team. Of course, there are some stupid GM’s out there.

Bonds stands alone.

Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal

by nostocksjustbonds on Jul 4, 2008 11:09 AM PDT reply actions

I agree that the Giants wouldn’t get much for Winn, but I feel that his ABs would be better spent on Schierholtz. I think a mid level prospect for Winn would be acceptable to see if Nate could be a part of the next winning Giants team.

Giants! Giants! HELP US GOD!

by j14 on Jul 4, 2008 11:50 AM PDT up reply actions

Agreed

Three years ago Randy Winn was every bit the player he is today, but three years younger and with a smaller contract, and we picked him up for a backup catcher and an ex-pitching prospect with a bum arm. Is there any good reason why we’d get a bigger haul for him today?

My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.

by Roger on Jul 4, 2008 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions

The difference between Winn and Correia

The difference in the situations of Randy Winn and Kevin Correia is about $7 million per year and about six years in age. Also, Randy is blocking a good prospect in Nate Schierholtz, while Kevin is filling an important role and blocking on one.

by sharksrog on Jul 4, 2008 4:27 PM PDT up reply actions

probably means

Schierholtz is available

by cakes on Jul 4, 2008 11:14 AM PDT reply actions

We’re not gonna get much for him.

..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.

by Cookyman on Jul 4, 2008 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions

That, or the Giants think that Schierholtz is going to make the U.S. Olympic team and will be in Beijing for most of the month of August, leaving RF to be played by…?? if Winn is traded.

Proud new parent of Mr. Buster Posey... you know, if he signs and stuff.

by GiantsFanInExile on Jul 4, 2008 12:59 PM PDT up reply actions

Bowker?

Everybody Loves Durham
comics | cartoons | Nattowear

by Natto on Jul 4, 2008 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions

Yeah

It’s not like the Giants have a shortage of people to play the outfield.

Only 887 games until the end of Zito's contract

by thehavenot on Jul 4, 2008 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions

Agreed, I just wonder if they think getting rid of Aurilia and Winn at the deadline will leave RF open to be played by a rotating field of players (with Bowker, Ort and whoever they get back in trade maybe covering 1B), and they’d rather jettison Aurillia now, try to deal Winn in the off-season and then go from there. I have no idea if that’s why they’re holding on to Winn, just seems to make sense.

Proud new parent of Mr. Buster Posey... you know, if he signs and stuff.

by GiantsFanInExile on Jul 4, 2008 1:08 PM PDT up reply actions

If

If the Giants got rid of Randy Winn, Rich Aurilia and Dave Roberts, who would stand in the way of John Bowker and Nate Schierholtz playing every day, unless the Giants got a good, young prospect or prospects in return?

by sharksrog on Jul 4, 2008 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions

that wouldn't make sense if Aurilia was gone

by boonitez on Jul 4, 2008 1:27 PM PDT up reply actions

Wouldn't be an Olympian

Nate Schierholtz wouldn’t become an Olympian if the Giants called him up right now because they had just traded Randy Winn, would he? Or has he already made a non-breakable commitment?

by sharksrog on Jul 4, 2008 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions

Sucks that Molina isn’t available. We might actually get a decent piece for him.

by rotorueter on Jul 4, 2008 11:33 AM PDT reply actions

I’m glad he’s not, I don’t want to see a Notgardo/Holm platoon the rest of the way home.

Giants! Giants! HELP US GOD!

by j14 on Jul 4, 2008 11:51 AM PDT up reply actions

We've already conceded this year

Molina, god bless him, won’t make a difference this year, and isn’t a part of any future Giants team. Same with Winn. I agree that we won’t get a ton for Winn, but moving him frees up salary and a roster spot for Ortholtz and Schiermeier.

Billy Hayes: His job is better than yours.

by delorean on Jul 4, 2008 12:04 PM PDT up reply actions

But what if we trade Durham for a catcher-of-the-future? These things can’t be viewed singularly.

by rotorueter on Jul 4, 2008 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions

Didn’t we just draft said “catcher-of-the-future”? Just sayin.

Adoptive papa to Omar...so basically I'm screwed.

by PacBellBoozer on Jul 4, 2008 4:44 PM PDT up reply actions

Fortunately, Posey can play CF.

Everybody Loves Durham
comics | cartoons | Nattowear

by Natto on Jul 4, 2008 4:59 PM PDT up reply actions

and Pitcher, closer, 1b, 2b, SS ,,,,,,

by wilriv21 on Jul 4, 2008 5:02 PM PDT up reply actions

In short, he’ll play wherever the f**k he pleases.

2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!

by Goofus on Jul 4, 2008 5:06 PM PDT up reply actions

Molina

A year ago I wanted the Giants to trade every player they had who was making over a million dollars in 2007. So I would have no problem with trading Bengie Molina now.

by sharksrog on Jul 4, 2008 4:32 PM PDT up reply actions

But Molina is no longer making over a million dollars in 2007.

2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!

by Goofus on Jul 4, 2008 5:07 PM PDT up reply actions

He's just playing his cards really really close to his chest.

I don’t understand keeping Winn around. The 2nd half AB’s at 1B/RF should go to Schierholtz, Ortmeier and Bowker. If the Giants expect to compete next year, they’ll need a big-hitting first baseman or corner outfielder, and the continued development of Bowker at the other position. Whichever route they go, Winn doesn’t make sense in RF.

You have to take Sabean comments with a grain of salt and a shot of tequila, but what he’s saying leads me to believe that a) Bowker will be starting at 1B next year b) Lewis may be dealt or c) he thinks he can trade Winn at any time (going along with his “Winn’s value is unchanging” comments from a few weeks back) and get the same results. I think Sabean thinks this team is closer to competing than it is.

Bengie Molina: stretching doubles into singles since 1998.

by jasomack on Jul 4, 2008 12:03 PM PDT reply actions

I would play

I would play both Nate Schierholtz and John Bowker almost every day, so they can work on hitting southpaws as well as right-handers.

by sharksrog on Jul 4, 2008 4:33 PM PDT up reply actions

That would seem to be the prudent course of action, wouldn’t it?

Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!

by Lyle on Jul 4, 2008 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions

I hate you people.

My son is a good kid.

Tentatively adopting Dan Ortmeier. And Boom Goes the Dynamite.

by Andy from DC on Jul 5, 2008 10:02 AM PDT up reply actions

So...

People still believe in Ortmeier?

by cheno on Jul 4, 2008 12:06 PM PDT reply actions

I do

as a 4th or 5th outfielder who can get starts against lefties. As an everyday player, no.

Giants! Giants! HELP US GOD!

by j14 on Jul 4, 2008 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions

No. He’s strictly in Tooth Fairy/Santa Claus territory.

by rotorueter on Jul 4, 2008 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions

He brings money/presents to children?

Only 887 games until the end of Zito's contract

by thehavenot on Jul 4, 2008 1:05 PM PDT up reply actions

I don't

But I also don’t believe in TI either, so hopefully I am wrong about one of them (or both I guess)

by m34josh on Jul 4, 2008 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions

Who?

Everybody Loves Durham
comics | cartoons | Nattowear

by Natto on Jul 4, 2008 3:18 PM PDT up reply actions

I’m pretty sure that’s the name of Thor’s hammer.

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on Jul 4, 2008 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions

I definitely believe

I definitely believe in Dan Ortmeier. I’ve seen him with my own eyes.

I just don’t believe he is a very good ball player.

by sharksrog on Jul 4, 2008 4:33 PM PDT up reply actions

I don’t understand not wanting to trade Winn. Molina, fine, even though I think he should be dealt (he’s in a slump anyway, just like last year).

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on Jul 4, 2008 12:14 PM PDT reply actions

Well

I like keeping Molina, he’s good for the pitching staff and a hard worker. I just dont think we have any options until Posey is ready to go (assuming he signs).

I think not trading Winn is a dumb move, Nate is ready to try out the majors and it would be nice to see if he can bring something back. If you get nothing but lowball offers than it’s no biggie keeping him around.

Durham, Aurilia, and Vizquel? Eek. Vizquel is awful and definitely isnt going anywhere. Aurilia has a chance to bring back somehting like Denker, and Durham is probably the same. Durham has the best chance of going as a rental.

I like the part with the young guns not being available, I’ll be honest im a little curious what we could get for Cain or Sanchez. It’s the same curiosity that people get when they have been in a relationship a long time and are curious how well they could still do at the bars/clubs.

Overall I feel Sabean is really afraid of making a bad trade, and would prefer to just stand pat. He knows he is one minor slip up from losing his job.

by Giant Voodoo on Jul 4, 2008 12:15 PM PDT reply actions

I think

I think Jonathan Sanchez would do well in the bars.

by sharksrog on Jul 4, 2008 4:34 PM PDT up reply actions

Schierholtz

2 possibilities on Winn not being available:

1) The Giants brass isn’t that high on Schierholtz. Frankly I wouldn’t blame them.
2) Posturing

Which do you guys think it is?

by cakes on Jul 4, 2008 12:42 PM PDT reply actions

Posted this above, but the rumor floating around is that the reason he made the Future’s team is because he is being considered for the U.S. Olympic team. If he makes it, he’ll be playing ball in China in August, and unavailable to the Giants until Sept. at the earliest. I think this is the most reasonable reason why they’re not considering trading Winn at the deadline; who knows, maybe Sabes et al thinks Schierholtz playing in China is a good reward for Nate now, and he can deal Winn in the off-season.

I personally would like to see Nate on the Olympic team – I think that would be a great opportunity for him.

Proud new parent of Mr. Buster Posey... you know, if he signs and stuff.

by GiantsFanInExile on Jul 4, 2008 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions

Would Winn’s no-trade clause also be a reason Sabean didn’t think he’d be dealing him?

2008 Giants: Scrappy! Scrappy! Joy! Joy!

by Goofus on Jul 4, 2008 1:33 PM PDT reply actions

It’s not full no trade though, right? Only partial?

Proud new parent of Mr. Buster Posey... you know, if he signs and stuff.

by GiantsFanInExile on Jul 4, 2008 2:15 PM PDT up reply actions

To Central Division teams, IIRC.

Proud adoptive parent of Tim Alderson.

by JT Jordan on Jul 4, 2008 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions

I believe

I believe Randy can block trades to ten of the other 29 teams.

by sharksrog on Jul 4, 2008 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions

I agree that Sabean is posturing with Winn. He can’t even begin to posture with older guys like Aurilia and Durham, but Winn is another story. He’s a little younger and he’s signed for next year as well. He’s going to pretend he doesn’t want to move him so that he doesn’t have to eat any salary. I think Molina is an untouchable though I agree that he shouldn’t be. The dropoff to Alfonzo and Holm is staggering, and I think they want Bengie around to handle all the young pitchers. Next year’s trade deadline is a different story, although they might still keep him around then because they want the compensation draft pick.

Brian Sabean's new dad: Firm believer in corporal punishment

by rxmeister on Jul 5, 2008 6:31 AM PDT up reply actions