Jesus has risen in the AZL!
by sectionop92 on Jun 25, 2008 10:00 PM PDT
39 comments
Catcher Jesus Navarro and recent draftee C.J. Ziegler are currently the top offensive stars for the Rookie League Giants in Arizona. Given that Wendell Fairley is off to a solid start (read his stat line beyond the batting average), I'll take it as a positive sign that this team, which is essentially cobbled together from the college ranks, organizational filler and the latest imports, that a young catcher and a over-aged corner infielder are leading the offensive output at current without some of the real talent signed and on the way in.
This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.
0 recs |
39 comments
Email
Print
Comments
Might need saving
Jesus Navarro’s career might indeed need saving. He batted only .179 in the Dominican Summer League last season at the age of 19.
by sharksrog on Jun 26, 2008 12:03 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Just another false idol, the REAL Jesus walks.
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
by Bhaakon on Jun 26, 2008 12:12 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I really like Ziegler.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 26, 2008 7:13 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I like xanthan!
No I thought he was a great choice in the 16th round, a big first baseman who can mash. 19 homers in the Pac 10 this year, not shabby at all. And he continues to mash here too.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 26, 2008 8:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But do you like like him?
..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.
by Cookyman on Jun 26, 2008 8:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who, Ziegler or xanthan?
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 26, 2008 9:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What do I get for the “maybe”?
it's always noonan somewhere
by sectionop92 on Jun 26, 2008 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well I’d say it depends on who takes me to prom.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 26, 2008 12:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I read prom different
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The one who takes me to porn?
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 26, 2008 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Now that’s my kind of prom!
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 26, 2008 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d go with Ziegler if I were you, he’s probably a better hitter than me.
by xanthan on Jun 26, 2008 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fairley
Ok, I’m beyond the .143 BA and I’m seeing 2 for 14 with 0 walks and 5 ks. Obviously 14 ABs are meaningless to comment on, but I will say I’m having trouble imagining which part of the stat line is solid. Also, Ziegler’s way too old for this league and I imagine will migrate quickly to the NWL, unless he’s going to be this year’s version of Andy D.
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Jun 26, 2008 10:18 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
But
He’s on pace for 120 HBP’s.
..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.
by Cookyman on Jun 26, 2008 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gamer.
Speed, defense... and an almost fanatical devotion to getting picked off.
by SF Pete on Jun 26, 2008 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fairley…even though he isn’t hitting, yet…is still able to find a way on-base, get a run or RBI, even if it seems minimal. I know we all want arcade-like numbers from him, but if he shows an ability to grind through the hard times, that may be a big breakthrough for a raw piece of meat like him.
it's always noonan somewhere
by sectionop92 on Jun 26, 2008 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t expect arcade numbers. I also know that 14 AB’s are meaningless. But he didn’t “find a way on-base, get a run or RBI”. A pitcher threw a baseball straight at him really fast, and he couldn’t duck in time. The bases were loaded so he got a RBI. Nothing to be proud of.
..so allow me to present Tim Lincecum and Matt Cain as two sweet, sweet bottles of warming hooch.
by Cookyman on Jun 26, 2008 11:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
eh, debatable
Maybe he couldn’t get out of the way, or maybe he crowded the plate in a crucial bases loaded situation and didn’t really try to get out of the way.
There are some players who have demonstrated that the HBP is an effective way to get on base in certain circumstance. Being able to crowd the plate effectively to take away the inside pitch is a skill, not a fluke. I’m not saing Fairley is this player – i’ve never seen him play, but it does exist.
Having the sack to purposefully take a 90 mph FB in the ribs is another matter.
For most players it’s just a flukey useless stat.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
example
In ‘97 Biggio got HBP 34 times. That is 4.6% of his PA’s that year.
His walk rate was 11.4%
There is no doubt that Biggio was doing something “different” than the average ML player to get HBP so many times throughout his career, and that “different” boosted his OBP from what would have been .391 to .415 in 1997.
I can’t think of a player who couldn’t benifit from a 24 point increase in their OBP in any given year.
Lean in!
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ron Hunt agrees with this post
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
by Lyle on Jun 26, 2008 4:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A HBP is as valuable as a walk
But, unlike a walk, it’s not an indicator of a mature approach at the plate. And, given the potential for injury, I don’t really want good hitters trying to get plugged in regular season minor league games anyway. Save that stuff for guys who can’t get on base the normal way and meaningful games.
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
by Bhaakon on Jun 26, 2008 3:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe in the terms of run values, an HBP is worth more than a walk because it generally happens when a pitcher is losing control. I think thats right.
I may be wrong.
by xanthan on Jun 26, 2008 3:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But the injury component is definitely worth considering
as Biggio’s old fellow killer B would attest.
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
by Roger on Jun 26, 2008 3:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Causation and Correlation
It probably Correlates w/ a pitchers loss of control.
However, hitting a batter in a crucial situation ( 0-2, 2 out, runners on 1st and 3rd) also probably rattles a pitcher mentally a little and can cause further struggle. In such a case casuation is in play as well.
Lean In.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It probably Correlates w/ a pitchers loss of control.
However, hitting a batter in a crucial situation ( 0-2, 2 out, runners on 1st and 3rd) also probably rattles a pitcher mentally a little and can cause further struggle. In such a case casuation is in play as well.
Lean In.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 5:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd also say that it correlates with being in the low minors
Where pitchers as a whole have worse control than the majors or upper minors. Frandsen only drew a HBP in 2.7% of his MLB plate appearances, as compared to 3.9% of his minor league PAs.
I think there’s also a question of how “leaning in” effects the players ability to hit. How does anticipating a HBP and crowding the plate change their swing? Does it make it harder to hit the inside pitch? Does it force them to shorten their swing and sacrifice power? Does it provide a mental distraction (just one more thing to think about at the plate)?
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
by Bhaakon on Jun 26, 2008 6:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Perhaps, but a walk generally means more pitches thrown
On the whole, the difference has got to be negligible.
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
by Bhaakon on Jun 26, 2008 6:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not suggesting that players should lean into heaters willy nilly
But I do think there is a certain “type” of player (cough, Frandsen) that may realize in CERTAIN situations leaning in a little bit may be in the teams advantage.
I think that’s a combination of skill and balls. I wouldn’t be so quick to dismiss it as fluke.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 5:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just as one may say that a batter has no effect on infield errors made on his groundballs
It could also be argued that fast runners cause infielders to rush, which in turn increases the chances of them making a mistake.
It’s probably not a skill you can really define in a statline, but It isnt entirely a fluke, either.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 5:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dammit, all of my posts are getting chopped
Fast runners may encourage errors as they cause infielders to rush fielding the ball.
It’s not an absolute stat, but reaching base an above average # of times on errors is not always a fluke, either.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 5:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why couldn't you define it in a stat line?
It seems pretty obvious: look at the change in batting average on balls in play on ground balls when a fast runner is on base versus when a slow runner it on base.
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
by Bhaakon on Jun 26, 2008 6:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, so tell me how you define a "fast" runner.
Eugeniooooooo!!!!
by FairweatherFan on Jun 26, 2008 7:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You didn't see it?
You didn’t see my explanation? It was really fast. You must have missed it.
by sharksrog on Jun 26, 2008 10:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You have a problem with stolen bases?
I suppose you could throw in infield hit totals as well.
Or you could do it subjectively, or dig up times to first base from somewhere (they aren’t available on the internet that I know of, but scouts and coaches take them all the time).
VAE PVTO DEVS FIO
by Bhaakon on Jun 26, 2008 10:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was a bit surprised to see Ziegler in the AZL, too. I hope he moves up quickly to NWL as you said.
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 26, 2008 10:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2009 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
