OT- Bavasi Fired
by OmahaGiants on Jun 16, 2008 12:22 PM PDT
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The Mariners fired Bill Bavasi today. According to the press release, "Vice President/Associate General Manager Lee Pelekoudas will take over as the interim General Manager." Pelekoudas will be a candidate in the team's permanent GM search.
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I’d say something snarky about Sabean now being the worst GM in baseball, but Sabean has been ok in the recent past. He gets a pass until the trading deadline.
Anyways, this is just great for baseball as Bavasi is a terrible GM. Hopefully the new guy will be calling up Clement ASAP.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
Anyways, this is just great for baseball as Bavasi is a terrible GM. Hopefully the new guy will be calling up Clement ASAP.
I still can’t believe they let Vidro DH for as long as they did. Truly a ‘wow’ moment.
Yup, Vidro is hitting .219/.267/.333 on the year. An OPS of .601 (rounding FTW!). Clement is OPS-ing somewhere around 1.100 in AAA. I don’t care what kind of translation you perform, there is no way Clement is a worse hitter than Vidro.
Sometimes I wonder how these guys feel about their situations. In my job, it’s not easy to objectively say I’m better or worse than another employee. However, in Clement’s case, he is objectively better at Vidro’s job than Vidro is. It has to be pretty demoralizing for something so painfully obvious to be so easily ignored.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
No! The successor for Bavasi should be obsessed with Vinnie Chulk and cheerfully trade Clement for him!
Doesn't Dave Littlefield need a job?
I’m sure it wouldn’t take very long to call every gamestop in the USA…
/Has a copy of Madden 64 to trade for a Wii & a PS3
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on Jun 16, 2008 3:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Lookout Landing humor
From a poster named Goose:
Your new Seattle Mariners General Manger- Wayne Krivsky
Because remember, there is no floor.
Eagerly awaiting Crazy Crab Bobblehead Night on 7/18.
New GM
I think it will be a newer guy, not an old school re-tread.
My money (not a lot) is on DePodesta… Or Billy Beane’s sidekick in Oakland whose name is escaping me and I can’t be bothered to look up….
I know he already named him, that’s why it was funny to me. Maybe he was thinking of Forst though.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
Yes
With honorable mention to Omar Minaya, Jon Daniels, Ned Colletti, and Dan O’Dowd.
Don't you mean "horrible mention?"
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 16, 2008 2:13 PM PDT up reply actions
I like how Minaya is going to follow the Mets around the country on their current road trip, all so he can be close by in case he needs to fire Willie Randolph. If you’re going to change managers, who not leave a huge carbon footprint while you’re at it?
Eagerly awaiting Crazy Crab Bobblehead Night on 7/18.
Minaya
Minaya is firing Randolph when he should be firing himself. Since taking over he’s increased the team payroll by 55 million dollars, and used the Brian Sabean method of signing washed up veterans to multi year deals. Two years to 48 year old Julio Franco!! All my Met loving friends made fun of me when the Giants signed ancient, brittle Moises Alou, and Minaya gave him a two year deal after that!! He has totally destroyed the Mets’ farm system with his win for now trades, and he hasn’t won. He just brought up two utility infielders in their thirties, one of them who was hitting .133. He basically has nothing down there except Fernando Martinez, who is hurt and at least two years away. He just gave sore kneed Luis Castillo a FOUR year deal when nobody else offered more than two. And this was even after stories appeared that Castillo was a bad influence on Jose Reyes. In the first year of the deal, they have had to stop playing Castillo in day games after night game. I could go on and on, but why bother. Minaya is incompetent, and I hate to say that since we went to the same high school.
Brian Sabean's new dad: Firm believer in corporal punishment
Minaya
also sucks at trades, and he’s chiefly responsible for ruining the Washington Nationals. He destroyed the Expos farm system before they moved to Washington. They also gave terrible deals to Pedro, Delgado, Beltran. And he got awful value for Lastings Milledge (albeit Church has played well).
In defense of Minaya, it may have been that he was trying to actually keep the damn Expos in Montreal by going around Loria and getting the best players he could then and there for a suicide run at the pennant. It’s not unheard of, and honestly, since the basic point of the sport is not to develop prospects for their own sake so much as it is to win the World Series, if the Expos hadn’t collapsed immediately after he made those deals, it could’ve gone down in history as an inspiring last stand. Instead of as, you know, Custer-y.
And the “terrible deals for everyone,” just seems like good old New York baseball. Spend like an idiot or everyone gets mad atcha. He’s hardly handcuffed that franchise, and any other Mets GM would’ve thrown the same funny money around in the passionate pursuit of mediocrity.
Lastly, well, as you said, Church is playing well and Milledge ain’t. I thought it was a pretty balanced trade when it happened, and I still think that.
"When Jackson Williams thinks of how many times Madison Bumgarner has tried to kill Tyler Walker..."
Omar Minaya – bad, but not awful.
Ned Colletti – hehe. definitely with you.
Dan O’Dowd, though. He hasn’t made any horrible decisions and definitely has let his farm system improve his team from within. I think he’s far beyond the Hampton deal and has made a bunch of solid decisions since then.
Jon Daniels – This is just flat out wrong. He has taken a bad team and a bunch of bad contracts and has turned the team in the right direction. He’s damn smart too. Graduated from Cornell. The Teixieria trade was smart and the Hamilton for Volquez swap was brilliant. Picking Justin Smoak and Robbie Ross this year were two excellent moves in the draft. Jon Daniels is a very good GM
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Jun 16, 2008 11:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Jon Daniels
They’re still awful.
How was Hamilton for Volquez brilliant? Volquez is the best pitcher in the major leagues right now. Hamilton is great, but his offensive output won’t offset their poor pitching all year.
Daniels got completely fleeced in Chris Young/Adrian Gonzalez trade for Adam Eaton.
He got atrocious value for Alphonso Soriano.
He traded John Danks for the piece of fecal matter that is Brandon McCarthy.
His Teixiera trade was decent.
The Gagne trade was a huge coup though. David Murphy has done well, and Engel Beltre has 5 tool talent.
I will say this, he’s done a good job drafting and making signings out of Latin America. But I just don’t see how that off-sets some of his awful trades.
Hang on
The soriano move was a bad move, but not horrible. He really couldn’t have gotten much else at the time and there was a huge push to trade him and open up salary space.
The John Danks trade was bad, but Brandon McCarthy had given every indication of not being a piece of “fecal matter” before the trade.
The Teixiera trade was genius. 5 excellent prospects for 1.5 years of a good first-baseman.
The worst trade he made was the Chris Young/Adrian Gonzales trade. Yuck.
John Koronka was had for nothing.
Trading shit for Carlos Lee and then reaping the draft benefits???
Hamilton for Volquez though? Seriously? Hamilton is an offensive centerpiece in a premium defensive position. Volquez got lucky at the beginning of this year and although he is a great pitcher, he is in no way as valuable as Josh Hamilton will be and is currently.
But seriously, 4 good trades, 3 bad ones, good signings, a rebirth of a farm system, great drafts and a turning around of the team. He’s a pretty good GM in my opinion.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Jun 17, 2008 12:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Let me put it to you this way
If the Giants were starved for pitching and we had traded Tim Lincecum for Josh Hamilton, would you still be calling it a great trade getting Hamilton?
Whoa there
Last year, Volquez wasn’t exactly in the discussion with Tim Lincecum to be one of the best pitchers in baseball. Yes, he has been amazing, but the projection systems had him anywhere from a 4.50 to 5.18 ERA. I don’t know what happened when Cincinnati got a hold of him, but they did something right.
Something to chew on: except for his 51 IP in AAA in 2007, Volquez has had HR rates generally over 1 HR/9. And that 51 IP in AAA sure seems fluky, as Volquez had his normal HR rates in high A and AA that year. In the majors this year, his HR rate is 0.31 per 9 IP! In Cincinnati! Yes, it could be real, as he seems to have transformed himself into more of a GB pitcher, but that’s a tiny HR rate for Cincy, and he might not look quite so stellar if that HR starts creeping up.
And really, no matter how great he is this year, this just wasn’t expected. There was a mixed response on getting Volquez, and even his supporters thought that he would be a good pitcher – not quite the great pitcher he has been.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 17, 2008 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions
Well
Lincecum is also performing better than expected. So the case still holds.
Both were their teams respective BEST young pitching prospects. The difference being Texas was dying for pitching, and they went and traded for a hitter. And no matter how good Hamilton has been, in the long and even short term it was a dumb move. Especially when one considers how easy it is to get production out of someone in Texas, as far as offense is concerned.
hmm
I actually have to think about this one a bit. I would be really sad to lose lincecum, but Hamilton is an extremely valuable player. I think i might be at peace with this deal.
However, Volquez
It was a mutually beneficial deal with the Rangers coming out on top I feel.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Jun 17, 2008 6:52 PM PDT up reply actions
I should be upset about this news, because now it’s less likely that we can work them over in a trade. For some reason, Bavasi wasn’t willing to give us Clement or Balentien for Ray Durham, so his stupidity didn’t help us.
Now, I’m just happy for M’s fans.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 1:28 PM PDT reply actions
People in Seattle need something to be cheery about..
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on Jun 16, 2008 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions
What about Sexon?
IF Bavasi’s successor releases Richie Sexon (which seems likley, to me) should the Giants’ pick him up?
I’m thinking that if he is used as a platoon partner for Bowker, why now? If he becomes the starting first baseman, then forget about it. Thoughts?
If he is released and can be signed for the minimum, it wouldn’t be a terrible idea. However, I would rather let Bowker hit LHP.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Agreed with sticking with Bowker, since, even at the minimum, you’re only looking at upgrading the team this year at the expense of the playing time for players who will be on the team in the coming years. If he were signed for the minimum, then signed somewhere else in the offseason, would we get any comp picks? If so, that might be worth it.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
Yes to the draft picks, but only IF we offered him arbitration and IF he showed that he could rake and just needed to get out of Seattle for some reason.
So, probably no picks.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions
The Golden Gate Bridge..
I would like to sell it to you…
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on Jun 16, 2008 3:16 PM PDT up reply actions
Sexson
Barely hit over .200 last year, and has shown this year that that was no fluke. I’d rather give Bowker a shot at playing everyday then sign Sexson as a righty platoon partner for him.
Brian Sabean's new dad: Firm believer in corporal punishment
that Carlos Guillen trade doesn't age well.
Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal
by nostocksjustbonds on Jun 16, 2008 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions
But he signed Rich Aurilia that same day! Who needed Guillen?
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions
No doubt
Neither does the Freddy Garcia trade. Or the Asdrubal Cabrera one. And Bedard is likely to be a travesty too.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
I read they were already shopping Bedard.
Hopefully by All-Star break
Adopted brother of the AnVil / GIANTSPACE™ returns!
by SoFa King Mike on Jun 16, 2008 4:16 PM PDT up reply actions
Yup, saw the same thing on ESPN today. They should trade him, they need to tear down and start over. It’s really a shame that they didn’t do this before the draft since they fucked that up too.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
good lord
trading Bedard now is the total admission of complete orgaizational meltdown. Not saying it shouldn’t be done, but jebus.
Yeah, but if they bring in an outside guy, he has no reason to not admit the failures of the past regime. And really, if he was trying to do a good job, he would probably need to do that.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
I agree it should probably be done, but wow, wow, wow. I can’t believe they just gutted their farm system to turn around and try to trade the same player to rebuild…
I agree completely, it’s brutal. Not only that, but they’d have to trade him for less than they paid since there’s less time left on his contract, he’s been hurt, and hasn’t pitched as well.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
I think I saw 4-5 major league players on that list. Including Pat Borders being designated for assignment twice..wow..
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on Jun 16, 2008 4:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Pat Borders
was traded for, designated, released, reassigned or called up like 28502750123750 times.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Jun 16, 2008 11:25 PM PDT up reply actions
I counted 3 good moves
Signing Raul Ibanez, signing George Sherrill, and signing Jose Guillen for 1 year.
The rest were all terrible. Yes I’m counting Kenji Johjima, because Johjima got a 3 year extension when Clement was ready to start last year. Yes he’s not great defensively, but I’m sure that would have been off-set by his bat.
Even the Ibanez signing wasn’t that great. He hit well enough, but his defense was/is atrocious.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
Here’s a brutal, more in depth analysis of his worst decisions:
http://baseballanalysts.com/archives/2008/06/mariners_foible.php
At some point you have to wonder if he might be the worst GM ever. My historical knowledge isn’t up to snuff, but Bavasi has to be in the running.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
lol, Terry Mulholland…
also, M’s fans who survived the Bavasi regime must’ve felt like they were watching the worst reruns of the Padres…
at least the retreads Bochy dusted off provided fodder for comedy.
That picture makes me uncomfortable
It’s got a ‘money shot’ feel to it…
by Johnny Disaster on Jun 16, 2008 7:21 PM PDT up reply actions
McLaren needs to go too
He’s moving Ichiro back to RF.
Click here to read what a moron thinks
His rationale is fucking retarded:
"When I close my eyes and think of Ichiro, I think of (No.) 51 in right field," McLaren said.
It’s funny, because when I close my eyes and think of Ichiro in RF, I think of a player who isn’t as valuable to his team as he could be.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
UZR and its related defensive metrics actually say that Ichiro isn’t very good in CF. It’s surprising, but pretty consistent.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 10:18 PM PDT up reply actions
BP’s metrics, which are admittedly sketchy at best, have him as above average. The difference in difficulty between RF and CF just can’t be that great.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
Yeah
All of the play-by-play based metrics have him as below average, though. I can’t remember if Dewan/Pinto metrics do or not.
As for the UZR/PBP-based metrics: they don’t have him as particularly good in RF either. It would be less believable if he was great in RF and bad in CF, but it’s pretty much a transition you would expect – around average or just below in RF, and something like 5-10 runs worse in CF.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 10:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh, and also
Who’s going to play CF instead? Not Balentien and certainly not Ibanez. If Ichiro goes to RF, then Balentien has to go to DH or back to Tacoma. That leaves Jeremy Reed in CF. Granted, Reed is supposed to be a superb CFer, so the move helps there, but what they really need to do is to blow things up and deal Ibanez (Mets?) and put Balentien in LF. If Ibanez doesn’t move, then have him DH.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 10:40 PM PDT up reply actions
How is Balentien’s arm? If he has to move to LF, then moving Ichiro to right makes a little more sense. If not, then they should just go FA, Ichiro, Balentien, left to right.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
I have no idea. Ichiro’s is pretty awesome, of course. I don’t have the stats or time, but someone could calculate the relative value of a Balentien/Reed/Ichiro OF vs. a Ibanez/Ichiro/Balentien OF.
I suspect that Ibanez is bad enough in the field that the Reed in CF option is better – especially if Reed hits somewhere between projections and his current 102 OPS+. They also have what a lot of AL teams don’t have – an open DH spot. They actually can stash Ibanez there because they don’t have anything like the Ortiz keeping Manny in LF situation.
I guess it also depends on what they can get in trade or via free agency. It’s a lot easier to get a LFer than to get a CFer,
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 10:58 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, that makes sense. How much more is his bat worth in center? I would imagine it would make up for the defensive hit.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
It really depends on what else they have to put out there. They have Jeremy Reed, an excellent defensive CFer. He could very well be 15-20 runs better than Ichiro in CF.
Reed’s defense probably probably saves them more runs than any of their other options gains them runs in RF or LF. Also, it gets Ibanez out of LF and gives them a better DH than Jose F. Vidro. And Clement shouldn’t be DHing if he can actually play 1B, because they don’t have anything good at 1B either.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 11:01 PM PDT up reply actions
True. It would be nice to see Clement get some time at catcher too.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
It looks like they just sent Balentien down and called up Clement.
http://www.lookoutlanding.com/2008/6/16/553302/wlad-down-clement-up
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
Finally… it’s about time. He only got 48 AB before getting sent down. Yeah, he was bad, but it’s 48 AB. And Clement isn’t like, say, Linden with the really high K rate in the minors.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 11:16 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, seriously, they need to just play him every day and stop worrying about a couple of bad games.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
They appear to be using Willie Bloomquist in CF. Using Bloomquist at all is a bad idea, but Bloomquist in CF?!? This is clearly not a team making rational decisions based on logic.
It’s time to steal some players from the Mariners. Come on Sabean.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 11:28 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I saw that. I assumed it had to do with a lefty on the mound. I assume Reed will be in against righties. I have no clue on Bloomquists’ abilities in CF, but I imagine whatever is gained through the platoon advantage is given straight back defensively.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
BUT, BUT, BUT
Ichiro has the Mega Man arm cannon!
Adopted brother of the AnVil / GIANTSPACE™ returns!
by SoFa King Mike on Jun 17, 2008 7:45 AM PDT up reply actions
Seattle needs to trade Clement ASAP. Putting him as a DH is a definite waste of a decent defensive catcher. Same for a move to first, though less of a waste.
Seattle will get much better value out of a trade, probably getting two or three good players, and can solve their DH problems elsewhere.
SFDugout.com is BACK! See the Top 50 Giants Prospects!
Can we get on that, then? How about some Brandon Morrow while we’re at it?
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Jun 16, 2008 10:18 PM PDT up reply actions
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