KLaw
by Osama91w9 on Jun 1, 2008 1:18 PM PDT
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Print• San Francisco is rumored to be shifting focus to Gordon Beckham at No. 5, unless either Tim Beckham or Buster Posey falls to them.
For whatever reason I just don't have a good feeling about this pick
I want me some Smoak
But I'd also be down with T Beck or Posey
But Alvarez would be steller too
no pitchers please
i would not like that
ok word minimums are really really annoying
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link?
go with what you know?
they should go with the best talent available. i dont think that’s a pitcher.
Bengie Molina: stretching doubles into singles since 1998.
There was talk somewhere from ESPN that the Giants front office was “obsessed” with Justin Smoak
Giants Cove: You'll be a better person for reading
I thought also from a KLaw bit, though it may have been a Callis chat.
by GiantsFanInExile on Jun 1, 2008 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions
From K-Law's mock draft 5/30/08
5. San Francisco—Justin Smoak, 1B, South Carolina
The Giants are said to be “obsessed” with Smoak, but they would take Tim Beckham if he fell here and would look at Brett Wallace or Gordon Beckham if the board blew up—for example, if the top four picks went Posey-Tim Beckham-Hosmer-Smoak or Beckham-Posey-Hosmer-Smoak.
So...
Law thinks the Giants would pass on Alvarez in favor of Wallace or G. Beckham???!!! [walks away from computer, bangs head on wall, curls into fetal position]
by baseballjunkie on Jun 2, 2008 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions
I too hope for a Smoak, Alvarez pick. From everything I’ve read about Beckham, his best attribute is “can stay at SS”. I’d rather have someone who has some hitting upside, thanks.
by GiantsFanInExile on Jun 1, 2008 1:36 PM PDT reply actions
It's debatable
Whether or not G. Beckham can stay at SS. Not everybody is convinced that he can.
Proud adoptive parent of Tim Alderson.
Hitting Upside
Beckham just hit his 24th HR yesterday. He also led the CC league last year with wooden bats. The more I see of him, the more I like. Especially since there will be several slugging 1B still there in the sandwhich round.
1. G. Beckham
1a. Dykstra
I could live with that.
dykstra
is more of a second baseman. He has a really ugly swing though. he’ll strike out a problematic amount in professional baseball. nahhhh
Isaac Galloway, I’d be happy with.
BROCK BOND LIKES HIS MARTINIS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, NOT STIRRED.
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Jun 2, 2008 12:48 AM PDT up reply actions
I think Smoak would help us more than Gordon Beckham would
And I also think there will be a pitcher or two in the top 4, so one of Posey, Beckham, or Alvarez could probably fall to us. But if it does come down to Beckham or Smoak, I hope they pick Smoak. A huge impact hitter with lots of power would help our lineup much more than a solid shortstop would.
on the edge of tears i read this on mbrumorsblog
Gordon Beckham is drawing serious interest from the Giants at the number five spot. If the draft goes Posey, Beckham, Alvarez, Matusz, then Beckham will go five.
by bartonboi on Jun 1, 2008 2:56 PM PDT reply actions
also
can anyone pleas post the “premium content”
by bartonboi on Jun 1, 2008 2:57 PM PDT reply actions
Listen up rookie…that kind of stuff is frowned upon here.
Oh, and be sure to grab my luggage over there.
Adoptive papa to Omar...so basically I'm screwed.
by PacBellBoozer on Jun 2, 2008 1:44 AM PDT up reply actions
Am I the only one that wouldn’t be upset with Skipworth? The guy is arguably the best HS hitter in the country and is projected to be a good defensive catcher as well. I like the comparisons to Joe Mauer.
Keith Law 2007 mock draft had the Giants selecting Jarrod Parker with the #10 pick. He did get Wendell Fairley right with the #28 oick.
May have been in a blog pre-draft, but I know Law said the Giants were in hard on Bumgarner. Not that it matters.
by KCE on Jun 1, 2008 4:31 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd like to think
..that if he hadn’t just been selected by Arizona, that we would have gotten Jarrod Parker.
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
For me, the bigger concern is that the Giants would even consider Posey or T Beckham with the #5 pick. Only Alvarez, Smoak, or Gordon Beckham would be the correct choices at that position. The Rays really should pick either Tim Beckham or Buster Posey, but who knows what they’ll do?
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
Some more Baggarly draft info
Thanks Baggs Blog
As I’m working on the game story and notebook for today, the Giants are having a little scouting combine on the field. About 15-18 potential draftees are taking part, mostly local college players. A few high school kids, too. We don’t have a roster up here in the press box, and I’m sure the Giants don’t want everyone to know who they’re watching. But I was able to figure out a couple. Cal catcher Charlie Cutler and infielder Josh Satin are among them. There was a Cal lefty, too. I think it was Craig Bennigson. There’s a few Fresno States, a USC, and a huge first baseman from Southern A&M named Edwin Anderson. Looks like a right-handed Ryan Howard.All the top brass is watching: Brian Sabean, John Barr, Ed Creech, Dick Tidrow, Bobby Evans. From what I understand, these guys aren’t being considered for the first three or four rounds. But interesting viewing nonetheless. It was at a workout like this a few years ago that Nate Schierholtz turned himself into a second-round pick.
I played against Cutler a few years ago. He was one of the biggest douchebags I’ve ever seen. He’s got some talent, but he was a total jackass to everybody around him. Hopefully that’s changed.
Proud adoptive parent of Tim Alderson.
yea and
that jackass leftfielder with some talent we signed 15 years ago turned out to be a complete bust too. We should definitely only take swell guys without any semblance of an ego.
Satin
I like Josh Satin. I’ve been to several Cal games this year and he’s been impressive. I’d like to see him taken in a later round, for sure.
He’s currently hitting .379/.500/.723, which are quite a bit better than the much more hyped David Cooper.
by KCE on Jun 1, 2008 9:00 PM PDT up reply actions
Tell us about Satin
What kind of hitter is he? What position does he play, and how well?
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
Ummm...
I think that would be SatAn…Beelzebub…the Prince of Darkness
by baseballjunkie on Jun 2, 2008 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions
I saw Cal play 5 or 6 times and he played 2B in all but one of those games. In the other game, he came off the bench and played LF (I think, memory’s a little hazy).
Right-handed hitter who hits well to all fields. Lots of line drives and has the ability to hit for power. Hit a walk-off bomb against UCLA on the last weekend of the year. Went 1-7 with 2 BB in Cal’s two losses in the regionals. Here is some additional info from Cal’s website:
Satin is also a semifinalist for USA Baseball’s Golden Spikes Award and the Wallace Award as the national player of the year. Satin is batting .388 with 11 doubles, 18 home runs (fifth in Pac-10) and 52 RBI. He is also sixth in the Pac-10 in total bases (140), 10th in hits (73), sixth in runs scored (55), fourth in slugging percentage (.745), third in walks (46) and second in on-base percentage (.508). Satin hit safely in the first 22 games this season and had a school-record a 27-game hitting streak from May 20, 2007-Mar. 29, 2008. He was the Mar. 4 Pac-10 Player of the Week. Satin was a Collegiate Baseball Freshman All-American in 2005.
Law has had experience in the Blue Jays front office
and as a scout, so perhaps sees things more from the perspective of a scouting director than a fan. That is the scary part… he could very well be right about the Giants’ plans. And what is even scarier:
This excerpt from Baggarly’s blog:
Plus, the Giants put a load of stock in the Cape Cod League. Players who excel there are easier to project making a successful transition from aluminum to wood. No coincidence, Todd Linden was a stud in the Cape. And G-Beckham happened to hit nine homers and had the best offensive showing of anyone in the Cape last year.
If the Giants do indeed select Gordo, let’s hope things turn out better than they did with Linden, who is now playing in an independent league somewhere, I believe.
by baseballjunkie on Jun 1, 2008 9:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Avoid Gordon Beckham, Matusz, Crow and Posey. I would want in this order: Tim Beckham, Smoak, Hosmer, Wallace or Alonzo. The points Baggarly made are silly to me: who cares how athletic our team is if they can’t hit? If Hosmer can’t play 1B he can play RF. If Wallace can’t play 3B he can play 1B. So the argument that Gordon Beckham is a good pick because he can move to 2B or OF is not legitimate. Take the best player regardless of position, body type or need and Gordon Beckham is not one of the 5 best players.
The G. Beckham YouTube video
I just watched it. Beckham does not impress me at all. Admittedly it was just one game but his defense looked average at best. The swing? Meh. Please, Giants, not with the #5 pick.
Noonan. Nooooonan!
by Giant Fan in Singapore on Jun 1, 2008 7:53 PM PDT reply actions
I don’t see why everyone is so down on Gordon Beckham. A lot of smart people think highly of him as a prospect, and it’s hard to find good hitters up the middle.
Honestly, i’m sure most people would be happy with any of the top 7 non-pitcher prospects -
Posey, Alvarez, G Beck, T Beck, Smoak, Skipworth, Hosmer who are all rated as Top 10 picks on varying sites. It’d be really hard for the giants to eff this one up, yet I just have this feeling…........
by i wish we were good on Jun 1, 2008 11:15 PM PDT reply actions
I forgot Wallace and Alonso. I reiterate, REALLY HARD to eff this up.
by i wish we were good on Jun 1, 2008 11:16 PM PDT up reply actions
which is why the front office will screw it up
Todd Jennings: Next up on the Non-prospect Backup Catcher Train. Next Stop: The Pine at AT&T Park
by Speedforthewin on Jun 1, 2008 11:17 PM PDT up reply actions
I want Alvarez, but I know he’ll be gone. Next I want Smoak. However, I can’t be too critical if the Giants pick someone else, because sometimes you have to give them the benefit of the doubt since they’re actually watching these players. I said this yesterday, and I’ll say it again today. We all went nuts last year when the Giants passed on Beau Mills and selected Madison Bumgarner, and as of today Bumgarner seems like a far better pick. Mad Bum is 5-2 with a 2.10 ERA, 59 K’s in 51 innings and only 9 walks at San Jose. He’s also only 18 years old. Mills IS one level higher, but he’s 3 years older and only hitting .255 with 5 homeruns in just over 200 atbats. Again, Mills may be a star one day but right now I think our front office deserves the benefit of the doubt if they pick someone we don’t like.
Brian Sabean's new dad: Firm believer in corporal punishment
I think whoever they pick is likely to be a reasonable choice, just because there are lots of decent options, althought some are more preferable than others. I think there’s one difference with regards to last year & that’s simply that Bumgarner is a pitcher. I think it’s quite easy to give the organisation the benefit of the doubt with regards to pitchers due to their good track record. It’s harder for them to get that same benefit of the doubt with hitters.
Proud owner of the most boring Username! Alex Hinshaw: Now showing in a bullpen near you!
First, I obviously agree that having never laid eyes on any of these players my opinion’s not worth much relative to professional scouts. That said, I replied to you yesterday and I’ll reply again, Bumgarner’s terrific start to his pro career doesn’t in my mind change the essential problem from last year, that with 6 picks before the 2nd round they had a chance to inject some offensive life into their farm system that they seriously needed to take advantage of, and instead they used 4 of those picks on pitchers and glove guys. Again I was never a Mills guy, but if you want to use hindsight, then clearly they could have picked up both Heyward and Burgess and still gotten a high profile pitcher (Alderson or Porcello) out of those same picks. It was a failure of purpose to my mind, that Bumgarner’s promise doesn’t erase.
My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.
This..
is correct. Last year was a golden opportunity. And even if the MadBum and Tim Alderson turn out to anchor our starting staff for the next decade, what we REALLY needed was offense last year…and not so much HS hitters as college hitters. If the problem was the potential cost of all those high draft picks, well they should have budgeted appropriately. Culberson and Williams were terrible wastes of prime picks. Noonan was about right. Fairley was big gamble; but perhaps that wasn’t the time or place to take that particular kind of gamble.
Time will tell how it all works out. But I think their strategy was all wrong last year.
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
only problem there is if they use the best hitter available philosophy and draft someone that doesn’t make it. Yes, they needed offense but it’s better to draft two stud pitchers than hitters that don’t pan out. Alderson and Bumgarner give them two more arms that would enable them to deal pitchers for offense, maybe even hitters that have already proven themselves. And you don’t have to trade either of those guys, their presence in the Giants’ system allows you to trade others. I agree that Heyward looks like a stud, but they could have easily wasted that pick on some hitter who turned out to be a waste.
Brian Sabean's new dad: Firm believer in corporal punishment
I agree - mostly
I am all for the best player, regardless of position. I think they did this with Bumgarner, but no so much with the later picks. Aside from Mills (if you like him, I don’t), there weren’t really any college hitter worth taking at that stage. Maybe Arencibia, but there was a distinct lack of good college hitters last year. Revisit this again in 2011.
Pedro Feliz would look great in Dodger Blue.
Yes,True, Fact
I would not be opposed to drafting a pitcher this year if they are rated higher than hitters on SF’s board. The problem is SF has stopped flipping some of it’s pitching surplus for organizational need. If Sabes could do that it would go a long way to solving some of SF’s woes.
agree
I listen to the Brian Sabean show every week and 9 times out of 10 he’s crying poor, bitching about the amount of resources the Yankees, Red Sox, Mets, Dodgers and others poor into player development. Then he wastes millions of dollars on injury prone, past-their prime, marginal upgrades (and sometimes downgrades). If we didn’t sign Dave Roberts, Rich Aurilia, Ryan Klesko, Steve Kline, Ray Durham and Barry Zito last year we still would have been around a 70-win team and we also could have been a lot more aggressive and creative with the draft and not had to take the cheapest player available. Its too early to say Culberson or Williams won’t ever pan out, but its not too early to say that we could have gotten 2 much better prospects with more offensive upside. Hell, I’d have rather taken 2 more good pitchers in that round than those 2 players. Take the best player available always regardless of need and cost.
I listen to the Brian Sabean show every week
This concerns me. Stop! Stop now!
we also could have been a lot more aggressive and creative with the draft and not had to take the cheapest player available
People keep attributing these selections (Williams especially) to cheapskatery, but it’s just not so. They all got normal bonuses for their slots.
Which is worse, of course.
Cheap because we were unwilling to pay first round money there or go above the slot recommendation so we took two guys who would take slot money.
Yeah, but (1) the slots are a real political issue in MLB; defying the commish carries consequences, and it’s not entirely unreasonable for teams to want to avoid that headache. And (2) they overdrafted those guys, or at least Williams, who was generally considered to be a fifth-round talent, if I recall correctly. There were lots of better players who would have take slot money.
You are correct, the problem isn’t cheapness, its poor talent evaluation at least with Williams and I would argue with Culberson as well. As for slotting, what are the punishments? You won’t get an all-star game down the road? I think the benefits of going above slot, particularly later in the draft, far outweigh any consequences that the inept Bud Selig would lay on anyone. I personally think the slotting system is ridiculous: why have suggested slots that no one really has to follow and then have marginal consequences only for the teams that owe it to their fans to get the best available players without punishing the agents? Its a system that does not make much sense to me: either have enforced slots like the NBA that teams and agents have to abide by or a completely free market.
The slotting system is crazy. W/O any consequeces, no one will ever care.
That being said, I think with a baseball draft you have to wait 3-5 years before making a meaningful conclusion. Perhaps you guys are right and Williams may not pan out, but on the other hand he may be a perennial All Star. Perhaps the Giants’ saw something in this player no one else did. Perhaps all the Giants’ scouts are hanging out in shoddy bars listening to country music and throwing darts at a board full of names. I just think you have to wait before saying the Williams and Culberson were poor draft choices.
Wise words indeed...
It’s very easy for us to play armchair GM. I would like to see Alvarez, Smoak, Hosmer, T. Becks, then Skipworth in that order, but I don’t know (and haven’t seen firsthand) what the Giants have. And being in the business, the scouts are privy to information that the public may not be aware of, things such as Kyle Drabek’s personal issues. Finally, by personally interviewing each prospect, scouts have an idea of what is going on in the players heads.
For what it’s worth, check out the minorleaguebaseball.com 2007 draft report on Beau Mills. Eerily similar to some of the touted bats in this year’s draft…
Gordon Beckham would be an alright choice, and to be negative would be nitpicking, but i’d rather us go elsewhere is possible. There’s just a few concerns with him, the fact that he’s a latecomer, the fact that he may have to move off SS, i’m not so keen on his swing, & the fact that i’m not sure his ceiling is that high.
Proud owner of the most boring Username! Alex Hinshaw: Now showing in a bullpen near you!
So,
he moves off SS to 3B. And that’s bad how? Because we could use one of those, too.
Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!
Don't Look Now...
As a Tulane Alum, I’m paying particular attention to the Tallahassee regional, and Buster Posey is absolutely dominating. His line is .533/.632/1.467 heading into the second championship game today. Small sample size alert, but it’s always nice to have a 2.099 OPS.
I am rooting for Tulane to start Shooter Hunt tonight, which would make for a worthy match-up.
I still don’t get it.
My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.
by howtheyscored on Jun 3, 2008 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions
Fantastic Four
Mad Bum
Alderson
Villalona
Noonan?
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 3, 2008 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Wow we get all those? Am I awake?
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 3, 2008 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions
G. Beckham
Looks like a lock to be a pro but there’s no real projection in him. He seems like a Comp Round Athlete with First Round makeup. It’s hard to imagine him hitting more than 15 Big Ones in a year, although he could be a good gap to gap hitter.
I guess if he can stay at SS then he’d be a decent pick. But for 2B or 3B I just don’t see the value.
Saberscouting came out with their scouting reports for the draft a little while ago.
7. Gordon Beckham, SS, Georgia
Bio: 6′0, 185, Bats R, Throws R, 21 years old
The Skinny: Everyone loves players at premium positions who can swing the bat and Beckham fits that description perfectly. There’s some question as to whether he can remain at shortstop, but he continues to answer any and all questions about whether his college production at the plate is for real, as he’s put up a huge season at Georgia. He may be a fringy shortstop, and not every scout is sold on his sometimes awkward swing mechanics, but Beckham put up some big numbers with wood bats in the Cape League and has done all he can to prove he can be an everyday big league bat up the middle.
Pros: Bat/Power/Position Combo
Cons: Swing Mechanics, Can he play SS?
Comparison: Michael Young with less batting average
Adjusted OFP: 58
Proud adoptive parent of Tim Alderson.
Adjusted “Oh crap it’s FP?”
"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.
by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Jun 2, 2008 12:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Adjusted
OFP-
Overall Fantasy Potential?
Outright Flop Possibility?
by baseballjunkie on Jun 2, 2008 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Aha, okay, it’s an average of the ratings of all a player’s tools on the 20-80 scale. The “adjustment” is the subjective modification a scout applies.
It blows my mind that people are actually doing this—averaging together the tools, giving equal weight to, say, throwing arm and power-hitting ability. Explains a lot about how the Giants select their players, actually.
Bobby Evans talks Draft
Here ya go!
Link it up!
SFDugout.com is BACK! See the Top 50 Giants Prospects!
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