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Roster Ideas

Step 1: Put Frandsen on the 60-day DL. Can anyone explain to me why this hasn't happened, and why he is taking up space on our 40-man?

Step 2: Send Bocock and Velez down. Burriss can take Velez's place as backup 2nd baseman. Aurilia can have Bocock's place on the Shortstop depth chart. Reasoning: Bocock looks more lost at the plate than most pitchers, and it can't be helping his development. Velez looks the same way in the field.

Step 3: Call up Justin Leone and Brett Harper. Reasoning: they are more worthy of the MLB time and they have power that we need to take a look at, especially considering step 4, below. Leone and Castillo can split time at 3rd, while Harper is broken in slowly as a backup at 1st. Make Bowker and Ortmeier your primary 1st base platoon, relegating Aurilia to mostly utility infielder work.

Step 4: Try to trade Molina for prospects. Bump Sandoval up to AA, in anticipation of possible big-league time in September if he continues to surge, or certainly next year. If trade happens, bring up GRod as Holm's backup.

Step 5: Try to trade Winn for prospects. If it happens, bring up Schierholtz.

When Omar returns: Keep an eye on Aurilia and Leone. If things go well with them, DFA Castillo. Consider bumping Noonan up to AA, for similar reasons as Sandoval (yes, he's young, but that hasn't stopped other teams, and we will need Shortstops and 2nd Basemen in the not-too-distant future)

When Roberts returns: Send down Harper, if you have to create a spot. Otherwise, if outfield is looking good, consider DFA-ing Roberts.

I think the Giants have way more tools in their toolbox than they, and a lot of fans, realize, and I for one look forward to what we may see in September. I don't expect us to be contending, but I do expect us to have some exciting youngsters getting playing time.

This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.

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Step 6: paragraphs

And DON’T bump Noonan to AA, the dude has like what? 2 walks so far? and they both came in one game? He’s not ready to be promoted. He’s hitting .290/.310/.419. That’s not performance worthy of a promotion to San Jose, let alone Connecticut.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on May 7, 2008 9:06 AM PDT   0 recs

way to make me look crazy :(

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on May 7, 2008 9:10 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I guess I'm drinking this "promote early" kool-aid

Hey, I think it might have been a good thing with Burriss- we’ll see.

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 9:17 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

the Burriss who’s hitting .242/.306/.273 in the majors?

The team might be devoid of middle infielders but that’s no reason to promote them to levels they’re clearly not ready for. And Noonan is CLEARLY not ready for anything other than Augusta.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on May 7, 2008 9:21 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Burriss is already at the offensive level Vizquel was last year

And while he may not be Omar on defense, he’s serviceable, and seems to get the fundamentals. His bunting skills and baserunning skills are a plus.

We’re not going to have many great players, so I’m settling for the potential for young, solid ones, which I see as better than free agents and bad trades.

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 9:24 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

2007 Omar Vizquel isn’t a level of offense to which anyone should be aspiring. I know you mean “he’s young and he’s already as good as Omar was last year!” but there are probably a lot of shortstops out there who could be inserted into the Giants starting lineup, play solid defense and fundamentals and manage a ~50 OPS+. Burriss’s performance so far in the majors this year (though I like him and would like him to succeed) shows absolutely no indication that he’ll ever be an acceptable hitter at the major league level.

I really don’t think that promoting so many players to levels they’re not ready for will make the team better any faster. I know the Giants seem very desperate to return to relevancy, but I think they’d be much better off in the long-term by taking the rebuilding process at a slower pace; at least, I think they’d be better off not being quite so aggressive with promotions.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on May 7, 2008 9:35 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Thing is, if your

OPS+ is in the 50s, you need to play D like Omar. If you’re just serviceable at D, solid fundamentally, you are looking at career of being a backup infielder stashed at AAA in event of injury to the middle infielders on the MLB roster.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on May 7, 2008 9:45 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Did you know?

I believe it is two, but it might even be only one of Manny’s hits that have reached the outfield untouched by an infielder. The guy is being overpowered, just as it appeared he would be.

The good news is that he has struck out only once in 33 at bats, which is exceptional. It appears to me that Manny has cut down on his swing in order to cut down on his strikeouts. But that appears to have made him into even more of a slap hitter than he was before.

I said over the winter that I was highly concerned by Manny’s skimpy 1.18 bases per hit as a minor leaguer. EXTREMELY small sample, but in the majors it has dropped to just 1.14.

If not for bunt and infield hits, Manny would be hitting less than Brian Burriss—although not striking out NEARLY as often.

by sharksrog on May 7, 2008 11:38 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Brian Burriss???

Did our shortstops get married recently?

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 12:21 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes

and they’re quite happy. Had to go to Vermont, or Mass, or one of those New England state to make it leagal, though. They were looking forward to a long honeymoon in Norwich, but this whole MLB thing screwed it all up.

by tyrannoman on May 7, 2008 1:43 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Oh, so silly. Just because they both suck, doesn’t make them gay!

FIRE BRIAN SABEAN

by zenbitz on May 7, 2008 3:22 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

But when Brian Bocock's last name becomes Burriss...

Methinks there might be something up. Just sayin.

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 4:15 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The mother of one of the grooms is very happy for the boys.

"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.

by BaronVonCurrentEvents on May 7, 2008 10:11 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree with you about Noonan,

but keep in mind that league average in the Sally is 251 .318 .375. And Augusta is somewhat of a pitcher’s park.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on May 7, 2008 9:41 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Good point about the context. Still, while I’m not particularly worried about his performance so far, I also don’t think it’s nearly worthy of promotion. I’d prefer to keep his development on the track it’s on right now.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on May 7, 2008 9:50 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Nick

Nick has a sweet stroke and likely will become an above-average major league batting average hitter with a little pop. But, man, doesn’t he really fit the Giants’ mold of players who don’t take walks?

by sharksrog on May 7, 2008 11:40 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I don’t think it really sounded like plate discipline was a problem when we drafted him. I’m still a bit boggled by how impatient a hitter he seems to be so far at Augusta.

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on May 7, 2008 4:12 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

trying to “prove” himself, perhaps? I can see a highly regarded guy geeking out and swinging at everything trying to impress. Give him half a season or so to settle, then we’ll get a better idea of where he’s at.

by tyrannoman on May 8, 2008 7:55 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm down with the majority of your ideas, hairy

I’m not convinced Harper’s ready to join the big club tho, even in a tryout role. Of course, he seems to have some power potential, so maybe he’d prove me wrong.

I dig the idea of sending Velez down, tho. Kid needs a reality check in a big way.

Billy Hayes: Nine more big-league plate appearances than you.

by delorean on May 7, 2008 9:12 AM PDT   0 recs

I'm not convinced either

But I think it’s worth a shot. If you want, substitute McClain.

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 9:18 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I’d like to substitute “looking outside the organization.” Our old pal Dan Johnson, for instance, is hitting .263/.378/.526 in AAA. Tampa has no use for him at all and would probably deal him for a low-ceiling arm or two.

by Evan on May 7, 2008 11:01 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Why bring up either?

Why bring up Leone, Harper OR McClain? They don’t really figure in the future when the Giants might be good again.

by sharksrog on May 7, 2008 11:41 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Because building for the long term isn’t the only goal. You want the actual existing team to be as competitive and exciting as possible, or you start losing fans in a hurry.

by Evan on May 7, 2008 12:18 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Well, you have a point there … I do kinda like The Great Leono, though.

by Evan on May 7, 2008 12:28 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I dunno

I think Harper has some potential. He’s not old at all.

SAVE_US.RAY
Nattowear: now featuring new crap!

by Natto on May 7, 2008 12:33 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Harper

is 26. If he can bring his SLG above 500 I think he will be deserving of a call up and prospect status. Until then, here’s hoping. In the meantime, The Great Leono deserves a call when/if Giants management has seen enough of Burriss, Velez and Castillo.

Adopted papa of a bouncing new waiver wire 27 year old. Castillo hits doubles.

by kennv on May 7, 2008 1:37 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

My boy will find a groove

In the meantime, everyone needs to remember: you don’t rebuild in a vacuum. If we can be 14-19 with this mismanaged group of hoodlums, then we might actually be able to be competitive and rebuild at the same time, if managed better.

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 3:03 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

No

The Giants are somewhat lucky to be 14-19. The time for being competitive while rebuilding passed a few years ago.

by sharksrog on May 7, 2008 6:18 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

but if we *could* rebuild in a vacuum...

it would be much quieter.

Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!

by Lyle on May 8, 2008 2:12 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Not if it was in a vacuum, though.

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on May 8, 2008 3:05 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Geez, all this trouble...

Can’t we just buy a new vacuum?

SAVE_US.RAY
Nattowear: now featuring new crap!

by Natto on May 8, 2008 3:22 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Losing fans

The time for the Giants to begin addressing not losing fans after the 2007 All-Star game was back after the 2002 season. The Boston Red Sox signed Theo Epstein as their GM at that time (when some thought it might be Connecticut boy Brian Sabean) and Theo immediately pledged to revamp the BoSox’s scouting and development systems. The effort paid off, as a few of their World Series contributors last season were drafted by Epstein.

The Giants soon went the opposite direction, intentionally forfeiting high draft picks. They zizzed when they badly needed to zag.

When the Giants re-signed Brian Sabean last summer, they hinted that the stupidity went above Brian, all the way up the ladder.

The time to worry about not losing fans is before you begin to lose them. Now it is far too late.

We all have heard of making one’s own bed and then having to lie in it. The Giants are now resting not so comfortably in the bed they have made over the past five years—if not the last 20, which began right after Will Clark and Matt Williams were drafted.

Really, if we were running a school for prospective general managers, might we not use the Giants as a case study of what NOT to do?

by sharksrog on May 7, 2008 6:17 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

"You are correct, Sir!"

To quote Phil Hartman’s impression of Ed McMahon.

Your 2011 SF Giants: the 2008 Augusta Greenjackets!

by Lyle on May 8, 2008 2:14 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I like Dan

I agree that Dan Johnson would be worth acquiring. He’s more ready than John Bowker, who likely would benefit from more seasoning in Fresno, and the Giants haven’t yet figured out how to hand
Nate Schierholtz a first baseman’s glove.

Some of the things the Giants haven’t figured out how to do are just amazing. Wouldn’t the Giants make an incredible case study for someone who was looking for what mistakes NOT to make with a baseball team?

by sharksrog on May 7, 2008 11:43 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree on all accounts

DJ is, if I’m not mistaken, unclaimed by anybody at the moment, having been successively DFA’d by the A’s and the Rays. His career line of .249 /.344/.419 would instantly make him one of the better hitters on the team, comparable to Winn with more pop and less athleticism. It would also take the pressure off Bowker, and make Aurilia more expendable.

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 3:05 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

How expendable?

Just how expendable does Richie have to be? :)

by sharksrog on May 7, 2008 6:19 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Thing is

the Giants could have acquired him without giving up a low ceiling arm, by just claiming him.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on May 7, 2008 12:05 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Ah, but he passed through waivers during that brief shining moment during which John Bowker was the next Matt Holliday. Now that Bowker is striking out all the time and has an OBP of .288, Dan Johnson looks a lot more interesting.

by Evan on May 7, 2008 12:20 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Don’t waivers go AL first, then NL (when you’re a player from the AL)? If that’s the case, then did the Giants even have a shot at claiming him off waivers?

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 12:25 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah

That’s how the Rays got him. I don’t think we’d ever know if the Giants would’ve picked him up or not.

SAVE_US.RAY
Nattowear: now featuring new crap!

by Natto on May 7, 2008 12:34 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The A’s waived him and the Rays grabbed him before the Giants had a chance. But then they immediately decided that they’d rather play Gabe Gross, so they waived him too, and this time he went unclaimed by everyone.

by Evan on May 7, 2008 12:39 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Seriously...

You’re just clowning me now, right?

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on May 7, 2008 12:40 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

mais non!

by Evan on May 7, 2008 12:41 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Man, I forgot about that. Bleh.

SAVE_US.RAY
Nattowear: now featuring new crap!

by Natto on May 7, 2008 1:48 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

So I guess he's still a Ray

Unbelievable.

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 3:08 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

So are Durham and Fosse

2008 Giants: A steaming pile of scrap!

by Goofus on May 7, 2008 3:28 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Durham

Not a ray of hope

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 3:41 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Didn't the Giants realize?

Didn’t the Giants realize when “Babe” Bowker got off to such a hot start that he was playing way over his head? After all, “Babe” had gone just 5-for-27, all singles, at Fresno.

Are you saying the Giants are stupid? Oh, you are? Then you’re pretty smart. :)

by sharksrog on May 7, 2008 6:21 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

RE: Step 4

Doesn’t appear to me that GRod’s still around. He certainly hasn’t appeared on any of the minor league rosters this year. I’m not entirely sure he accepted the demotion in ST.

My boy ain't fat, he's just big boned. Big bat, too.

by Roger on May 7, 2008 9:26 AM PDT   0 recs

I think the Baron or the Mercury News or somebody mentioned that Rodriguez is recovering from a concussion.

by Dan from NM on May 7, 2008 9:29 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

When I asked around in Fresno about G-Rod they didn’t know what happened to him. I remembered after the fact of course that he had some post-concussion syndrome issues. I think it was mentioned briefly here before the start of the season. Egg on my face.

"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.

by BaronVonCurrentEvents on May 7, 2008 9:53 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I think the recent article in the Chron about Holm mentioned that GRod is still out with post-concussion issues.

2008 Giants: A steaming pile of scrap!

by Goofus on May 7, 2008 11:43 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah, I didn't know about the concussion thing

Where’s a knoodler when you need one?

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 9:48 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

With the A’s.

SAVE_US.RAY
Nattowear: now featuring new crap!

by Natto on May 7, 2008 11:21 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Trudat

But it was a rhetorical. I actually have been pleasantly amused by the Giants->A’s movement that has been happening lately, with Knoedler, Linden, and Davis.

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 11:26 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Well

Billy Beane is famous for making the most of undervalued commodities, and what could possibly have less value than a SF Giants positional player castoff?

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on May 7, 2008 11:40 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Last week my boss and I were speculating what the Giants would do with Zito being demoted to the bullpen and Lowry and Correia on the DL, if and when they needed a starting pitcher. She said she’d heard they were going to call someone up, and I found that to be pretty dumb (the idea, not that she repeated what she had heard). The remaining minor league pitchers on the 40-man roster are all RP, so to call up SP the team would need to send someone down AND clear room on the 40-man. But then I thought they could transfer Franny to the 60 day DL because he’s not playing this year.

That was a redeeming conversation to have since I got ”....” looks from guys in my office when I mentioned something about Sanchez throwing really well. F them. My boss gets me.

"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.

by BaronVonCurrentEvents on May 7, 2008 9:57 AM PDT   0 recs

I think we need to slow down on the Velez hate

His defense is not THAT bad. He’s made a few bad plays, and made ONE play that cost a game and has left a bad taste in everyone’s mouth.

However, the reality is he has only made 2 errors this season, which is less or = than Castillo (6), Bocock (3), or Aurilia (2) in equivilent playing time. He has the fewest errors on the infield.

I know that errors don’t capture every bad play, but the truth is he just is not as bad as everyone all the sudden thinks he is (he’s not great either, but until Sunday no one was saying he was a disaster). He’s made ONE bad play at a bad time and it costs a game – it doesn’t mean he is an atrocious defender and all hope is lost.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on May 7, 2008 10:02 AM PDT   0 recs

Yeah it’s starting to get to me. I admit to being ridiculously high on the guy, and yes my heart is breaking to watch him make some absolutely retarded decisions on the field, but let’s just calm down for a minute.

"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.

by BaronVonCurrentEvents on May 7, 2008 10:10 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yes, he is. It’s not the “one play that cost us a game” that make us dislike his defense- at least, not for me.

He just doesn’t cover much ground. And that’s where it hurts us. I noticed it while watching him in Spring Training but didn’t have any random defensive metric to support it, but now there are some. Simple zone metrics like RZR have him at a .750 mark, which is below average. Baseball Prospectus’ RATE 2 has him at an 82 (which is a -18) at the position.

Brian Bocock, on the other hand, has an .877 RZR, which is second only to Troy Tulowitzki. The RATE 2 also reflects this, with a 121 (+21). Velez actually is a liability at the position.

Too bad the Fielding Bible or Chris Dial don’t have updated ratings, otherwise I’m absolutely positive that it’d also say that Velez is atrocious.

Proud adoptive parent of Tim Alderson.

by Anticon23 on May 7, 2008 10:13 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah, it's not "Velez hate"

I actually like the guy. But things like the foul ball yesterday that dropped aren’t counted as errors, but showcase a distinct lack of fundamentals. It’s that kind of thing that happens way too much. He rarely gets the E, but when he’s getting glares from teammates (as w/Bocock), or creating situations where balls drop because a veteran defender doesn’t know how to handle his being in the way (as has happened with Winn), well, that’s unusual.

¿Julio is tourist in San Francisco? Harper's Bizarre!

by hairball on May 7, 2008 10:16 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

not a hater

it’s just that he’s not ML-ready, in the field OR at the plate. I like the guy too, and am excited by his speed, but he needs seasoning.

Billy Hayes: Nine more big-league plate appearances than you.

by delorean on May 7, 2008 10:18 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Agreed, HB. The MLBs are not the place to learn fundamentals (like who has priority on pop ups). I think it is almost shocking how fundamentally bad he is with the basics of the position. I mean, what does go on in the minors? Aren’t they taught anything? Even with Burriss there are basic, fundamental (+ hustle, focus) gaffes. Bocock, OTOH, really does seem to know what he is doing in the field. Did he learn all of that at Stetson?
I guess I think it comes down to maturity/work ethic. Guys like Frandsen and Bockout exhibit maturity and show they have been working hard. Velez and Burriss seem to have less maturity, a little more ‘hotdog’ in them. But, in a counter argument, Velez is said to be a very hard worker – I just wonder if that has always been the case or just appears now that he is in the majors.

by allfrank on May 7, 2008 10:34 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Why do Frandsen and Bocock get a pass? I seem to remember Frandsen not running out a popup in LA last year that led to a DP. Bocock’s been picked off on the bases this year just like Velez has been. What specifically shows that these two “exhibit maturity” while Velez and Burriss don’t? I would hate to think that you’re judging them solely on appearance (and you know what I mean here) rather than what actually happens in games.

I was THE GREATEST OF ALL TIME (for 3 days in 1995).

by Mike Benjamin Hit King on May 7, 2008 11:57 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Give me a break

Race has nothing to do with it, jesus.

Bocock has showed extreme maturity at the plate in his willingness to take pitches and not try to do too much. He got picked off once like an idiot and never did it again. (he got picked again, but not looking like an idiot)

As far as Frandsen, not running out a pop up is a very veteran thing to do. duh.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on May 7, 2008 12:10 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

How would you know

that Bocock and Frandsen have better work ethics than Velez and Burriss? Especially since Velez’ work ethic has been praised?

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on May 7, 2008 1:27 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

What if

this is as good a defensive player as Velez can be? I’m excited about the guy, and I love watching him on the basepaths, but the defensive lapses cannot be a surprise. To paraphrase Denny Green, I think Eugenio is who we thought he is. Slappy hitter, a little pop, blazing speed, and a complete liability with the glove. I don’t think being sent down will improve his defense, just reinforce what we see before us.

by tyrannoman on May 7, 2008 1:49 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

It's probably close to true

With time, he will get better. The question is just how much. Probably only a little bit. Can he stop having so many “duh” plays? Probably. Will his ability to read the ball, etc improve? Probably not too much.

Right now, I would be satisfied w/ a reduction in the “duh” plays. I think that will come.

Eugeniooooooo!!!!

by FairweatherFan on May 7, 2008 2:14 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

And we let 'em off the hook!

2008 Giants: A steaming pile of scrap!

by Goofus on May 7, 2008 3:29 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm not defending Velez' D

I disagree with the implication that Velez sucks, because he does not work hard.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on May 7, 2008 9:13 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Chris Dials numbers are simply zone rating

converted into runs relative to average, based on the average run values of plays made by each position, and the average zone rating at that position.

Zone Rating has Velez at a pathetically bad 656 at 2b.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on May 7, 2008 10:26 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Thanks for the clarification. =)

I’m not an expert on defensive ratings, obviously. But it seems pretty clear that when different metrics show he’s bad, and I had that impression just from watching him offhand, he must be pretty damn bad.

Proud adoptive parent of Tim Alderson.

by