Two days 'til...
One of the perks about being a blogger or columnist is manufactured outrage. By my count, baseball provides over 524,982 situations that make it reasonable to suggest that society is likely to crumble. The Clemens inquisition is one of those situations -- partly because no one expects the Clemens inquisition. But the Giants not really looking for a first baseman is something else that deserves a heaping spoonful of manufactured outrage. If you claim that I'm overreacting, all I have to do is point to my Blogger's Union membership card. Try not to pay attention to the fact that it's written in crayon.
That written, I also think that I'd prefer to read the same "Family Circus" panel for an hour than read 95% of columnists and bloggers who specialize in manufactured outrage. So when it comes to something as pointless as the opening day starter on a last-place team, I'll tread carefully. It really doesn't make a whit of difference to this team. If Matt Cain doesn't start opening day, he won't care. Heck, it might even motivate him more.
It's the idea that kills me. Barry Zito didn't earn the position of opening day starter. He unearned it over the first three months of last season. He was paid more money than any other pitcher in the game to perform like any other pitcher in the game. The second half he had last year made me optimistic -- really, it did -- but he was anything but an ace last season.
Handing Zito the opening day gig says:
- Sorry, kids; tenure is more important than performance
- We aren't paying this guy to be a #3
Bruce Bochy sat through every game last year. He saw Matt Cain pitch, and he saw Barry Zito pitch. If he makes Zito the opening day starter, it will speak volumes about where the Giants really are in the rebuilding process. Unless it doesn't, that is. It will give an indication that we shouldn't expect to see much of Fred Lewis, Nate Schierholtz or Kevin Frandsen. Unless it gives no such indication, and I'm making too much out of a meaningless decision that hasn't even been made yet. I will write this: I watched just about every Zito start last year, and thoughts of award and special recognition never crossed my mind.
Society will crumble, though. In a few years, when you're climbing over a pile of bodies to drink puddle water -- thrilled to even get that chance -- remember the 2008 opening day starter decision.
0 recs |
110 comments
Comments
Re: Two days 'til...
Upgrade!
by howtheyscored on Feb 12, 2008 8:59 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
If it were me, I'd go with: Cain, Barry Zito, Tim Lincecum, Noah Lowry, Kevin Correia.
by Dan from NM on Feb 12, 2008 9:01 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by Grant on Feb 12, 2008 9:06 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
Lowery
Zito
Lincecum
Cain
'Nuff said.
by Cookyman on Feb 12, 2008 9:30 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by howtheyscored on Feb 12, 2008 10:27 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Bah
by UnleashTheGore on Feb 12, 2008 9:06 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Bah
by howtheyscored on Feb 12, 2008 9:10 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Bah
by KyrieEleison on Feb 12, 2008 2:05 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by MeSoKrabby on Feb 12, 2008 9:07 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE YELLING ABOUT!!1!!
by awesomer on Feb 12, 2008 10:08 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
My tummy itches
by SoFa King Mike on Feb 12, 2008 10:31 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
THE NORTH ATLANTIC GETS AN INCH WIDER EACH YEAR!
by WalrusMan on Feb 12, 2008 10:37 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: THE NORTH ATLANTIC GETS AN INCH WIDER EACH YEA
That's only because U-boats keep sinking shipments of Enzyte from Britain.
BRITAIN STANDS ALONE!
by zenbitz on Feb 12, 2008 10:54 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: THE NORTH ATLANTIC GETS AN INCH WIDER
I'm not sure what we're doing here, but that was fun.
by Grant on Feb 12, 2008 11:56 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
As well, recently the survey asked who should play 3rd, and while most said "Someone acquired in a trade," the second place vote-getter was Kevin Frandsen.
While I think Frandsen should not play 3rd, he should be HANDED second on a silver platter, I think that shows the fan base is strictly for the youth. If Sabean and Co. expect to fill seats they better play off the "hope" that youth movements provide-- despite the relatively small payoff youth movements most often have, at least initially.
But do you think the content the Giants MLB.com page contains has anything to do with how they really expect to play this team? I mean, not only the surveys, but the articles and Mailbag are all about the youth, too.
by lrs77 on Feb 12, 2008 9:48 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by TedWillamsbobblehead on Feb 12, 2008 10:15 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Want to make it interesting?
by TedWillamsbobblehead on Feb 12, 2008 10:34 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Want to make it interesting?
by SoFa King Mike on Feb 12, 2008 11:19 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Want to make it interesting?
by Kitspool on Feb 12, 2008 11:22 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
OR some dumb sportswriter may argue that Matt Cain only had X opening day starts and thus isn't worthy...
by nostocksjustbonds on Feb 12, 2008 10:58 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by jasomack on Feb 12, 2008 11:43 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by Kitspool on Feb 12, 2008 11:35 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by GaryEdmundCarter on Feb 12, 2008 12:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by Roger on Feb 12, 2008 1:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
But if we are judging the pitchers, then Hudson was the best of the three.
by thehavenot on Feb 12, 2008 3:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
If two Aces are Co-Aces...
by Lyle on Feb 13, 2008 2:45 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: If two Aces are Co-Aces...
by Roger on Feb 13, 2008 7:48 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: If two Aces are Co-Aces...
by senorvegas on Feb 13, 2008 11:06 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
The few moves/non-moves they made are going to make it a lot tougher to swallow Durham, Aurilia and Roberts getting AB's, even though they need playing time to restore value, and outrageous to watch Zito go 3 innings and give up 7 runs on opening day.
by jasomack on Feb 12, 2008 11:39 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
We have no ML ready position players worth a damn.
Molina/Winn/Roberts/other old guy have zero trade value.
I didn't want Vizquel either, but SOMEONE has to play shortstop. Fransden? Eugenio Velez?
Rebuilding isn't some 110 loss punishment you have to endure to get better ("Character rebuilding?"). It requires you having some young talent to develop, or some veteran talent that is worth some young talent on the trade market.
by zenbitz on Feb 12, 2008 12:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by TedWillamsbobblehead on Feb 12, 2008 12:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
Neither one is a long-term solution, of course, but it's frustrating to watch management again and again go for a short-term patch that is clearly not even a good short-term patch.
by Evan on Feb 12, 2008 1:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
By the way how does one measure veteran savvy? Also outside of America is their a metric conversion? These are the things that keep me up at night. Least of which is who the f$!k is going to start opening day.
by WilliamVanLandingham on Feb 12, 2008 3:19 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
I sure don't see Everett sliding into first base headfirst the way Omar can, kicking up huge clouds of veteran savvy every time he does.
by tobias on Feb 13, 2008 12:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
I really don't want to pay him 5m to bat .220/.300/.299 and play moderately-above-average defense in 2010 as a senior citizen.
by jasomack on Feb 12, 2008 4:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by rxmeister on Feb 12, 2008 6:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
As for Vizquel, I think part of keeping him may have been courting him as a future coach/manager and as an aid for more aggressive recruiting in Latin America. He's a very smart guy who could have far more post-playing career value to the Giants than Everett.
by NearestNorwich on Feb 12, 2008 7:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Vizquel future recruiter...
by Lyle on Feb 13, 2008 2:49 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
If these young guys aren't going to develop into average/above-average OF's, we need to find out NOW so we can start bringing other guys in.
I like Winn, but he's blocking Schierholtz, Lewis and Davis. By the end of '08/beginning '09, he might be blocking Bowker, as well. I know nobody wants us to lose two of our (this hurts to say) best hitters, but this isn't the year to hold on to aging, average players.
by jasomack on Feb 12, 2008 5:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
Shuerholtz is 24... he has at least a year in AAA before he can legitimately be called blocked.
Lewis and Davis need 400 PAs or so this year. They don't need 700. There's nothing wrong with having them (with Roberts) as OFs 3/4/5/platoon mates.
They are "blocked" in the sense that they are out of options. But they are too old to be legit prospects, and frankly, have never really crushed AAA. I think they are out of options, so I think they start in SF.
The number of PAs Winn and Roberts vs. Lewis and Davis get in 2008 is not really going to impact the team in 2009-2011.
The big problem is the infield anyway. As in "we ain't got any"
by zenbitz on Feb 12, 2008 9:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, genius idea commencing!
I know that some of you will hate me for revolutionizing the game of baseball, but it's so much better for the Giants this way.
by thehavenot on Feb 12, 2008 9:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Oh, genius idea commencing!
So, who gets to be rover - Lewis or Davis? Or both?
by Ott on Feb 13, 2008 11:12 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Oh, genius idea commencing!
by zenbitz on Feb 13, 2008 12:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
Shucks.
by Anticon23 on Feb 12, 2008 11:56 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Good news, everyone!
by groug on Feb 12, 2008 1:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Except . . .
=(
by Anticon23 on Feb 12, 2008 3:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Except . . .
I watched a whole History Channel documentary on this. It was pretty hilarious.
by groug on Feb 12, 2008 3:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Except . . .
by daveinexile on Feb 12, 2008 3:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Except . . .
by thehavenot on Feb 12, 2008 4:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Except . . .
I agree with you the Bigfoot & Alien adventures from The Weekly World News are entraining as well. Anyone seen who the Aliens are backing for president this time around?
by daveinexile on Feb 12, 2008 4:36 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Except . . .
by UnleashTheGore on Feb 12, 2008 4:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Except . . .
by paboperfecto on Feb 13, 2008 6:03 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Cain IS the starter and 2nd base is up for grabs
by GiantsLover on Feb 12, 2008 12:05 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
2B Velez
LF Lewis
RF Schierholtz
1B Ortmeier
3B Frandsen
C Alphonszo
SS Vizquel
Call me a sadist, but this line-up actually keeps me interested.
The twist is that Winn, Rowand, Roberts, Aurilia, Durham & Molina are all solid/excellent bench players.
by Kid Fresh on Feb 12, 2008 12:41 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Once in the season this would be fun to see.
by Andy from DC on Feb 12, 2008 12:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Once in the season this would be fun to see.
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by GaryEdmundCarter on Feb 12, 2008 5:57 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by howtheyscored on Feb 12, 2008 6:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by rxmeister on Feb 12, 2008 6:43 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
But that doesn't mean my hopes are high this season. Even as impressed as I was last year I think his season with the bat was only just passable. His defense has been in a sharp decline for the last few years. I don't see a reason to believe that he'll hit better this year, and I do see reason to believe why he might hit worse or hurt himself and not hit at all. And his defense isn't very good. I liked Molina 2007. I just really don't think I'll like Molina 2008. He's going to be a trainwreck sometime in the near future if he doesn't improve his conditioning, and I'm afraid to say that I'm able to see that wreck happening this year.
by howtheyscored on Feb 12, 2008 7:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
The problem with Giants is that they have 4 positions like this (Molina, Vizquel, Winn, Frandsen/Durham), 3 black holes, and a plus CF (unless Rowand reverts to hitting .275 again, in which case he's firmly in the first category again)
I am a little undecided about calling LF a black hole. Maybe it's a grey hole. I am assuming some combination of Roberts/Lewis/Davis play there. Actually, I think if you take Roberts/Lewis/Davis/Winn and 2 corner OF positions, you will average out to 1 terrible and 1 adequate hitter. I am not sure which parts of the 4 will be what. The upside is that they both (positions) might be adequate in the Molina sense, the downside is that they might both be horrid.
And that's giving credit to everyone's UPSIDE potential. I think Ortmeier's HIGH end is that he's in the bottom 1/3rd of NL 1B with the bat. The downside is that he's back in AAA, and Aurilia is the in the bottom 1/5th of NL 1B.
by zenbitz on Feb 13, 2008 9:54 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
I'm too lazy to look the other projections up, but ZiPS actually gives Alfonzo a better projection for '08 than Molina. It's probably all those doubles that Molina stretches into singles.
by jasomack on Feb 12, 2008 6:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
OK, somebody has to say it
Having said that, Zito's future has a lot more hope than Durham's or Winn's.
by achiappanza on Feb 12, 2008 12:52 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
LF - Roberts (35)
SS - Vizquel (41)
RF - Winn (34)
C - Molina (34)
CF - Rowand (30)
2b - Durham (36)
1b - Ortmeier (26)
3d - Aurilla or Frandsen (37,26)
I could be wrong on the ages on some of these guys, but that don't look like a youth movement to me. At least the pitching staff is young - until they trade for Dave Weathers or Troy Percival to close.
by hummbaby on Feb 12, 2008 12:53 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Can't disagree...
by UnleashTheGore on Feb 12, 2008 1:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Can't disagree...
You know what scares me? That Sabean will toss some AB's to Ortmeier, Davis, and Lewis, and then, when they don't pan out, throw up his hands, scream "we need proven commodities who can do the little things!!" and deal for Crede & Matsui (both Matsuis!), and extend Vizquel until he's 50.
Usually, when the Giants finally cave in and give AB's to young guys (Niekro, Linden), it doesn't end up working out. I wonder how much that entered into Sabean's mind when he started "focusing on young players."
by jasomack on Feb 12, 2008 5:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Can't disagree...
I think I have a pretty good handle on what theGiants consider "youth" to be.
by Roger on Feb 13, 2008 7:39 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Can't disagree...
One of the older BP books (2002?) had this quote about the Giants: "They have good players and young players, but the good players are not young and the young players are not good".
Things haven't changed much, except we don't even have any good old players anymore.
by zenbitz on Feb 13, 2008 9:44 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Can't disagree...
by Roger on Feb 13, 2008 10:50 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by someguynamedg on Feb 14, 2008 10:34 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by Roger on Feb 12, 2008 1:56 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Pitcher X?
by multiphasic on Feb 12, 2008 2:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Pitcher X?
by Mike Benjamin Hit King on Feb 12, 2008 2:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Pitcher X?
by KCDrummer82 on Feb 12, 2008 3:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Pitcher X?
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by The Gene Hackman on Feb 12, 2008 3:26 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by howtheyscored on Feb 12, 2008 4:46 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
What are you, an Irish R&B Singer?
by Anticon23 on Feb 12, 2008 6:57 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
Wait, my bad. I'm at the wrong point in the decline and fall of the Sabean era.
by thehavenot on Feb 12, 2008 3:34 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by jasomack on Feb 12, 2008 6:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
To me, Zito being named Opening Day Starter would piss me off, especially considering Cain deserves it. But what's going to piss me off is we'll probably sign a third baseman this offseason and have a competition for second base between Frandsen and Durham. And Durham will probably win because Franny can play multiple positions (even if not particularly well) and Franny isn't a savvy vet. This despite Durham batting something like .218 last season.
THAT is where my ire will be drawn from.
by JRPhillips on Feb 12, 2008 5:29 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
Is there a particular free agent 3B you fear? Is it Jeff Cirillo?
by jasomack on Feb 12, 2008 6:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
"Well, Ray had a good spring, dropped about 10 pounds, and is playing like he's 25. Its pretty hard to justify benching an All-Star coming off a great spring training you know."
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by rxmeister on Feb 12, 2008 6:46 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by JRPhillips on Feb 15, 2008 9:56 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by howtheyscored on Feb 12, 2008 6:28 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by Mike Benjamin Hit King on Feb 12, 2008 9:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by howtheyscored on Feb 12, 2008 9:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by sam23 on Feb 12, 2008 6:47 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
Already Mt. Rushmore Noggin is droning on about the irrelevant minutiae that keeps us biting our nails in anticipation
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 8:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by sam23 on Feb 12, 2008 9:05 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 9:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by Dan from NM on Feb 12, 2008 9:41 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by E Ticket on Feb 12, 2008 9:59 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Two days 'til...
by paboperfecto on Feb 13, 2008 6:09 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Scott Williamson
by WalrusMan on Feb 13, 2008 8:44 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

by 


















