Vernon Wells?

6 years, $100M left on the contract, can opt out after 2011.

if the blue jays are trying to shed payroll and want to get out from under this contract, is it worth it for us to pursue?

James has his 2009 projections looking like this:
23 hr
85rbi
.281
.817 OPS
.355 wOBA

of course this is in toronto... as far as i can read espn has the rogers centre park factor as favoring the pitcher even more than the big phone, but i'm not sure how that works.

anyhow, wells just turned 30 last week and played in only 108 games last year, but i'd still prefer him in center to scotty.

the jays definitely won't give him away, and would need to replace him in the outfield, so i'm thinking:

rowand, sosa and english for wells.

blue jays save $52M and rowand's deal is 2 years shorter than wells. they also pick up some good pitching prospects.

i REALLY want out of rowand's contract, and this gives us a middle of the order bat without having to give up too much.

i've always liked wells and wanted us to pursue him before his large extension was signed, so maybe i'm still all over 2005 wells.

10 months ago redhornet78 38 comments 0 recs |

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maybe i’m still all over 2005 wells.

i meant 2006 wells, of course (32, 106, .303)

Dodgers fans eat their young.

by redhornet78 on Dec 20, 2008 11:15 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

Initially was hoping a Zito for Wells deal but know that would not work. Not only is Wells a solid player he is also a very solid person. Since it is a salary dump trade for Toronto would SF need to include both Sosa and English in that deal?

The net cost to SF is worth making a Rowand for Wells trade.

by wilriv21 on Dec 20, 2008 11:36 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

solid person = irrelevant. The Pirates chose Andy Van Slyke over Barry Bonds on the basis of personal solidity.

"he walked 18; new league record! Struck out 18, another new league record! He also hit the sportswriter, the PA announcer, the bull mascot twice..."

by i did my job on Dec 20, 2008 12:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Are you implying that Barry was a prick?

You probably know it as MYANMAR, but it will always be BURMA to me!

by NuschlerFace on Dec 20, 2008 12:59 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Vernon Wells could on Day 1 become the face of the organization very easily. Would be great on the field, in the clubhouse and out in the community.

by wilriv21 on Dec 20, 2008 1:04 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, but who will be the pancreas of the organization!?

Honestly, I have heard this “face of the organization” crapola more this offseason than any other I can remember…and not just from Giants fans. This media created nothingism belongs right up there with Jeter’s calm eyes.

It means dick.

by Lars The Wanderer on Dec 20, 2008 2:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

not to the bottom line

by wilriv21 on Dec 20, 2008 3:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

It means nothing to the bottom line either.

by Lars The Wanderer on Dec 20, 2008 3:35 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

no joke. The main thing for the bottom line is winning. It dwarfs just about every other effect on ticket sales, including advertising.

The Denker bus is now bound for San Diego. Those who were passengers on it are now angrily stranded at a gas station in Modesto, CA. Not much about baseball here .

by oldjacket on Dec 20, 2008 11:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Lincecum is the “face of the franchise” and he doesn’t cost $100M+ (yet).

Bonds stands alone.

Proud adopted parent of future big league slugger Thomas Neal

by nostocksjustbonds on Dec 21, 2008 10:43 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Beat me to posting this

not sure what it would take though, but if we could move Rowand in the deal I would do it in a heartbeat.

Giants! Giants! HELP US GOD!

by j14 on Dec 20, 2008 11:46 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

A 7 year, $126 million contract?

That’s just eerie. Those numbers must be cursed.

I’d love to have Wells on this team- I was really disappointed when the Jays signed him last year before he became a free agent.

by Useful_Idiot on Dec 20, 2008 12:31 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

4 8 15 16 23 42

If God had intended us not to rosterbate, he would've made our arms shorter.

Padre renuente de Luis Perdomo, porque él es todo el que se deja hasta junio.

by Mike Hawk on Dec 20, 2008 2:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Rowand and a minor league pitcher not named timmy or madison. Yes please! I’d even throw in Tashner

Proud father of Eric Surcamp!

by The Thrill on Dec 20, 2008 1:47 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Any Blue Jays fans out there?

I don’t really follow the AL closely but it’s my impression the Jays have to go young and build up the farm system like the Rays did to have any hope of competing with the Yankees and Red Sox. If so, they have no chance of competing anytime soon and it would be pointless for them to take on Rowand. They would not be shedding enough salary and would be committed to him for too long. The Yankees, Red Sox, and Mets would all be better fits on the east coast if getting rid of Rowand is the goal (the Mets need a left fielder). Perhaps the Cubs could be a player also.

by NearestNorwich on Dec 20, 2008 2:27 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

I’d even entertain the idea of giving up Sanchez for Wells. I’m not sure Toronto would accept just Rowand and a minor league pitcher, but if they are really trying to unload salary than I guess it’s possible.

by Useful_Idiot on Dec 20, 2008 2:28 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

If the Jays did decide to trade Wells and go with a full on rebuilding process there is no way in hell they would take on a bad contract in return (putting aside the face that is would be almost impossible ethically to trade a player 1 year after he signs a long term contract with you). If you want Wells you are going to have to start with Lewis and Sanchez and throw in one or two of the B-level pitching prospects you mentioned.

by FluLikeSymptoms on Dec 20, 2008 2:30 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

If that's the case, I say no

Lewis could end up with numbers similar to Wells’, and throwing in Sanchez on top of it is way too much.

by Useful_Idiot on Dec 20, 2008 2:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I doubt the Jays are going to rebuild, and if they do and want to trade away Wells and Doc, they would probably look at young/minor-league positions players, which the Giants don’t really have a lot of right now.

Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all.

by baetown415 on Dec 20, 2008 3:35 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

"young/minor-league positions players, which the Giants don’t really have a lot of right now"

We have just as many young minor league position players as any other team in the league. They may suck but we have them!

Proud father of Eric Surcamp!

by The Thrill on Dec 20, 2008 3:43 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Hahahah, alright, you got me there.

Aaron King is still my homeboy... iffy mechanics and all.

by baetown415 on Dec 20, 2008 3:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I'm not really sure why this would be a good idea ?

Comitting to 6 years 100M for a player on the wrong side of 30?

Sounds a lot like Aaron Rowand to me.

McC's Outstanding Newcomer '08.

by FairweatherFan on Dec 20, 2008 4:19 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

+1

We pay $52M+ more for 1 more year of basicly Aaron Rowand. Very bad idea.

by giantsrainman on Dec 20, 2008 5:53 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

basically rowand? come on man.

i’d have to disagree here.

* what btrns and btwins means

2008 VORP: Wells: 30.6
Rowand: 15.3

Rowand has had the benefit of playing his best statistical year in a hitters park (2007, Citizens Bank) while Wells has played in a park that has favored pitching while playing in the hardest division in baseball.

I agree that wells is overpaid, but here is what i see:

-he’s a better player than rowand
-he’s a year younger than rowand
-we have no center field prospects that he’d block
-he’s a proven #3 or #4 bat in the line-up, which is something we all bitch that we need
-he would automatically be our biggest offensive threat (rowand is no offensive threat)

if we had the chance to pick him up AND rid ourselves of rowand’s contract i’d do it in a heartbeat. the free agent market is thinning out. teams are taking the “sign our young star to big contracts” approach, so that a teixeira-type superstar hitting the market is going to get increasingly harder to find.

we also have no advantages to attracting star position players. the biggest free agents to join us do so because we overpay drastically. to get ANYONE considered a star player we have to pay a contract similar to what wells gets, and even if we offer the most there are bigger market teams that can outbid us for the best free agents.

Dodgers fans eat their young.

by redhornet78 on Dec 21, 2008 11:08 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Whatever - The Difference Ain't Worth $52M

by giantsrainman on Dec 21, 2008 11:26 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

And It Sure As Hell Ain't Worth $52M And Sosa And English

by giantsrainman on Dec 21, 2008 11:27 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Isn’t Wells also a top notch defensive CF compared to Rowand’s declining defense. Adding more total value than just the 1.5 btwins?

Also the $52M figure should be reduced to consider that Wells is signed for 2 additional years. Even if you assume that he regresses to a league average CF he would be worth about $8-10M for each of those years making his contract value only about $32-36M more than Rowand’s. When you spread that over over 6 years, you are talking ~$6M/year.

I would definitely give up two B level prospects along with Rowand for the possibility of adding one of the bats this team needs to turn things around.

by VizquelQuest on Dec 21, 2008 2:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Signed For Just One Additional Year - Signed between 2006/7 Just Like Zito

by giantsrainman on Dec 21, 2008 2:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

My Misake - Cot's Verifies That He Was Signed For 2008-14 Not 7-13 As I Had Incorrectly Remembered

That said, he is actually owed $116M for the remaining 6 years so the difference would be $68M not $52M.

Again, this is a very bad idea!

by giantsrainman on Dec 21, 2008 2:49 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Also According To UZR From Fangraphs Wells was .8 Runs Worse Then Rowand Last Year

Further, according to Chone’s Defensive Projections Wells is projected to be 2 runs worse the Rowand this coming year.
So Wells seems to actually lose value compared to Rowand on defense.

by giantsrainman on Dec 21, 2008 2:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Wow. I thought I remembered him being considered one of the top defensive CF’s right before he signed that deal. If his defense is in fact worse than Rowand’s it wouldn’t make sense to give up prospects and financial flexibility for a marginal upgrade.

by VizquelQuest on Dec 21, 2008 7:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

He’s been pretty good until last year. Might have been a fluke.

The Denker bus is now bound for San Diego. Those who were passengers on it are now angrily stranded at a gas station in Modesto, CA. Not much about baseball here .

by oldjacket on Dec 21, 2008 11:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, and Wells was playing pretty banged up last season. He had a broken wrist and then hamstring issues. Pre-2008 he was a plus-defender in CF.

/deer head
Bay City Ball

by xanthan on Dec 23, 2008 10:22 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yea. If the idea is to rid ourselves of Rowand’s contract, it doesn’t seem that smart to take on a player who is owed more than he is.

by deuce deuce on Dec 20, 2008 8:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly

Aaron Rowand is not a bad player, he is just redundant on this team and a little over paid.

Vernon Wells is also not a bad player, but is just as redundant as well as being much much much more over paid.

Why again?

McC's Outstanding Newcomer '08.

by FairweatherFan on Dec 20, 2008 8:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed. I don’t see his numbers getting any better at this point in his career. I don’t like the idea of putting out more money. I ‘d rather ride out Scott’s contract or dump him in a deal in the future that won’t cost us more money.

I Don't Tolerate Intolerance!

by Giant among Angels on Dec 20, 2008 9:36 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs