Evaluating Winn's trade value
by AngelWillSaveUs on Dec 12, 2008 9:29 AM PST
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The Cameron/Cabrera trade got me thinking a little about Randy Winn, a favorite of this here sites rosterbation fantasies, and his trade value. First, here is some info on Mike Cameron, Randy Winn and Melky Cabrera:
Cameron:
-Plays CF
-OPS: .837 in '06, .759 in '07, .809 in '08
-Entering Age 36 Season
-Under contract for 1 yr/$10 mil
Winn:
-Can play CF
-OPS: .721 in '06, .798 in '07, .790 in '08
-Entering Age 35 Season
-Under contract for 1 yr/$8.25 mil
Cabrera:
-Plays CF
-OPS: .752 in '06, .718 in '07, .614 in '08
-Entering age 24 season
I think we can agree Cameron is a better player but based on remaining cost, they are pretty much equal parts. So, it looks like the market value of Mr. Winn has been set-without picking up salary, it's a CF with limited/no upside*. (and I know how much we love those: I'm looking at you Mr. Roberts)
So, is it worth it to give Winn away to get Nate at-bats as an everday player? Possibly. I mean, no way. Actually, I'm not sure. So I open it up to the good people of the McCoven to convince me one way or the other. But the idea of Winn being a lynchpin in the Giants quest to find a viable corner infielder with some power seems to be a pipe dream.
*I'm aware that a lot of trade scenarios have included Sanchez or other young prospects combined with Winn. However, if this is the return a Randy Winn gets on his own in the trade market, I doubt he adds too much to those type of deals.
This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.
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Don’t forget that Cameron is far superior to Winn defensively and also has more power. Winn’s value has to be less.
Why isn't Sabean held accountable for leading the Giants into many years of mediocrity???
believe it or not, one of the main reasons that the Yankees want Cameron is that he’s close friends with CC and they want to make him feel as comfortable as they can in his first year in New York. It wasn’t enough to pay him 160 million, they now have to bring in his posse. The most amazing thing about this trade with the Yankees if it happens, is that initially the Yankees wanted the Brewers to pick up part of Cameron’s contract. Of all the teams to ask!! One day after you outbid them by 60 million dollars for their best player, you have the nerve to ask them to send you a few million in a trade!!
Brian Sabean's dad- will make a few phone calls to help his son find a new job after next season
Is Cameron really far superior defensively to Winn these days? He was in his prime, certainly, but he has lost a few steps since then and Winn appears to be one of the absolute best defensive outfielders in baseball.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
There is the..
CF vs RF debate. We really aren’t sure what Winn’s D in CF is anymore, and we aren’t sure what Cameron’s D in RF would be.
Winn really is a great defender, but also is this just because he’s learned RF at the Booth so well? Or that he’s really a great defender.
The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."
Have to agree
with you JP. Randy Winn is not percieved as a star. Most people don’t bring his name up when talking about the best outfielders in baseball. What makes that wrong is that as he quietly goes about his job, he has turned into a very, very good outfielder.
His RF defense at Pac Bell is some of the best I have ever seen played in that park. He plays the wall better than anyone I’ve ever seen. He covers the corner and the “alley” very well.
He has not been terrible as an offensive player either. From Baseball Refererence.
His career numbers over 7.75 seasons prior to Giants:
.278/.342/.393 with an OPS+ of 94
His career numbers after 3.25 seasons with the Giants:
.307/.358/.407 with an OPS + of 117.
Randy Winn professional baseball player. At 8.25M, Undervalued Asset.
My adopted sons Matt Downs and Ben Copeland . Still not ramked in the McC prospect list.
Undervalued?
I don’t see Randy Winn as an undervalued asset. In fact, during a time when there isn’t a high demand for outfielders and when teams are watching their pennies more, I think his salary is high enough to make him a tough trade.
Not as tough as Dave Roberts though. :)
I just think that in the rush to make room for Juggernate, Winn’s consistency is often overlooked. At his salary, IMO he’s a good value for the Giants or as a trade chip with the marginal salary and one year remaining on his deal.
Does he lack power ? Yes, but he does hit for average, gets on base, has decent speed, and is a solid defensive player that can play any OF position well. Is he exciting ? No, but he shows up and goes to work.
RAZR numbers anyone ? Is he a break even, plus or minus as a defensive player ?
My adopted sons Matt Downs and Ben Copeland . Still not ramked in the McC prospect list.
I’d love to see the Giants trade Randy Winn, but if they were going to do it, we would have heard the rumors already. Until Nate proves he’s better than Randy, Sabean is going to hold on to him. We should just be thankful that Nate is out of options so that they have no choice but to keep him and give him significant playing time. We can also be thankful that Sabean said no to the agent when he went to him for an extension.
Brian Sabean's dad- will make a few phone calls to help his son find a new job after next season
The Goofus Doctrine
Keeping all four outfielders and giving them equal PAs while rotating Winn among all three OF positions makes the most sense:
- It protects us against the uncertainty of Lewis’ full recovery
- It protects us aginast the uncertainty of Schierholz’ ability to be a productive everyday player
- It gives them better platoon matchups and a stronger bench
- It keeps Winn around as a trading chip team at the deadline
ORgetting a comp pick for him following the season
My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman
/ Stamped Approved !!!
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
Here comes Captain Obvious wearing his Atomic Wedgie!
by daveinexile on Dec 12, 2008 11:15 AM PST up reply actions
I didn’t think this possible when Goofus stated this earlier, because I didn’t think that Aaron Rowand would be happy with so much bench time, but after that dinner they had, Rowand seemed to agree that he was tired at the end of last season and needed more rest. The only problem with the Goofus Doctrine is that Bruce Bochy loves the veterans so much that Dave Roberts might be getting the playing time instead of Schierholtz.
Brian Sabean's dad- will make a few phone calls to help his son find a new job after next season
How does the Goofus Doctrine
handle the “Dave Roberts Situation”????
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z75QSExE0jU&feature=related
I believe what Goofus is trying to do is rid this team of Dave Roberts.
by Useful_Idiot on Dec 13, 2008 11:30 AM PST up reply actions
Xanthan Gillooly :-)
My adopted sons Matt Downs and Ben Copeland . Still not ramked in the McC prospect list.
/ static cracks from the public address system
Paging Mr. Robert.
Paging Mr. Roberts.
Report the the Captain. Bring your life jacket.
That is all.
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
Here comes Captain Obvious wearing his Atomic Wedgie!
by daveinexile on Dec 12, 2008 12:12 PM PST up reply actions
to be fair
Ms got ripped off here.
FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?
I think one possible destination for Winn could be the Angels. They need an OF (maybe even 2) and If they sign Teixeira they are not going to have a lot of money to throw at one. He is certainly their kind of player, they might be more impressed than most teams with his 25 for 27 stolen bases last year.
Sanchez and Winn for Brandon Wood? Is that too much for Wood (I think I might overrate Wood a bit)?
by FluLikeSymptoms on Dec 12, 2008 11:46 AM PST reply actions
I like Wood a lot.
And not just for puns and joke. (Just try and tell me a line up with Bocock and Wood doesn’t make you grin.)
But I think Sanchez alone is overpaying for Wood. We know Sanchez can still at the Mlb level even if just as a reliever. We are still not certain Wood can. That’s more risk to be taking on and am not sure we would be getting compensated for it.
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
Here comes Captain Obvious wearing his Atomic Wedgie!
by daveinexile on Dec 12, 2008 12:19 PM PST up reply actions
yeah, that’s probably true. What could do it? Winn and Sosa with us paying some of Winn’s salary? Winn and Hinshaw/Sadler?
by FluLikeSymptoms on Dec 12, 2008 12:21 PM PST up reply actions
Here is were I sound like broken record
If sending Winn we would be sending 1-2 compensation picks all ready. The Angles are a smart enough front office to use that effectively.
Here is were I have to admit it’s been months since I looked at the Angels farm so I am unclear on what kind of depth they have at third, middle infield and arms ( if talking sending Sanchez instead).
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
Here comes Captain Obvious wearing his Atomic Wedgie!
by daveinexile on Dec 12, 2008 12:32 PM PST up reply actions
While I would like the productivity that would come with the assignment of a Type “A” classification would prefer WInn to be a Type “B”. Highly doubt any team would sign Winn if a Type “A” free agent but might Type “B” thus receiving a pick.
I can't pove your wrong.
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
Here comes Captain Obvious wearing his Atomic Wedgie!
Slightly off topic.
If we got Wood think we could find a Harold and a Richard to man 2 of the other infield spots?
Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!
Here comes Captain Obvious wearing his Atomic Wedgie!
by daveinexile on Dec 12, 2008 12:34 PM PST up reply actions
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