Open Wistful Thinking Thread

by Grant on Nov 24, 2008 11:16 AM PST Comment 55 comments

Remember how worried a lot of us were when the Giants were linked to Carlos Lee? And remember how, when the Giants didn't sign Lee, how they turned around and signed Barry Zito with the money earmarked for Lee?

Damn, how I wished the Giants had signed Carlos Lee. With Lee, the Giants probably would have been forced to fill center field with an in-house option, like, oh, Randy Winn. This would mean no Rowand. No Rowand would give the Giants more money to throw at C.C. Sabathia (still a bad move, but with no Zito around, I'm down...)

Sure, Lee would be worth a few more wins each year, which would have meant that the Giants wouldn't have been able to draft Buster Posey. But that's good news for you Smoakophiles out there, right?

Oh, and Bengie Molina would not have ever had to hit clean-up. The laws of nature would not have been violated so.

Read the hindsight-strengthened stupidity of this quote and shudder:

For the long-term, I hate the (Zito signing). For the short-term, I love it. I'm glad it isn't Carlos Lee. Really, really, really glad.

I'm sorry, Carlos. I'm sorry, readers. I'm sorry, world.

Come back, Carlos! I didn't mean those hurtful things!

Comment starter: What free-agent signing in the past were you terrified of, only to have it turn out to be a good deal? Or, at least, would have helped the Giants more than the option they eventually signed?

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I totally whiffed on Molina because I thought he’d break down really quickly. Catchers past the age of 30 with weight issues? No thanks. But he’s been a pretty good Giant during his time with us.

/deer head
Bay City Ball

by xanthan on Nov 24, 2008 11:20 AM PST reply actions 1 recs

And if we’re talking about other teams, I thought the deal that Mags got from the Tigers was crazy. He was coming off some weird knee surgery procedure that he had to leave the United States to get. I know the Tigers had some injury language written into the contract but it was still a little risky.

His OPS+’s during his time with the Tigers: 113, 112, 167, 127. Not bad.

/deer head
Bay City Ball

by xanthan on Nov 24, 2008 11:24 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, I hated the Molina deal and he’s very much outplayed my expectations.

Barry Zito: Mike Hampton with a guitar

by JakeS on Nov 24, 2008 3:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Carlos Lee still isn’t very good though. He gives most of the runs he produces on offense back on defense. I mean, I’d rather have him than Zito, but he still wouldn’t have been a very good signing (unless we put him at first, in which case it might have been better.)

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.

by jponry on Nov 24, 2008 11:25 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

You know, I can’t really think of any off-hand. The signings I’ve thought were terrible have mostly turned out to be terrible. Maybe I’m forgetting something – if so, I’m sure I’ll come up with it later.

I’ve been wrong in the other direction plenty of times, though – I’ve liked signings that have ended up causing nothing but grief. Like Edgardo Alfonzo. And, though it shames me to admit it, I liked the Armando Benitez signing at first. He was GREAT with the Marlins the year before we got. Lights out. Which makes his horrible, horrible tenure with the Giants that much more painful.

Never has a poster been more correct in the history of the internet. Ever! - ResDog on yours truly

by jcb9 on Nov 24, 2008 11:25 AM PST reply actions 1 recs

A-Rod

My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman

by Goofus on Nov 24, 2008 11:26 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

I’ll take my crow cold & straight.

I thought Benitez would be some were between poor- average. I know the front office was going after some one to close so I thought he was the least of evils. It turned out much, much worse.

A side of Roberts as well. I thought as a 4th outfielder/ show the kids how to play/ insurance policy incase the young outfielders were 4A or worse was not a terrible idea. I had no idea they were dreaming of him as a full time starter or they would then go get Rowand a year later.

Ivan Ochoa - Heir to the legacy of Rob Andrews & Rikkert Faneyte!

Here comes Captain Obvious wearing his Atomic Wedgie!

by daveinexile on Nov 24, 2008 11:33 AM PST reply actions 1 recs

After Bonds hit 73 homers, I remember discussing how much I’d be willing to pay to re-sign him. Myself and pretty much everyone I’d talked to agreed that we’d offer a reasonable contract, but probably wouldn’t keep him around, because he was ready to break down.

In 2002, the Giants went to the World Series. Egg on my face (and playoff tickets in my hand, baby!).

"He called the sh** POOP!" -- Adam Sandler

by JRPhillips on Nov 24, 2008 11:47 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

wait…Giants went where?

/blinks

Charlie Hayes ate my homework

by glenallen hill's waterpipe on Nov 24, 2008 12:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

they won the National League pennant, then baseball had to cancel the World Series because of a mass, undersea, unexplaned sponge migration.

by tyrannoman on Nov 24, 2008 12:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

oh come on Ray

The sponges moved about a foot and a half

FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?

by zenbitz on Nov 24, 2008 1:02 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

this post reminds me of the time

Grant tried to drill a hole in his head.

Go Fred Lewis... You're better than the alternative... Yippee...

by Uribe nee Gonzalez on Nov 24, 2008 4:20 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

THAT WOULD HAVE WORKED

FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?

by zenbitz on Nov 25, 2008 10:40 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I thought the Rowand signing was bad

but it was because I thought Rajai and Dave were better alternatives. Ha!

After a year… the signing is still bad. though not as bad as Zito. and not as bad as not re-signing Bonds and signing Rowand. uhhh… if that makes sense

Adopted Giant: Aaron King

Wearing the crown by 2011. Or at least the LOOGY hat

by baetown415 on Nov 24, 2008 11:48 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

I didn't like the Vizquel signing at the time

I thought he was too old and washed-up to give the Giants any value.

Uh…whoops.

GROUGTHINK ALERT

by groug on Nov 24, 2008 11:55 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

Hmm, now that you mention it, I sort of fall into this category too. Well, my feeling was that a 2-year contract would’ve been fine, but three years was too much. Which isn’t an entirely indefensible position.

Never has a poster been more correct in the history of the internet. Ever! - ResDog on yours truly

by jcb9 on Nov 24, 2008 11:58 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Same here.

When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on Nov 24, 2008 12:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

yep. Omar brought much-needed joy to the Giants even if the 3rd year of the contract was a disaster. Great signing.

Disfrute Los Gigantes every day at www.leftymalo.com

by leftymalo on Nov 24, 2008 12:19 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs

…isn’t the question here free agent signings that you didn’t want to happen that didn’t happen and now you kinda wish they had?

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.

by jponry on Nov 24, 2008 12:02 PM PST reply actions 1 recs

Reading comprehension is stupid and overrated

GROUGTHINK ALERT

by groug on Nov 24, 2008 12:49 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, I agree with Goofus.

/deer head
Bay City Ball

by xanthan on Nov 24, 2008 12:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

But that was grou....oohhhhh

This actually went through my mind for a few seconds.

The Basil Fawlty Moderating Strategy:
"We could run a nice blog here if we didn't have all these members getting in the way."

by WalrusMan on Nov 24, 2008 4:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

But we are talking about signings that did happen that we didn’t like at the time that turned out alright.

My Dave Righetti is better than your Dave Righetti.

by howtheyscored on Nov 24, 2008 11:11 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

The one thing good thing about getting Zito rather than Lee is that it allowed us one more year of Bonds, including 756. Not sure it was worth it, though.

by Evan on Nov 24, 2008 12:16 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

ya in some way that makes it worth it to me as a fan that was there, tho maybe not to the whole ‘winning team philosophy business’ tho. what a dilemma

by lincypoo i wuv u on Nov 24, 2008 7:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Gee, I've been calling that a bad thing

My 2008 mantra has been “If Carlos Lee took the money, we wouldn’t have been saddled with either Barry.”

It’s not that Barry’s HR chase wasn’t fun. It’s that Sabean’s strategy around him set back the rebuilding effort.

"[Greg] Vaughn is in a funk so deep, George Clinton wearing a miner's helmet couldn't find him."
- Jim Baker, ESPN.com, May 2002

by achiappanza on Dec 2, 2008 1:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Bad Vlad

When he signed w/ Angels for 11mil.We signed JT & M. Tucker and then told we were tapped out.Then somehow had 8mil for G.Maddox,which he refused.That was big and could have been big for us.RH power hitter w/ Bonds,come on!

by hudson101 on Nov 24, 2008 12:20 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Randy Winn’s extension has turned out well. Gotta eat crow on that one.

Beltre after his big year seemed like a disaster in the making, and a lot of people still see it that way, but in fact the M’s got a good deal, and he would have spared us a lot of Alfonzo and Feliz and Castillo.

by Evan on Nov 24, 2008 12:20 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Also, I was a big advocate for Andruw Jones last year and was furious that the Giants chose Rowand over him.

I may yet be proven right on that one, though.

by Evan on Nov 24, 2008 12:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Sorry to say you were behind me on Andruw Jones

Was standing with Boras on this hoping SF would sign for lots of monies. Thanks for not listening to me, Sabes.

The player who got away and wished SF signed was Carlos Beltran. Thought he was soft, injury prone and not in love with the game enough to earn the big bucks. Now wish he was playing CF and batting third in the order.

by wilriv21 on Nov 24, 2008 12:34 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs

I gotta sign this confession, too

even worse, I thought the Giants’ should’ve traded Durham for Sexon….ugh. Can’t even imagine the suckitude of that mess.

by tyrannoman on Nov 24, 2008 12:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

haha I was on board for that too

by lincypoo i wuv u on Nov 24, 2008 7:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

i'd rather have Andruw poo Jones and his contract

than Aaron, uh, “scarin” Rowand and his

Adopted Giant: Aaron King

Wearing the crown by 2011. Or at least the LOOGY hat

by baetown415 on Nov 24, 2008 2:11 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Not a FA

But can`t get over that A.J. deal!We could use those P`s now,esp.Nathan!

by hudson101 on Nov 24, 2008 12:26 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

?

No clue what you’re talking about. I remember no such thing.

When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on Nov 24, 2008 12:33 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs

LUCKY

by hudson101 on Nov 24, 2008 12:36 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Come on, we never had Burnett.

There amass been plenty of articles written this spring about the stud shortstop Matt Cain and Tim Lincecum , as well as the fluid young outfielders and thirteen basemen Kevin Frandsen.
comics | art | Nattowear | McFAQ I & II

by Natto on Nov 24, 2008 1:02 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I was also against the Molina signing at first. Now I love Bengie.

"While conservatives tell you 'leave things alone and no one will lose,' and liberals tell you 'interfere a lot and no one will lose,' baseball says 'someone will lose.' Not only says it - but insists upon it! ... Democracy is lovely, but baseball's more mature." BVCE supports SF Dugout and Manny Burriss.

by BaronVonCurrentEvents on Nov 24, 2008 12:49 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

We just signed Renteria

2 years $18 million

You probably know it as MYANMAR, but it will always be BURMA to me!

by NuschlerFace on Nov 24, 2008 12:53 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Did you accidently leave out the:

/bad joke?

They say some players get out of bed hitting; Pablo Sandoval doesn't wait that long

by bgunn on Nov 24, 2008 12:57 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I wish I did...

You probably know it as MYANMAR, but it will always be BURMA to me!

by NuschlerFace on Nov 24, 2008 12:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Argh!

Why now?

This is stupid. They could have waited and not lost a draft pick.

by Lars The Wanderer on Nov 24, 2008 12:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

what? Why not wait a week…or at least wait for Furcal to play out. That being said, I don’t mind the deal so much. $9mil seems about right, and 2 years isn’t so bad. But why now?

by tyrannoman on Nov 24, 2008 1:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

so far the only one reporting this is mlbtraderumors…hopefully it’s a false start (like when it was reported the A’s signed Mike Cameron a few years ago).

Unless the $9mil for Renterria will allow the GIants to seriously chase down CC or Tex, I don’t get the timing here.

by tyrannoman on Nov 24, 2008 1:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

by Natto on Nov 24, 2008 1:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I have always liked Renteria, but I don’t understand the timing for sure.

You probably know it as MYANMAR, but it will always be BURMA to me!

by NuschlerFace on Nov 24, 2008 1:04 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Can`t find this,got a link?

by hudson101 on Nov 24, 2008 1:15 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Homepage OH,I`m so dubm sometimes

by hudson101 on Nov 24, 2008 1:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

sort of on the same subject...

I still wish we could have had a chance at Aramis Ramirez. I was really bummbed when he decided not to test free agency.

My adopted Giant: "Raptor Jesus" Guzman

by Goofus on Nov 24, 2008 12:54 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Grissom

that was I think the the highest value-to-my-disgust ratio.

FIRE BRIAN SABEAN... UNLESS HE KEEPS DRAFTING WELL. .. AND SIGNS UNDERRATED PLAYERS LIKE AFFELDT OR PHELPS. .. OR ALRIGHT WHO'S PLAYING WITH THE ALIEN MIND-SWITCHING RAY?

by zenbitz on Nov 24, 2008 1:04 PM PST reply actions 0 recs