Which Arbitration-Eligible Players?
Sabean Straight Talk?
I'm not sure if I am the only Giants fan who felt this way, but I was absolutely astounded at the number of definitive statements Brian Sabean made in his end-of-season post-portem. I mean, c'mon: this is Mr. "Kick the Tires", "At the end of the day" Sabean we're talking about here. Anyways, I was astonished by the number of actual roster/line-up details he threw out there. Granted, we'll see how many were true, but still.
"We'll pursue trades for arbitration eligible players..."
As we all know by now (cough) one of those statements was that the Giants would likely pursue arbitration eligible position players in trades due to a myriad of issues with this year's free agent class. Relative to a player pool like, say, all of baseball, or all of baseball under 30 years old, or all of the minor leagues, arbitration elible players represent a fairly concise list. Especially considering needs that the Giants have, and/or the types of teams who are somehow "scared" by arbitration for their talented players. Basically, if we take Sabean at his word (insert punchline), all of us wannabe GMs have something to work with.
Now my apologies to the MANY of you who contribute a hell of alot more to this site than me, but I haven't really seen a post that tries look at this arbitration eligible player pool somewhat exhaustively. Also for those of you who have been down this logic path hundreds of times before. I'm sorry wasting your company's time. If there has been one, or a branch discussion in another post, sorry. I tried to look. I don't always get the inside stat jokes either but I sometimes try to laugh along like I do. "He used OPS+? What a weenie! Hahahaha. Hehe. Ha... What the hell?" Kinda pathetic. Here is my logic: The key for Sabean (we hope) is getting not only arbitration eligible players, but arbitation eligible players WITH TALENT. Hmmmm. What sorts of teams, when faced with paying a talented young player, would wave the white flag? Teams that for whatever reason upchuck at the thought of a payroll over 50mil. Looking at teampayrolls and thinking through team tendencies, here are the teams that might get green in the face when faced with a talented player ready to get paid (2008 payroll in paranthesees):
Florida (22m), Tampa (44m), Oakland (48m), Pittsburgh (49m), Washington (55m), Kansas City (58m), and Minnesota (62m).
The Goods
Here are the arbitration eligible players on those teams:
Florida: Dan Uggla (2b), Jorge Cantu (3b), Dallas McPherson (3b), Matt Treanor (C), Mike Jacobs (1b), Josh Willingham (LF), Jeremy Hermida (RF), Cody Ross (CF), Alfredo Amezaga (Inf). Pitchers: Kevin Gregg, Scott Olsen, Ricky Nolasco, Josh Johnson, Joe Nelson, Logan Kensing.
Tampa: Dioner Navarro (C), Jason Bartlett (SS), Jonny Gomes (OF), Gabe Gross (OF), Edwin Jackson (SP), Grant Balfour (RP).
Oakland: Justin Duchscherer (SP), Huston Street (RP), Kirk Saarloos (RP), Rob Bowen (C), Jack Cust (DH, OF).
Pittsburgh: Nate McClouth (OF), Ryan Doumit (C, OF), Adam LaRoche (1b). Pitchers: Paul Maholm, Zach Duke, Tyler Yates, Denny Bautista, John Grabow.
Washington: Ryan Zimmerman (3b), Ryan Langerhans (OF), Ryan Wagner (RP), Tim Redding (SP), Jesus Colome (RP), Chad Cordero (RP)
Kansas City: John Buck (C), Joey Gathright (OF), Esteban German (2b, OF), Jason Smith (3b, SS), John Bale (SP), Jimmy Gobble (RP), Luke Hudson (RP), Joel Peralta (RP), Kyle Davies (SP), Brandon Duckworth (SP), Zack Greinke (SP), Mark Teahen (OF, 3b), Brian Bannister (SP).
Minnesota: Jason Kubel (DH, OF), Matt Guerrier (RP)
Once again, if we take Sabean at his word it is likely that he's looking at 1 or more of those players. It's a lot of players, but it would be pretty easy to cross off at least half due to position or age. My question to you is which players is Sabean looking at and what will it take to get them?
I've seen some brutal posts and responses to the idea of Zimmerman on this site. We'd have to pay to get him, but I do not see him as some young untouchable Albert Pujols. How much? I don't know, but that franchise is a mess. I don't think it's Lincecum laughable to get him. Feel free to disagree, but give me some substance on the "laughable-ness" scale. Florida Marlins hitters are another group (particularly Uggla from a position fit standpoint) that are intriguing. Yeah, I know the homers may not transfer, but. For a couple random ones, how about Jonny Gomes? Jason Kubel? Basically just predict who Sabean is looking at. Remember: He said it.
This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.
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Ryan Zimmerman is kind of overrated to me. I wouldn’t say no to acquiring him, but I think he’ll cost more than he’s worth.
I’m slightly intrigued at a buy-low for Jonny Gomes.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on Oct 22, 2008 12:42 PM PDT 0 recs
You leave my white whale alone!
I like Zimmerman when he isn’t hurt. He plays excellent defense at 3B (+23 plays above average in ‘07!) and is a league average hitter (not adjusting for position) or slightly better. I think if he’s healthy, he’s very good. He’s one of those guys that’s not overly flashy but is more a sum of all his parts type of player. He won’t be traded for awhile.
I’d buy Gomes if he could platoon at 1B. He hits LHP well but he really doesn’t have a defensive position. Hasn’t his shoulders been messed up or something the past few years?
#1 JUDY STEFFES FAN
My favorite pie is (name of pie flavor)
Bay City Ball
by xanthan on
Oct 22, 2008 12:55 PM PDT
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Zimmerman's injury
Guess I was hoping his nicked up status for most of this season would maybe make him available (versus a McClouth who got alot of pub). Seems like Zimmerman has been expected to break out, but hasn’t quite put it altogether for a full season. Combine that lull with an injury and maybe he could be had…
by lucecooler on
Oct 22, 2008 1:07 PM PDT
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Disagree that he hasn’t broken out yet. His rookie season of: .287/.351/.471 20 HR’s, 114 OPS+ opened a lot of eyes to him. He was 2nd in RoY voting that year.
He actually reminds me of Adrian Beltre some, league average hitter for his position with outstanding defense.
#1 JUDY STEFFES FAN
My favorite pie is (name of pie flavor)
Bay City Ball
by xanthan on
Oct 22, 2008 1:10 PM PDT
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I'm just bitter
cuz I had him on my starting fantasy roster this year and was expecting him to take the next step… so I guess I should say he didn’t break out “for my meaningless fantasy team”. Still a 24 year old middle of the order hitter at a position of need. Sounds pricey, but I say make it happen short of Lincecum and probably Cain. Probably Sandoval too, but…
by lucecooler on
Oct 22, 2008 4:22 PM PDT
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I stole Jonny from you...
due to my royal Royals screw-up. Ryan Shealy out. Jonny Gomes in. Thx.
by lucecooler on
Oct 23, 2008 8:32 AM PDT
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Ryan Shealy used to be my white whale.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on
Oct 23, 2008 3:55 PM PDT
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I could see Jonny Gomes
But only if he changes the spelling of his name to Jhonny…
As for the rest of the grouping here’s my thoughts on players to go after and that would be available. For the record I have no idea what it might take to obtain them so if the price is high, I’m guessing Sabean would pass.
Florida: Dan Uggla (2b), Jorge Cantu (3b), Dallas McPherson (3b), Josh Willingham (LF), Cody Ross (CF) Pitchers: Kevin Gregg, Scott Olsen, Ricky Nolasco
Tampa: Jason Bartlett (SS), Jonny Gomes (OF), Edwin Jackson (SP), Grant Balfour (RP).
Oakland: Justin Duchscherer (SP), Huston Street (RP)
Pittsburgh: Nate McClouth (OF), Ryan Doumit (C, OF), Adam LaRoche (1b).
Washington: Ryan Zimmerman (3b), Tim Redding (SP)
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on Oct 22, 2008 12:57 PM PDT 0 recs
Pittsburgh
I heard somewhere (conveniently forgetting where) that Pittsburgh was hot to trot to sign McClouth/Doumit to long term deals, since they just traded Bay and Nady away. Of course, if that’s not true, I’d take some McClouth. Just not sure Pittsburgh would part with him (or it would take too much).
by lucecooler on
Oct 22, 2008 1:01 PM PDT
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a caveat to the McClouth idea
I had him on my fantasy team this year (coincidentally I had Aaron Rowand his last year with Philly) and while he started really hot, he really stunk up the joint had a poor showing in the 2nd half of the season (Just like Rowand). I wouldn’t give up a ton to get him…
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on
Oct 22, 2008 1:06 PM PDT
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also why I don't like NotSoNasty Nate
Although I turned McLouth into Evan Longoria, and turned Longoria plus change into A-Rod, so my fantasy story ends nicer…
I support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.
by Takimoto on
Oct 22, 2008 1:25 PM PDT
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I dumped NotSoNastyNate
And obtained Longoria as well….it’s to bad that half my league gave up and I ended up 4th because of it
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on
Oct 22, 2008 2:14 PM PDT
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The Rays wouldn’t get rid of Bartlett. He’s INDISPENSIBLE!!!!!
by Natto on
Oct 22, 2008 1:16 PM PDT
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Uggla, Willingham, Gomes, Balfour, The Duke, Doumit
I support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.
by Takimoto on Oct 22, 2008 12:59 PM PDT 0 recs
Why Willingham?
versus his compadre in the outfield, Hermida? I honestly don’t know much about either.
by lucecooler on
Oct 22, 2008 1:05 PM PDT
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I know Willingham (like Cody Ross oddly enough)
Has a ton of pop (or maybe a ton of pop in small east coast ballparks), and might be worth looking at for the right price.
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on
Oct 22, 2008 1:07 PM PDT
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“Who are six guys who have never been in my kitchen?”
Insert witty signature of your own choosing here.
by Flapjacks McGurty on
Oct 22, 2008 3:36 PM PDT
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+1 more
That, and the “Sam the sportcaster” were my two favroite episodes
Zooperstars, they quack me up!
by Goofus on
Oct 23, 2008 4:27 PM PDT
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On a side note
would moving the infield diamond and mound about 5-6ft closer to the fences, dramatically alter things at 3rd & King in HR terms? Would this be a better fanpost than a in thread question?
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on Oct 22, 2008 1:08 PM PDT 0 recs
Basically instead of moving the fences in and having to reconfigure seating, walls, architecture, etc.
They could move the diamond (1B, 2B, 3B, Home), infield, mound, coaching boxes, etc. a couple yards towards center field. In my mind this would shrink the size of the outfield (cutting down on hits), but bring the hitter closer to the fences (increase HRs?). In addition the foul ground would be a bit larger so maybe lower averages a bit more by increasing the # of catchable foul pop ups.
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on
Oct 22, 2008 1:16 PM PDT
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hitters that don't suck will fix everything.
Fairley odd parent to Wendell
by WTF on
Oct 22, 2008 1:24 PM PDT
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True...
But do you see hitters that don’t suck being traded for and/or signed as FA’s?
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on
Oct 22, 2008 2:15 PM PDT
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good point
it’s almost as though the world series isn’t over or something
Brian Sabean figures that if he buys enough bottles, one of them is bound to have lightning in it.
by jasomack on
Oct 24, 2008 9:52 AM PDT
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We could rotate the whole park
So bay breezes blow out instead of in. That wouldn’t be that hard to do right?
I support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.
by Takimoto on
Oct 22, 2008 1:27 PM PDT
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No need to be like that...
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on
Oct 22, 2008 2:15 PM PDT
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sorry I just hate blaming the park for not having the personnel necessary to field a team with power.
I support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.
by Takimoto on
Oct 22, 2008 9:04 PM PDT
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the park is fine the way it is.
Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.
PABLO SANDOVAL AM STEAL DEATH, DESTROYER OF WORLDS.
by jponry on
Oct 22, 2008 1:17 PM PDT
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ME2
#1 JUDY STEFFES FAN
My favorite pie is (name of pie flavor)
Bay City Ball
by xanthan on
Oct 22, 2008 1:21 PM PDT
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the park is fine the way it is
I would put the bar back in the Field Club, but otherwise…
They say some players get out of bed hitting; Pablo Sandoval doesn't wait that long
by bgunn on
Oct 22, 2008 1:42 PM PDT
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There is a bar in the field club, the club level too.
by Cainer on
Oct 23, 2008 2:55 AM PDT
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There is a counter in the Field Club. The bar was removed
in the redesign a couple of seasons ago.
They say some players get out of bed hitting; Pablo Sandoval doesn't wait that long
by bgunn on
Oct 23, 2008 10:25 AM PDT
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Will the Rays stay cheap?
I wonder how much their trip to the WS is going to affect the Rays’ attitude towards their arb-eligible players. You’d think they might learn from the Marlins’ example that dismantling your roster right after an exciting playoff run is not a great way to build the fanbase.
Scott McClain: Great story, no place on the 2009 Giants.
by EliminateMe on Oct 22, 2008 2:11 PM PDT 0 recs
The Rays should pick up a good chunk of change from extra ticket and concession sales
Plus I bet they are nailing people for season tix already….Add in the baseball welfare $ they should get when the Yankees, Mets, Red Sox, etc. go on spending sprees this off season and they should have some coinage available…whether they spend it or not is a completely different question.
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on
Oct 22, 2008 2:17 PM PDT
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Also
I wonder if the Rays will be able to use this WS trip to secure rights to getting a new stadium since the Trop is outdated. Although funny enough, the Trop also provides the team with a unique home-field advantage.
by Hobbes2d on
Oct 22, 2008 3:00 PM PDT
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Is the entire Royal team arbitration eligible?
I know Meche, Mahay and Guillen can’t be
The bases were drunk, and I painted the black with my best yakker. But blue squeezed me, and I went full. I came back with my heater, but the stick flares one the other way and the chalk flies for two bases. Three earnies! Next thing I know, skipper hooks me and I'm sipping suds with the clubby.
by Mike Hawk on Oct 22, 2008 3:28 PM PDT 0 recs
yeah
i was thinkin the same way when i saw meche on there
Brad Hennessey: the next Kevin Correia
Kevin Correia: the next Brad Hennessey
by stealth snail on
Oct 22, 2008 3:30 PM PDT
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let me check
You’d think a list like this would be floating around out on the www, but from my google searches I had to basically piece these together from different fan sites. I’ll double check that Royals link. It seemed odd to me, specifically the guys you mentioned. I will say, just to prevent a run on the bank, that I’m very confident in the other franchises I have listed…
by lucecooler on
Oct 22, 2008 3:51 PM PDT
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yeah.... I was wrong
the correct list. I’ll update it. Noteworthy change is Mark Teahen. Doh!
by lucecooler on
Oct 22, 2008 3:59 PM PDT
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I'll take any of those Flo pitchers
esp. Ricky Nolasco.. Post All Star: 98:12 K:BB ratio… WOW
proud father of the newly acquired Brandon Crawford..
by Azmanz on Oct 22, 2008 3:29 PM PDT 0 recs
Nolasco & Matt Garza
Were 2 big reasons why I had the best pitching staff in my league..Also Ubaldo Jimenez for the Rockies was up and down but has AWESOME stuff. Any thoughts on the rumors about Garrett Atkins being made available for trades? Also any thoughts on the Tigers/Red & White Sox/Yankees/Mets/Cubs/NorthWestern Angels of Aztlan blowing themselves up after losing out to the Phils & Rays in a spot in the World Series? I’m inclined to think it’s going to be a seller’s market if you have anything of value (I’m looking at you Benji Molina) to a contender…
Down in Front Meat!
by homerdrew415 on
Oct 22, 2008 3:59 PM PDT
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No thanks for Atkins.
proud father of the newly acquired Brandon Crawford..
by Azmanz on
Oct 22, 2008 7:45 PM PDT
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We'd have to pay for his 870 ops
when we’d likely get his road 790 ops
proud father of the newly acquired Brandon Crawford..
by Azmanz on
Oct 22, 2008 7:46 PM PDT
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Major Fail
…on the Royals listed above. Removed around 6 from the list and added Teahen and Greinke plus a couple more. Stupid unrealiable fan sites. Wait… I mean… Stupid Royals unreliable fan sites.
by lucecooler on Oct 22, 2008 4:07 PM PDT 0 recs
The Royals have fans?
The bases were drunk, and I painted the black with my best yakker. But blue squeezed me, and I went full. I came back with my heater, but the stick flares one the other way and the chalk flies for two bases. Three earnies! Next thing I know, skipper hooks me and I'm sipping suds with the clubby.
by Mike Hawk on
Oct 22, 2008 4:46 PM PDT
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Green
I support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.
by Takimoto on
Oct 22, 2008 9:04 PM PDT
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Egg
I support Roger Kieschnick in his quest to becoming the best Kieschnick ever to play professional baseball.
by Takimoto on
Oct 23, 2008 1:39 AM PDT
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White
Why isn't Sabean held accountable for leading the Giants into many years of mediocrity???
by oldrips on
Oct 23, 2008 8:35 AM PDT
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Ghostbusters
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com. It's not being updated right now. Hope for more at your own risk.
by groug on
Oct 23, 2008 4:31 PM PDT
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PoseyBusters
They say some players get out of bed hitting; Pablo Sandoval doesn't wait that long
by bgunn on
Oct 23, 2008 4:43 PM PDT
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Syphilis
The bases were drunk, and I painted the black with my best yakker. But blue squeezed me, and I went full. I came back with my heater, but the stick flares one the other way and the chalk flies for two bases. Three earnies! Next thing I know, skipper hooks me and I'm sipping suds with the clubby.
by Mike Hawk on
Oct 23, 2008 4:50 PM PDT
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machine
Trent Kline: Decentish. Also, my website is called ChatterBalks Dot Com. It's not being updated right now. Hope for more at your own risk.
by groug on
Oct 23, 2008 10:00 PM PDT
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