Giants' Salary Totals for '08

by allfrank on Jan 26, 2008 9:01 AM PST Comment 27 comments

I discovered this by accident while reading Lefty Malo's site. Using his contract numbers (which he posts at the far right on his page), and adding .5 mil for the rookies who have yet to make the team, I calculate that the Gmen will spend $77.5 mil (and I admit, every time I add it up I come up with a different number). Thus, they are roughly $25 mil below their budget. This can only be good. It gives them flexibility to: a) eat Durhams salary, b) spend more on the draft (ie, draft Boras' clients), spend more in Latin Am and Asia.

PITCHERS
Cain (.7 M)
Lincecum
Zito (14.5 M)
Lowry (2.25 M)
Correia
Total: 17.45 + $1.5 mil for Lincecum & Correia

Walker (.75 M)
Wilson
Hennessey (1.6 M)
Kline (1.75 M)
Chulk
Misch
Capellan
Messenger
Total: 4.1 + $2.5 mil (.5 mil for each remaining roster spot)
Total: $25.5 mil

Taschner
Matos
Pichardo
Sadler
Sanchez
Threets
Valdez

CATCHERS
B. Molina (6 M)
El. Alfonzo
G. Rodriguez
Total: 6 + .5

INFIELDERS
Aurilia (4.5 M)
Durham (7.5 M)
Vizquel (5 M)
Ortmeier
Frandsen
Total: 17 + .5 + .5

Ishikawa
Velez
Denker

OUTFIELDERS
Roberts (6.5 M)
Rowand (12 M)
Winn (8 M)
Lewis
Davis

Schierholtz
Timpner

Total: 26.5 + 1

OTHER Bonds ($5 M deferred from '03 + interest)
Matheny ($2 M club buyout)

This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.

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Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

Thought the 2008 SF budget was about $90-95M, so that would be approximately $15M under budget prior to spring training. Spend wisely fellas.

by wilriv21 on Jan 26, 2008 9:13 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

I believe the Giants should put a decent percentage of their saved money into picking up a draft choice or two who has falled due to high salary desires. They should also put some into beefing up their players development. And they might want to put some away for a rainy day, since the forecast for the players under their control is for lots of rain through at least the end of the decade.

by sharksrog on Jan 26, 2008 3:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

I believe there are deferrals to include as well.

"When Jackson Williams thinks of how many times Madison Bumgarner has tried to kill Tyler Walker..."

by multiphasic on Jan 26, 2008 9:15 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

2008 deferred payments

Yeah, and the 2008 deferrals are huge - over $17 million:
Bonds $10.8m ($5.8m from his last contract, and $5m a year through 2011 from his previous one)
Matheny $2m
Alou $2m
Benitez $1.6m (next year too)
Vizquel $1m

by FavoriteSpring on Jan 26, 2008 11:49 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yes..

But there's always the tried and true "deferrals come out of a different account" thing people say.

Coming to you from the Land of Many Beers

by WalrusMan on Jan 26, 2008 1:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

HAHA, I just posted almost the exact same thing on the "10 things" diary.

by Cainer on Jan 26, 2008 10:43 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

Zito makes more than 14 mil this year, though. I think he's getting between 16-17. But I think that cancels out by the fact that some of the players on the roster, like Ishikawa and Denker, get more like $50 K because they're on minor league contracts, at least I think so anyway.

by boonitez on Jan 26, 2008 10:52 AM PST reply actions 0 recs

Zito's remaining contract

08:$14.5M, 09:$18.5M, 10:$18.5M, 11:$18.5M, 12:$19M, 13:$20M, 14:$18M club option ($7M buyout)

by Cainer on Jan 26, 2008 10:55 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yea, I remember that...

A great 2 year contract. Then an ugly 4-5 year contract.

Coming to you from the Land of Many Beers

by WalrusMan on Jan 26, 2008 11:29 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Zito's remaining contract

I stand corrected. But still, the numbers are still a little off because of all the money we owe Bonds, Worrell, Benitez, and other people.

by boonitez on Jan 26, 2008 4:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Zito's remaining contract

Only partially true. See below. If the Giants want they only have to fund $5M (Barry's 2006 Salary deferral) of deferred dollars in 2008. They will have to fund another $9.3M (Barry's 2007 Salary and Earned Bonuses dererrals) in 2009 but could choose to fund this early in 2008 but they do not have to. The Giants have already funded all deferrals for all other players not named Barry Bonds!

by giantsrainman on Jan 26, 2008 5:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

He's not counting Ishikawa as making 500k..

He's just putting him on there because he's on the 40 man I think. If he makes the roster, then he'll make about the 500k (or 300k something for the major league minimum.

Coming to you from the Land of Many Beers

by WalrusMan on Jan 26, 2008 11:28 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

According to the MLB Labor Contract

http://mlbplayers.mlb.com/pa/pdf/cba_english.pdf

ARTICLE XVI--Deferred Compensation

There shall be no limitations on either the amount of deferred compensation or the percentage of total compensation attributable to deferred compensation for which a Uniform Player's Contract may provide. Deferred compensation obligations incurred in a Contract executed after December 31, 1985 but before September 30, 2002 must be fully funded by the Club, in an amount equal to the present value of the total deferred compensation obligation, on or before the third January 1 following the championship season in which the deferred compensation is earned. Deferred compensation obligations incurred in a Contract executed on or after September 30, 2002 must be fully funded by the Club, in an amount equal to the present value of the total deferred compensation obligation, on or before the second July 1 following the championship season in which the deferred compensation is earned. For purposes of this Article XVI, full funding of the present value of deferred compensation obligations shall mean that the Club must have funded in each year the current present value of the then outstanding deferred payments, discounted by the Article XV(K) uniform annual interest rate applicable to the current year. Notwithstanding the above funding requirement, each Club shall be entitled to an annual deductible amount of deferred compensation which need not be funded. Such deductible amount shall be applied to the aggregate of Uniform Player's Contracts executed during a given Basic Agreement period and shall be in an amount equal to the lesser of $2,000,000 or the present value of the total deferred compensation obligations owed by a Club pursuant to Uniform Player's Contracts executed during a given Basic Agreement period. The deductible amount applicable to Uniform Player's Contracts signed during a given Basic Agreement period is applied against the Club's current aggregate deferred compensation funding obligations from Uniform Player's Contracts signed during that Basic Agreement period and not any particular Uniform Player's Contract(s). Unless the Uniform Player's Contract provides otherwise, a Club may fund deferred compensation obligations in such manner as it elects; provided that in all events the funding method used by the Club must be such that the amount(s) funded are exclusively for the uses and purposes of satisfying the deferred compensation obligation(s) being funded; provided further that such amount(s) funded are subject to the claims of the Club's general creditors; and provided further that each Club shall certify to the Office of the Commissioner by July 31 of each year (and the Office of the Commissioner shall provide such ertifications to the Association by September 1 of such year) the manner in which its deferred compensation obligations that were required to be funded by July 1 of that year have been funded. In addition, by each July 31, each Club shall provide to the Office of the Commissioner all records relating to its deferred compensation funding arrangements, and the Office of the Commissioner shall supply any such records to the Association upon request.

The operative sentence to the Giants defered contracts is as follows:

Deferred compensation obligations incurred in a Contract executed on or after September 30, 2002 must be fully funded by the Club, in an amount equal to the present value of the total deferred compensation obligation, on or before the second July 1 following the championship season in which the deferred compensation is earned.

What I think this means with regards to the Giants "Deferred Compensation" is the following:

Barry Bonds' 2006 $5M Deferred Salary must be funded by July 1st 2008. (Barry's 2002-2005 $5M each Deferred Salaries were funded in 2004-2007 respectively. Per Barry's 2002-2006 Contract his 2002 deferred salary was paid in 2007 with 2003-2006 Deferred salaries scheduled to be paid in 2008-2011.)

Barry Bonds' 2007 $5.8M deferred salary must be funded by July 1st 2009 and per his 2007 Contract will be paid in 2012.

Per Barry Bonds' 2007 Contract his $3.5M in deferred earned bonuses are to be both funded and paid in 2009.

Per Moises Alou's 2005-2006 Contract all deferred compensation was both funded and paid by the end of 2007.

Per Armando Benitez's 2005-2007 Contract it was his $7.4M signing bonus that was deferred not his yearly salaries. Therefore it all had to be funded by July 1st 2007 sense signing bonuses are earned at signing and not yearly as salaries are. Yes, $1.6M each is still to be paid in 2008 and 2009 but they have already been funded.

Per Mike Matheny's 2005-2007 Contract it was his $3M signing bonus that was deferred not his yearly salaries. Therefore, like in Benitez's case, it all had to be funded by July 1st 2007. In Mike's case it all had to be paid by 2007 as well.

Bottom line, only some of Barry Bonds' Deferred Compensation is yet to be Funded. Barry's $5M Deferred Salary from 2006 must be funded in 2008, and his $5.8M 2007 Deferred Salary and $3.5M Deferred Earned Bonuses must be funded in 2009. I am guessing that the Giants are choosing to fund all $14.3M of this in 2008 so that they are free of these obligations in 2009 when they will make a serious run at competing again.

by giantsrainman on Jan 26, 2008 3:03 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Left Out Omar Vizquel's Deferred Compensation

Per Omar Vizquel's 2005-2007 Contract it was his $1.75M signing bonus that was deferred not his yearly salaries. Therefore (like Benitez and Matheny) it all had to be funded by July 1st 2007 sense signing bonuses are earned at signing and not yearly as salaries are. Yes $1M and 0.75M respectively are still to be paid in 2008 and 2009 but they have already been funded.

by giantsrainman on Jan 26, 2008 3:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

minor notes

Correia will make $400k in 2008 and Alfonso will make $382,000.

MLB minimum is $380,000.

Bonds stands alone.

by nostocksjustbonds on Jan 26, 2008 5:26 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Re: minor notes

I thought Correia was arb-eligible this year?

Matt Cain: He'll save children, but not the Dodger children.

by jponry on Jan 26, 2008 5:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: minor notes

You are actually quoting 2007 numbers. Correia is eligable for arbitration in 2008 and the Giants have offered $850K while Correia has asked for $1.3M They will either negoiate a figure in the middle of the arbitrator will pick one of the two. Alfonzo or Rodriguez (whichever wins the backup catcher job) will again make just above the MLB min in 2008 but the min increases in 2008 from the $380K of 2007 to $400K in 2008.

by giantsrainman on Jan 26, 2008 5:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Let's Take A Look at 2009

I am going to start with four assumptions.

$100M 40 Man Roster Budget
Giants re-sign Pedro Feliz for 2 years at $6M each.
Omar Vizquel's 2009 $5.2M Option Vests.
The Giants decide to fully fund the remaining $14.3M of the not yet funded deferred compensation owed to Barry Bonds in 2008 so none needs to be funded in 2009.

With these assumptions we have the following 9 committed contracts for 2009 totaling $69.6M:

Barry Zito at $18.5M
Aaron Rowand at $12M
Randy Winn at $8.25M
Dave Roberts at $6.5M
Bengie Molina at $6M
Pedro Feliz at $6M
Omar Vizquel at $5.2M
Noah Lowry at $4.5M
Matt Cain at $2.65M

In addition we will likely have 6 Arbitration Eligable Pitchers likely to total $7.4M.

Brad Hennessey
Kevin Correia
Vinnie Chulk
Tyler Walker
Randy Messenger
Jack Taschner

This leaves 10 PreArbitration Players that will likely total about $4M and 15 Non 25 Man Roster Players that will likely total about $1M.

The above spends $82M of my assumed $100M 40 Man Roster Budget.

This leaves $18M to chase after that much needed True CleanUp Hitter. Could not this $18M be the first year of a long term contract for the likes of Mark Teixeira? Could the following team in 2009 be a serious competitor in the NL West?

LineUp:
Roberts/Davis LF
Frandsen/Velez 2B
Winn RF
Teixeira 1B
Rowand CF
Molina C
Feliz 3B
Vizquel SS

Bench:
Alfonzo/Rodriguez C
Ortmeier/Schierholtz 1B/OF
Velez/Frandsen IF
Davis/Roberts OF
Lewis/Bowker OF

Rotation: Cain/Zito/Lincecum/Lowry/Correia

BullPen: Wilson/Hennessey/Chulk/Walker/Messenger/Taschner/Sanchez

Would not Teixeira and Rowand make a nice offensive foundation for 2010 and beyond? Would this plan not provide plenty of time to develope useful cheap starters to replace Molina, Feliz, Vizquel, Roberts, and Winn with in 2010? Heck, we might even have the replacement outfielders and catcher on the roster now.

by giantsrainman on Jan 26, 2008 8:43 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Re: Let's Take A Look at 2009

I don't think that team would be likely to be competitive. The pitching could be good, but the hitting would still be deficient IMO.

by sharksrog on Jan 26, 2008 10:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Let's Take A Look at 2009

Kinda depends on weither or not a couple of Schierholtz, Ortmeier, Davis, Lewis, Bowker become good enough to displace Roberts and Winn as starters. If a couple do we could have a pretty damm good offense. If they don't I think the pitching would still be good enough to compete we the offense that remains.

by giantsrainman on Jan 26, 2008 11:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Let's Take A Look at 2009

Schierholtz has shown he can hit for average, but he has yet to show he can walk or hit for power in the major leagues. I like him the best of these guys, but I don't see his becoming much more than average as a corner outfielder.

Ortmeier is completely overmatched at the plate as a first baseman. He would have to hit FAR better in the majors than the minors to be an above-average hitter for a first baseman. The only hope I hold out at all for Dan is that he changed his swing from the left side (the weak side of his switch hitting) and actually hit better from the left than right after being called up.

Davis is a very good fielder who is unlikely to hit enough to be even an adequate center fielder. Given that the Giants just added Aaron Rowand as their new center fielder, Davis becomes a likely fifth outfielder type.

Lewis knows how to take a walk and does show potential. But he's getting old to be a prospect already, he has poor baseball instincts and he strikes out too often to ever hit for average.

Bowker put up a very good season in AA last year, reshining his prospect star. This season at Fresno will be a very important one for him, although I wouldn't expect him to be a lot of help at the major league level until 2009 at the earliest. Bowker probably does have the highest ceiling of this quintet. Whether he will come close to reaching it is still a big question.

The Giants are going to be lousy in 2008 -- and likely in 2009 and quite possibly 2010, as well. I wish it weren't so.

Really, the only reason to go to a Giants game this year is to watch Tim Lincecum pitch. Possibly Matt Cain if you like good pitching in a less flashy package.

I think most of the important action will take place in the low minors for the Giants in 2008.

by sharksrog on Jan 27, 2008 6:35 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

Sorry to be nitpicky, but if you cut n paste a big thing from my site, at least give folks a link.

Also re. deferred salaries:

the Giants don't owe Moises Alou anything this year. See his contract detes here.
It's unclear when Bonds's '07 deferred money must be paid. When I know I'll add that.
Matheny's $$ isn't a deferral, it's a buyout of his '08 year.

"There's not enough bases out there to intentionally walk everybody you want to." - Grady Little

by leftymalo on Jan 26, 2008 9:46 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

Lefty,

You were not my source. Cots was. You are right about Matheny's buyout but I assumed that it had already been paid or at least funded by insurance.
True, Cots is unclear about when Barry's 07 Deferred Salary of $5.8M is due but it is clear about when his $3.5M Deferred Bonuses is due. I did indeed assume 2012 as just a ligical progression of the 2002-2006 deferrals being due in 2007 thru 2011. But, even if I am wrong, I was still planing on funding it in 2008 regardless of when it is due. Finally, I never stated anything different on Alou.

by giantsrainman on Jan 26, 2008 10:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

He meant for the main post.

Nate Schierholtz cannot play third base. Nate Schierholtz cannot play third base. Steve Kline is pretty okay. Nate Schierholtz cannot play third base.

by groug on Jan 26, 2008 10:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

Oh, sorry then Lefty, my mistake.

by giantsrainman on Jan 26, 2008 11:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Re: Giants' Salary Totals for '08

No, this is my screw up, for which I apologize. I gave Lefty credit in the text, but I didn't provide a link - mostly because I am a moron, which, I am sure, reflects on the rest of the post.
But I apologize to Lefty. His is one of 4 or 5 blogs I read daily and immediately after I read McCronicles. I apologize to you, too, Rainman. Like me, you don't need help getting into trouble. But I do appreciate your additions to this diary.
When you couple the infusion of talent into our lower minors with this surplus in the budget and corresponding flexibility it gives, I do think there is some reason to be cautiously optimistic - in addition to, or in spite of, the lack of action this Winter. Is it Feb 13, yet?

by allfrank on Jan 27, 2008 11:17 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs