A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

by m34josh on Jan 12, 2008 5:25 PM PST

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3193556

Anyone else think the Giants should've "kicked the tires" to see if we could work out a deal for one of our six center fielders? Kotsay is awful and usually hurt, and they got a young kid with a bright future in the A's bullpen in return.

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Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

Oops, too many 'for's in there

by m34josh on Jan 12, 2008 5:27 PM PST reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

Yeah, I would of very much liked to have traded Roberts but Sabean seems to overvalue Dave and does not seem to be even considering trading him.
I think though that the Braves were not in the position to take on a contract and I would agree with Sabean that he should not have to send dollars with Roberts to move him.

by giantsrainman on Jan 12, 2008 5:34 PM PST reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

I think everybody knows that Roberts can't hack it in center by now. His value as a corner outfielder given his contract is, I think, nothing. Get used to him being here for a while.

there is no pain greater than being behind the Rockies in the standings

by oldjacket on Jan 12, 2008 7:59 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

some big market team would love him as a 4th of/fill in leadoff hitter/pinch runner. just like he was with the bosox. i think we'll be able to move him midseason if not before, particularly if he starts well. thats the only reason why im not totally opposed to him starting over nate or lewis to begin the season.

by sam23 on Jan 12, 2008 11:29 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

yeah i think sabes is thinking his outfielders are worth more than they actually are. He dreams of trading roberts for a good prospect which will never happen. Its too late into the offseason for major trades so I say keep the pieces we have and see if there is any interest during spring training (if a team gets desperate if a player gets hurt on their team) then wait till the deadline where maybe people like durham, roberts, aurilla have bounceback years and are traded to contenders for prospects.

Zito 2008=20 wins Mark My Words 12/18/07

by ACgiant87 on Jan 12, 2008 5:36 PM PST reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

I wish I still had faith that durham, roberts, and aurilla were capable of having comeback years. Now I would settle for just finding someone to pay them next year

by m34josh on Jan 12, 2008 9:50 PM PST up reply actions

Bullpen, you say?

You'd think Sabean would have been ALL OVER quality bullpen arms. What, since we missed the playoffs last year and all because our relievers lost so many games.

But then again... could he afford to give up a center fielder? If he traded one we would have only had half a jillion, and Brian don't like them odds.

He is Vengeance. He is the Knight. He is Dave Righetti. PRAY TO HIM! / Also, my blog. For writers.

by howtheyscored on Jan 12, 2008 5:38 PM PST reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

The Braves needed a centerfielder, and the A's are covering a lot of the money. Roberts is terrible in center, the Braves know this, but he's definitely solid in left. Winn might have worked, but I don't know if the Braves would have been willing to pay more salary and players. It doesn't seem like Sabes is trying to deal ANYONE this offseason.

Southern California: Water thieves and Dodgers fans.

by jasomack on Jan 12, 2008 7:31 PM PST reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

I've been disappointed in Sabean's lack of action this offseason, but if other teams are trying to steal our young pitching in exchange for hitters who are not any better than the garbage free agents that are still out there, then I'm with Sabean. If the only way we can get a quality hitter is to sacrifice a Lincecum or Cain, then let's keep our shitty offense intact. It would really bother me to see Lowry pitching well or Sanchez realizing his potential for other teams and all we have to show for it is some .220 hitter because Sabean made a desperate deal.

Hillary: Will cry for votes

by rxmeister on Jan 12, 2008 7:37 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

I agree.....I think our staff needs to be left intact...Cain+Zito+Lincecum=over 50 wins, Lowry should add as many as 15 more wins....all we need is a 1st and 3rd baseman that gets over 15 homeruns a peice, and then we might make the playoffs

Patrick Willis probably could hit more home runs than the 2008 San Francisco Giants....thanks a lot Sabes

by Giantsdan on Jan 12, 2008 9:53 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

How do you figure? Cain+Zito+Lincecum won 25 games last year with a better offense. I want them to win as much as the next, but there is no fricken way Cain+Zito+Lincecum+lowry win 65 games

by m34josh on Jan 12, 2008 10:48 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

I have to believe that Cain's luck regresses (progresses) to the mean, and Lincecum's win total goes up just from pitching a full season. Call Zito a wash, and that's probably 10-15 more Ws for those guys just from win totals alone (a shabby qualifier, but what the hey!). Since 15 is veeeery optimistic, I'll go to 10. So now we're at, oh, about 35 just there. Add in wins the team gets when these guys get no decisions, that could be 5 a piece realistically, so 15 more does = 50. When we subtract the 100 wins the offense will lose us over last year, though, we end up with -50. I guess that's not so good...

It's really a shoddy methodology for a lot of reasons, but I can see where you COULD have that kind of optimism.

He is Vengeance. He is the Knight. He is Dave Righetti. PRAY TO HIM! / Also, my blog. For writers.

by howtheyscored on Jan 13, 2008 1:30 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

The really crazy thing, I think, is expecting 15 wins from Lowry starts. To get to that you have to assume 1) his luck (esp. run support) doesn't regress dramatically, 2) his control returns to pre-2007 levels, and 3) he avoids injury.

And that's a heck of a lot to assume.

He is Vengeance. He is the Knight. He is Dave Righetti. PRAY TO HIM! / Also, my blog. For writers.

by howtheyscored on Jan 13, 2008 1:33 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

wow. thats the most optomistic take ive seen or heard yet. good for you.

by sam23 on Jan 12, 2008 11:32 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

Ortmeier and Feliz could get 15 home runs a piece. Or even if Ort hits 10+ and Feliz hits 20, you've got 30 homers, and the worst offense in the majors.

As far as all those wins... you need to score more runs than the other team in all those games. With a top 10 offense, Cain and Lince could be counted on for 15 a piece... but this is the Giants we're talking about.

Southern California: Water thieves and Dodgers fans.

by jasomack on Jan 13, 2008 8:03 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

Is there any other team that still needs a CF?

Randy Winn is pretty good in center, and we might actually get something for him.

there is no pain greater than being behind the Rockies in the standings

by oldjacket on Jan 12, 2008 8:01 PM PST reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

the yankees if they pull off the johan deal but that doesnt look likely. the twins but they will almost surely land one in the johan deal. thats pretty much all i got off the top of my head, but seems like anyone else would probably rather deal for coco crisp than winn. id hang on to winn because i dont think the demand for him is real high right now and he's the closest thing we've got to a #3 hitter.

by sam23 on Jan 12, 2008 11:35 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

we have too many outfielders though. Fred Lewis and Nate both belong in the major leagues at this point and one of them is going to have to go back to Fresno. If Nate or Fred were smart they would ask the Giants if they could give first base a shot this spring, and they should ask him right now before they sign or trade for somebody. If the Giants were smart they would have asked one of them already, but we already know they're not very bright. Dan Ortmeier is an inferior player to both Nate and Fred, yet he has the inside track over them on the Opening Day roster because he already made this switch.

Hillary: Will cry for votes

by rxmeister on Jan 13, 2008 5:40 AM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

i agree id like to see nate there, but if you cant get ANY value for roberts or winn and cant move nate to 1st, i dont think it would kill him to get every day playing time in fresno for a couple months. hopefully one of the vets will improve their trade value with a hot start and/or some contender loses an OF to injury. its not perfect but nothing will be this year.

by sam23 on Jan 13, 2008 9:56 AM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

We shouldn't be trading anyone for pitching unless it's a straight salary dump.

by NearestNorwich on Jan 13, 2008 10:21 AM PST reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

Even when you are getting rid of one of our six center fielders and gaining a kid in his low 20s that has closer potentional?

by m34josh on Jan 13, 2008 11:49 AM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

I'd rather trade for a position player with potential, even if he's more of a longshot. We've shown we can develop pitching.

by NearestNorwich on Jan 13, 2008 2:10 PM PST up reply actions

Relievers

But have we really shown we can develop relievers? I count Brian Wilson and Brad Hennessey. At best, the jury is still out on Taschner. Sadler and Munter have had problems.

I'm thinking we haven't done all that well in developing relievers. But I do see hope in the minors. So yeah, I'd trade an excess outfielder for someone like Joey Devine.

The SF Giants: we're not much, but you should check out our team in Augusta!

by Lyle @ McCovey Chronicles on Jan 14, 2008 6:03 AM PST up reply actions

Accardo

and . . .Joe Nathan . . .=(

But I agree, and I've always liked Devine's delivery and stuff. He's fun to watch.

Brian Anderson: I can has spot in Fresno 'pen?

by JT Jordan on Jan 14, 2008 9:48 AM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

I wouldn't mind dealing any of our position players, if it means losing some salary and giving more AB's to the kids. Wait, we get a pitcher out of it too?

Southern California: Water thieves and Dodgers fans.

by jasomack on Jan 13, 2008 8:06 PM PST up reply actions

Re: A's trade for Kotsay for Joey Devine

The problem is, the Braves wanted a short term, experienced CF, who doesn't cost much for a year before their young players are ready.

Roberts doesn't play a good CF, is also questionable on the injury front, is under contract for 2 years & costs too much compared to Kotsay. We would have to have eaten at least $8M over the 2 years to make the price the same & even then, the defense issue would lead them to prefer Kotsay.

Winn is the better option, but again is under contract for 2 years at a lot of money. If we'd have eaten his contract like the A's did, then the Braves would have prefered him, but i couldn't imagine us eating $6M a year of his contract.

by GiantFan on Jan 14, 2008 5:51 AM PST reply actions