State of the Giants (Outfield)
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 8:34 AM PDT
71 comments
Continuing from my other diary, here's the OF:
Left Field
Barry Bonds
07: $15.8m plus bonuses (probably will end up with $19.3m)
2007 Line: .280/.497/.590
Since ASB: .234/.451/.594
Remember when it was unclear whether Bonds had enough in the tank to come back, play a full season, and break the record? Well he did, he does, and when he is in the lineup, he is the best hitter in baseball. Still. At age 43. Now Barry isn't the most valuable hitter in baseball, as he needs a fair bit of time off, but by rate, he is still the best, whether by OPS, OPS+, Runs Created - pick one. Is he worth $19.3m? Well, probably by the end of the season, but his pecuniary value to the Giants is so much greater. Say what you will about the circus, about needing to get younger, etc, but Bonds should be back next year. There is no impact bat this side of Alex Rodriguez with which the team could replace Bonds. He is a force, and there aren't enough FA bats to make up for it. Even if the team were to get equivalent production out of multiple players, it would cost more than Bonds! The fan in me wants Barry back, but the analyst in me confirms that it is a good idea.
Center Field
Dave Roberts
07:$5M, 08:$6.5M, 09:$6.5M
2007 Line: .266/.333/.364
Since ASB: .344/.406/.417
Speed ages well, but was Dave Roberts so integral to the success of this ballclub that he was worth signing through 2009? Granted, Roberts has been injured this year, hurting his performance, but then again, old players get injured. Also, Roberts's entire game is speed, so one bad hammy and he's done. Dave's strong second half is inching him back to his career line, and I wouldn't be surprised to see him above his career numbers before the season is done. Unfortunately, he is exactly the kind of player this team doesn't need. His defense is about average, he is blocking young players, and at the very least he keeps Winn's better defense and CF bat stuck in RF. Dave's contract is fine IF he is a starter, but he is overpaid as a backup. He has to go. Or Winn has to go. Or both have to go.
Rajai Davis
Minimum Salary
2007 Line: .271/.357/.354
Since ASB: .429/.524/.600
With SFG.: .440/.548/.640 (!!11!!1!11!! ok in 31 PA)
Rajai's best attribute is his speed. Actually, for the Giants, his best attribute is that he hits righthanded and can play CF. In his age 26 season, Davis will turn 27 in October, and his career minor-league line is .305/.375/.407. He can take a walk, he can hit for a little average, and he can FLY. What he doesn't have is power. The reviews on his defense are mixed, but he certainly has the speed to make up for bad routes. What we have to hope for here is that the Pirates are stupid and didn't know what they had, but don't be fooled by the crazy post ASB small sample numbers. He isn't that good. He will likely stick around as a backup OFer because Lewis and Roberts can't hit lefties.
Right Field
Randy Winn
07:$4M, 08:$8M, 09:$8.25M
2007 Line: .292/.346/.414
Since ASB: .325/.384/.447
Randy Winn is awesome. OK, Randy Winn is average. OK, so maybe I just like Randy Winn. Winn's RF defense is above-average, but no so much that you like his bat in RF. Winn should be playing CF, where his bat would be fine. Winn is about a league-average hitter - maybe better because his OPS is OBP-heavy - but you don't want him in RF. Basically, here's the problem: we talk about a hypothetical team of 9 Randy Winns putting up 5.2 runs per game (yes, his RC/27 is 5.2). The issue is not that a team of 9 Randy Winns wouldn't average 5.2 runs per game. The issue is that the real team has a pitcher batting ninth, Pedro Feliz, Ray Durham, Omar Vizquel, Dave Roberts, and Bengie Molina in it. Because you aren't going to get Randy Winn production from all of the other positions, you need someone much better than Randy Winn to make up for the crappy parts of the lineup. Winn is earning his salary this year, but again, he blocks young guys, and his contract is a waste on the bench. We can't trade Randy Winn, you say? He has a no-trade clause? See how fast he waives it when you tell him he will be sitting on the bench. Winn would be perfect for the Reds. I like Randy Winn, but Dave Roberts and Randy Winn should not be starters on the same team. At minimum, one needs to go. Preferably, both need to go.
Fred Lewis
Minimum Salary
2007 Line: .275/.356/.401
Since ASB: .257/.350/.286 (40 PA)
Free Fred Lewis! Fred Lewis may not be better than Randy Winn, but he is cheaper. Plus, according to UZR, his defense is 4-5 runs better. Yeah, he looks bad, but he is very fast, and speed makes up for bad routes. Unfortunately, Lewis can't hit LHP - not in the minors, not in the majors. Lewis and Rajai Davis could make a fine platoon. Lewis and Winn could make a fine platoon as well - Winn, despite being a lefty-masher, is pretty crappy against RHP. I should have mentioned that in Winn's section. Between his minor league numbers and his major league numbers, Lewis has proven that he can play. In the absence of a star RF acquisition, Lewis should be playing, and even then, Lewis should probably be in CF with Davis.
Nate Schierholtz
Minimum Salary
2007 Line: .325/.349/.400
2007 AAA.: .322/.358/.531
Schierholtz doesn't walk much, so his OBP is low for his AVG. He also doesn't hit for a ton of power, and what is there is mostly in the form of doubles. His advantages: unlike our other OF prospects, he is actually a prospect - age 23, compared to Lewis and Davis at 27 and 26. Also, unlike most of our other OFers, he doesn't show much platoon split, so he shouldn't be a liability against LHP. That said, I am not high on Schierholtz. He can't really play CF and he doesn't have the power for RF. Sure, a .531 SLG is nothing to sneeze at, but that is going to be a sub-.500 SLG in the majors. I say leave him in AAA and try to develop some power, because without it, he isn't going to be a long-term answer in RF.
Other Minor League help:
Dan Ortmeier: sure, he is in the majors, but why? He is a bit of a lefty-masher, solid in the field, and has a little speed. Decent backup, I suppose.
Clay Timpner, John Bowker, Eddy Martinez-Esteve, Eugenio Velez: read Steve's Minor Lines. Actually, Timpner kills RHP but can't hit LHP at all. We have a lot of bad platoon splits in the system.
This FanPost is reader-generated, and it does not necessarily reflect the views of McCovey Chronicles. If the author uses filler to achieve the minimum word requirement, a moderator may edit the FanPost for his or her own amusement.
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Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
One question though, when comparing the defense of Lewis and Winn, are you talking about their performances in CF or RF?
by rotorueter on Aug 12, 2007 8:32 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
The plus or minus runs is against average.
Winn:
RF: +4 runs saved per 150 games
CF: -3 runs saved per 150 games
Lewis:
RF: +8 runs saved per 150 games
CF: +76 runs saved per 150 games (VERY SMALL SAMPLE)
Roberts:
CF: -25 runs saved per 150 games
Holy sweet crap I hadn't noticed the updated UZR for Roberts before. He wasn't as bad on the last UZR update. Yeah, that might be small sample size fluke, but it matches what my eyes see, which is that Winn is a LOT better in CF. That -25 per 150 is basically 2.5 wins that Roberts costs the team with his glove over 150 games. That is just awful for a guy who isn't a great hitter. FWIW, Baseball Prospectus has Roberts as below average, but barely.
Also: every 10 runs either way is worth a win.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 9:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
Each number is runs saved per 150 games, and at the player's primary position unless noted otherwise. I will post the IF numbers at the other diary.
Bonds: -14
Davis: +27 (CF, with PIT) - fairly small sample size.
I have no numbers for Schierholtz, and small samples for Ortmeier (+40 in LF, -26 in RF - odd, and too small a sample to draw conclusions).
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 9:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by Roger on Aug 12, 2007 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
And as for the defense and scouts? I guarantee that the scouts are just like us, albeit better trained, in that they watch the guy play defense and decide how good he is. The problem is that a guy who takes a smooth route to the ball, doesn't make errors, and "looks" good out there is going to be praised as a good defender. A guy like Davis or Lewis, no matter how many balls he gets to, is going to be denigrated for looking clumsy. Bonds isn't really that bad, but you would think that he is twice as bad as Manny Ramirez to hear commentators talk about his defense. Do scouts make the same mistakes? I bet they do.
If I were to criticize UZR, or Chris Dial's ZR work, or any of the others, I would probably say that they don't note exactly where the fielder was positioned. If the fielder makes what would be a tough play, even out of his zone, he gets credit, even though the play might actually have been fairly easy. If the fielder misses a ball because he is positioned incorrectly, what seems as if it would be an easy play in the zone would count as a miss. Fortunately, the greater the sample size, the more likely those events even out. MGL is quick to say that we shouldn't draw strong conclusions from smaller samples of UZR data, and I would bet that conclusions he draws about a guy's fielding would be taken from a two- to three-year sample size.
I posted the UZR numbers anyway, because while we may not draw very strong conclusions from the data, it is really all I have. To get a little more perspective, here are Chris Dial's final 2006 numbers at BTF.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 10:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
I don't know if MGL has made an adjustment to the UZR numbers for that, so it is possible that Winn's and Lewis's numbers are actually better than what is listed. I am wary of trusting what I see, but Winn appears to me to be very good in RF, and it wouldn't surprise me to see that his numbers have taken a hit because of the wall.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by Roger on Aug 12, 2007 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
The numbers aren't perfect, especially as defensive metrics are in their infancy compared to offensive numbers. But when the numbers all agree on something, even when they come from different systems, then we have to question whether our eyes are correct. Like with Derek Jeter at SS. He doesn't look bad, he hustles, and he has a good arm, but the ball doesn't go "past a diving Jeter!" seven million times because it was particularly well-hit. Yet, many eyes have decided that he deserves a Gold Glove.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by Roger on Aug 12, 2007 12:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by Lyle on Aug 14, 2007 7:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
Which is the more accurate system to follow, Dewan's Fielding Bible or the UZR? Or is it just a matter of preference?
Watching Jeter is fun, because he is absolutely incapable of throwing the ball while standing still. There's an excerpt from the book on the Fielding Bible site on Jeter vs. Everett, if you're in the mood to read an interesting article.
by Anticon23 on Aug 12, 2007 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
I like to look at multiple systems. If they agree, then I have a decent sense that they are correct, at least within an acceptable degree of error. If there is an outlier, I like to try to figure out why, and why that system or type of system would be in error.
Most of the time, for my purposes, a general agreement by the different systems is close enough. I am not as familiar with Dewan's system, but it, UZR, and Dial's work all are based on play-by-play data, which I believe will be more accurate, at least over time.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It isn't so much that which is more accurate
You can find an explanation and discussion of the UZR system here. And also of course, on MGL's blog.
IMHO James' article in the Fielding Bible is an outstanding example of how to look at defense.
by rfloh on Aug 13, 2007 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Outfield walls
by rfloh on Aug 13, 2007 12:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Roberts is an excellent LF
by wilriv21 on Aug 12, 2007 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Roberts is an excellent LF
by Roger on Aug 12, 2007 11:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Roberts is an excellent LF
But:
(A)
LF Roberts
CF Jones or Rowand or Hunter
RF Winn or Schierholtz or Lewis
isn't nearly as good as
(B)
LF Bonds
CF Winn/Lewis/Roberts/Davis
RF Schierholtz/Lewis/Winn/Davis
Of course, what would be better is to have Bonds and a FA slugger and Lewis/Winn/Davis, but who knows if that will happen.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
by not as good - are you talking offensively?
by wilriv21 on Aug 12, 2007 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: by not as good - are you talking offensively?
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: by not as good - are you talking offensively?
Both offensively and defensively. Option (A) would be, at the ABSOLUTE MOST, about 3, maybe 3.5 wins better on defense, but that would be more than offset by the loss in offense.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by DrBGiantsfan on Aug 12, 2007 9:20 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
It seems more likely that the minors is the place to tinker with a swing, but I actually don't know if it makes much difference. Plus, you have a point in that any of these guys, Nate included, is going to have to make an adjustment to MLB, so why not get it over with sooner.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 9:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
One is Shawn Green:
http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/G/Shawn-Green.shtml
He never hit more than 13 HR in his 3 minor league seasons, and never hit more than 16 in his first 3 MLB seasons (in a hitter's park), before busting out with 35 in his 4th season in the majors. He followed that with 42, 24, 49, and 42 over the next 4 seasons.
Another is Don Mattingly:
http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/M/Don-Mattingly.shtml
He only had 37 HR's in his entire minor league career (in 1,842 AB's), then put up just 4 in his rookie year, before hitting 23 in his 2nd season in MLB, and followed that with 35, 31 and 30 over the next 3 seasons (albeit in a great HR park for LHB's).
Coincidentally (or maybe not), both players had startling power outages later in their career, but they do provide examples of how good-hitting minor leaguers can develop power once they reach the majors. If a LHB can do that in the Giants home park, however, is another question. Especially when considering that no LHB besides Bonds has ever had a 20 HR season for the Giants in their current park (though a couple of switch-hitters have).
by English Professor on Aug 12, 2007 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by losingcalifornia on Aug 12, 2007 2:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
From all the reports I've read, Schierholtz has the ability to hit some mammoth shots, and it wouldn't surprise me if all his doubles soon translated into HR. Even if they didn't completely turn into HR, with triple's alley at our park Schierholtz would be amassing a bunch of XBH.
by Anticon23 on Aug 12, 2007 4:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
Brian Giles? Hard to say. He and Marcus have fallen off the power cliff, so it does look a bit suspicious, but Brian has gotten older and moved to Petco, where HR go to die.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by projectmayhem713 on Aug 13, 2007 1:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
speaking of inflated numbers...
;)
by Lyle on Aug 14, 2007 8:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by howtheyscored on Aug 12, 2007 11:03 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by jtoj on Aug 12, 2007 11:29 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Speed
by Andy In Fresno on Aug 12, 2007 9:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
My take is to get rid of Roberts and Winn, and platoon Lewis and Davis and Ortmier and Shierholtz. With Bonds, that gives you your 5 outfielders. Even if we have to eat the cash, and DFA those other two. I can't stand the sight of them.
We still don't have anybody that can remotely come close to replacing Bonds. Not. Close. Not even far. And Alex Rodriguez is coming here as much as I'm going to be the opening day pitcher for the Boston Red Sox.
I'd also buy out Bochy's contract, and rehire Baker to kick everybody in the ass and put some fire back in this bunch of pathetic lethargic losers. Thats exactly what Craig did in 86 and Bake did in 93. Enough of the Jimmy Davenports, Felipe Alous and Bruce Bochys. This is a roster full of jaking, over the hillers who are about as inspired as Rosie O'Donell at a Slim-Fast convention.
by E Ticket on Aug 12, 2007 11:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
And as long as we're going to suck next year anyway (see: infield), I'd love to get all four guys starting regularly so we can finally lay to rest who, if any, is the actual prospect.
by howtheyscored on Aug 12, 2007 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
I wouldn't mind having an OF of Bonds/Lewis/Davis/Schierholtz/one of Roberts or Winn, but if that is the case, is there any chance that Winn or Roberts is a backup? Probably not, so both would have to go.
Sabean would do well to dangle some young pitching in trade this offseason with the condition that the other team take Winn or Roberts. I would bet that the Reds or Phillies would take that offer.
I wouldn't mind seeing this lineup next year:
CF Lewis/Davis
RF Schierholtz/Winn
1B Burrell (trade w/Phillies, FA after next year)
LF Bonds
3B Lowell (FA, two years max, please)
.C Molina
2B Frandsen
SS Vizquel (or some cheap acquisition)
P
It isn't great, but if the young pitching takes a step forward, Zito doesn't suck, and the bullpen gets straightened out, then the team might have a chance with a little luck. If the stars align and the team is actually in it, then 2B or SS could be upgraded by the deadline.
If not, at least the team doesn't completely suck, and Burrell or Lowell might be worth something in trade. Burrell's contract would no longer be an issue, and Lowell could help a contender if his contract isn't for 4 years and backloaded. We have nothing in the system ready for 1B or 3B, so no kids are being blocked and rebuilding isn't stifled by long contracts.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 12, 2007 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
Someone else is going to have to take this one on.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 4:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
College Sluggers
- Pedro Alvarez, 3B, Vanderbilt. The current concensus #1 overall pick. Hey, we still have a chance, right? So he's not a first baseman. We can use a slugging 3B too!
- Justin Smoak, South Carolina? Lower BA than some others, but appears to have unlimited power potential.
- Kid from Miami, damn, now I'm blanking on his name! Great power and great plate discipline. Not a great body so stuck at 1B. So, who care? We need a slugging first baseman, dammit.
- Dave Wallace, AZ St.
by DrBGiantsfan on Aug 12, 2007 7:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: College Sluggers
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 12, 2007 11:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yonder Alonzo
by DrBGiantsfan on Aug 13, 2007 7:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by rxmeister on Aug 12, 2007 2:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by E Ticket on Aug 12, 2007 3:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by SloIsLonelyForTheOrange on Aug 12, 2007 11:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
One other thing -- I doubt the Feds will ever get him on perjury although they may try, but it's a lock they can get him on income tax invasion (they can get any of these athletes on that if they really want to because of all the perks, shows and so forth). It shouldn't reduce his leverage because it will be chickenshit compared to what a lot of others in our society do to cheat the IRS but the reality is that it will.
by NearestNorwich on Aug 12, 2007 12:01 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
Without quibbling about Barry's exact place in the pantheon of hitters (or sluggers, if you will), he is certainly worth $15m or more to the team from his production and what he means to the team's earnings. If you have a better place to spend the money, then by all means do so, but where?
It isn't as if Barry would be blocking much, unless you have plans for a Schierholtz/Lewis/Davis OF, and it would be a one-year contract, so the next great Giants team wouldn't be burdened by his salary.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by NearestNorwich on Aug 12, 2007 3:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
For the star/superstar FA, it probably matters quite a bit. Those kinds of FAs often like to show up with a new team as the big star, lauded as the savior, the man, if you will, and that is never going to happen on a team with Barry Bonds. Sure, Alfonso Soriano can go to the Cubs and coexist with Derrek Lee, for example, but with Bonds - home run king, HOFer to be, best player in SF (at least) since 1993 - you are definitely going to be second fiddle.
Maybe that won't be as big a deal now, because Bonds is probably not going to be here longer than through next season, if at all, so a player might not worry about a year of Bonds in a 5-7 year contract.
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 4:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by jponry on Aug 12, 2007 12:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Say goodbye to John Boy
by wilriv21 on Aug 12, 2007 12:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Say goodbye to John Boy
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bittersweet
by wilriv21 on Aug 12, 2007 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: Bittersweet
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/08/12/SP6QRH1PH.DTL
by sfgreg on Aug 12, 2007 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
I suppose Misch has the potential to make Lowry acceptably expendable, and we'd still be able to try the Sanchez experiment.
But Sanchez kind of scares me. I see no evidence that he can handle a starter's workload and a couple of compelling exhibits to show that he can't, and he still doesn't have the kind of secondary stuff I want in a starter...
But God I love that guy's arm, anyway...
I am somewhat torn, but the main idea is Sanchez scares me and Misch doesn't, and I don't see a big enough difference in upside to make me very confident about the risk.
Anybody willing to convince me? Or should I wait for the upcoming pitcher's diary?
by howtheyscored on Aug 12, 2007 6:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by BawLa on Aug 12, 2007 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 12:47 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 12, 2007 12:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by howtheyscored on Aug 12, 2007 6:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by rxmeister on Aug 12, 2007 2:48 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
He's ranked 21st in the NL in OPS at .760, 27th in SLG at .413 and a miserly 7 Jacks, and he's tied for 17th in Steals with 10 with Rajai Davis who has 73 ABS compared to Winn's 435.
I think I need to not take you seriously on some things, and just chalk it off to you being a New Yorker.
by E Ticket on Aug 12, 2007 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by Sayhey on Aug 12, 2007 4:39 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
would you substitute Hunter for Jones?
by wilriv21 on Aug 12, 2007 5:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: would you substitute Hunter for Jones?
by Sayhey on Aug 12, 2007 7:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by E Ticket on Aug 12, 2007 5:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by Sayhey on Aug 12, 2007 7:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by Azmanz on Aug 12, 2007 7:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by North Side Chicago Expatriate Giants Fan on Aug 13, 2007 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
Reminds me of Grant's post a week ago or so about Winn being the second best hitter on the team. Heh. He's awesome compared to the rest of the lineup, that's for sure.
by paboperfecto on Aug 13, 2007 11:54 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
That's about as accurate as "Porn stars age well"
And great flippin' jesus do we really have 4 identical slap hitting OFs who can't quite play center of different ages? Winn/Roberts/Lewis/Davis/Shurholtz?
by zenbitz on Aug 13, 2007 2:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
Well, to each his own.
by howtheyscored on Aug 13, 2007 2:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re: State of the Giants (Outfield)
by Goofus on Aug 13, 2007 2:15 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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