How will Bonds be remembered?

by achiappanza on Aug 1, 2007 11:33 AM PDT Comment 17 comments

I was asked this question on a Dodger forum, and wanted to share my answer here.

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How do I think Bonds will be remembered? I think better than most people are saying now. It also depends on whether or not he gets passed by A-Rod or anyone else any time soon.

The main reason is that the big number (career homers) is the most memorable number in sports. It's a number so important, that it wrongly transcends time... everyone who's been in MLB gets measured against that number regardless of the homer-friendliness of the era. (I should admit that I have predicted before that fans will start to gravitate towards era-adjusted numbers, which is kind of an argument against what I'm saying here.) If Barry's still #1 in 20 years, I expect that the natural inclinations of fans will return, which is number first, circumstances second.

In the long run, I don't see any reason why the steroid era will be viewed any differently than the dead ball era, or a live ball era, or any other pocket. Barry will always be a part of that, maybe even the first example, but he'll be tied to the era, not set apart the way it's happening now. People forget to hate assholes... look at how Ted Williams is revered today. (Ty Cobb is an exception because racism was a big part of it, and that's still a sensitive issue for the world, unfortunately.)

In fact, if the steroid era is viewed differently, I predict it will be even less anomalous. That is, it's entirely possible that performance enhancers are here to stay... that technology will always be one step ahead of Johnny Law, and in fact Bonds' transgressions will stand out even less, being reduced to an early adopter of a permanent change, rather than the King of a limited aberration.

I don't think this is a Giants fan talking, I think this is rational. How does it sound to you guys?

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Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

Sounds good. But what do you think will happen/change if ARod does, in fact, pass Bonds in 2013?

Your 2012 NL ERA champion: Sergio Romo

by Lyle on Aug 1, 2007 12:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

That's still a long way to go for Arod. To do it by 2013 would take pretty close to 6 seasons averaging 50 HRs throughout his mid- to late-30s. He's only had two 50 HR seasons in his career so far. Just, you know, perspective-wise.

by Roger on Aug 1, 2007 12:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

I was assuming he'd end the year with ~510 HRs. If he averaged 45 for the next 5 years (2008 through 2012), he'd begin the 2013 season with 735 HRs and presumably be within striking distance of Barry's 760-770. Big assumptions, but my best guess.

Your 2012 NL ERA champion: Sergio Romo

by Lyle on Aug 2, 2007 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

If he ends the year with close to 510 homeruns, I think his total in 2013 will be a moot point. :)

Coming to you by proxy (I adopted: Dave Righetti!)

by howtheyscored on Aug 2, 2007 1:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

If Bonds isn't the HR king, I think a lot of the bitter energy directed at hanging "cheater" around his neck will lose steam. So he would lose some of that negative coverage, but he'd also lose the big record that at this point will anchor any argument that calls him the greatest hitter of all time.

Not that this claim would ever make consensus, but the case will peak when he's #1.

by achiappanza on Aug 1, 2007 2:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

We'll find out in 30 years.

Steve Kline: He's pretty okay!

by groug on Aug 1, 2007 12:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

But I can't wait that long!

Barry Bombs gear | comics | Ray Durham is... yeah.

by Natto on Aug 1, 2007 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

Pretty much they way Ted Williams is. They never won it all, and they were notoriously unpleasant human beings, but people's emotional reactions to those facts will fade over time

The home run record will fall eventually, but I'll be shocked if anyone ever manages a .600 OBP again. As the years go by, and newer and better PEDs come and go, it will become clear that no one has ever been better at hitting a baseball than Barry Bonds.

by Evan on Aug 1, 2007 12:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

That's pretty much exactly my take on it, too... albeit with the caveat that if all the glaciers melt and the oceans rise and AT&T and few other places end up underwater, it might not be a big topic of discussion anymore.

by Roger on Aug 1, 2007 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

"You'll find out soon enough."

"Awww, but that's not soon enough."

Coming to you by proxy (I adopted: Dave Righetti!)

by howtheyscored on Aug 1, 2007 9:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

I'm with you as long as notoriously means "reportedly".

by zenbitz on Aug 2, 2007 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

Bonds will be remembered as a revered legend on the field, but also as one who defines the "steroid era," in which homeruns were more revered than the competition of the game and led to many players using chemical substances to increase the number of homeruns they hit. Bonds' records will still be impressive, but he'll never be remembered solely for them.

by ololo3 on Aug 1, 2007 1:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

Great question! I also wonder how things like the following will affect how he's remembered:

An indictment
A conviction
An admission and "mea culpa"
Whether he continues to play even when his skills are gone
His post-retirement persona
How hot his mistress looks in the upcoming Playboy spread

Bold Prediction: Klesko will finish the 2007 season with at least 20 HRs. (OPS+ is 129 as of 7/1/07)

by Goofus on Aug 1, 2007 3:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: How will Bonds be remembered?

The first five also applied to Cepeda.

I am El Person and I ¢¾ this message.

by El Person on Aug 2, 2007 1:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

on a Dodger forum?

Am I the only one wondering what you were doing on a Dodger Forum?

by Jakespaar on Aug 1, 2007 3:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: on a Dodger forum?

Heh. I lived in Venice in 1997-98 and got the daily dosage of Dodger reporting in the Times. So when they started a BB on latimes.com, I joined up as an open agent of the enemy.

The group has hopped a couple boards since, but it's a nice, respectful little community most of the time and I like getting to make points that might be redundant around Giant boards but not so much there. I've actually gone to a few Giants-Dodgers games with these guys here in SF.

by achiappanza on Aug 1, 2007 5:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs