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Cain is Able! Take That, Pun Police!

Baseball Prospectus recently had a roundtable discussion on their choices for the top minor-league pitching prospects here. You have to be a subscriber to read it, but, like Baseball America, if you have the clams it's definitely worth it. There is no Baseball Prospectus mansion with young starlets hanging around a lavish pool and sipping drinks garnished with little umbrellas, though. Again, that's just Baseball America.

In the roundtable, there is one mention of Matt Cain. Not only is there only one mention when discussing the top pitching prospects in the game, but that one mention is dismissive:

...(Matt Cain) translates poorly...
Which means?
Tourist:
Please, tell him the antidote to the venom is in the suitcase on the bed!  We need the key to the room!

Cain:
Su cabra no se prepuso comer la microficha.
(His goat did not intend to eat the microfiche)

Hotel Worker:
¿Que?

Tourist:
There...isn't...much...time.... Tell him to please hurry!

Cain:
Su tío hizo una nave en una botella. ¿Cómo hacen eso?
(His uncle made a ship in a bottle. How do they do that?)

Hotel Worker:
Cuerdas poca.
(Little ropes.)

Tourist:
Tell my wife I love her....

All goofiness aside, what does "doesn't translate well" mean? This is a pitcher who turned 20 after the season ended. He dominated high-A ball with a mix of power and control. Perhaps his poor translation was due to his less than stellar AA finish, but that still featured a 3.35 ERA and respectable strikeout numbers. At age 19, no less.

Prospectus' top-50 list came out today, and Cain is a respectable #28. Respectable being a relative term, as there are only eight pitchers in front of him. Considering the admitted bias against young pitching at Baseball Prospectus, that is some fairly high praise. However, Brandon McCarthy is above Cain. Cain had a higher strikeout rate, lower homerun rate, put his best numbers up in high-A as opposed to McCarthy's low-A, and was over a year younger. Both Kannapolis and San Jose are pitcher-friendly parks, and at the lower levels the walk rates were almost identical, so there are no inherent advantages there. The main advantages seem to be that McCarthy's ratios held up better in AA, and that McCarthy was also able to put up gaudy numbers in the Carolina League before advancing. However, Cain appears to have somewhat of a statistical edge over McCarthy, as well as being the Scout's Blend.

Wait a sec.  Am I on the internet, quibbling about the arbitrary rankings of two minor-league pitchers? As I look into the mirror, I kneel, and dub thee, "King Nerd".

What we can gather with this, so far:

a) Baseball Prospectus might put much less weight on the differences between low-A and high-A.

b) The Baseball Prospectus projection system, PECOTA, doesn't love Cain as much as the scouts love him.

Fair enough, though it would help if we knew exactly how PECOTA does its thing. Or, rather, it would help if someone else knew the proprietary formula who could dumb it down for me. Perhaps with finger puppets or a diorama. The system doesn't look just at stats, also taking into consideration body size and age, and comparing all the factors to players throughout the history of baseball. Exactly which of those factors is pushing the "translate poorly button" for Cain is unknown, but it is my guess that his young age is working against him when trying to predict his career. Younger pitchers who are rushed, and Cain is on a faster track than most, might burn out with more frequency.  

I hope that isn't the case, and I hope the system is wrong. Or, if not wrong, that Cain beats the odds. After all of the prospecterica coming out lately, the kid is really starting to excite me.

Poll
Where would you rank Cain among minor-league pitchers?
Top five
4 votes
Top ten
1 votes
Top twenty
1 votes
Not ranked
0 votes
hes the best picher in baseball in 2006 and teh giants will finally WIN THAT RING!!!!!
4 votes

10 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 7 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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PECOTA Explanation
Grant,

A general explanation for how PECOTA comes to its forcasts can be found in BP 2003 on page 507.  I cannot give you a summary for the explanation is far over my head.

by Rob Assalino on Feb 23, 2005 12:44 AM PST reply actions  

Yeah...
I was referring to the "nuts and bolts", more than the general idea behind the system.  To pinpoint the exact reason for Cain's poor translation, more or less.

by Grant Brisbee on Feb 24, 2005 12:27 AM PST up reply actions  

Baseball Prospectus
One of the major problems I have with Baseball Prospectus is that they have this system, that is based on their proprietary formulas, for which there is no evidence (other than that miraculously found by themselves) that it is one whit better than simpler, easy to obtain data, and their unswerving conviction, which they constantly pronounce, that anyone who doesn't see how much better their system is ignorant, and probably brain damaged. ( The second problem I have with Baseball Prospectus is that I am a Giants fan, and they are quite comfortable with their pronouncement that Brian Sabean is the anti-christ- it's a freaken miracle that a Giants prospect is even on their list).  Seriously, eqa, RAP, RARP, don't tell me anything I can't already see with OBP/SLG/OPS, it's just more complicated.

by prospecthound on Feb 23, 2005 10:05 AM PST reply actions  

Disagree a bit...
I really enjoy the PECOTA projections, and the early returns seem to be positive on their predictive power.  I'm assuming the new book will have a recap of the 2004 predictions.

I also like EqA, just because I'm not that stat savvy.  Park-adjusting numbers, and then crunching them to look like a stat I grew up with, is no small feat.  AVG/OBP/SLG is still what I spend 95% of my time on, though.

by Grant Brisbee on Feb 24, 2005 12:22 AM PST up reply actions  

Cain's ranking
I think the Baseball Prospectus ranking of Cain is reasonable. Personally, I'd put him higher in the list, but there's plenty of room for debate when it comes to young pitchers.

by Dan from NM on Feb 23, 2005 12:04 PM PST reply actions  

Can I play the pun game, too?
Alright, enough of the puns, but how about Twist of Cain?

by Dan from NM on Feb 23, 2005 12:11 PM PST reply actions  

Right on Prospect Hound
I am so tired of Baseball Prospectus.  Oakland and LA get 4 or 5 prospects because they subscribe to the all knowing Moneyball.  

I'm getting tired of this debate.  Stats and scout are both important and it's time to end the argument.  

by slcgiant on Feb 23, 2005 4:27 PM PST reply actions  

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